West Cornwall Local: Penzance - St. Austell & St Ives - The Definitive Feedback Thread

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by chieflongshin, Oct 15, 2021.

  1. dbrunner#4864

    dbrunner#4864 Well-Known Member

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    Physics are accurate enough for a Hornby HO model
     
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  2. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Aren't given the chance? I've definitely seen a response recently from JT posted here on the forum that they have decided against it to this point.
     
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  3. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Well i've gone from interested in first rivet dlc to on the fence because of the sounds to "I'm out". Sorry thats too much. I'll stick to first party product only from DTG for now.
     
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  4. dbrunner#4864

    dbrunner#4864 Well-Known Member

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    Really? I didn't see that post. I would be a shame if someone with such quality routes like JT would not be interested in TSW.
     
  5. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Their quality has certainly improved in recent years. I remember their work at Penzance being ripped apart a few years back (things like overlapping windows and buildings sinking into the ground)
    I'm sure they'll appreciate that people have forgotten their past failures and allowed them to move on
     
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  6. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    I haven't bought one of their routes in a while (not been interested really) - have they got over their tree fetish?
     
  7. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    No idea. Gave up on TS1 in January of this year and not gone back
     
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  8. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    "All they have to do?" You do realize that UE's sound engine is utterly different from that in TSW1? And that there are only 32 audio channels not 256? Looking at "how it's mixed" in TSW1 is all well and good, but it can't be copied in the way you suggest.
     
  9. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Just to repeat my comment from the other thread, the 8 car 150 formation on the main line is ludicrous. As a retired railway controller who spent a large part of their career dealing with the Regional Railways side of things, we were lucky to have the bare quantity of sets to cover the service. A few ECS moves may have conveyed 3 or 4 sets, like the infamous 03+25 Canton to Gloucester, but not in passenger service. It wasn't nicknamed "Poverty Rail" for no reason. The other factor is that you could not do selective door operation on Class 150's so at short platforms you will end up with doors opening outside the station. If operating overlength, any extra sets on the rear would have to be locked out of use.

    This looks like a fudge to cover for the lack of HST's or XC loco hauled services, TBH the incorrect livery HST would at least have been more operationally accurate.
     
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  10. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    its from Bachmann :D
    upload_2021-10-22_19-32-32.jpeg
     
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  11. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    I thought the 8-car formation was only available in scenario planner, and all the services are 2-car.
     
  12. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    The PIS is also broken on West Cornwall.
    Like Not in Service by the AI
     
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  13. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Considering the challenge DTG have had with the London Commuter route in replicating all the density of the buildings etc., along the trackside throughout that route, Rivet Games have much less to do on West Cornwall as there are not many buildings to work on.

    Driving from London to Brighton really gives you an experience of driving a realistic route. However I don’t get that feeling from watching the West Cornwall route. Rivet and Dovetail must work on this to give customers the best expression and what matters to me is that it looks right. I sincerely hope they will get the few landmarks correct. DTG raised the bar with London Commuter and I would like to see Cornish landmarks like Truro Cathedral and St. Michael’s Mount looking right. St. Ives, scenery is desperately incorrect. The church on the hill is missing in the harbour view as are the harbour walls and light house. Porthminster beach is not right, missing buildings and Pedn Olva and Porthminster Hotel (now renamed St. Ives Harbour) are both left out, as has the Carbis Bay hotel, by the Carbis Bay station. Penzance has no views of the town which you can see as you approach the station on the live train. This route was set in 1991 and although it is 30 years ago, there have not been very much in the way of change. All the places I have mentioned have been in place since I first visited the area in the early 50s.

    When you look at all the fantastic routes so far issued in the game, I am sorry to say it, but imo, the three Rivet routes are bottom of the list. I hope Rivet will continue to work hard on their routes to bring them up to the standard of the other routes. I hope eventually I will be able to say that Rivet have eventually done a good job. A lot goes into making a route and it’s important that it feels and looks right before it is released to the public.

