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What To Do About The Nec

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Mikeboy, Sep 9, 2020.

  1. Mikeboy

    Mikeboy Member

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    I thought I would express some thoughts about a way of bringing the NEC back to TSW, given it's been noted by DTG in the streams that Amtrack's now strange absence from TSW has been noted. Matt's reasoning for why NEC didn't become preserved in the live stream made a good deal of sense (and also explained why Sand Patch Grade was effectively a remake rather than becoming preserved).

    Personally I didn't buy NEC for TSW2020 due to the short route length and the poor reviews. While I seem to have been retroactively vindicated I can understand why people may be annoyed that this one route didn't make it through.

    My idea is therefore to remaster the section of track between New Rochelle and Newark Itl., along with the locos, as done with SPG as part of an extended route down to Philadelphia 30th Street Station which includes the Acela loco. In total this represents 29.2 miles of remastered track, and 77.9 miles of new track.

    Given this is a bumper pack I think that would justify a higher price (say £30 rather than the usual £25); a discount for TSW2020 NEC owner to reduce the cost to the usual pricing could then be offered (which with one new loco and 78 miles of track would be IMO quite justified). The SW1000 and Metroliner (along with the Keystone services) could then be remastered and then unlocked for those who already had it, and there will be new purchases from people like myself.

    This route would open up a whole bunch of potential add-on DLC options, including the NJ Transit's Northeast Corridor and New Jersey Coast routes, SEPTA's Trenton Line, and various long distance services (including sleepers, which would be an interesting addition) that operate along the route.
     
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  2. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    I’d want it to go all the way down to DC. I want to have a good distance to operate the Acela. I would like them to include NJ Transit along with it to increase the variety of trains and services on the route.
     
  3. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I'd rather have Boston to Providence.
     
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  4. Mich

    Mich Active Member

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    The 77 mile extension on its own would be the longest route in the game, the Acela alongside having to redo the existing route on top of that would be a large work flow, I think too large to reasonably expect. However I do agree with the general idea that the route should be remastered and extended, personally this is what I'd suggest.

    1: Remaster and fix the existing route and stock: Don't think this really needs explaining, I think pretty much everyone agrees with this point.

    2: Extend to Stamford: Sure it wouldn't be huge extension, but it's more way more manageable than extending the line to Philly or New Haven. And I think the extra 15-20 miles would still go a long way towards addressing the length issue as this would still be enough to put it pretty much in line with SPG or PC lengthwise.

    3: Include the GP40-2 and/or SW1000R: Would serve a good way to make rebuying the route way more tolerable for people that don't already own them. If you already owned could give you a bigger discount than if you just had the route.

    This isn't as exciting as the Acela proposal by any means, but I think everything I listed is very doable knowing the limitations of what's been released.
     
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  5. stinkyheadsman

    stinkyheadsman Member

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    Totally agree with this. Much more feasible (financially for DTG and just possible) which makes it more possible.
     
  6. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

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    I agree something should be done with the NEC route. Although it wasn't my favourite route, I'm still sad it didn't make it to preserved collection. I'm actually happy that I never bought the SW1000R DLC, which I think isn't a good sign. I don't think DTG should ever want people to be happy they haven't bought their product. I still think this situation should be fixed, in one way or another.

    The train simulation hobby has always been about building up a collection. Having DLC not carry over from one TSW-version to another TSW-version is something that I consider a very bad thing. Considering what happened to NEC, which other DLC can we expect not to be preserved in future TSW-versions? I don't even want to have such a question. I want to rely on my collection being preserved in future TSW-versions...
     
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  7. uvm0902

    uvm0902 Member

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    I kindly ask DTG to return to the NEC revision. I'm waiting for the route in my collection.
     
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  8. Luke8899

    Luke8899 Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion this is a high expectation, train simulation hobbyist or not. Expecting the same base volume of content on each new subsequent release of a game will at best serve only to delay any new content as more and more effort each time goes into ensuring older content is updated for new software requirements and particularly on console. The fact that DTG are not even charging for this is, again in my opinion, madness, and that people still complain about one route not being included and upgraded for free is one of the many oddities of this train sim hobby-ist world. Few if any other games companies would do what DTG has done here, and certainly few would have done so at no additional cost to the user. Personally, I'd sooner a new Amtrak route than DTG rebuild NEC, which is still perfectly playable along with the SW1000R in TSW2020.
     
  9. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

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    I think most of us who bought content for TSW never expected a TSW2 so soon. This might be an expectation built up from Train Simulator, which, despite the updates it received, still fully supports all the content made for the game years ago, and even combining any of this content in several ways.

    One of the things that adds value to the content is that it can be combined. Running any train on any route, adding more flexibility and possiblities. Considering these routes aren't cheap, I think it's pretty decent to expect a collection built up over the years keeps being supported. I'm not asking for new features here. I'm not asking for fixing any bugs NEC had. But I do think it's not unreasonable to request NEC to be available for TSW2.

    It adds value to a DLC if you can rely on it that it also will work in a future update. If any DLC can be left out and not be preserved in a future version, there's no real point in building up a collection at all, and I might as well reconsider spending any money on this.

    Doesn't the Trainz-series support content bought for older editions? I don't know many other train simulators to compare with.

    I do know both Euro Truck Simulator 2 and American Truck Simulator get frequent updates, even on older DLC, for completely free.
    In Farming Simulator, content from previous game versions, including DLC for previous versions, are added as optional mods, free to download for anyone, regardless of having ever owned the previous game or its DLC.

    So you don't mind paying again for the SW1000R or are you expecting a free update here?
     
