Dtg Should Extend The Length Of The Upcoming Harlem Line To Southeast.

Well perhaps it probably would've have been better in my opinion to have done the Hudson line and not this route. That way if they did decide to make the new haven line and then the harlem line last, you would have all the trains sub in. But of course they choose this path and and shot themselves in the foot.

I don't have an issue if the new haven traffic wasn't included since they don't have the realistic trains anyway. It's not like the route would be fully dead without them anyway

 

Not necessarily. Remember what they did with SEHS, ECW and BML: subbed in 'incorrect' 377s, but then when the 465 and 317 came out, put them in there instead. Similarly here they could use M3s as placeholders for potential future M2s.

 

However, there is another interesting side note here: as with the BR 363, once again we see a route coming out which uses a loco which was previously a separate DLC. Of course, you still would have to buy the DLC to run them on RSN and LIRR, but it also might just be an indication of..... what? Not sure. Possibly the M3 and 363 haven't sold well enough separately that undercutting their DLC sales makes much difference.

 

Within the tunnel section, dont know how many of these are stil in existence
59th Street - built but never opened now used as an emergency exit


72nd Street - closed 1901 but still used as an emegency exit
86th Street - again closed 1901 but still used as an emergency exit.

Theres numerous overground stations abandoned, although Ive do idea what if any of the infrastructure of these remains.

 

The infrastructure of the overground stations don't exist anymore. They were demolished decades ago.

 

It would perhaps be wishful thinking that these old subway structures would be modeled for the sake of realism, but, I suppose like in the Boston route, it would be considered a waste of precious development time and money.

 

TrainSim-Matt Hey Matt, thanks for taking the time, for this feedback, please don't hesitate to ask all the fans and people such as myself who live in new york city, to get photos and other pictures and video sources you may need to make this the best-released route. We are all happy to help you in any way. Just let us know when you want us to get the picture. Can you also make another thread specifically for the Metro-North Photos and Resource Thread, so that we fans can post all of the photos and videos for your team? Thank you

 

What would have been better is if they considered the P32s that would have given more versatility in service patterns as they realistically utilize every major branch of the MNR network. Throwing 3rd rail equipment for OHLE territory ain’t the move. Granted, even if a small portion of the stub they’ll place on the route is still 3rd rail. But either way as short as the route is, but the time you get frustrated with the lack of services. You’re already done with it anyways.

 

This has already been done for Train simulator 2021, therefore they are doing another line.

 

Matt was mistaken, and he apologize already

 

Same here, happy to help take photos or videos where needed.

 

TrainSim-Matt Just waiting for Matt to create a New thread specific for this Metro-North Route Thread

 

TrainSim-Matt
Reference of current Harlem Line

Video of North White Plain to GCT

 

According to the mta the miles distance of north white plain is 24miles
https://new.mta.info/document/48686

 

here's a video of m7A

 

The underground stations are just really small side platforms with electrical boxes and emergency exits anyways. They didn't model it in both the New Haven and Hudson line in ts so i don't expect them to be modelled here

 

I will say that the trains on the Brighton Mainline are missing Thameslink services which is why the Brighton section seems like a ghost town. It doesn't seem likely that a Class 700 will be made anytime soon, so there's a huge discrepancy between the London section of the route and the Brighton section.


I'd rather that not happen on Metro North, so I would rather see "fake" New Haven line trains use M7s in place of M8s for more traffic. This is one of the most busiest routes in North America, much more symbolic of a rush hour experience than Providence Boston. It would be strange to see Grand Central be a ghost town. If I wanted an American passenger with barely any traffic, I'd just play LIRR instead instead of shelling out 30 dollars for a similar experience. Especially since this route is only 24 miles long, it would be shameful if the appropriate Hudson Line and other electric trains aren't included. DTG already messed up MTA once already, I hope they don't make the same mistake again.

 

I wouldn't even be so fussed about the pantograph if we're not seeing the overhead line section (presuming the trains would portal out before they'd need to do any kind of changeover). Just having a placeholder M2, so you see AI trains with a red instead of blue livery would be adequate for most players (even many of those who would spot the difference would probably accept that over another ghost town like LIRR). If they do the other line and develop a proper M2 later on, they could update the model to the new one, but for now, it could just be a repaint.

 

It wouldn't be a full on ghost town if the Hudson line ai services were included though. Also the M2s no longer run on the Metro-North railroad anymore

 

The Hudson Line only follows the Harlem Line from Grand Central, to a little after 125 St. That leaves the other 85% of the route a ghost town. Plus, the portion of the route that would see the Hudson Line, would only add about double the Harlem Line services. That's about 300 services, or a train every 10 mins (according to the schedule), compared to about 500-600 with the New Haven Line, or a train about every 3 mins (again according to the schedule, and my time railfanning at Harlem - 125 St).

Also, the M2's were only retired in 2018, and this route could be set then. (Who knows?) Not much would have changed. Actually, there would probably be more services if the route was set then because we wouldn't have the pandemic timetable.