    This photo is of Penzance station taken in 1991 and if you study this, you will see that Rivets version around the station is massively different.
    785EB7D6-5679-4B1B-A768-4F79033B05B1.jpeg

    I hope that Jasper and DTG will look into this and the other photos I have posted here and on the Rivet forum.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
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  14. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    that’s not 1991. We didn’t have BR Blue back then did we? Pretty sure that would be late 80s? Think 91 was Intercity ? Exec or Swallow

    anyway, Not important - I get your point !
     
  15. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    ghawk2095, I lived there. The picture showed was taken on Saturday 20th April 1991
     
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  16. WaveyDavey

    WaveyDavey Well-Known Member

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    I really think you are mistaken. In 1991 the WR did not have blue grey HSTs with 253*** set numbers still under the nose. I also found this photo taken on 31st July 1982 and you can see the same freshly laid tarmac on the platform, the gas holder in the exact same weathered condition and the bushes in the retaining wall all the same size.

    I did also find the second image that WAS taken in 1991 notice IC livery for the HST, No shrubs in the retaining wall, The platform lampposts that have been replaced by a newer metal type, The end of the station shed roof having been covered in and also notice the tarmac in the middle of the platform..... By now not nice and new and black but very faded and grey.

    So I would say your photo was taken in 1981 not 1991.


    zzz8-penzance-31st-july-1982-copyright-clive-smith_1_orig.jpg 6473092585_fa5f29e8d2_b.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2021
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  17. atpyatt

    atpyatt Well-Known Member

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    The first picture is definitely pre 1987 not 1991, you can see the goods bay roof still standing in the back left of the picture, this was demolished in 1987 apparently.

    I also didn't think BR blue was still around in the 90s, my recollection is of sector liveries around that time, Regional Railways, Intercity Swift livery and grey locos with the sector logo on the side.
     
  18. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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  19. atpyatt

    atpyatt Well-Known Member

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  20. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    I believe there were a few straddlers in Blue into the very early 90s. I think the last HST power cars were repainted in '91. There may have been a few locomotives and coaches still in it - nothing like that picture though.
     
  21. dbrunner#4864

    dbrunner#4864 Well-Known Member

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  22. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    Agree with the post nwp1, the scenery is lacking to put mildly. However the picture is definitely pre 1987. Not only are the HSTs in full rake BR blue. The locos are also without the front headlamps added in the mid 80s.
     
  23. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    I think not. I’m afraid everyone else agrees with me….late 80s max.
     
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  24. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    I posted a link which works for me It shows a series of pictures by clinking on the link on the left of the picture that appears all taken by Kevin

    Kevin
    Penzance, 20th April 1991
    The scene at Penzance station on the quiet spring afternoon of Saturday 20th April 1991

    I am not disagreeing with anyone but the scene shown around Penzance station didn’t differ until this century.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
  25. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    1990s you had intercity livery NOT BR Blue, on the HSTs as you will see here - https://transportdesigned.com/pictures-every-single-hst-livery-ever/
     
  26. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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  27. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I am not doubting what you all say, but I only posted what I thought was genuine. All the dates showed April 20th 1991 and if you search for pictures of Penzance Station in the 90s these and other photos come up looking exactly the same. No work was done to the surroundings around the Station until well after the date of RIVETs route. Have a word with Penzance council who will be happy to confirm info@penzance-tc.gov.uk
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
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  28. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    If that's pulled the date from file EXIF information, it may have been the date an original photo was scanned or otherwise digitised, rather than actually being the date the picture was taken.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
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  29. heardturkey

    heardturkey Active Member

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    From the original photograph on the Cornwall Railway Society Site.
    Search Galleries-Cornwall_Penzance
    An early 80's view of Penzance taken by the Late Edwin Pascoe then a fitter at Long Rock HST maintenance facility. Photograph from Ruth a relative of Craig Munday. Copyright Note the long gone gas holder in the background and the awning over the parcels facility to the left.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
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  30. atpyatt

    atpyatt Well-Known Member

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    Also it looks like there were significant changes to the station yard in the 1980s, albeit not to the station building itself:

