PlayStation What A Team

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by keith_gilham, Jan 27, 2023.

  1. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    So the new dlc that’s been filling my inbox and social media accounts with it propaganda is out on the 26th yay yay yay spend your money with us it’s great….

    “Oh there’s an issue with the console release so will release it on the 31st” Ha so once again another dlc I predict that looks cool as hell simply won’t work… what is it this time? Red lights? Points that won’t route correctly? Random spads? Or the really fun performance issues of horse show pass those 6fps are fine just sell it to em they won’t mind……do you guys actually test anything ?? Convince me otherwise!!!
     
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  2. DTG Matt

    DTG Matt Executive Producer Staff Member

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    An issue was found with the TMS screens and rather than try and rush to push something out that might break the game entirely we decided to pull the release - and a 5 day gap is the minimum, hence it's 5 days later.

    ... and yes, it ultimately transpired Xbox had the same issue - however in my defense... the developer consoles do NOT exhibit it and work 100% perfectly - so I had no idea at all this was going to happen.

    Matt.
     
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  3. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    In game development, some issues only show up on release/last minute. Everything's working fine and then something goes wrong. Other games suffer this too. You can never have bug free games these days. And like Matt said, the issue didn't show up while he was testing it using the dev console. And the issue popped up very last minute. Dtg didn't intentionally create the bug. If you know anything about game development, then you would know that issues will pop up last minute. Would you rather have a broken release or have it delayed and fixed.
     
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  4. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    Matt, seriously, that is no defence at all. Are you really suggesting that no one actually tests (or simply plays) the release candidate on a normal, non-production, console or PC before it’s sent for people to spend money on? That actually beggars belief.

    I’ve been saying for years that many of the issues with each TSW DLC are immediately obvious within half an hour of simply playing the game. Now we know why every first stream is met with horror by the people watching, no one has actually played it before. You’re the Senior Producer here, what is going on?
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2023
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  5. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    You mean like horseshoe curve or spirit of steam or west Cornwall or boston or London commuter?? To name a few
     
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  6. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    how strange the developer consoles work 100% fine but everyoneeeeeeee else’s they have an issue and as for the not pushing something out and risk breaking the game completely why change the habit of the last few years?? As I mentioned above all the dlcs that are full of bugs… I own all 3 versions of tsw and I have now just about every dlc and loco add on so I am fairly committed to the product! I would really really like just for once one of the new dlcs to be able to play ??? Is that too much to ask Matt? West Cornwall for instance an hour and a bit of traveling in a 37 only to run into your best ever issue “red light means stop” or clinchfeild run down the track hour plus swapping out consists on a siding only to get trapped in the siding by a train going up hill That’s stuck behind a red because my caboose is staged on the main line… spirit of steam telling me I’ve driven through a red signal when there is no red signal!!!!! I know you need to add content to keep money rolling in and the game developed but slow down id rather weight a bit longer for a complete wow factor dlc then your current “knock one out over lunch who cares if it works we will do another and the suckers will buy it and forgot the old one” approach
     
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  7. SBos

    SBos Well-Known Member

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    Thank goodness they delayed the release for PlayStation. Given all the issues I have read about won’t be bothering at all now so saved nearly £30.

    Yet another route with so many issues that all of them will never be fixed. DTG and Rivet learn absolutely nothing.
     
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  8. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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  9. elric#1386

    elric#1386 Well-Known Member

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    As I've stated in other threads. Beta testers are needed. Players that don't have developers hardware. When a product is believed to be completed, hand it over to a handful of volunteers outside of the company, Everyday folk like the members of this forum. Let them do a independent Beta Test for a few months. You can then fix it as the reports come in. Then when they are happy, and you are happy go ahead with the release.
    As it is now your system doesn't work! Announce new Item, a few weeks later release said Item for general sale, with no real world testing. It's so obvious it's going to be full of bugs!
    How you operating at the moment and have been, you are basically asking the consumer to pay £30 to test the product for you with little hope of it getting fixed!

    If you asked for beta testers to help find the bugs, I would be willing to wait a few months from announcement to it's release. I also think a lot of the members of this forum would also, knowing that we will be buying a quality product instead of a white elephant?

