Route Mittenwaldbahn: Innsbruck - Garmisch-partenkirchen Feedback Thread

Perhaps the 1020 is less noisy than the E94... I've only ever seen the latter live... yet. The ÖBB did refurbish these things quite a bit after all

 

I tend to do timetable night runs using custom weather, with the date set to January, a clear sky and around 80% snow coverage on the ground. It works on all routes and this one is no exception. Prepare yourself for a wonderful nighttime driving experience. The snow and clear sky makes the scenery visible and some routes look superb at night using this method. Enjoy.

 

Is this a bug or is it intentional that you can't reduce the trees?

 

Thanks Dom, that would be great. Very surprising that such an old soldier would be so quiet.

 

Just a heads up for Xbox users who have purchased this and are unhappy with the product you can report it on the Xbox store page if you feel short changed by DTG and hopefully this will at least force them to add a more accurate product description.

Unfortunate this issue is such a big one as TSG have done such a great job with this route.

 

Where is this on the route?

 

Never been on an E94, but have been on a 140 and that matches my experience. In the cab, you don’t hear the motor whine much (if at all) but the fans are very loud and drown most other things out. I’m not sure how the cooling power of a 140 compares to a 1020 and thus how comparable the fan noise level is.

For what it’s worth, I did have a go with the 1020 and a 1500t train on LFR today (because of course I couldn’t resist). Two things. Firstly, it is true that TSW’s 1020 does start producing more noise when both at speed and under load - think upwards of 60km/h in tap 12 or more. Not much sound starting off though while pushing her as far as I could due to the heavy load. Secondly, it’s mostly the external sounds that suffer. If you’re standing still with weak blowers, the cab has the blower sound but the external view is completely silent. That’s on PS5, just in case.

Very glad to hear that the sounds will get another once over. It’s the only thing that irks me a bit with this otherwise fantastic route.

 

Great route and nice scenery. Could other developers use as standard
Found two little bugs:
1) Cab of 1020: the driver position is buggy. When going in External view and back I become positioned further back. When I zoom in and back I never cant get back as far as before. Only when I go again in Externe View and back I became positioned further back again. [someone mentioned it some pages before].
2) As I walked in Innsbruck the stairs down, I couldn´t walk up back to the platform (the 1st on the western side of the station. Dont know the platform number right now). Sometimes I got stuck further down, sometimes I got little closer to the platform (and sometimes passengers prevent me to go up). On the stairs to another platform i could go up.

 

This is a much better description of the bug than whatever I wrote a few days ago I find myself frantically switching to the external camera and back inside again quite frequently to get that cool wide field of view. I hope they set this as the default in an upcoming patch, even after zooming in and back out again.

 

Which one is the 1500t train?

 

I play on PC and I agree that it's the exterior blower sounds that are lacking the most. I hope the audio improvements doesn't make the motor sounds too loud compared to the rest of the sounds though. I have only done one run with the 1020 yet, but the interior sounds isn't bad compared to what I would expect and have heard on Youtube.


The 1020 in general is really great to have in game, and it is a fun unique experience to drive it. I love little details like the speedometer wabbling which makes it even more difficult to drive on this route. However, one issue with the route I've noticed is that the passengers doesn't get off at the last stop. This leads to passengers being in the coaches when the shunting moves are being done. I don't know if this is a route specific issue though as it happens on other ones too.

 

So is the signalling correct or wrong for Austria?

 

In Mittenwald, See you signs from Stations building on Platform 1. Then you go over the tracks around the warehouse along the road, it's about 1 km from the station towards the mountains ..... We were looking for it for a while too .....

 

I think this also occurred in one of the livestream appearances Lukas had before release, and he essentially said it was a core issue.

 

Quiet isn't the word I'd describe, loud is the word but largley down to the blowers!

The change is a general increase in volume by around 50% to bring it in line with other locos, it was noticeably quieter than other vehicles so this brings it inline with others. The exterior blowers I did already note as being a bit quiet and adjusted, although naturally they would be louder inside than out. There was some further quirks of the occlusion I have also adressed.

 

So far, the patch notes this tuesday should look like this… /wishing
-removed inner window reflections on OBB1020, so you can see beauty of this route even from inside of the cab!
-On PS5 , in BR111 and OBB1020 as well we repaired Circle button triggering not only SIFA acknowledge but Indusi Wachsam too, which does not corensponded with TSW4-5 standards. Now, when hitting circle button, only Sifa triggers, Indusi wachsam did too only if Indusi magnet needs to be acknowledged.
-revisited signaling system for Vorsignals so they doesnt show Halt when next Hauptsignal is Frei
-various performance improvements, mostly above Insbruck to Mitt
-adjusted sounds for OBB1020, stronger sound outside
-various route scenery details fix (cows, etc)

 

This schedule mission spawns me randomly on the map but without train.

