Confirmed tonight on the roadmap stream by DTG Matt, Xbox Series X version is using Gen 8 settings in places, whilst the PS5 version is using PC settings. I would like to know why this is, what is stopping DTG from making a true Xbox Series X native build of the game? Gaming isn't cheap, the Xbox Series X is the premium version of the two Series consoles, therefore it seems pretty unacceptable that we pay a premium, yet are saddled with an inferior product when compared to other platforms.
Like Matt said in the stream, it's being held back by the Series S which has less memory than is required to deliver a PS5 matching experience. There is, though, no technical reason why they can't build the game to identify which console it is running on and change the draw distances, I'm guessing there just aren't enough players on Xbox to justify the effort it would take.
Because the Series S, while having Gen9 features, the console is closer to an advanced Xbox One than the Series X. As far as I'm aware, Series X|S enhanced games are almost always done for both all the same; without any difference between them. It wouldn't be too bad to just have control over the settings, like PC. Consoles aren't all the same so I would rather that. Regardless, it's not that bad on Series X.
This isn't the case though, watch any Digital Foundry comparison video and they will tell you which features have been trimmed back for Series S, more often than not it is reduced foliage and draw distances. I'm guessing where DTG fall down is on the theory that anything built in Unreal Engine can spit out both PC and console versions of the end product, maybe they need to ask Epic how to run a different config file based on the console model detected?
It’s a very bad situation. If TSW were a bit more high profile, they wouldn’t get away with this. Basically, if you have the choice, don’t buy this game on XSX. I’m certainly not throwing any more money towards it on there.
On the other hand, the PS5 version running on the PC settings actually causes it to have an inconsistent framerate, while the Series X runs mostly at 60fps because of it's lower settings. It's not a very smooth experience whatsoever on the Sony side.
Not only the graphics but also the sounds; the audio quality is reduced significantly on Xbox to keep the file sizes small for the Series S ram limitations. In places it’s really bad. DTG still refuses to make a better sound set for the Series X, so all must suffer. The graphics on the premium console were not too bad if I recall, and consequently ran pretty smoothly. The PS5 does have higher settings but struggles with heavier routes.
Having moved from Xbox One to a Series X recently, I can say that I don't see how gen 8 is holding the Series X back. In my experience, there is a vast improvement between the two. Game now runs smoother than it ever did. Hardly any stuttering, and a consistent framerate.
The only setting that's gen8 is the landscape tile streaming distance. I'm pretty sure we can tune it up on the x fine, to be honest (each platform does have its own configuration already) but I'm no expert in that so I'm not going to make assertions on the stream until the engineering team come back to me and confirm it. The audio issue is slightly different - because thats not a runtime config issue, it's a BUILD time config issue. You can't supply different builds for the Series S and Series X - so you can only have one sound set essentially. At least on Gen 8 vs gen 9 they have different sound sets but that series S really does get in the way here. That said, as I said on the stream, we're experimenting with changing the setting for audio quality so we can assess the impact on ram usage and then judge whether it's worth the potential increase in out of ram crashes along with how much, if at all, that's likely to be. By and large, at this point, gen8 has little to no impact on gen9. Series S is the bigger impact but we've eliminated one area of conflict by letting the series s use the gen8 timetable instead of the gen9 timetable - now the gen9 is no longer held back by that which is a huge benefit. Matt.
This reduced streaming distance is actually what makes the Series X such a smooth experience. Ideally the PS5 streaming distance would also be tuned down, as I’m sure it would be transformative on the heavier routes like L2B and DRA where it really struggles. The upcoming PS5 Pro on the other hand will probably be able to deal much better with the current settings, but that remains to be seen. It’s baffling why Microsoft would impose the exact same audio files on Series S and X. When you think of the hundreds of other titles that are shared by the two consoles, audio quality doesn’t seem to suffer on those. It also raises genuine questions, why does TSW (which runs on UE4) use so much more ram than other games using the same game engine, and can it be further optimised?
Probably. But if it means entire mountains are not visible (leaving a flat landscape) or pop in at the last moment, then I’m not sure it’s worth the trade-off. Other than that, the framerate fluctuates between 30-60 fps on XSX, so I wouldn’t say it’s a very smooth experience as it is.
I don't know much about Unreal sound files but in TS many sounds are (as far as I'm aware) in a variant of WAV, which is known to have quite large file sizes. I'm not sure what sort of files need to be used for TSW, but I would have thought that a compression method like MP3 or M4A would help. I doubt you'd get many audiophiles judging the crispness of the sounds if they're compressed a little. With that said Train Simulator in its early days would have much weaker hardware to work with than TSW, and despite using less efficient sound files I'm not aware of it causing any issues, but I assume it's a lot more complicated than that.
Didn't notice any missing mountains, but mine rarely dropped to 30 fps, and even in Victoria station at 7 am it would only drop to late 40s, early 50s. It all depends though on the route and how well optimised it is. Try a heavy route on a PS5 and believe me you will appreciate the smoothness of the SX settings.
Please don't 'tune down' the PS5 stream distance, my only real issue with this game is the abundance of pop-in, I can ignore the rare instance of dropped frames but trees suddenly appearing just in front of you is probably the most immersion breaking thing in this game, and I certainly wouldn't want to start experiencing things like missing mountain ranges and 887,000 tonne bridges popping in!
Dont worry no plans to reduce the streaming distance on PS5. but yes, I suspect it is one reason why the series X is silky smooth and the PS5 is *mostly* silky smooth
I made some screenshots showcasing the difference between PC (and indirectly PS5 since it uses similar distance-rendering settings) and XSX, to give you an idea of the extent of the missing mountains: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/psa-a-dire-lack-of-mountains-on-xsx.79884/ In my experience the experience on XSX is anything but silky smooth. Sure, whole distances between stations can run fine (ignoring the ‘standard’ hiccups), but at countless stations or yards the framerate dips as low as 30s. It does seem to be full 4K though, I’ll give you that
Ok let me rephrase - on average, better than PS5 by a small amount. But, thats because its doing a little less
+1 to not reducing stream distance on the PS5, the performance is nowhere near bad enough to warrant it.
DTG Matt Just a thought, but I have no idea how it would or if it could be implemented etc. Could we have a graphics quality tab in settings for the consoles please? Similar to what they have on PC, and like things like Xplane have? Then people can choose between frame rate and loading distance etc.
In my experience, the XSX runs smoothly. I don't even experience framerate drops to 30, maybe mid 40s at most.
So if it does turn out to be an easy setting adjustment on the series X for the tile distance would we be able to get that in an update before the audio. I know you said the audio was a priority but if it is just a quick setting change... Just would love to see the mountain routes have less popup in front of me. Also on the roadmap it was said that the Fife Circle route upgrade would stop the Forth Bridge from popping up on 8th gen. But it does thia on the Series X as well. I assume its related to the tile distance as well.
Well, there's no such thing as a quick settings change - you change settings, you need to do some testing and see what other impacts it had. It's not extensive for sure, but it'll be in amongst the mix of other priorities the team are working on so I'm not going to promise anything at this point I don't know for sure, but i'd suspect that this is more a case of moving a major asset like this out of the scenery tile and in to something called the persistent tile - that's normally how we handle massive assets like this, so they're always visible even from way beyond tile loading distances. Seem to recall this change is already in on the test builds. Matt.
