The only thing on BRO that should give you PZB penalty braking is GPA speed check sections before speed reductions. Perhaps they're encountering those.
Not gonna lie, I’m having a blast with this one, even with its imperfections. The 103 is a fun little rocket once it gets going. And it’s an engaging drive with all the grades and curves. And the the route itself is awesome. The scenery is laid out nicely; it makes me feel like I’m there- although the foliage popping in all over the place is a little annoying in the denser foliage areas. Really great ambience though, letting the 103 rip against a really great backdrop.
Played the BR110 freight service 63759. I think the expected arrival time in the timetable does not take into account that a player in PZB mode M can't go faster than 120 Km/h, so it is not possible to do it on time. Also can't get enough points for a gold medal. I don't think the arrival time is counted for the points, so I guess that I just cant travel enough metres to make the required points. Additionally, the stop marker at Koblenz is way too close to the red signal. PS: This is just an example, but I guess many of the freight services will have the same problems.
I have to admit, same here. It’s so amazing for me to finally get some vintage stuff with TSW’s visual quality (something Zusi just can’t compete with) that I’m enjoying the route regardless of the issues for now. I agree with the points jolojonasgames raises. The brakes on the 103 feel like they can’t be right. Happy to be corrected by Maik but something feels off. The sounds of the 103 do lean a bit much in the 110 direction but I can live with that if it’s between getting a 103 at all or not.
I've had a few runs up and down, and overall I enjoy this route a lot. There is a lot of detail in the scenery, which is very dense throughout the route. The 103 also feels and sounds nice, and I love the new IC vagons with route plates, and vagon numbers, instead of a modern PIS. I really hope that DTG, for a change, quickly irons out the few issues that there are, but, tbh, I don't have my hopes ups. Especially after Trenton, which is still waiting for essential fixes, weeks after release.
The "shadow bubble" is awful again - just a few meters out in front. First thing I noticed and turned off shadows completely.
It's in the second cab, on the place where the pantograph selection is in the first cab. It also took me a while to find. If only there was a way how have all the controls documented somewhere... in a easy to reference form. I don't know, maybe as a pdf... But I guess noone figure how to do that yet... /sarcasm DTG, you really need to up your game on manuals. Changing PZB mode is basic operation, and if I would want to play "where is waldo" I wouldn't be starting your game.
They do, see WCL for reference. And the layers are awful, they are a fantasy and so totally unrealistic it is laughable. So for a "rivet counter" who likes to recreate a past period they are a joke. Therefore if I play WCL I have to uninstall content! They should make the selectable not err on the side of those for whom realism isn't so important as for some of us it does harm the experience.
I really like this route, the scenery and landscape looks great overall. Stations all have unique (floor) textures and grunge dirt effects and lots of attention to detail on the route itself. For me it's on par with Dresden-Riesa.
In addition to the performance slumps that do occur, what bothers me the most on such a demanding route as the Rhine route is the foresight: For me, that destroys the whole immersion, which makes everything in the distance look oversimplified and washed out. And it is very noticeable here that building types are repeated over and over again, as only a handful of new houses have been added. This is particularly noticeable in the old towns. Too bad, I thought the Rhine route could become my favorite route, but that's not the case.
I've run the route once in each direction and consider it DTG's best route in ages. If anyone is put off by some of the comments on here, don't be.
This is a limitation from the UE i guess and have nothing to do with DTG... In TSC is that also a known issue. Its how the rendering is in modern engines.
Unsure if it's been mentioned already or not but please consider disabling the substitution of the LFR 110 into previously released german routes. (and the Bremen 110 too) Also, Snow Buildup, being a TSW 3 core feature, should be standardized on all new routes.
