What's The Next Big Thing Tsw2 Offers Up

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by chieflongshin, Jan 22, 2022.

  1. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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  2. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Well we have Matt and Nat on the stream this week. Cue questions about why preserved updates are taking their time getting though qa. I would say they'll be a tease this week, a couple of hard questions from Nat for us to hear about. mid be very surprised if preserved updates are announced without Adam about.
    Hopefully not a kick a can down the road stream
     
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  3. Aldarion

    Aldarion Member

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    Haven't checked the roadmap stream this week but I'm very sad to see that my two favourite routes have dropped down in the priorities list - TVL and NTP :(:(:(
     
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  4. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I am not sure BL ever had 80% market share, it was more like 40%. The Ford Cortina and then the Escort were the best selling cars in Britain during the 70's and 80's. The Austin/Morris 1100/1300 was the best seller before that, which was a BMC product. However, having had examples of most BL cars over the last few years and having an Cowley build Austin Rover product sitting on my drive, I can say that BL cars were no worse than any of the competitors at the time. Indeed BL and BMC before it were well ahead on the technological front, using FWD, transverse engines, hatchbacks, 5 speed gearboxes and innovative suspensions systems well before many other competitors, it was only really Renault and Citroen who were probably more innovative. BL's main downfall was lack of investment in the right areas and unions who went on strike at the drop of a hat.

    If the government hadn't allowed BMW to buy Rover from BAE we would still have a thriving car industry. The collaboration with Honda in the 80's and early 90's was very sucessful and produced market leading cars. Unfortunately BMW only wanted the Mini and 4WD technology and allowed the rest of the range to stagnate and then sold the carcus off and sadly then it was doomed to failure.

    I think the beginning of the year is always quiet, I imagine they are still planning for the year ahead. There is a lot less on the roadmap now in terms of up and coming releases so not so much to get excited about I guess.
     
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  5. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    The Mini was also selling well in Japan before BMW got their hands on it and when they did the first thing they did was destroy all the jigs that made the original Mini as they feared the competition. BMC,BL,Austin Rover produce some good cars Rover V8, Mini as well as others, yes they made not so good ones like the Allegro that was reported to go faster backwards but I used to hitchhike to work and sometimes I used to get picked up in an Allegro and sometimes a 2CV and I would take the Allegro everytime over that 2CV. ;)
     
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  6. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I had two Allegro's fairly recently and they are very underrated, they are like a big mini, fun to drive with safe handling but far more comfortable to ride in. Compared to an equivalent Escort or Chevette they were a far nicer inside and more advanced, they didn't have acres of bare metal. I would love a 2CV but they are silly prices now, the Dyane was a better car though.

    Anyway I fear this is very much thread drift!
     
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  7. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I've not long finished eating, sat here with a beer (good old tiger) and thought I'll have a look at the thread. Through one diluted pupil I've sat and thought I was on pistonheads instead.

    Most definitely drifted off topic.

    I do have a theory though that there will be something interesting released in summer. They spoke about a summer update last night so I'd envisage something big coming to core
     
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  8. fabristunt

    fabristunt Well-Known Member

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    I feel like I am missing something. Has this discussion spiralled into the usual Britain good, rest of the world bad as ususal?
     
  9. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    No, not in the slightest we were talking about misplaced attacks on BL. But it was my fault so back to what we were talking about.

    Matt talked about the next core update, I hope it is given more time this time around. But when would they think about doing that? July/August?
     
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  10. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    Most Likely, because that was when the rush hour update was announced. Probably they're going to put 3 packs again
     
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  11. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    August is a quiet period for software sales as people are away, spending more time outdoors, so it makes sense to put a major release out in this period to capture as much revenue as possible.
     