    1968:
    upload_2021-10-25_13-2-46.png

    Post 1987:
    upload_2021-10-25_13-2-58.png

    Looking at the picture from the early 80s makes me wish they had set it 10 years earlier! A lot of "rationalisation" occurred between the 80s and the 90s I think.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
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  31. Southern Driver

    Southern Driver Active Member

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    Can i just the debate is about a train that is (albeit absurdly) from the route!!

    as I’ve mentioned elsewhere the 150/2 has a TPWS MCB behind the driver. TPWS wasn’t even contemplated until after the Southall Crash in 1997.
     
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  32. fabristunt

    fabristunt Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they did that to make it usable on other routes, just like the tees valley trains. I'm all for bashing Rivet, but this might ve the only right thing they did in this DLC.
     
  33. Warspite

    Warspite Well-Known Member

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    Regardless of the date of any of these photos, the one thing which should be obvious to everyone (including Rivet and DTG) is that they all feature HSTs which aren’t even in the route. I know I keep going on about the absence of an HST on here but this will be the main reason I cannot buy the route, class 150 sounds aside. Unless, of course, we ever get an HST in a DLC.
     
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  34. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I think there has been so much discussion now about the class 43 and various other things I'd currently think I was buying one shoe of a pair. Money's going to go to DTG for one of their old or current routes I think at this time.
     
  35. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    I agree. A valenta HST is badly needed. DTG are quick enough to re-use the 101 DMU, the 66, or the 377 electrostar in various guises, I don’t see why they can’t get the sounds from AP and redesign the cab etc. sell as a stand alone product like that 31 or 33 if nothing else. It would sell like hot cakes
     
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  36. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Maybe AP don't want to sell them?
    And it wouldn't just be the cab. Matt said this on stream several times. It would be another rebuild from the ground up job

    This is kind of true. The two versions of the 66 are still a thing... Played the one on GWE yesterday and wished I'd never touched the horn button
     
  37. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to sound like an armchair CEO again, but can't Rivet have published West Cornwall Local using DTG's GWR license? That way we would already have an appropriate HST to layer on. Choosing 1990's just because of licensing seems like more effort than is necessary.
     
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  38. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the license stipulations.
    Given DTG couldn't officially use anything other than the 43 in the green on green livery I would suggest that the license may well be quite restrictive.
    People seem to assume that if you have a license for something then it's easy to get a license for more, which isn't necessarily the case
     
  39. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    166?
     
  40. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if some licenses are route specific, say with GWR on GWE. That might detract from re-obtaining licenses for use on other routes containing the same TOCs.
     
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  41. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, forgot about that, but again that's only in GWE green
     
  42. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, because First said "don't do FGW dynamic lines pls kthxbye" (probably a bit more professionally though).

    Given they seemed to have a good relationship with FGW/GWR in the past on TS1 and using their license more generally (example, a fully-branded GWR HST appears in the TS1 South Wales Mainline (even the unbranded re-release from last year) and FGW has appeared in many TS1 add-ons in the past), I find it odd that the TSW license would be so restrictive as to only apply to one route.
     
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  43. fanta1682002

    fanta1682002 Well-Known Member

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    WHY
    Coming Soon
     
  44. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    It would be interesting to understand what they've swept up on it. I know there was menus but it would be good to understand what else
     
  45. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    DVD wouldn't sound and achievements don't work. I think those and the blank menus are the main reasons it was postponed. Sam gave a provisional date of 4th November so we may hear/see something next week.
     
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  46. Skyz2020

    Skyz2020 Well-Known Member

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  47. fanta1682002

    fanta1682002 Well-Known Member

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  48. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Well that's a sale price we will miss this time round
     
  49. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    Achievements work fine (at least, the six I have got so far).
     
  50. Ravi

    Ravi Well-Known Member

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