  10. paul.tuc

    paul.tuc New Member

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    My suggestion would be make the NEC a reduced price since you can only play it on TSW2020 and therefore because it cannot work on TSW2 then a price reduction could see more people instead in it as it is.
     
  11. uvm0902

    uvm0902 Member

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    I cannot imagine a DTG simulator without the northern corridor. I want this to happen as early as possible.
     
  12. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I would prefer DTG to make a better section of the NEC, instead if bringing the current one to TSW2.
     
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  13. vogelm10

    vogelm10 Well-Known Member

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    So I'm confused. I thought they said all dlc content from tsw2020 was going to be made free for tsw2. Seems to me that's not the case at all.
     
  14. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    So from even before the release, they made it clear that the NEC wasn’t coming to TSW 2. That’s pretty much the only drawback from preserved collection as the livery designer is going to be added gradually. Now what I hope they do, personally, is make a route with both the new and old Acela, as well as an ACS-64. But this would be a new route, hopefully longer than the old one. Perhaps it could include a CSX timetable as well like how the German routes support trains released earlier.

    Honestly, as much as people complain about TSW, I think they need to stop. It’s the best train simulator currently available in my opinion, and though you may disagree, it sure is the best looking one, and the only one on console. What we need to improve the game is some good competition.
     
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  15. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    I've said before that the section of the NEC they modeled for TSW was maybe the worst possible choice. It's short, which is fine IMO, but having Penn Station at the midpoint just kills any sort of momentum for the ACS-64, which is a shame since it's a nice model. Keystone cabcar is virtually useless. No NJT traffic even though they have that license. I do like the CSX portion and the Amtrak switcher though.

    I hope some form of NEC comes to TSW2 eventually, though. Newark Penn to 30th St would be nice IMO. Lack of SEPTA license would kinda suck, but they could cheat and use NJT stock for local service between Trenton and 30th St.

    Add in Acela and you'd have a properly busy route.
     
  16. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    I think DC or Philadelphia to Penn Station would be a nice route.
     
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  17. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Original MSTS had DC to Philly IIRC.
     
  18. CrazyDash

    CrazyDash Active Member

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    I totally agree. Short + high speed trains is just a horrible combination. They are the most boring routes in the game cuz you only stop twice on the line. And you don’t even get to go 125mph on the route we were given. An extension would be a very good idea. The only issue is that is about 90-100 miles which is a bit of a stretch for TSW2 since our longest route is the TGV Duplex route we are getting soon which is only 50 miles. But I would totally support this.
     
  19. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I think if DTG have said that it would be easier to start from scratch, then I'd like to see a different chunk of Amtrak represented to start things off. Maybe part of Keystone Corridor. If they're planning on redoing the ACS-64 and Amfleet cars, those run the Keystone Service, and if they can secure the license, SEPTA's Silverliner IV could represent the Paoli/Thorndale line. The P40 Genesis (for partial Pennsylvanian service) and SEPTA's Silverliner V could be added for DLC down the road. Running from 30th Street Station out to Coatesville would be about 40 miles (comparable to SKA), plus a little extra trackage to Suburban Station to have a proper SEPTA terminus.

    SEPTA currently has ACS-64 variants, for which the Amtrak model could presumably be simply re-liveried, as well as Comet cars, which could be hopefully reused without too much effort for any future NJ Transit add-ons.
     
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  20. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    I think this would be an awesome route if they could get the SEPTA license, for all the reasons you list. Additionally, the SEPTA ACS-64's have a really cool livery, and Paoli/Thorndale line would give you the upper level at 30th Street, which has nice views of the surrounding city and could actually look pretty good in UE4.

    Keystone service stops at Ardmore, Paoli, Exton, Downingtown, and Coatesville, right? SEPTA currently terminates at Thorndale, but is supposed to extend to Coatesville once station renovations are completed- not sure if COVID has caused any project delays though.
     
  21. malikrthr

    malikrthr Well-Known Member

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    I really hope DTG considers bringing some form of the NEC to TSW2. It would be crazy if NEC is usually featured in many train simulators. I would be glad if NY-Penn to Washington is featured or even NY-Penn to Boston.
     
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  22. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I believe those stations are correct. The Pennsylvanian would only stop at Paoli and Exton in this section of the route. I have no idea what SEPTA's plans are--sometimes (most of the time), I'm not fully convinced SEPTA even knows what its plans are.

    Amtrak 30th Street Station would look phenomenal rendered in Unreal--coming down from the SEPTA platforms into the main concourse, and then down to the Amtrak platforms. Especially if they fudged the date setting of the route and could model the old flip-board that's sadly no longer there.
     
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  23. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I'm sticking with my suggestion of Boston to Providence. Here's why. 150 mph for the Acela, that section has never been in a simulator, and MBTA wants in.
     
  24. Mikeboy

    Mikeboy Member

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    Appreciate this is longer, however DTG have said before that the limitation leading to shorter routes is not a technical one, but a time/money one. Now that we've got IoW which is charging less for a shorter route I think they could at least try the principle of charging more for a longer route. I know I'd be willing to pay more for one that's got more content.
     
  25. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    My take on what should be done with NEC is to leave it as it is and anyone who wants to play it can play it in TSW2020. It’s still there, fully available to play, and only the player’s decision not to have TSW2020 installed is standing in their way of playing it. DTG can then focus all their attention on bringing new routes to TSW2.
     
  26. ixofxiii

    ixofxiii Active Member

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    Idk. It only goes 150 for what, 20 mins?
    Meanwhile, "the Raceway" (new Brunswick to Trenton) is a nice stretch of straightaway for a constant 135 plus most of Jersey is a nice stretch once you get past Rahway.
    It took the Acela I was on a few weeks ago an hour to go from NY Penn Station to Gray 30th St station
     

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