Would You Pay Extra For ‘pro Range’ Loco Dlc Add-ons?

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by londonmidland, Mar 28, 2022.

  1. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2017
    Messages:
    2,815
    Likes Received:
    14,358
    As the title says, if the option was there for TSW, would you pay extra for a Pro Range loco DLCs?

    What is a Pro Range DLC?
    Pro Range DLCs offer more accurate sounds, physics and functionality, as well as higher textures and visuals for train DLCs.

    Why do I think a Pro Range is needed for TSW?
    Currently, with the train offerings supplied with TSW, it can be really hit and miss as to whether said train(s) supplied are of a consistent, high quality. Some trains will have great physics, sounds and functionality, however, others can be the complete opposite. Generally, but not exclusively, separate loco DLCs are of a higher quality compared to ones already shipped with a route.

    However, this is not always the case, so it would be nice to have the option for players to choose, as to whether they want to spend a bit more on DLCs if it guaranteed all of the above points.

    Would you be willing to spend extra if it guaranteed better sounds, physics and visuals?
    I think the current pricing of train DLCs is very generous for what you get, so I, personally, would be willing to spend a bit more.
     
    • Like Like x 25
  2. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2021
    Messages:
    2,187
    Likes Received:
    4,504
    The issue I have is it we have a premium price for higher quality are DTG basically admitting the cheaper DLC is bug ridden or has poor sounds/physics.

    I've no issue with paying more for more features/longer routes/trainsets with multiple aspects such as a pendo, ICE4 or a freight loco complete with a rake of premium wagons but things like physics and sounds should he right full stop (or as close as possible).
     
    • Like Like x 31
  3. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    922
    Likes Received:
    1,943
    The issue is that the description of the current non-Pro range includes:

    - Highly detailed, feature-rich, driving cab with accurate true-to-life performance and handling
    - Authentic and detailed sound recordings, recorded from the real locomotives

    Which is exactly what you want right?

    Also who would be the judge of whether it qualifies or not? Extra time spent? Opinions of a set of testers? You only need one dud in the "premium" range and that's it.

    I think with TS Classic they do this because sometimes they are remaking years old stock with newer tech and it is obviously better than before hence premium, but making a set of standards that would define premium here is very difficult.

    Another way of looking at it is that minimum standards should be created and all releases should be subject to these. Skyhook getting sent back is encouraging, but the fact that the new Swiss route has issues with the safety system and still there are issues with WCL suggest that minimum standards are not currently being enforced.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2020
    Messages:
    1,113
    Likes Received:
    763
    If I remember correctly TSxx did something like that a few years back when they came up with something called the pro version of the loco, as you said. I would want to see this come to TSW 2 if the price is reasonable but it also has to be like you said to get all of the trains sounds right which definitely also include the realistic train track noise, flange, squeal, screeching, junction, and track and the detail on the train have to be highly graphic and very close to how it is realistically, also there has to be more control that we can interact with such as windshield wiper where the water actually work and wash the train window, also in-cab full announcement
    for the line, station, and trolley service, and any other control that you can interact with, similar to its real life version. :cool::D
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2020
    Messages:
    954
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    There should be a focus on better sounds, physics and visuals from the outset. We shouldn't have to pay extra for that.
     
    • Like Like x 13
  6. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2018
    Messages:
    1,049
    Likes Received:
    1,662
    Yeah i'm gonna go with the consensus here and say we shouldn't have to pay extra for what's already advertised.

    That's not saying I'm not willing to pay more for DLC, if that's what's needed to improve quality, but if a price-hike is needed it should be implemented across the board, not a further fragmentation of the player-base.
     
    • Like Like x 8
  7. rpeterbroughlowe

    rpeterbroughlowe Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2020
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    128
    "Study Level" would be good.

    Looking at the recent Swiss release, it seems you can just climb in the cab and away you go. In reality ETCS requires 'start of mission details' to be in-putted which is crucially determines to how the system performs (single set, double set etc.).