So, I've decided to make a list of things I like about LFR, things that I feel need to be improved and things I hope will come. At the end there's a section with things I have questions about. Good The timetable is honestly quite good and varied, it has many overtakes and interesting patterns, and reflects the route and it's role as a major north-south connection very well. Generally the scenery is quite good and immersive. Stations and signal boxes look especially good and really reflect the '90s well with the non-standardized platforms. Rolling stock choice feels good (to start off with) The '90s are a very welcome break from all the traffic red and modern engines and units we've seen so far. The interaction and timing together with Niddertalbahn is very nice. Need to be improved Signal sequences need to be looked at properly. There's a lot of weirdness going on making it very frustrating to play, especially with PZB and knowledge of how the signals are supposed to work. Routing for some services is weird, leading to unannounced diversions over switches that are only safe for 40km/h while you're doing 160 km/h. (I've previously in this thread outlined IC 822 and EC 8 as two services that have this issues). HUD doesn't reflect route speed limits accurately, sometimes being to early, sometimes being too late. River, need I say more. The Karlsruher cab car has a weird effect when you jump to the '2' camera where the headlights and destination board look like they have some weird LOD things going on. The Karlsruher cab car destination blind still resets like on BRO initially (this has been fixed there I believe). Fixes to the BR 110 in Livery Designer, currently you can't place things further than halfway down. There still seem to be some issues with cars going through crossing gates. BR 110 shouldn't sub into modern routes, especially in orient red (I don't mind the traffic red, as it seems to be only when you select it as a player). UK license plates on German cars. The names of Bingen Hbf and Bingen Stadt are listed as 'Bingerbrück' and 'Bingen', their older names (before 1993), in the timetable. This is incorrect and should be fixed. The destination boards on the IC coaches say "IC/EC xxx: Linke Rheinstrecke", or the translated variant of it. It should read "IC/EC xxx: *name of the train, i.e. Steigerwald*". If the game can read wether the service is an IC or EC and which number, it should also be able to read it's name right? There's no physical snow buil up, even though this came on routes before this. It's really a let down when playing in wintery conditions. The fan sounds are incredibly loud in the cab. I get that these are old locomotives that had loud fans in real life, but it shouldn't be the same in the cab as outside the loco I think. What I hope will come PIS. I really miss this as it gives you information on what's going on with the trains around. I love lookin at them and seeing where the trains you meet are going, and I also really like the looks of the '90s PIS. Hopefully it will come. IR coaches (in a future DLC) An engine like the BR 140 for freight, maybe with some more freight waggons and use of the ES50 waggon from Niddertalbahn (in a future DLC) The BR 110 on some higher level services (like the Airport intercity, which IRL only ran with 4 coaches, or the occasional IR service) The removel of the Karlsruher cab car from D-trains. A cab car isn't really realistic on these services, they should all be loco hauled n-Wagen, and then loco hauled IR coaches if those ever come. Remember, these were nightly (international) long distance trains with sleeper coaches being quite common. Some shunting oppertunities with the BR 365. More liveries (orient red BR 103, blue/beige BR 110, silver n-Wagen, etc.), though I really do hope that DTG doesn't try to sell those at a high price as I think they should have come with the route. A variant of the BR 103 without the skirt and physical logo for Livery Designer, as it's currently quite weird to make liveries for it. Being able to walk through the BR 103 side corridor. This would be really convenient, and it seems all modelled down there, so why not let us walk there? BR 101 substitution on some top line services. A bit more variation in consist length. 14 coach Intercities weren't uncommon from time to time, it would be nice to see some more variety there. Improved church models. The ones on this route are just a let down, in general and especially in comparison to real life. They're reused low quality models. (More general, but) improvement to the newest lighting so I can actually still see in summer conditions without being blinded by shiny ballast. What I wonder about Is the BR 103's braking really accurate? It puts down over 5 bars with even small brake applications, making it really difficult and weird to brake. This can't be correct right? Is some of the signage supposed to be reflective? I get the feeling that the speed signage etc. isn't reflective, but I don't know if these already were in 1997.
I've noticed the same issue, in BRO the HUD displayed the max speed for the train (normally 120kph for freights and 140kph for the cab car) but it doesn't seem like it's being implemented into this route weirdly.
Nice route! Some small things: On the collectible routemaps it reads "Ingleheim" instead of "Ingelheim". The parked cars have "British" licence plates (front white, rear yellow), although we are in Germany.
