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West Coast Mainline South In Ts2021?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by aidanhughes1, Sep 8, 2020.

  1. aidanhughes1

    aidanhughes1 New Member

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    This release confuses me. They're releasing the route in the deluxe edition of the game, but a free version of the route already exists on alanthomsonsim.com? if you missed out on getting the virgin class 390 before it was discontinued then sure, but if you already have it then you can just download an avanti reskin? the inclusion of an avanti 221 is nice as i haven't seen one of those released for free yet, but i can't see many people going for the deluxe edition when a lot of the content included can be gotten for free elsewhere
     
  2. Steve 31

    Steve 31 Member

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    The current WCML route might be free but it needs an incredible number of assets to run correctly. I don't have all of the assets so therefore I would have to buy what I need and then it isn't free! If you happen to have all of the requirements installed already then great but I keep my installation as clean as possible and to run that route would mean a very large increase to my program size.
    I don't have the route but not sure how many custom assets there are but I would expect more in a payware route and hopefully less stations would have generic buildings.
    Not knocking the freeware route at all, it get's good reviews but I like the route to be self contained and not need loads of other routes to run. Therefore I would buy the program for this route alone although as I now tend to use TSW I would probably end up waiting for a bit!
     
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  3. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    I've just watched a video where he says they will be using the new route to finish off the WCML, so looks like once complete, the "missing link"/Thompson entire WCML will actually use this new route.


    Do not under-estimate how many people that statement includes. I stepped away from TS for a while, and when I came back, all the things I wanted had been canned. I managed to get NW Coast and South Wales Coast through old game licenses, but the Pendo was off limits for me. This alone makes it worthwhile. The only thing I will then be missing that I can no longer get is the Virgin 1st gen pack... and I only really want that for the 47.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2020
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  4. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    And - as been pointed out - it requires a whole load of stuff to make it work
    Steam: London to Brighton
    Steam: Woodhead Line (original)
    Steam: West Coast Main Line Trent Valley
    Steam: Liverpool to Manchester
    JustTrains: Newcastle to Edinburgh

    Ok if you have already bought these before but the cost of two of these would cover the cost of the new WCML version.

    Peter
     
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  5. Reef

    Reef Active Member

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    I am so happy, I very nearly bought the FCL a few weeks back but held off and bought a few older and cheaper ones instead with every intention of purchasing the FCL "In a few weeks" Now that 2021 has been announced I'm soooo glad I held off..

    Also..
    Well let's face it, they could have hardly made it any worse.. :D:D
     
  6. Peter Hayes

    Peter Hayes Active Member

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    If you have none of the Assets it would cost around $300 USD to acquire them all.
     
  7. Odd1ne

    Odd1ne Member

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    I am looking forward to seeing what assets are used and see the difference between the two routes. Be good to see new street in the game and wonder if they will use this for new routes from Birmingham now
     
  8. AlexTheMole

    AlexTheMole Active Member

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    I can only echo what others have said, freeware routes are only viable for people who either have a lot of money to spare or have been buying DLC over years. I'm a huge user of freeware routes (mainly due to lack of good payware steam era routes) and even only buying during sales it has cost me an obscene amount of money so far.

    Also Euston to Birmingham is a pretty iconic route, and this is the first time Birmingham has appeared in a payware DLC. Don't people who really want to play such an iconic journey without spending £££ on multiple DLCs deserve to do so?

    Edit: Also on top of that you have various freeware assets from UKTS that are required, and many people are not comfortable downloading and installing 3rd party stuff and would rather it just be done through Steam. So it caters to them, and ideally any hobby should cater to as many people as possible.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2020
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  9. ntypeman

    ntypeman Active Member

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    Will be interesting to see if BNS lives up to expectations... I was once told that the approach to BNS was/is known as "The Crucible" as you need to get a red before you get a colour (you get held at a red signal outside the station whilst awaiting platforms to clear before then getting a yellow or green to enter the station)... Will the congestion be replicated???

    For those of you who aren't familiar with the game of snooker, "The Crucible" is a near legendary venue in Sheffield where major snooker tournaments are held and within the game of snooker a red ball must first be potted before a player can pot a coloured ball...

    Eric
     
  10. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    That's more down to the scenario makers... I'm sure there will be some who do and many who don't
     
  11. USRailFan

    USRailFan Member

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    You'd likely need an insane amount of stuff to fully replicate all the stock operating in and out of there correctly though? Pendolinos, Voyagers, 350s, Class 68s with Mk3s... And I guess there's a lot more diesel stuff too? And likely 90s/92s/66s with freight as well...
     
  12. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Im the sort of nutter who has everything british (other than steam)... as in my collection is worth over a grand at full prices
     
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  13. USRailFan

    USRailFan Member

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    I used to buy virtually everything that was released, but have concentrated mostly on post-1980 North American and European stuff for the last few years.
     