    TSW is probably war thunder level in terms of simulation, enjoyable but doesn't really require much study. Again, this goes back to to the maturity of the player base and by that, I don't mean age. Expectations are for whatever reason, much lower than flight sims. They just are.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    8,398
    Likes Received:
    12,269
    Well, let's put it this way- Maik Goetz has said that given the amount of time he put into the BR 101, it really wasn't economically viable for the price. If say a 25% surcharge was applied for loco DLCs of that quality, then it would encourage that level of work.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  9. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    In TS1, pro range trains have extra functionality that wouldn't be found in other trains - nothing more, nothing less.

    TSW trains are already more detailed than some of the stuff in the pro range and DTG at least make an effort to make them realistic and simulate features that aren't in many TS1 things, even if they don't work properly.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  10. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2021
    Messages:
    2,187
    Likes Received:
    4,504
    I have zero issue with paying £16 for a loco dlc and £30-£35 for a route dlc providing the quality was there across the board. BUT I'm not going to be standing for some of the QA issues and reduced featured that we've seen recently.

    I'm also not going to drop £16 on a loco dlc only to find said loco is included in another route as standard just with a different livery.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2022
    • Like Like x 5
  11. BlaringHorn

    BlaringHorn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2021
    Messages:
    162
    Likes Received:
    289
    Maybe a poor analogy, but it would feel like having an existing car as a new DLC in a racing game, just with no traction control or ABS available: not really a fan of that "train of thought". Although I have complained about the pricing of some content, I do think loco DLCs could actually be bit more expensive than currently (at least, if they are not DB 187-level quality).
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,857
    Likes Received:
    5,667
    I agree. First improve the quality, sounds, physics and visuals on all locos. Then I would consider paying more. I don't like the notion of a two tier catalog.

    Of course, the question is kind of moot, because we rarely see any new locos in the game. That's one of the things that separates TS from TSW2
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2022
    • Like Like x 5
  13. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    8,398
    Likes Received:
    12,269
    Who races with TC or ABS on????
     
  14. BlaringHorn

    BlaringHorn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2021
    Messages:
    162
    Likes Received:
    289
    I think even in reality, many racecars nowadays have many levels of adjustable driver aids? And they were allowed even in Formula 1 in the early 2000s, IIRC. It's just my assumption that most players play with at least some aids on (unless it's a complete arcade game that doesn't bother with such details), and that the people who play without are the "hardcore" minority.

    Sorry for the OT!
     
  15. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2019
    Messages:
    1,821
    Likes Received:
    4,913
    Locos have already seen a fair cut in what could be considered quality. Not super important things, but it shows more time used to be spent there. Engine rooms are basically all gone if not necessary for getting on and off the train. And look at the undercarriage of good old HST - the number of details there, that's not something you see on new stock.

    I would be fine with some pro-range trains, but I would expect that to be something like Smokebox TS Big Boy in TSW. Locos I get for a normal price should have a decent amount of functionality (definitely everything connected to driving... looking at ACS-64 without cruise control) and authentic well-made sounds. There is absolutely no reason that should be extra.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. gogglesguy

    gogglesguy Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2020
    Messages:
    103
    Likes Received:
    177
    Like with working and accessible toilets? One can certainly dream about attaining the golden throne award in TSW.

    (Edit: those flush sounds better be realistic and in 3D surround sound)
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2022
    • Like Like x 3
  17. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2020
    Messages:
    4,950
    Likes Received:
    8,023
    I might pay more for something really special and as alluded to elsewhere there's a good chance we might see slightly higher pricing on the steam stuff. However it would have to be both really good and something I really want to pay (say) £15.99 as opposed to the regular £11.99. I bought the G6 and while it is a superb model, ultimately I found it a little too modern and shunting/trip freights aren't really my bag so I couldn't say I would have purchased at a higher premium price.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. byeo

    byeo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    2,069
    Yeah, 100% I’d pay more for a “study level” train. I pay the same and continue to do so within Flight Simulator. I’m currently waiting for the Boeing 737 to be released by PMDG which I suspect will cost around £60+.
     