Thank you for this comprehensive list. I'll add a few things (hoping the dev team will see your list and my additions): Yes! This is giving me uncomfortable TSC vibes (as it's, I'm afraid to say, quite sloppy in places). When coming into Bingenbrück Rangierbahnhof, there's no warning of an upcoming red signal, you go over the 500 Hz magnet and boom, Zwangsbremsung. If you know about this and slow down beforehand, you see that the red signal has a "Rangiersignal" switched to go. AFAIK, this is not correct at all, since you're coming from outside the station. It should be a green main signal. Same thing happened to me coming into Mainz on a passenger service. As I said in a previous comment: walking to the other cab inside the BR 103. The space is modelled, it's necessary before every service to switch on PZB and SiFa. I imagine it's not a huge task to define the space as walkable. Why didn't they? This is much, much more important than my walkable loco corridor. This again gives me bad TSC vibes: Basically, the maximum usable brake setting is 2 (19%), after that it's just unrealistically strong. It looks like the brake cylinders put on far too much pressure. Haven't tried that one yet, but in general throughout the game I wish we could start with snow on the ground but clear skies under dynamic weather. I suspect though that that's a limitation of the dynamic weather that'd be hard to work around. All in all, I really like this route. The locos look great, the scenery is great, there are varied options.... I just wish the braking and signalling was better.
I feel like that is just a missing weather preset for dynamic weather, and I would also really like to see it. I agree with your general points and will update my list with some of your stuff too
I have now tried, and LFR doesn't seem to have snow buildup. That is really a big shame, as I expected this feature to be standard for routes now, and it is a huge improvement to the look and feel of routes in winter.
I forgot something quite important that has been mentioned by others as well: the fan sounds in the cab on both locos. The compressor and the engines themselves are fairly faint, but the fans sound the same outside the loco and inside the cab. That can't be right and should be adjusted.
On Timetable service SE 3352 I have been stuck at a red signal for 25 mins exactly 7km away from Koblenz. Two other trains are stuck ahead of me as well that can‘t enter the station
So the game pass discount finally kicked in yesterday evening so I’ve bought it and played about 3 - 4 hours. I like it a lot. I won’t list my good and bad points as they’ve all been covered already and for the most part, I agree with them. The two most annoying things for me though are : Lack of PIS. Even if it’s not working it would be nice to see it. The 103 Wipers. Every run I’ve done has snowed or rained. It’s really getting on my nerves that the connecting bar detaches itself on each sweep. Once I saw it I can’t un see it. Generally though, happy with my purchase and looking forward to seeing some fixes. I didn’t see all the preview of Niddertalbahn last night, but I think the DMU from that laters in? If so that will be nice to give it a bit of a faster tun.
The brakes of the 110 on BRO were already too strong. Same for the 110 here on LFR. But the brakes of the 103 are even more overpowered.
Spot on end regarding the corridor on DB Baureihe 103 it should be where Linienzugbeeinflussung Punktförmige Zugbeeinflussung Sifa switches are. Basically you have to run it like a DR Baureihe 250 which is the original designation for DB & Pressnitztalbahn Baureihe 155 for PZB LZB & Sifa
There are a couple of speed reduction warning and signage missing going in the Mainz direction. There is also a warning of a drop to 120kph and the track speed is actually 100kph when you get to it.
Defintiely agree with the brakes being far to strong and speed signage track side and in the hud could do with being looked at please.
There is a solution to make the brake of the locomotive more realistic.... In the room behind the driver there is a yello switch wat standard is activate at brake mode R what means "rapid braking" this is not the correct setting... IC/EC or IR with in the game 9 coaches you have to switch to braking mode "P" for passenger.... I hope this brings more realism now in game and more realistic breaking force. See the picture below...
No it has not been fixed ;-) Nope...Video is made in "P" mode with 60% brakes applied, this is no emergency braking or "schnellbremsung"
It happens to me with the locomotive DB 103. When I start braking, the transformer disconnects me. I have to turn it on every time I brake. Is there a way to keep the transformer from shutting down?
This probably also confirms none of the testers ever run without the HUD... what IS actually being tested? Missing scenery is not found, safety system bugs are not found and now signaling gets through to release in a dire state...
I saw the same post on rail-sim.de and tried it out. I can't say I see any big difference in braking behaviour.
