The Big Problem With Ap Trains...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by inversnecky, Jan 26, 2021.

  1. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    I've never been able to replicate that.
     
  2. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Interesting. I wonder if something broke in the install and it might need to be reinstalled.
     
  3. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
  4. IronBladder

    IronBladder Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2017
    Messages:
    894
    Likes Received:
    1,708
    I definitely have this problem, repeatedly after multiple installs. As with the previous poster, AP advised me that they know about the problem and had corrected it on newer products (i.e. expansion packs). I too am annoyed they haven't gone back and corrected it in their loco sound packs.
     
  5. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    Which products do you see this this fault with? In my video you can see the class 47 Sound Pack working just fine here and the 20. The only other sound packs I have that are 55 and 87, and the new "old" wagon sound pack. They all work fine. [edit] I have the 390 sound pack too... also fine.

    [edit.. sorry, forgot.. I have the 92 sound pack as well... also fine.

    [edit]... just checked the AP site... I also have the 303 sound pack... also fine.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2021
  6. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    They may not want to fix it, but did they say what actually causes it, because it seems like it's not a universal fault that effects everyone?
     
  7. IronBladder

    IronBladder Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2017
    Messages:
    894
    Likes Received:
    1,708
    Class 47 and 55, though I've yet to try the current downloads from AP. I'll give them a try tonight, but with AP's previous stance I'm not confident it will have changed.

    BTW, same problem with DTG's class 35 Hymek pack, so it's likely there's some core issue, though AP know how to work around it with newer products.
     
  8. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    If they continue to sell the product, they owe it to current and future customers to fix it. This argument is one I make to DTG as well with older DLC. It seems to be a sickness among developers.
     
  9. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2020
    Messages:
    1,418
    Likes Received:
    2,092
    AP don't have a tendency to update old packs unless it involves adding newer products to scenario AI. The sound for the class 40 still has a bug in 64 bit mode for instance. It would be nice if they could add more recent liveries to older packs too (e.g. Northern livery on the 170) but that's also unlikely to happen. I guess they rather focus on producing new content than fixing old ones. Eventually all those old sound packs will probably be replaced by enhancement packs anyway. A compromise between consistency and new content.
     
  10. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    Well I posted a video of it not happening here with the 47, so it's not a universal fault.
     
  11. arapajoe3

    arapajoe3 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2020
    Messages:
    93
    Likes Received:
    102
    It really happens to me with some of the sound packs that I have: 20, 47, 52 and also the class 90. I also have the 101 and 390 but these do not present problems of loss of sound of the join track, but I suppose that being more modern they are updated and fixed. Sometimes changing the external and cab cams several times the sound reappears when entering the cab again, but it doesn't always happen...
     
  12. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    It is not a sickness. There is no gain from DTG to spend time and money to correct something.
    The user might see a problem with something but if it still works there is no incentive to fix it.
     
  13. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2017
    Messages:
    535
    Likes Received:
    932
    I've jumped on the AP bandwagon late last year, partly due to my subscription to ATS. And probably have about around 80% of their catalog.. This is quite a lot for someone who just jumped on. I find their products to be pretty exceptional. Just wish there was an American-based team to give the same level of quality, as it is sorely needed. Crazy part is, I haven't used nor played TS much in the last couple of months. Due to my attention to other games. TSW is a struggle for me, as it looks pretty but very limited in many aspects. Being also a console product. I don't see it doing much better than it is. If MSTS is anything to go by, TS1 very much still has a lot of life left in it left.
     
  14. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Sorry, but I will have to continue to disagree here. If a product is removed from sale (such as the Oovee Class 150), then sure, there is no point to fixing errors with it because you will not gain anything from it, period. But if you continue to sell the item, there is still the chance that money can be made from it. If you don't fix it, you are saying that you stand by shoddy content and that says something about your brand. For the sake of your brand and your name, you should fix such content. Especially if it's something you know now how to fix and have fixed in newer products. Because, for the name of your brand and the public opinion of your brand, you want your content to be the best there is. By not fixing it, it leaves the chance that this is not the case.