  14. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Literally I have only bought UK routes and trains outside of the bundle I first bought... Same for 3rd party stuff... all UK
     
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  15. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    If you had the Freeware version you would need a large amount of stuff - no different between either version

    There are no 68s and Mk3s working anywhere on the WCML
    At Birmingham they use Moor St and Snow Hill - as in the Chiltern Route

    Peter
     
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  16. Ian1991

    Ian1991 Well-Known Member

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    I given up on ts2020 once TSW2 was released, whilst I enjoy these games I wouldnt call myself a proper enthusiast. But now having my local line put into the game, and my hometown by DTG it will be interesting to see how they build it without killing framerate. Birmingham was done by just trains but a pretty awful attempt, limited scenarios and no ai on a quick drive.

    If DTG pull this off then I may keep TS2021 going until the longer routes start to appear in TSW2, its just a shame that this route was not selected for TSW2 down the line as it literally has everything, freight, commuter and high speed.

    Looking forward to it.
     
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  17. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I doubt if you would get longer routes in TSW2 because of the large number of assets that need to be created.
    In TS20xx you have a station and the buildings are just walls which you can just pass thru with the camera to find an empty box.
    The same station in TSW2 and people would expect to be able to walk around it
    How much building would be required to enable people to walk around Euston?

    In TSW2 you don't have any trains on the mainline section from Queens Park to Harrow and all the sidings at Wembley are empty.
    You can not even just have a Class 66 as an AI train going past as you drive your Bakerloo train

    Peter
     
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  18. brummie

    brummie Member

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    Silly question, although the news items state that the WCML will be available with the 'Deluxe Edition' only, what if like me, I don't want all the routes just the London to Brum one, will it be available as a separate purchase from launch, or do you think it will become available at a later date?
     
  19. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    It will probably be available as a stand alone route but that might not be until next year.
    The Southampton - Bournemouth Route was released with TS2020 (September 2019 release) but it was in 2020 before it was released on it's own

    Before then I think the deluxe edition will be discounted in a Sale so it might work out cheaper to buy the whole lot and just remove the routes you don't want - as I do with the US Routes
     
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  20. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    They've said it will be available as a separate DLC, but I haven't seen "from launch" or not. Presumably there'll be streams this week which may clear that up
     
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  21. brummie

    brummie Member

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    Thanks Peter. I thought this may be the case.
     
  22. brummie

    brummie Member

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    I will keep an eye out for any streams, didn't find much up to now regards my query.
     
  23. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    I've never once removed any DLC... I just ignore teh stuff I don't use, but my install is getting a bit bloaty now. I'm assuming you just untick the DLC you no longer want in Steam's "Manage Your DLC" link? Does it leave crap behind that needs manually removing? If so, I'd rather just manually do it.
     
  24. USRailFan

    USRailFan Member

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    The only thing it might leave behind is blueprints.pak files. And any custom/edited scenarios.
     
  25. brummie

    brummie Member

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    Hi Pookeyhead,
    I was just thinking the same as you re unticking the DLC you no longer want in Steam, maybe someone will comment who knows more about this.
     
  26. Odd1ne

    Odd1ne Member

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    I keep thinking of doing this too my files are getting stupid big now
     
  27. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    To remove a Route or Train go in to the Steam Client > Library and click on Train Simulator
    On the RHS side is manage my DLC - find the route and untick the box

    When untick a route or train in the Steam Client then Steam thinks you are not using it and won't let you run it.
    But the files are left in place as Steam does not normally delete them

    For a Route go to \railworks\Content\Routes\ and delete that route from your system
    Which route? - have a look here for the route numbers
    https://railworks.freeforums.net/thread/17/railworks-route-numbers

    For a loco again untick it in the Steam Client, find it's folder and delete it

    If at some point you want it back then go in to the Steam Client and re-tick the route/loco and it will automatically install a new copy
    You never lose anything purchased thru Steam even if you change computers

    Peter
     
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  28. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    Ahhh.... no point then. I was only doing it to free up some HD space. May as well leave it as it is then, or just delete manually. I just thought un-ticking the box would remove it. .
     
  29. brummie

    brummie Member

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    Thank you so much for the explanation on how best to delete unwanted routes.
     
  30. brummie

    brummie Member

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    But if you don't delete from those tick boxes in Steam, next time you verify game cache or Steam does an update it will be re downloaded again.
     
  31. ntypeman

    ntypeman Active Member

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    Does anyone have any ideas of how much we're looking at for the deluxe version???

    Eric
     
  32. WhippleStripper

    WhippleStripper Member

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    I've been commuting to New Street for four years and I have never seen freight go through it. The only freight wagons I've seen there were a couple of engineers wagons late at night alongside a platform they were doing work on. No loco present.