 

There isn’t any be default. I went into the formation designer and put a 1020 together with 17 (I think it was) of the loaded VTG Eanos.

Well, I assume it’s not correct to be shunting with the shunting signals at danger. I think TSW struggles to differentiate shunting moves and train moves and that causes problems on Austrian routes because of the unorthodox way their signalling treats shunting signals.

I do hope this doesn’t get lost along the way. It’s quite unfortunate that there are still locos being released with the outdated logic.

 

As it came up in suggestions thought I would pop the thought in here, too.

Why is the Krokodil so squeaky clean? Looks like it came out the Fleischmann HO model box! Could we not have at least the possibility of a slightly weathered or dirty version showing up in game? Just a thought.



Though £325 - eek!

 

I miss the chassis texture improvements there 1020

 

PS5
Service 5484 Change Ends at 16:00 in Innsbruck is missing from the service offer at OBB 1020

 

Agreed, the blowers are definitely the most noticeable sound contributor in the cab. I just hope that +50% isn't too much of an increase. Just did a run with more heavy loads and in higher "gear", that already made it considerably noisier!

I just finished another 1020 scenario and thought the exact same! A little bit of weathering for the old lady wouldn't hurt
Although most of the other vehicles ingame also tend to look a little bit too pristine...

One reason why I switched from model trains to Transport Fever

 

My slight concern as well, we don’t want a repeat of the 103, 110 etc. where a wall of white noise drowns everything else out. SimRail actually does the effects quite well with the fan spooling down as you gather speed so you can clearly hear the traction whine.

 

But it's a fact that the blowers are that loud on the 103s and 110s, and the 111s too. On those locos you can't hear much traction whine because there is not much to hear. The Kroc does have a so called "Tatzlager" drive, the others use "Hohlwelle". The latter is really quiet and starts being audible at speeds around 80 with a quite high frequent tone that is not massively loud.

Question is: what do you want? Realistic audio, or audio that fits YOUR needs? I think realistic audio is the best for the masses. And of course, only when possible to reproduce, what is always a big challenge with trains. Don't expect perfection. If all would ask for perfect audio, we would not have 10% of the available content yet. Audio is often a blocker for doing a train at all.

 

PS5
Service BR111 number 5438 ...... incorrectly stated that it is to Garmisch, it should be to Mittenwald

 

PS5
I tried adding OBB1020 to the Semmeringbahn and Salzburg-Rosenheim maps. In the case of Semmering there was no problem, in the case of Salzburg-Rosenheim in Timetable mode it said Not enough space and it doesn't work... that's a shame. In Free Roam mode it works....but that's quite uninteresting

I tried adding BR111(beige/blau) to the Salzburg - Rosenheim map and the same problem, with BR111 it's a bigger shame. So if it could be fixed? Thanks in advance

 

PS5
Another crossing that needs a little comparison, this time in Giessenbach

 

Appreciate your response Maik. I think in the case of the Krokodil it is more genuine surprise that such a lovely old loco would be so relatively quiet. As regards sounds generally then yes, sometimes it is necessary to have a compromise between reality and entertainment. The Class 45 and Class 47 are perfect examples where the external sound cannot actually be heard in the cab but they would be really boring if the sounds were done realistically. Not sure how it is in Germany, but the sounds and smells of trains are one of the key appeals of the railway hobby, certainly here in the UK.

Anyhow I would hope this can be taken as constructive feedback and indeed your colleague has stated the sound levels will be receiving a little buff. The loco and new route are amazing and it has been frustrating not being able to spend more time on it trying to reach the February distance Mastery objective.

 

tatzlager, which means axle hung motors and straight gears, those would be loud
the same goes for those Milwaukee Road boxcab electrics that just arrived in TSC
Still, audio fidelity does so much more for the impression you're driving a heavy, hard working locomotive than any fancy graphics
but loud audio will get boring after a while and in the prototype, crews complained about it and even got hearing damage over their years of service?

 

I’d caution against ‘we’. I certainly do want a repeat when realistic as Maik also explains. For me personally, the enjoyment does not come from the sound itself, but from the accuracy of the sound, if that makes sense.

 

Very good route and rolling stock, was worth day 1 purchais. I agree the sounds need a revisit, since the krokodil is rather on the quiet side.
Hope TSG will patch all reported things.

Taking a few overhauled 1116 from Bludenz to Wolfurt: --> Yes by the way DTG still didnt make 1116 substitution working on Vorarlberg, which is totaly pathetic at this point. This was in the patch notes once.