    My opinion BTW is a general one, not specifically related to AP or DTG themselves.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  15. mattdsoares

    mattdsoares Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2020
    Messages:
    640
    Likes Received:
    1,281
    In a balanced, healthy market, you're right. However PC Train Simulation is not a balanced healthy market. There are essentially two games in town with any sort of mainstream appeal as a train driving sim and DTG makes both of them. This is reason 1,342 why monopolies and lack of competition are bad for everyone other than the company with the monopoly. A healthy competitive market should punish poor quality via consumer choice. But take that choice away, and brand reputation becomes largely irrelevant. Just ask Comcast here in the US. They'll tell you alllll about that.
     
  16. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    I'm still awaiting a fix on the TGV Reseau which was broke from Day 1 and despite some DTG staff saying it will be fixed and others saying "Don't Hold Your Breath" nothing has happened in the two and a bit since release in December 2018.

    WCML-South was seriously broke and DTG had to do something about it - because this train works we still await a fix
    If the maker of any Add-on considers a fix is necessary they will make one but if people are living with it then it goes to the bottom of the pile.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Wrong. They will tell you "There is no problem with our service". :mad:

    Of course, being in Canada, we don't have to deal with them. :cool:

    You're not wrong. I also have been pointing out a huge lag issue on Cajon Pass. And issues on Sherman Hill. I'm told the latter is definitely going to get updates (pointing out they repackaged it in 2020 might be helping with that), but given the process they go through to test stuff, it's not coming quickly enough if there are even fixes coming. I have told DTG that there is an easy solution: have a group of people who do your beta testing for free. I mean, hey, we're playing the game anyway, so it's a good use of our time without even having to pay us. The most you might have to do, voluntarily, is give them a free DLC from time to time. That's it. Doesn't really cost you anything, especially if they weren't going to buy that DLC anyway, and it might get them interested in more like it, increasing sales even further.
     
  18. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    I think that is a good idea Cyclone :o ;)
    Have a beta fix that could be sent to the people that have volunteered to test something.
    The requirement of the tester would be that you already owned the DLC you were going to test.
    There is a chance that we might find something out.
     
  19. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    It depends on the item. I mean, this volunteer team could even test new and expected to be major items. They are all revoked from each user's library later and everyone carries on. (The issue is that users may have to periodically delete their scenario list and have it rebuilt, etc.) Otherwise, that's exactly right. If a user has an item, chances are they already know what needs to be fixed and are willing to see if it's fixed.

    The one risk is that they have to keep mum about what they are doing. No telling friends what they are testing, etc. This kind of thing usually has an NDA policy. You break it, you're off the team. No streaming such work, either! (Videos are fine provided they are not published and kept either for your review or for showing something stil not working to DTG, but some even bar you taking ANY video; Age of Empires III had a watermark across the screen and bouncing around that made it obvious you were filming the beta.)
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    I still think it would be easier having a Volunteer team to look at updates to products already on release
    The last thing DTG will want to do is have information about a new DLC because somebody blabbed.
    Whereas as simple update to current DLC would not cause much of a problem
     
    • Like Like x 1
  21. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    It's called an NDA, Peter. I've had to digitally sign them on more than one occasion. You blab, you are effectively breaking the law and it can lead to fines or prison time. You don't blab.
     
  22. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    If you are working on something and you tell a mate and he puts it on Facebook how is it proven who released the info?
    I think the problem is you Cyclone just want to play with something new and most people would like fixes for what we already have.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2021
  23. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    I own over 200 DLC, Peter. I am not lacking for something new to play. I just want to see all of it work properly, that's all. Given I've found bugs with three routes already, I can logically assume many of my other products also have bugs.
     
  24. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Aren't all TS users "extended beta testers"?!
     
    • Like Like x 4
  25. IronBladder

    IronBladder Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2017
    Messages:
    894
    Likes Received:
    1,708
    Well I've tested the latest version of the Class 47 sound pack and I still get the joint sounds disappearing inside the cab if I've used the helicopter or global cameras. Sometimes saving the scenario will restart them, but not always.
     
  26. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2020
    Messages:
    1,418
    Likes Received:
    2,092
    I take my words back, AP just updated their Class 40 to fix the sound looping issue in 64 bit. Big thumbs up!
     
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  27. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    Pookeyhead
    must download that
     
  28. arapajoe3

    arapajoe3 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2020
    Messages:
    93
    Likes Received:
    102
    great news, thanks for the notice! I hope that with this come new updates of the old sound pack to fix them
     
    • Like Like x 1
  29. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    We must have a spy - a very welcome spy - in our midst :)

    Well done AP!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  30. PhÜnKî_Rø0sTā

    PhÜnKî_Rø0sTā Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2019
    Messages:
    499
    Likes Received:
    424
    They need to update some of the scenarios in some sound packs to use the mk1 vol 1 coach pack and possibly the 390 that comes with WCML south as currently theu require content thats been discontinued.
     