If you look for strict realism on DTG's German routes you will be disappointed. There are IC trains with no dining cars, Nightjet trains with no sleeping cars (!), drivers wearing out of date uniforms, city details that are just wrong (e.g. Wuppertal) and so on.
That may be so, but they could have just used the IC coaches and slapped a really simple two-step paint job on them and it would have had a much more realistic feel. Some people probably would still complain, but I would have a much easier time believing that I'm driving a "Riviera Express".
You need to have the tap changer down to 0* before you apply brakes, otherwise the main breaker will open to prevent damage to the transformer. *The actual tap setting, on the display, not just turning the wheel back to 0- there's a delay.
This is not correct. Germany (and many other UIC-countries) have been using R-brake for passenger trains since the 1940s. P- and G-brake are used almost exclusively for freight trains (some passenger vehicles might lack R-brake and then they will of course use P-brake). In fact, the IR and IC coaches should be in "R+Mg" (default setting) to utilize the magnetic track brakes in emergency. If you run an IC train in P-brake then it will be heavily restricted in speed. Regarding the reports of unrealistic brakes on the BR110 and BR103 what I have been told by a BR110 driver is that in normal service braking the locomotive uses either electric brake or air brake. Not both. In emergency the BR110 will use low air brake pressure + electric brake (low being "niedrige abbremsung" or 3.8 bar). Currently in the game the locomotives use both air and electric braking so essentially the locomotives are braking with twice the realistic brake force (approximately). This is my guess as to why they are reported as braking too strongly. Of course it is possible that there are other factors that contribute (maybe the air brake force is too high etc, I haven't tested or worked on these locomotives so I have no idea).
Being on PC Steam, I used a mod to drive the BR 101 on this route and it is nothing less than superb. Please DTG, I implore you to make the BR 101 officially sub in occasionally for the BR 103 so our community friends on console can share this experience too. The BR 101 entered service in February 1997 so it's not an outlandish flight of fancy and gameplay wise it really is special.
The problem is, the BR 101 at the moment can't use the doors on the old IC cars. Same for BR 110.3, it can't use them either.
Thanks for this explanation! I didn’t think about this. Now it makes sense that it was not done, as it would have needed a redesign of the 101 and it is not just a simple sub. I am just wondering why DTG have not mentioned this and why they have not chosen a 1996 timetable, as they would have avoided this problem all along?!
As far as I understand it the BR101 uses the door system called SST-F ("Seitenselektive Türsteuerung Fernverkehr"). This system allows the driver to not only release the doors but to select which side of the train the doors should be released. So the jumper cables sends several signals (open left, close left, open right, close right etc). The new IC coaches are compatible with this system. The old IC coaches that are used on LFR use the door system called TB0. This system is more primitive and only sends two signals (afaik): open doors & close doors. The side selection is handled by the conductor (or the passengers?). IRL if the BR101 is driving coaches with TB0 then simply moving the door selector away from "close all" will send an "open doors" signal, otherwise the signal state is "close doors". In TSW the BR101 was not initially intended to drive coaches that use TB0 (since these didn't exist at the time, afaik the Dostos use TAV) so that functionality was never implemented. To make the BR101 compatible with the old IC/IR coaches on LFR the loco would need to be updated. I guess that is why the layers were left out. A funny thing is that the BR101 behaved closer to TAV in it's initial release. TAV is more complex than SST-F and allows for traction lock when doors are open (among other things). When I made the TSW3 update I removed those TAV specific things and made it worse (but more realistic ).
So, besides I like to repeat, please fix the brakes, I made a video for you guys, the visuals of the route are stunning in many places.
Please find attached screen shots of speed reduction problem. The hud tells us the approaching speed restriction is to 120kph but the line side signage says 100kph which is correct.
But the yellow warning sign for this speed limit also says 120, something has clearly gone wrong here.
I think there are some 1000 Hz magnets missing or not enabled round Mainz main station. Started a IR journey today and the signal at the platform showed Vr 0, but I didn’t need to acknowledge it and didn’t got a restricted speed limit of 40 km/h as usual. Same happened at the next Vr 0. Only at the 3rd VR 0 signal right before Mombach was an active 1000 hz magnet.