 

On the 111 the direct (loco) brake behaves a little weird. If you apply the direct brake and "overbrake" the c-pressure to a higher level using the indirect brake, then releaes the indirect brake again, it will also fully release the direct brake which according to the 111 schematics (both 1983 and today) and the behaviour of the modernized 111 irl shouldn't happen. The cylinder pressure should only regulate down to 3,6bar (full direct brake) or whichever pressure was set using the direct brake before. It's a little annoying when you want to secure the train using the direct brake after stopping.

 

Fair comment. This is why the subject of sound is very subjective. However there’s a reason why many cab ride videos on loco hauled trains certainly from UK producers such as Locomaster Profiles and Videoscene actually record the sound with microphones in the rear cab with the window open then match it to the video clip. Or a few years back now a guy called Rolf Stumpf issued some audio CD’s of various on train trips he had made recordings of, notably Greek Alco’s and some stuff from Germany too.

 

Oh, really? I wouldn't know - recorded cab rides were never hugely popular in Germany as far as I can tell. Don't get me wrong, I certainly see your point and why some would want a more liberal approach. I do agree with Maik though that a simulator should put realism above all else (in sounds as in all other aspects).

To stop us talking in circles (mea culpa, you know I always jump in when the fan noise levels get brought up ), tastes are different and sounds are no exception to this.

 

What you describe is the reason at least 1 direct brake valve per locomotive has to be in the open position when using cab cars or double traction etc. Applied direct brake valved caused a lot of damaged over time . So yes the indirect brake wont just release the brake pressure while the direct brake is applied. The connection to the brake cylinder is made with the "doppelrücklagventil", means the stronger pressure wins.

In the Situation where the indirect brake is released, the direct brake will have effect on the pressure without resistance from the other pipe.

 

Not sure if this is a bug or the cows are just really aggresive.

 

I'm talking about single traction no cab car, the coupled cab is in the middle position as it should be. The direct brake pressure will always be on the valve since it's a seperate system and as soon as the pressure from the Steuerventil (or Druckübersetzter for that matter) is below the direct pressure, the valve will close on the Steuerventil side and the cylinders will stay pressurized with the direct brake pressure. While the Steuerventil C pressure releases.
Right now ingame it's like as if the valve is stuck in position after releasing the indirect brake, so the higher direct pressure doesn't "win" and the cylinders fully release.

 

This is my third dedicated feedback comment for this add-on. Previous comment HERE.

Scenery

• Kaltenbrunn: There seems to be a bit of a collision/texture glitch in a large grassy field a few hundred meters west of Kaltenbrunn, directly south of the track. There’s a sort of “scar” going down the whole width of it, perpendicular to the track. Most noticeable in low sunlight.
• Klais: There’s a relatively big level crossing here, and a car approaching it from northwest (so eastbound on the big street running parallel to the track) stopped very early in the turning lane of the big street - about a hundred meters away from the level crossing. It ended up clogging the whole eastbound lane of the big street, even for the cars going straight on which didn’t want to turn at all.
• Mittenwald: Some of the plants in the big circular pots on the platforms are poking out of the bottom of the pots. And some of them are glitching/shaking erratically if you look closely. The latter also happens at other stations, as detailed in one of my two previous feedback comments.
• Between Scharnitz and Giessenbach: For a few hundred meters, there’s a long and narrow path parallel to the tracks which not only looks incredibly unrealistic (seems like the popular “dirt road with two tire grooves” texture was simply cut in half), large parts of it are also floating in mid-air.
• A few kilometers south of Giessenbach: In the first big curve after the relatively straight departure from Giessenbach, approximately where the road underpass is located, the track and ballast are floating above the ground.
  • The same occurs basically exactly between Seefeld and Reith, in the curve directly northwest of the bridge over the road.
• Seefeld: The yellow line texture on the southern end of the island platform (track 2) is partly sunken into the ground.
• Ehnbachtunnel: Plant stuck in the ceiling at the western tunnel exit/portal. Stone/rock texture also clipping through the angled western portal sidewall.
• Martinswandtunnel: Hole in the tunnel wall near the southeastern end of the tunnel. Best visible when approaching from the northwest.
• Innsbruck West: The ramps and slopes/inclinations of the platforms (especially the track 2 & 3 island platform) would profit from a bit of smoothing. They all look quite blocky/craggy, with the polygons being clearly visible. A good example is the ramp towards track 2 at the eastern end of the track 2 & 3 island platform canopy.
  • The lamppost directly east of the aforementioned canopy has no collision.
• Innsbruck Hbf: Lighting/shadow issues with the large concrete bus canopy (?) parallel and adjacent to track 14b. Best viewed in the morning and standing west of the canopy.
• Innsbruck Hbf: The accessible (southern) passenger underpass has numerous issues.
  • There are holes at some of the transitions between the stairs to/from the platforms and the main underpass.
  • There are also two big holes at the upper end of the track 215 staircase.
  • Many of the stairs have a peculiar issue where, if the player moves upstairs and stops anywhere on the staircase, they cannot go further up and instead need to start all the way from the bottom again.
  • The northern underpass (entry blocked off by invisible walls) has multiple instances of floating grass near the stairs.
  • There’s a small amount of earth/ground texture clipping on the tracks 9 & 13 island platform between the two underpasses.