  19. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    922
    Likes Received:
    1,943
    Yes but even the HST has limitations, you can't go into the compartment behind the cab, and you can't get through the carriage door nearest the power car. I was quite disappointed by both of these limitations.
     
  20. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    1,939
    Likes Received:
    3,310
    No. Simply increase the price of DLCs altogether if money is the issue. But don't make separate "actuallyworking" and "half finished" DLCs. That would just give them a reason to make standard DLCs lower quality.

    Anyway for most DLCs the issues are not low detail or incorrect physics, but simply bugs. A bug free product shouldn't be "premium".
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  21. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    There was a lot of disappointment at the time.
     
  22. highland beastie

    highland beastie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2021
    Messages:
    201
    Likes Received:
    405
    I'd be willing to pay extra if the loco has highly realistic sounds, physics and all around and all those kinds of things, but also as much services as possible for that train for every route it runs on and lots of different liveries for it.
     
  23. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    4,297
    Likes Received:
    8,691
    I wouldn’t pay extra for a pro-range of DLC. I would be willing to pay more for DLC if enough time was given to properly develop the DLC to maximise quality and reduce the number of issues. I think a lot of the issues are due to the fact so much DLC is released. Quality over quantity is my firm belief. In my experience, you cannot have both.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  24. Ravi

    Ravi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2021
    Messages:
    395
    Likes Received:
    399
    ummm. I have TS classic and compared to that, almost all locos in TSW are pro-range no?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  25. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    9,191
    Likes Received:
    8,610
    I don't think a pro range is necessary in the same way as it was in TSC. That game was developed for over a decade with different software houses doing different things as tech progressed, so having a "new advanced version" would make sense.
    The only thing different now to when TSW was made is a few versions of UE and how much DTG coders know over what they did then.

    I am happy to accept that the main core functions of a lot of the stock they put out work more than 80% of the time, but I know some people want every door, every button, every sound and every window to work, probably because at some point they're getting bored of actually DRIVING the train and prefer to go poke something til it breaks
     
    • Like Like x 1
  26. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,931
    Likes Received:
    4,283
    In general yes... but it depends on what I'm getting.

    IMO TSG with the G6 has found a good compromise, there aren't many useless features like in the Rivet trains (mainly thinking about the Ge4/4 and coaches), but the physics and systems are excellent, and with good physics you have a pretty strong foundations for good sounds.

    If paying for a pro range means that I am getting a TSG train + eye candy "features" then that's a no.

    A pro range wouldn't have to cost more, but have a different focus and make different compromises to the current locomotives. If those locos would have to cost more because less people are interested in physics, systems and accuracy to real life compared to just pulling the blinds or having a nice 3d model, and that results in a price increase that's fine to me, but I wouldn't want to pay to have some useless "details" and visuals.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  27. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    Makes me think of the radios in TS1, which seem to have pushed AP locos and trains into the region of £20-£30.

    Everyone raves about them like they're the best thing since sliced bread but all they do is light up and go beep when you press a button. At least in TSW you can click it contact the dispatcher.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  28. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2020
    Messages:
    1,089
    Likes Received:
    1,550
    I've always though many forum members sound very entitled.
    They expect a standard of quality and authenticity which frankly will never be available for the price charged and the average hardware available.
    Only those with very high end equipment would benefit from the extra details.
    An exclusive club so to speak.

    We don't know the details of sales between the various platforms. I expect PC's are in a minority, but don't know.
    Then where should the extra attention go?
    Lighting, cab authenticity, sounds or scenery, etc.?
    Indeed how long can they continue to support older consoles?

    The trouble is every time they improve their offerings, there's always a demand for more.
    Prices will go up I'm sure, but the rest.
    Well we can dream.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  29. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    I wonder how many people who are calling for price increases would only moan about it if/when it actually happens and then only buy things in sales.
     