  31. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Do I just download and reinstall the AP 40 over the existing one?
     
  32. arapajoe3

    arapajoe3 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2020
    Messages:
    93
    Likes Received:
    102
    Yep, just download and install it again
     
  33. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Good eye.
     
  34. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    I'm on it. Just noticed this morning that there was an update on the 13th... downloading now.


    asdfasdfasd.JPG
     
  35. Texasrangers UK

    Texasrangers UK Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2018
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    34
    Oh the 175 has been updated. Will download that. I must check more often!
     
  36. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    Definitely fixed.

     
    • Like Like x 1
  37. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,565
    Likes Received:
    11,446
    I have noticed the class 421/423 sound pack seems to lack joint sounds especially over points which is quite immersion breaking, especially with older trains, I know it is an older pack, the DMU sound pack has them present.
     
  38. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    A lot of the diddle-de-dum sounds are track related.
    Try the 421/423 on an older route or the Dmu on the Brighton Line
     
  39. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,565
    Likes Received:
    11,446
    Okay thanks I hadn't realised that, I thought it was built into the trains themselves, something new I have learnt. I will try that doing some investigation, the Brighton line is definitely one where I don't get point work sounds. I assume it isn't an easy fix?
     
  40. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    8,420
    Likes Received:
    2,675
    I think it is in the Tracks.bin file but I'm not entirely sure - it is probably best running different trains over the section of track.
    See if some trains make the point sounds at junction
    Did you get the AP sound pack for the Southern Emus before it was withdrawn?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  41. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,565
    Likes Received:
    11,446
    Yes I have had it a few years, I think I bought it when it was first released. It will be interesting to see what developments occur, I think the models still look pretty good.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2021
    • Like Like x 1
  42. Blu

    Blu Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2021
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    92
    I like the AP products and have most of them. But I do find mainly with the sound packs, that they are intermittent in some sounds not working from time to time. A restart of the game will usually solve it but not always. Ive learnt to live with it.
     
  43. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    You can always submit these as potential bug reports and ask whether they are planned for updates. It's possible Richard might not know about the problems. He does try to update his products. Even older ones from time to time.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  44. SJA

    SJA Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2020
    Messages:
    289
    Likes Received:
    243
    Funny you should mention that today as I had that problem for the first time last night with the Class 66 EP on one of the packaged scenarios out of Felixstowe freight terminal. I'll keep a look out for any others as it's literally the first time it's happened to any of the AP packs I've had.

    But Richard is good with bug fixes as Cyclone says.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  45. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2020
    Messages:
    3,160
    Likes Received:
    1,051
    Exactly. Too bad not every developer does this with older products within reason (i.e. don't break a thousand scenarios using the trains and route). Would make for a much better product overall.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. ntypeman

    ntypeman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    269
    Rather than start a new thread I hope no one minds if I go slightly off topic however it does regard AP...

    I bought the AP Mk1 coach pack then downloaded & extracted the files (as per instructions) then ran the installer, that's when my problems begun...

    When the installer gets to a certain point it "hangs", the computer remains functional and I can still click the option buttons in the installer window (and they remain functional) but the installer won't proceed... I initially thought it might be a bad d/load so I deleted the file & re d/loaded it again but it still does the same thing... I even set it running & left it overnight but to no avail...!!!

    I've reached out to AP for support but as yet have not had a response (probably due to the Easter break) but in the meantime does anyone have any further suggestions to install the coach pack???

    Thanks in advance...

    Eric
     
  47. Pookeyhead

    Pookeyhead Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2018
    Messages:
    4,180
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    Try installing again, but by right clicking as selecting Run as administrator.
     
  48. ntypeman

    ntypeman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    269
    Cheers Pooky...

    Tried it but it comes up with 1152: Error extracting data.msi to the temporary location

    Eric
     
  49. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2020
    Messages:
    2,252
    Likes Received:
    841
    Do you have enough disk space?
     
  50. ntypeman

    ntypeman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2018
    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    269
    On D:\ yes, C:\ ummmm... not sure...

    I made a "temp" folder in D:\ and extracted the files there with the sane result...
     

Share This Page