BR 111 DBB

• In certain sunlight conditions (e.g. late afternoon), many of the button/indicator edges on the TSG Tele-Funk board on the left side of the dashboard flicker periodically. Their material seems to be very sensitive to lighting changes.
• Question: How is the Traction Motor Fan lever (Off/Strong/Weak) used during gameplay? The manual is quite vague in that regard.

 

PS5
I was riding the BR103 service from Inns West to Inns Hbf in the afternoon, on the way I was stopped twice by Indusi magnet at the sign indicating a Red + shunting permit. I used the PZB Overide, and nothing, still the penalty brake.....am I doing something wrong?

 

Did you hold down PZB override?

 

Hold on, I tried again, it works fine for a while, then it stops me again......I guess I'm doing something wrong

 

While I'm thoroughly enjoying the route I have an issue with the Krok runaround services e.g. E681 Change ends (part 1.) i waited the moment like instructed then gort down and uncoupled the coaches as instructed and the loco buggered off with the station being on a downward slope. I would have thought that the brakes would have been applied when the service started as with every other service I've ever done since I started playing TSW way back on TSW 2020. TSG need to through each and every service and ensure that the brakes are applied as they should be as the train is set us as just arrived and loading passengers

 

You can leave it off for shunting (as long as you’re not shunting some really heavy trains around). Otherwise, put it on as you’re about to set off and leave it on. Weak or strong is up to driver’s discretion.

 

Also not really sure why these run round moves were created as lots of individual legs. Surely it would have been easier and less confusing in the timetable display to make each run round one timetable. Also I suspect you will get an element of what happened on the Glossop line occurring here. If you return to free roam intending to grab the next leg, then you may find the AI has beaten you to it. Suspect that might be what’s happening here.

 

I had the exact same issue on this service! Thought it was my fault, that I missed the magnet or waited too long or something. Seems to be an PZB (or rather Indusi) issue after all.

The fact that each of those shunting moves has been split into a different service baffles me too. The issue you described, with the AI hijacking the next shunting move, also happens frequently on routes like Rosenheim-Salzburg or Maintalbahn. Verrrry annoying.

If this has been done to fill up the timetable with more services, a better way (in my eyes) would have been to add a couple of shunting services for other non-Mittenwaldbahn trains instead. For example, shuffling around Innsbruck Gbf to arrange a freight train destined to go across the Brenner or the Arlberg. Or take an 111 at Garmisch, grab some n-Wagen from another track and bring them to the platform for an upcoming München-bound service.

Or another idea:
Add an option to the game, to be able to "reserve" follow-up services (if available) for yourself upon starting any service. So the AI won't even try to take over those follow-ups

 

OldVern, AmityBlight, Lukas mentioned the reason for the split up runaround services on stream. It’s only done on the German side so the AI properly changes ends (and sets up lights etc the other way around). As I’ve said before in other threads, reversing is a big no no in Germany. You must always change ends and the split up services allow the AI to be in line with that.

The Austrians were far less strict about that (as in many other areas the more I learn about it) and reversing was common. Thus, the runarounds on the Austrian side are not split up and let the AI reverse.

It’s just a way of getting the AI somewhat compliant with official rules and increase authenticity.

 

Aha. Understood. However in that case they need to work with DTG to avoid the Glossop (or Hadfield) syndrome where you returned to free roam and as you were changing ends, the AI promptly stole the next working from you. Not sure how that can be done without changes to the core. Maybe the end of run screen should offer to drop you in the next working, rather than the cab where you were. The workaround on Glossop was to change ends before releasing the doors at the final station stop so you were in the correct cab to pick up the next working. That’s probably not going to work here.

 

I don’t think the issue being describes was one of the AI taking over, it was that the loco rolled down a hill because the brakes weren’t set. No point in analysing an issue that isn’t present.

 

It was just a thought…

Has the OP applied the handbrake or parking brake, then?

 

It's up to you as the driver to make sure the brakes are properly applied. If I understand your meaning correctly.