    • Like Like x 8
  30. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    9,191
    Likes Received:
    8,610
    Depends on what those details are...
    Working internal PIS controls would work for everyone
    A cruise control that works would work for everyone
    Higher definition visuals would work for anyone not using a potato for a PC or a really old console (and by high def I mean 1080p not 4k)
    Depending on HOW they did the sounds this should work for everyone (though some may need better output equipment to benefit)
    The GSM-R having some functionality beyond call the controller would work for everyone

    Not talking rocket science here, just some things which add a bit of life or a bit more to do than "shove in key, put in drive, wait, brake"
     
    • Like Like x 4
  31. WVUadam

    WVUadam Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2018
    Messages:
    560
    Likes Received:
    569
    I think there shouldn't be a pro range. It wouldn't improve the quality because of what you already have said with the limitations in place.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  32. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Messages:
    5,161
    Likes Received:
    13,573
    I’m not convinced that a higher priced loco DLC would translate into more income for DTG in order to pay for the extra dev time to add the extra features or spend more time honing the physics etc. Higher prices automatically results in fewer people buying so the higher unit sales cost gets cancelled out by the smaller sales numbers. Whether I would pay the extra is therefore irrelevant as I know many players definitely wouldn’t.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  33. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    3,507
    Likes Received:
    6,557
    There shouldn't be a need for a pro-range. If they can get and implement accurate sounds and physics then they should do it for the range they have, not charge more under the guise of a pro-range, I doubt they would wish to go down that road anyway.

    A lot of the pro-range in TS1 were for third party creations which had more features.

    I would pay more for loco packs if they added something substantial, for example some new wagons or rakes of carriages.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  34. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    1,939
    Likes Received:
    3,310
    I never complaing about price. I'm happy to pay full price if the content is good - for example, Sherman Hill, Harlem Line or Boston Sprinter I enjoyed all of these. They are not perfect, but worth the full price for me.

    And I would be willing to pay more if it means better content. For example, less bugs, more polish, longer Harlem Line, or Sherman Hill track 3.
    I would already expect a more polished product with less bugs at these prices, but if money issues are in the way to deliver, then I could agree to increased prices. But then I would expect better quality as well.
     
  35. Tomas9970

    Tomas9970 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2018
    Messages:
    626
    Likes Received:
    613
    Nowadays, I'm pretty reluctant to speak on this subject but if you really want something that's top of the line, it might be a good idea to look at DCS. While the devs and third parties prettymuch always manage to deliver an amazing product in every aspect, even the most basic plane like the Christen Eagle (which has very simple cockpit so most dev time goes to art, sounds and physics) costs 30 dollars and it only goes up from there.

    Another thing to consider is that while real trains have non-gimmicky features like data input and brake percentage settings, they would become essential part of the train's operation if implemented in TSW, which would unavoidably upset the casual crowd. This means that you would have to have these trains in a separate lineup, which could upset people from both sides if their fave somehow ended up in the wrong category.

    Also at that price point, the train shouldn't be tied to a route and be something universal (like an MS Vectron) but that seems like a minor concern compared to the above.
     
  36. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2020
    Messages:
    263
    Likes Received:
    558
    The question in my opinion is ¨Is DTG able/capable to deliver higher quality content?¨
    Players have expressed the intention to pay more for some content but the developer seems to still struggle with the ¨standard¨ one.

    Another approach that I was thinking at is releasing routes without rolling stock and the rolling stock separate leading to players creating the route as busy as they want/can afford. In this way there will be no duplicates and triplicates of trains and EMUs either.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  37. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    9,191
    Likes Received:
    8,610
    One word, timetables.
    For DTG to create the timetable and map the stopping points they need to know which stock is going to be used, otherwise the timings, AP and stopping points all get messed up (hence why they can't easily swap a three car BR class 101 for a four car BR class 166 for example)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  38. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    1,942
    Likes Received:
    3,223
    So, the problem here is inconsistency. The price tag of route DLC and loco DLC are quite consistent and are in fact tiered into specific price tags. The problem is we don't quite know what we can realistically expect for such a DLC.