    Come on DTG, Rivet it's time to change your policies and bring in Beta Testing!
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2023
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  10. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    Yup same done several beta tests over the years and we all know bugs are there for testing… finished product is a joke with dtg and let’s not mention the ticket farce sorry I mean system
     
  11. jefalcon6

    jefalcon6 Active Member

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    I agree with the above posts. New routes should be tested on a normal console before release. Is this not current SOP?
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2023
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  12. elric#1386

    elric#1386 Well-Known Member

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    Well it certainly explains why when we put a ticket in, they respond with "We have tested it on our system and everything is working as it should be"?
    I put a ticket in about the derailment in SoS Edge Hill Sheds, Edge Hill Yard, where you derail reversing up to take on coal. I sent them screen shots. But apparently it just doesn't happen. Because on their system it's working fine! So they suggested that I make sure I have the points set correctly. Now reversing back to get the coal you are approaching the points from the bottom of the Y so if you don't change them you go right instead of left. Taking the Wrong route Should Not Derail a loco!
    Incidentally to complete this scenario don't reverse back directly to the coal chute, just take the right on the points and reverse up so you can approach the coal chute from behind. Doing this you don't derail.
     
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  13. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    I recently did some beta testing for a developer for a product for another sim (not SimRail). They asked for volunteers to state their case why they should be involved, picked who they wanted, had us sign an NDA and off we went.

    We were testing the product in the consumer environment on a variety of different hardware setups and I think it’s fair to say collectively the feedback given, and the developers willingness to act on it promptly made a massive difference to the product that was released. They are committed to receiving further feedback to develop and improve the product post-release via the same channels. I’ve been very impressed with the whole thing.

    Contrast that with this 5 year old title where seemingly no-one play-tests on a non-developer machine before release, and then release after release is a bug-ridden shambles. What can you say to it, other than it’s shambolic.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2023
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  14. elric#1386

    elric#1386 Well-Known Member

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    I beta tested Windows XP Pro. Also had to state why, then when I was sent the DL link had to sign a contract then it installed.
     
  15. DTG Matt

    DTG Matt Executive Producer Staff Member

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    Just to be clear - it's not actually possible to put unreleased content onto a retail console from either Sony or Microsoft. The idea is that developer consoles are supposed to mimic the real things and this is the first instance we've found where the Microsoft one doesn't.

    There may be a way to solve this in the future when we're able to do beta for unreleased products - but we're still working with MS and Sony on how to achieve that on DLC.

    Also, let's not confuse issues - i'm specifically talking about the TMS issue on the 385. Other topics referenced above are likely other things that should be reproducible with enough info. I don't know the specific cases being talked about, but I do know that often we don't get enough info on tickets such as "every services crashes" so we try a few and none crash - turned out, it was just a handful that crashed but without detail, we couldn't find it. When you report a ticket, please be specific down to the most stupid pointless minutia that can't possibly be relevant and even if you think it's "every" then please just give a few examples that are "specifically", then we can take it from there.

    Matt.
     
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  16. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    The ticket I sent in about horse shoe farce was exactly as you asked I gave the details of the route/scenerio/timetable and the details of the issue “red light can’t turn a wheel from the very beginning” this was the same day I think the dlc was released… being told to skip it and play on timetable isn’t really the best answer is it? I posted the issue on the forum in the bug checker section and someone replied ahh ty yes we are looking into it and we’ll get back to soon as we have an idea…. Well blow me tsw3 is now out and still no answer… and the fact if I skip the level to do the next one the frame rate is absolutely shocking!!! And tbh unplayable I would/could maybe understand this if I had a pc and bought the dlc knowing my graphics card and memory etc weren’t upto the levels required…. Buts I bought the console dlc therefore it should be turn it on and it will work… Matt ?? Surely you can see the frustration of the player base? Nothing on the console gets fixed… just move on to a new dlc so they forget about old broken stuff must be in Latin over the doors there
     
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  17. FredElliott

    FredElliott Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  18. DTG Matt

    DTG Matt Executive Producer Staff Member

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    Do you have the ticket number? If so i'll go look it up and find out where it went.

    Matt.
     
  19. keith_gilham

    keith_gilham Active Member

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    Unfortunately not.. however the same issues are still there.. I can post a new ticket if it will actually do anything?
     
  20. DTG Matt

    DTG Matt Executive Producer Staff Member

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    Yes Please - and ping me the details so I can follow it through the system!

    Thanks Keith
     
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  21. ExcelsiorGamingYT

    ExcelsiorGamingYT Well-Known Member

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    That's not actually true, I can't say much due to NDAs

    That's not actually correct I can't say much due to NDAS but I'm on xbox and I'm testing new expansion dlc for a game that's been on xbox a while now. It won't be out for the general public for a few months yet. So consoles can test unreleased content
     
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  22. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I think these preview streams need to be a minimum of four weeks out for a good few hours so people can support whatever publisher with feedback.

    4 weeks out must be close to a final build and surely the engagement and support of 100s of eyes watching and listening will be beneficial.

    there's too much getting past the beta team into final release builds the community pick up and in londonmidland case rectify or improve within a week
     
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  23. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

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    Why is that no surprise at all…
     

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