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  12. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Steam locomotives and down the Road ÖBB routes. In the future Motorail trains ÖBB Timetables lists this Autoreisezug these use Hccrrs waggons Rear Pantograph safe but when you have Laaers 560s Sekqrs Ddm 915s behind the locomotive followed by WLABMZ coaches front Pantograph up. You don't see that on AI Trains pulling Zacns future Zagkks LNG wagon Zags LPG and Laaers560s since they run rear Pantograph up which is unsafe in real life. If you have a Motorail train in timetable mode you need to break it down as part 1 Shunt the Hccrrs Laaers 560s or Sekqrs Ddm 915s to the loading Dock then drive the passenger coaches to the platform part 2. ÖBB used to do this on Köln Duisburg railway at Düsseldorf Hbf pre 2021 when the Düsseldorf Train went to Amsterdam via Duisburg Oberhausen-Arnhem Railway. Currently seen at Hamburg Altona EN490 Hans Albers Innsbruck Hbf to Hamburg Altona which has a Motorail dock. Also allows Amtrak Autotrain.
     
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  13. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    I think the most valuable Big Project - and it is a big one - that DTG should engage in is fixing the save routine so that it works reliably, so that one no more worries about coming back to where one left off than in any other game. Sure, there are a lot of variables to track- but there are a lot to track in an RPG or 4x game, and they seem to manage it. I never worry that restarting Crusader Kings is going to result in my campaign being an unsalvageable wreck.
     
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  14. rabid

    rabid Well-Known Member

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    That last roadmap stream seemed to imply that DTG have a serious bottleneck in their QA process. They have been outsourcing to third world countries and these QA centres have been understaffed due to various reasons. Sounds like they need to start investing closer to home and get the queue moving. There must be plenty of people in the UK who would welcome a bit of part time QA testing work surely? As a player these roadmaps are informative but frustratingly they highlight the internal processes tying themselves in knots in DTGs organisation.
     
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  15. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Not the first company to be bitten by the lure of cheap labour
     
  16. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    That is true enough. Do you play CK3? How is the Royalty pack?

    Doesn't make it right though.
     
  17. roysto25

    roysto25 Active Member

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    I agree on the lure of cheap labour. In Mumbai there is a major problem with burn-out - paradoxically, not due to the work, but the incredible nightmare of commuting for hours to get to work (most employees cannot afford to live in Mumbai itself). The result is extremely high turnover - this means the apparent advantage of cheap labour is wiped out by the low productivity and training issues (since many new employees are straight from IIT and only know a product 'out of the box')
     
  18. roysto25

    roysto25 Active Member

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    The reality is that Microsoft got in the OS business because Digital Research (prime supplier of OS for IBM main frames) made a major blunder in not taking the PC (and DOS) seriously, thus opening the door for Microsoft. They later made DR-DOS, a far better OS than MS-DOS (as was IBM's own version), but it was too late - Microsoft was a much more agile and unscrupulous competitor and having the system in all OEM machines was the killer, since 99+% of users just use what they are given.
    Just remember that Bill Gates was the person who said that no-one would ever need more than 128mb of ram and the internet would go nowhere.
     
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  19. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Multiplayer
     
  20. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    Career Mode
     
  21. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Good idea for me ÖBB routes because some sleeper trains run with Hccrrs covered autoracks Laaers 560s & Sekqrs ddm 915s. Laaers & Ddm 915 need front pantograph up Hccrrs rear pantograph up. Requires a Motorail dock. ÖBB terminology for those is Autoreisezug
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
  22. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    First the save system should be first, before adding these new mode, and update ;)
     
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  23. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    More realistic Snow such as like this video in real life
     
  24. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    I think what is NOT coming is these Preserved route updates. Why was none released with this DLC that was released yesterday. DTG keep saying slots were important and we know some Preserved updates are ready so why no release? The way sam was hinting in his stream he made it sound they were coming any day now.
     
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  25. malakhit

    malakhit Member

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    Honestly, one of the first priorities should be getting TSW2 to a point where it has feature parity with TS2022. The fact that we're still lumbered with the incredibly basic scenario editor, and no consist editor, is one of the most confusing parts of TSW2 for me - a game from 2009 has managed to get this right, but the latest and greatest product can't? Unfortunately, service mode and the prebuilt scenarios will only keep people's attention for so long before they've seen it all and done it all; choosing not to give users the power to make their own fun is going to limit the game's long-term appeal.