 

If they set it before the pandemic timetable, then even Crestwood services can be added for the rush hour timetable portion......man I miss the M2s lol

 

DTG Natster TrainSim-Matt Still waiting for Natalie or Matt to create a New Thread for us (fans) to put pictures and video and other resources for the team to use for the upcoming Metro North Route, cause we as the player don't have the right to create the thread.

 

Don’t tag the team. If they want resources they will ask for them. If they don’t ask it means they don’t want any. Random postings aren’t real resources either, if they do want something it is likely to be something specific. The team can use search engines and youtube themselves, they don’t need help with that.

 

All I’m saying as far as American Content.. we get stiffed with partial routes. 20+ miles is justified when the Brighton Mainline is 50 and sees as much action, if not slightly more or less.
It’s okay to give American more mileage when it’s just open plains or mountainous freight routes with little scenery and industry to implement along them.
We get shafted so much that we are willing to accept crumbs when pretty much the rest of the more focused and respected territories get something sensible or when a route is in danger of being cut short (looking at Reisa-Dresden).. there’s an uproar, which was largely heard, supported.
Us US folk may put up an argument for brief moment and get fed the usual song and dance as to why short routes are justified. Just hard finding justification for continuous support as a US customer for TSW, when it is mostly beneficial for the other two main territories. Would be nice to see the same level of respect given to the American audience as well.

 

Also you would think that since the game has been out for 5 years, DTG would finally be capable of producing lengthy routes on a consistent basis. To their credit they have but still this route should've been longer.

I just hope now that this route won't be another buggy mess and have memory crashes

 

31 to Southeast, 38 to Wassaic.

 

Absolutely, and also add Yankees-E 153 St (and maybe High Bridge yard as well, it would be great gameplay) for game day trains. It would be perfect for a scenario and isn't far at all from the regular Harlem Line. Think the LIRR Belmont Park but for this route. They already made that stop twice in TS1 anyway. So in total, 13 more stops (and 30 miles) to Southeast, 1 stop (0,5 mile at most, maybe 1,5 with the depot) to Yankees-E 153.

 

NYer here! It's 31, not 50. It's over 50 miles from Grand Central to Southeast but 13 more stations (up from 18). Also will Yankees-E 153 St (and maybe High Bridge yard) be included too? It would be like the LIRR's Belmont Park, only 1,5 miles and 1 extra station with the yard (maybe 0,5 without the yard) and would be perfect for a game day scenario! The station has been modeled TWICE in TS1 (once for NYNH, once for Hudson Line) and presents a LOT more gameplay opportunities. Given all this information, would you perhaps reconsider the Southeast extension (and Yankees-E 153/High Bridge)?

 

50 miles total, not 50 more miles. It's a 30-mile extension from what is there now.

 

Since Dtg isnt going to extend released routes, the harlem line as it is announced, looks like a missed opportunity. We get a route which ends in the middle of nonsense.

Still rather prefere a different route choice for development, but a complete one. At least with a logical service termination point, which southeast would be in this case.

I agree on sam that every route would be nice in a way to have for tsw2, but they need a real business case because developing s route isnt cheap. Especially with all the routes and tracks existing, i dont get dtgs decision.

What did they expect? Of course people here are disappointed, the section to southeast seems not out of range or impossible to create.

 

As matt says, anything is possible.

Once streams for this route approach, it'll be interesting to see why they couldn't make the full electrified section of the route. Now were bascially getting a half baked experience. I don't buy the station excuse considering that London Commuter has 30 stations and the electrified section of the Harlem line also has 30 stations. Some of which aren't even massive or complex. Melrose, Tremont and Willamsbridge for example are small side stations that can only fit a two car train. Woodlawn can only fit 6 cars.

 

Me too, i can't believe they can't put the full route in, and according to mta.info schedule website it is 53 miles to SouthEast and only 24 miles to North White Plain, that is a huge difference considering that they won't extend it to South east, while fo the London Commuter the total mile i believe is close to that miles, and they were still able to do it. I don't mind to pay extra, just give us the full route of the Harlem Line, while still doing amazing job on it. If the team need more resource, we will help them get the stuff they need. Why are they not asking us to help them?

 

Also services from grand central to/from southeast are about an hour or less. Similar amount of time as the Southern services from brighton to london victoria on london commuter.

If they do decide to make another metro north line in the future without the diesel setions, include the full electrified line and not part of the line. Drivers on the metro north railroad don't stop at a random station and have a driver change. They do the full journey

 

Let's not.forget they made a 46 mile Peninsula Corridor and all...This why I said DTG is biased on east coast passenger dlc with crappy excuses, hence the horrible LIRR, but u took time to build a FULL 50 London Commuter..I understand the full service to Southeast is about 53 miles but still not fair when full electric service ends at Southeast....

 

This.... My sentiments exactly.

 

It does beg the question why DTG were able to make and offer the whole nine yards between London and Brighton and yet create a truncated US route that ends at an arbitrary point somewhere short of the whole dollar. Why not use the license to the full, even if it takes more time to develop. The extra sales for a complete route would likely more than pay for the extra time and expense. As it stands, we're left waiting to see whether the extra Hudson and New Haven services will somewhat compensate for the disappointing route length.
This route could be either an enjoyable urban snippet.... or a major lost opportunity.