    That's not to say there is no freight, but I've never seen any. It's very different 30 miles north at Stafford which has lots of freight going through it. I guess it most go south on the Trent Valley leg which runs parallel to the route through New Street.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2020
  33. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    There are ways to avoid New Street, I think via Soho Junction is one way so a freight would not need to go through the station. The last thing they would want is a freight train holding up what is already a bottle neck.
     
  34. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    That's the same with 3rd party DLC sometimes though.. I'm used to that. I assumed unticking it would also remove the files, hence giving an easy, quick way to reclaim some drive space.. but if not... then I'll not bother.
     
  35. martschuffing

    martschuffing Member

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  36. Steve 31

    Steve 31 Member

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    Re freight at New Street, it isn't common but there have been diversions booked that way when Sutton Park or Camp Hill lines are closed. Got a few pics in this album:

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/31466/albums/72157636423449044

    The Colas steel from Washwood Heath to Boston was booked to run through New Street when that ran to save running round at Saltley. It ran for many years with 47's and 56's but finished a few years ago.
     
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  37. Cyclone

    Cyclone Active Member

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    I tend to agree with this. Yes, there is a freeware version of the route, but even in any projects connecting routes this will quickly take the place of the free route as there will be Workshop functionality and no need to have to connect 15 different downloadable assets to make the route run. I prefer clean installations, and personally would be happy if the freeware route makers would just gain permission to put the assets in their actual routes (especially if it's free anyway, why should we have to go download a bunch of extra stuff?). That is perhaps the reason I've never bothered with a lot of stuff outside of Steam, so far only picking up a couple of Just Trains items on the side that I have not yet installed. I want everything to work out of the box without having to look up other items which then may depend on even more items to run. Yes, this is also a complaint of mine on the TS DLC setup, but it's even worse off of Steam.
     
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  38. Peter Hayes

    Peter Hayes Active Member

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    P749
    "When untick a route or train in the Steam Client then Steam thinks you are not using it and won't let you run it.
    But the files are left in place as Steam does not normally delete them"


    Not so it does remove the Content files (except scenarios) from your PC but not associated assets so it does save a small amount of a hard drive.
     
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  39. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Which is strange as the Content files are a lot smaller than the Asset files associated with a route & stock
     
  40. USRailFan

    USRailFan Member

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    If you untick a DLC in Steam client, it removes everything related to that particular DLC, both Contens and Assets
     
  41. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    I feel any package where multiple routes are included for the price of one is worth it. Even more so for an individual who doesn't have any of the included content.
     
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  42. brummie

    brummie Member

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    Just been confirmed that the WCML will be available to purchase separately or as part of the Deluxe edition, which is fine by me. That was the only route I was interested in.
     
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  43. Forzaboy4

    Forzaboy4 Member

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    Yeah they use Landor St or Stechford
     
  44. Peter Hayes

    Peter Hayes Active Member

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    If you untick a DLC in Steam client, it removes everything related to that particular DLC, both Contens and Assets

    I don't think so - there are common assets associated with many routes - deleting those would cause chaos. When you untick the route in your downloadable content it merely removes (these days) the content\route\maincontent.ap file. It leaves behind any 3rd party stuff you have installed.
     
  45. ex-railwayman

    ex-railwayman Member

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    But, nobody knows what is included with this new route yet, have DTG included the Northampton Loop, I'd imagine they have included the Daventry Freight Terminal DIRFT, which is on the freeware route, and I have 2 copies of this freebie installed, as we're now up to version 5, the first version which I have set up for 1980s/90s, and the latest version for 2000s onwards, lots of new station buildings and other misc. assets on the new version, as the author has been inspired by new payware materials that make the route look more modern and uptodate, so, until we see what DTG have built on their route we can't make any decisions, however, I think it very premature to think that their version will be better than the freeware offering, even though more scenarios will become available on Steam workshop.
    Tomorrow is the big day.........
     
  46. Cyclone

    Cyclone Active Member

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    My basis on better is from a usability standpoint. I have not really seen the freeware offering, though I am sure great work was done on it. The question is whether it will now all be for naught.
     
  47. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I think both can sit alongside each other to complement each other. Some people only like using steam as everything is in one place, those moaning about DTG replicating another route should think on that! Also some will be happy to be able to pay £24.99 for one route, especially if they are new to the sim rather than having to purchase extra routes which they might not otherwise use to run a freeware version.

    Others (and I am one of them) enjoy freeware offerings as they often cover more track maybe more areas and don't mind downloading other assets and I happen to own most UK DLC so it already an expense spent!

    I am very grateful for those who spend time making freeware routes, I am also, in a different way I suppose, grateful for the payware available too.
     
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  48. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    No sign of it on Steam yet. Isn't today the release date?
     
  49. Cat

    Cat Well-Known Member

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    Usually about tea time.;) Between 5/6 pm is the norm so that DTG staff have gone home and are not inundated with questions that the punters can work out for themselves overnight.
     
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  50. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

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    Balls... I'll be busy tonight, which is why I'm home now. I was hoping to grab it this afternoon.
     

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