    After that, I can't see any way to avoid addressing the fact that TSW2 is still lacking a lot of the content that TS2022 has. Obviously this is something that can only come with time, but TS2022 has the considerable advantage of third-party developers like Armstrong Powerhouse and Searchlight Simulations, to name but a couple. I know developing for TSW2 is supposedly harder (though given that it's using the fairly well-documented Unreal Engine, I'm not sure why...) and there are more stringent licensing requirements this time around, but those developers really pushed the envelope with what was possible in TS2022, and added valuable variety to the sim environment. I can only hope that more developers can gain access to the TSW2 dev kit, and start producing that important variety of content that the game currently lacks.

    Finally, there's just the number of irritating little bugs that have been known about for a good year or more but never seem to get attention. I get that Dovetail is a relatively small studio working on a rather niche title, and therefore it's hard to find the dev time to sort out technical debt, but keeping existing paying customers on-side is important for such a studio, and one thing that is guaranteed to do that is listening to the customer base and fixing the problems that they point out for you.
     
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  26. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    It would be good to see some proper snow. Deep snow, trains with ploughs and the snow blowing out the way like this. Those thuds of snow are incredible. Looks like Dresden elephant has been hit by train too. Equally check out the steam train with the sparks. Just looks beautiful.
    (On a side note NS Trains seem to hit a lot of things)

     
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  27. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    For some reason I cannot see your pic/video chieflongshin but if I quote your message I get the link in Brackets.
     
  28. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    That's odd, I'm not too sure to be honest. Seems to be ok locally.

    upload_2022-2-20_19-53-40.png
     
  29. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    I see that one, how odd. Can't play it though.
     
  30. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Well-Known Member

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    DLSS is a big feature I would like to see to improve frame rates. This is now a possibility with the current UE version.
     
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  31. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    And useless to anyone who doesn't have an RTX card.
     
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  32. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I’m still in the air with dlss. It made some difference to cyberpunk but I wasn’t blown away. The scenario editor would be a welcome upgrade, be nice to see more of what people could create.
    One thing I’d like to see more of is scenario or radio chatter. Perhaps an ability to have silent communication with signaller if you tab, but vocal if you press phone or radio.

    Sam mentioned he’s working on a pick a train first, route second approach. Thank food for this. The current system is clunky as hell, especially with the German route. I think the UI will get an overhaul too.
     
  33. 59321747

    59321747 Well-Known Member

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    I hope to upgrade to Unreal 5 before the end of the year, more real world and scene, I want to experience the real train driver in the game.
     
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  34. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    No chance, they only moved to 4.26 last year. I don't think unreal 5 will please the people that like detail and FPS just yet. Matt had said it's not on the radar either.
     
  35. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    imo Unreal 5.0 will mean TSW 3.0 and probably for the 9th gen + PC only but then it will be some time off, I doubt it will be this year. Unless of course 9th gen sales goes through the roof and then who knows?
     
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  36. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    TSW's processing requirements are already crushing 8th-gen consoles and older PCs. A step-change to UE5 would shrink TSW's player base to whatever rather small percentage of players own unobtainable-unless-scalper-priced 9th gen consoles, or PCs that cost the price of a decent used car.
     
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  37. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    Agree, Why would they move to UE5 when UE4 is already a problem, and also on top of that most Simulation Games aren't even using UE5. Maybe until they fix the current problem that we are having in UE4, then they will talk about it when ready. As of right now they should stick with UE4
     
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  38. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that sounds like the logical thing to happen. By the time the majority of Gen 8 players have moved on to Gen 9 I'd think that the state of Unreal 5 will be very well known to developers and then DTG can consider it properly. How long that will take remains to be seen, I suspect 2 or 3 years at minimum personally.
     