 

Also dtg would've already have some sort of reference for Grand Central Terminal, Harlem-125 Street, Melrose, Tremont, Fordham, Botanical Garden, Willamsbridge, Woodlawn and Mount Vernon West stations since all those stations are in the New Haven line route in Train Simulator 2022. Those stations in ts weren't that far off from their real life counterpart either. That's already 10 stations out of the 30 stations on the full electrified section on this line that they would already have reference for.

 

And how do you figure there will be extra sale, and extra sale means how many copy

 

I been in these forums since the very beginning… just an observation, but how many times have I read “a missed opportunity” but yet the company still seems to be solvent - just saying . Stating if XYZ was provided it would result in more sales is nothing but total conjecture.

Would I like this route to be extended as many suggest? It all depends, the sweet spot for a run on a timetable or scenario for me is around an hour, longer and I usually do not have time to complete, so even if it is a long route, I stick to time tables or scenarios that fit the time I have to dedicate to the sim. Really enjoy the different turns on CCR - one long run broken into multiple timetable runs… on shorter routes, usually the scenarios and timetables fit within my time frames. I guess what I am trying to say is the length is not the most important deciding factor, but the type and qualities of the activities that the route provides.

 

I agree that route lenght isnt the only important factor of a good route.

But:
Even if many players amount of playing time is an hour, a map shouldnt stick to that, its a simulator and in my opinion a "complete service" is much more worth in terms of variety.

Tsw has improved to a giant "sandbox" of possibilities for accurate train behavior and more important different playing styles.

You can drive a scenario, drive a service in the 24h time table, drive all day in the 24 h timetable without leaving, and if you dont have enough time, drive a section and take over the train next day at the same point to continue your service.

Dtg uses the ue4 engine and improved ts heavy to what it is now in tsw2 with detailed trains etc. and simugraph, But on the map structers about different playing styles they didnt use the true potential of tsw2 at all to improve.

Immagine if flight sims are made for just 1 hour flight time. People dont have the time just pick a closer destination

For my self, a saw me at reading so many times when i wanted to continue the trip to oxford.
Same at eastbourne when i wanted to complete the service to ore.

And i will see me standing at north white plains wanting to continue to southeast where express services actually ends.

So yes this feels like a missed opportunity.

Its like if British Rail improved their trains and infrastructure over the years, and still drive the timetables from the 70s.

At the point devs are ready to make longer routes or merge them (network), dont cut routes with only a partial service possible, then this peace of software earns its title of train sim world.

Right now dtg has a ton of work to implement the additional services at brighton section, so they need to work on their development strategy too.

 

I'm just going to put a stake on the sand here that I hope journey mode isn't just 30 episodes of snow rain and night. I see journey mode as a lazy persons way to get bad weather

 

Well there is a reason the majority of train enhusiasts are still playing the older train simulators, and that reason is exactly all those missed opportunities. Things like not having an editor shorter routes, less trains per route - these will scare away many people from the game. It's not going backrupt, but definitely doesn't live up to it's potential, so a big portion of the potential playerbase is stuck playing TS or Trainz or other games. If you don't believe it, go check out any train simulator group and see how many people are not willing to switch over to TSW for these exact reasons.

While I agree that length isn't everything, length itself isn't the problem here. It's the fact that it's an unfinished route, it stops midway, you are unable to do a proper service from one end to another. While this is understanadble for longer routes like NEC or a freight route, on a shorter commuter route it's a big immersion killer and the whole thing feels unfinished when you have to give up your train halfway to it's destination.

Just like on LIRR, the main branch services suck, because you have to stop and give up the train at Hicksville. The branch line runs are fun however, even despite being shorter, because on those you can actually go from terminus to terminus.

 

I've said it before, train sim routes and locos are far more diverse (yes I know around since the dawn of time) but the only thing that keeps me on tsw is the graphics and being able to run around. I wish we'd start getting more choice of loco and longer routes like they have.
It makes me wonder if there are any incentives to develop for DTG as a third party, any lures that can be chucked out to the ts developers that have the knowledge of ue4 too

 

Well a full run from Grand Central to southeast takes about an hour or less anyways which is the same amount of time as brighton to london southern services.

Also DTG already have routes in which doing a full service can take more than an hour and a half. Some are even two hours

 

This here is exactly why I don't use journey mode

 

There are some good journey modes, but yeah, for example LIRR's journey is horrible. It's just full of snowy nights with completely clear, starry skies. How does snow fall out of nothing, I wonder?

Hopefully they make a better one for this, though having only A to B runs kind of limits journeys anyway.

 

The timetable provided by the Metropolitan Transportation Authority on weekdays and weekends it's only the express to North White Plains from Grand Central Terminal 1hr 27 to 1 hr 30. Can't be M7A 10-12 car trains due to substation issues while M3A 10-12 trains don't fry the substations. Send M7A 10-12 car trains to Brewster Yard and southeast service failure your train has substation failure.

 

Quality ROAST. Far too many Journey Mode services have rain with very light cloud cover too. Magic rain falling from a near cloudless sky.

 

Kind of a running joke that to make a scenario "interesting" you make it rain or snow... Been the same in TSC for years