    I'm not sure a Pro-Range would solve this issue. And I'm not sure increasing the price tag would even solve it. Train Simulator has a Pro-Range, which are said to have more advanced features and may not always be simple to drive, but even within this Pro-Range there's some inconsistency in the features included. And there's barely any price difference in Pro-Range content compared to the ordinary content.

    We're used to a certain price tag, and apparently it has worked well for DTG, because prices of Train Simulator DLC are identical. I suspect DTG already found a sweet spot in their price tag. Increasing the price tag would result to less sales being made, and thus generating less income, so that's not solving anything.

    However, we don't know what quite to expect on a feature-level, as quality (be it features, sounds, or anything) is inconsistent. And to add to that, the amount of content even varies. Route DLC may be long or short, include many new rolling stock or just recycled ones, and Loco DLC may include some wagons or may not include anything at all. While, to simplify, we could assume that any DLC with the same price tag would generate the same amount of revenue, and thus can have the same amount of max development budget allocated to it. Spending more resources on something like route length (often reqeusted here) would mean they'd have less resources available for developing locos. So you'd either have to make short routes, make bad quality rolling stock, or recycle the same old Dostos again, just to stay within the budget and make sure you'll turn a profit in the end.

    I guess making bad quality rolling stocks (or routes) would be the worst of the option. So that'd mean either shorter routes, or recycling trains. Not a popular thing, but at least by now we kinda know that we have to expect Dostos in the next German route.

    It's a matter of expectation management.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  39. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    I think what mariussoare_84 is suggesting is using the layering system for everything and not include any trains in the route download, selling them all as extra add-ons, probably released at the same time as the route.
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2022
  40. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    1,942
    Likes Received:
    3,223
    Probably not. I probably make my purchase decisions on different things than you do, and it probably differs for several of us.

    For example, I'm not using PZB. So I honestly couldn't care if a loco features PZB and I certainly wouldn't be interested in paying more for it. I also don't know most of the trains in real life, so while people have been saying the sounds of the Class 150/2 is junk, it sounds convincing enough for me. At least it sounds different from the other trains. While the Class 465, which is often praised for its sound, looks like just another modern UK EMU that I can barely use on any routes. (I eventually made a purchase during a discount. Admittedly, it sounds good, but no clue if the real Class 465 sounds the same. Never seen one in real life).

    I usually make my purchase decisions on things like;
    - Do I like how the loco looks? (which is very personal)
    - Can I use it on the routes I own? (one major downside of the Class 465)
    - Does it add anything different from the stuff I already own? (another major downside of the Class 465)

    If I have decided I want this loco, I'll probably buy it regardless of its quality, although if Steam reviews are negative, I might wait a little longer and wait for a sale. So perhaps, very perhaps, I may actually eventually, on average, pay more for a Pro-Range loco, but it wouldn't be the main thing I'd base my decision on. I bought many of Rivets DLC despite being aware of the mixed opinions of the quality (and without regrets, I must say), but waited quite a while buying the Class 465 and BR101 even though I knew these add-ons were being praised for their quality.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  41. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2020
    Messages:
    263
    Likes Received:
    558
    Pretty much my idea.
    When they release a route, they choose the era so they should have it clear what trains are running on the route at the time.
    The timetable can be created based on this to include all the adequate rolling stock from the start in the planner. Then release the rolling stock or use existing one if it suites the route, not necessarily at the same time as the route is launched but if a newly launched route requires rolling stock that is not available yet then at least a bare minimum should be released with it.

    The rolling stock should also come in various liveries to help with variety on the route. Right now, when I hear Matt talking about trainspotting I find it funny as the deversity is very limited. Same dostos, 143, 146, 185 and Talent 2 on all German maps over and overa gain.

    Comparing the game with model trains categorization, why not use a similar era/epoque system.

    In this way the lifetime of a route is extended, replayability is much higher due to the diversity and DTG can animate old routes simply by releasing new stock.
    With the latest expansion pack they had to create a new timetable which extends the process and adds an unnecessary step in the menu to select between timetables.