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  39. Mich

    Mich Well-Known Member

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    Why would 9th gen sales cause them to go to a new engine when they already support them just fine under the UE4 based TSW2? If anything 9th gen success would just cause them to double down on the current 9th gen versions of TSW2. I don't think it would be worth fracturing the small train simulator population with a second simulator on the same platform. Maybe when the PlayStation 6 is a thing then maybe you'll see a UE5 based train sim from DTG, but until that point I doubt you'll see anything of the sort.
     
  40. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    I never meant that, what I meant is if 9th gen sales went through the roof (which is doubtful) they would have an excuse to stop supporting 8th gen. They make money now off of 8th gen but as I said if 9th gen sales really took off at the expense of 8th gen they would not make a profit, and If that happened I find it hard to believe DTG would continue with them. But imo that is still a long way off.
     
  41. WVUadam

    WVUadam Well-Known Member

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    Train conductor role
     
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  42. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree and that's how both the LIRR Yellow M7 & Harlem Line Blue Metro-North M7 does work in real life usually the middle cars UK & Europe railway Carriages. Where they are located 3rd if 6 car formation 4th 8 car train 5th 10 car train 6th car for a 12 car train
     
  43. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

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    At this stage, to me it's clear that they are emphasising a bit on monetising the game. They built this road with Diesel legends I believe and it seems it had the desired effect to do more of them. There will be ads in the game by the looks of it.

    How they will use the new income sources, we'll have to see.

    There was quite a noise made by the community after the Rush hour delay and fails plus a few other sub par routes. Not enough time passed over those events to see how the developer changed in that regard and determine a how things will go from now on development wise. I think the second part of the year could show us if they truly cared back then or they go by the same old.

    Another new approach that I'm seeing is that Matt dedicates personal time to play the game on console to look for issue that players report and the overall feeling of the game on Xbox at least. This is something that I value from him, despite being a PC player. I think this shows respect and implication and I hope it will materialise sooner rather than later into improvements for that console.

    I hope they are actively working on bringing DX 12 to PC especially since Xbox already has it since the last core update.

    My biggest hope is for proper weather and liveliness in the environment around the tracks but this is an utopia on the current engine and not going to happen.

    They seem to have forgotten that TSW 2 should be an improvement over TS as when they build the same routes in TSW 2 in many cases they lack the length, locomotives or rolling stock we used to have in the old TS. To me, the "evolution of train simulation" should at least start from where TS left it and deliver the same quantity as minimum on the new engine, not less.

    (sorry if it's too much text)
     
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  44. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    TSW/PC has run fine on DX12 since the UE 4.26 upgrade. It defaults to DX11, but it's easy to change.
     
  45. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    What's the difference between DX11 and DX12?
     
  46. Quentin

    Quentin Well-Known Member

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    Oversimplifying drastically, DX12 moves work from the CPU to the GPU. So if you have a fast graphics card and a (relatively) slow CPU, it can improve framerate (other things being equal). If the reverse is true it could reduce framerate.
     
  47. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    What would be my best option since my graphic card is a gtx760 and my CPU is an i7-11700K?
     
  48. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

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    I know, I use it with DX 12 as many of us do. I mentioned it since they made it work on console they should make it work and become the default on PC as well.
    This is one of those surprise upgrades that wasn´t on the roadmap but made to Xbox. I hope it follows the same ¨surprise¨ road on PC and not remains forgotten in a corner somewhere because it requires too much work and doesn´t bring any cash in. ;)
     
  49. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    I meant on PC, which is what I use. And, as mentioned above, DX12 might not be preferable depending on one's hardware. For those with older/slower GPUs it's a downgrade.
     
  50. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

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    I agree. I think they´ve mentioned several times that from the data collected via surveys they know that the majority of players have low performance systems.
    I believe this is a historical characteristic of sim players in general regardless if it´s planes, trains, buses etc.

    In my opinion, there is already a place for players with less performant systems, that is TS.
    TSW 2 should bring the simulation and graphics to a superior level so a higher requirement should naturally be expected by players.
    It´s why I said in my original post that DTG should remember how the game is described and return to that statement of ¨evolution¨ to deliver as expected.
     
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