    With more planning from the beginning they can make their own life easier particularly since we know how much they like this part. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  42. Coastway trainspotter

    Coastway trainspotter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2021
    Messages:
    2,852
    Likes Received:
    2,173
    We shouldn’t have to have ‘pro range’ , the locos should be made with those features already
     
    • Like Like x 8
  43. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    9,191
    Likes Received:
    8,610
    As an example, if they created a 1970 GWR route (think Dawlish Sea wall) then you'd have Westerns, Hymeks and Warships all pulling passenger services, but with very different power, therefore very different timetables, so it would be quite difficult to create a timetable to cover "available rolling stock" unless the only stock provided had similar power characteristics
     
  44. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,928
    Likes Received:
    3,908
    Wouldn't they do that anyway if they were to bring either of those locos in as a layer (for example, layer in the 52 from DLGW)?
     
  45. mariussoare_84

    mariussoare_84 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2020
    Messages:
    263
    Likes Received:
    558
    Noted! On DRA for example we can pull a freight train with the 143, the 155 or the 185 in the sam amount of time according to the timetable despite the differences between these locomotives.
    The 143 with its 240 kN and the 155 with 480 kN.

    In the end if we can't get away with one timetable per route then so be it. The secondary timetable added to SKA could have been part of the base timetable if the planning was different.
    As Clumsy Pacer says maybe that can be done through layers.
     
  46. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    5,906
    Likes Received:
    8,406
    Exactly. Honestly I don't understand why threads like these pop up time and time again. DTG have said over and over that increased prices doesn't mean that quality will suddenly improve. The issue is boils down to inconsistency. Some trains have good quality whilst others don't. It's the same with route dlc's as well. Paying a "premium" price wouldn't change things. In fact that would lead to less sales because there are many players who already see dlc's for this game as too high already. DTG simply don't consistently make or publish "highly authentic recreations of locos". That's just the reality. They can do those things but they just aren't consistent in terms of quality

    Increased prices=less sales.

    Look I know there are some that want to click every button, switch and go to the restroom but the reality is that isn't gonna happen. So can we please stop with these pointless threads to increase prices for quality that simply won't change as DTG have said thousands of times.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  47. roysto25

    roysto25 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2019
    Messages:
    241
    Likes Received:
    284
    The elephant in the room may be the increasing similarity of modern consists, especially EMUs, which in the long run may start to limit interest in new DLC. Creators Club may help, but the only solution seems to me to install more and more detail in the systems, be they operating or safety and the density of timetables. Detailed equipment rooms may be nice, but unless there are interactive systems back there, they are simply a drag on resources. There may be many 'gamers' in the user base, but I wonder if they see TSW in the same way they see other games and doubt they are put off by systems complexity. The pricing question is one for the marketing specialists, specifically pricing analysts (don't know whether DTG has one, but would be surprised if they do not) - it is far more complicated than most realize.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  48. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2020
    Messages:
    4,950
    Likes Received:
    8,023
    Or the other answer of course is to pull their fingers out and give us the promised more powerful scenario and timetable editor so we can do the job ourselves.

    The original hiatus was supposed to be allowing Creators' Club to bed in. Well that's been going for a while now so time we had a bit more info on progress. Personally I couldn't give a rat's behind about AP and achievements, but I would like the ability to sit down and devise a timetable on NTP that makes diverse use of the traction and rolling stock available, or brew something up on RSN using 101's, 155's and maybe the 612's just for a laugh.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  49. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    9,191
    Likes Received:
    8,610
    If they programmed in a layer then that layer would have it's own stopping pattern etc
    I thought the proposition was that they would make a route, which people could populate from any of the DLC available rather than relying on "what comes with the route"?
     
  50. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2019
    Messages:
    3,430
    Likes Received:
    5,129
    I agree with this. There’s enough mud between what we get, what’s not standard, what’s preserved, what’s a timetable pack without lumbering trains into this mess too. I’d be concerned about (based on my own user experience) whether this would stop anything else getting caught up in months of QA bottleneck
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page