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85 Blue

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by rat7_mobile, Sep 7, 2020.

  1. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    I am using the red train, and there is a 85 blue, and all I can do is to get the train a short distance before it stopped and it then take about 5 minutes bfore I can get it to go agaln for another short distance. I presume the 85 is the speed at which to speed control is set, but the track speed is 175
     
  2. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    I just found out, if the 85 blue is eanble (CTRL+ENTER), th maximum speed the train can go at is 20KM, faster than that the train stopped after a short distance, and pressing the Q, DEL, END, PAGEDOWN, keys does nothing until the rain has been stopped for 5 minutes
     
  3. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    The blue 85 means that PZB is activated. If this is at the start of a run, you are limited to 40kph until you release PZB or PZB releases automatically. After that, PZB is activated by acknowledging certain signals and speed reductions. It’s really quite a complicated safety system, but if you go on the Train Simulator YouTube Channel, Matt from DTG gave a tutorial on how to use it.
     
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  4. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    Apparently when the 85 blue is activated, the maximum, without the train stopping and having all kind of light and buzzer going on for 5 minutes after the train stopped.

    As for youtube channel, that is a video, it is intended to show the track, video are not for showing how to use the train, a manual is what is needed. (PS to play the video cost money)
     
  5. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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  6. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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  7. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    The Rules are still the same :)
     
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  8. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Active Member

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    The PZB rules are generally the same, be it for the game or for the real thing.
     
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  9. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    But the fact that rules are the same for the real thing and the game, still does not make it work in the game, as the game is using keyboard to make it workna drel thingI have no idea what it sue but there is not keyboard on the train, so it use some of knobs on in the cabin

    And I really doubt that the real train use 20KM as a speed, unless the use of the system represented by the 85blue is not in sue in realality
     
  10. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    20kph is not a speed dictated by PZB. The slowest speed is 25kph when you have stopped under the influence of a 500Hz magnet (red signal).
     
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  11. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    You need to make sure you do not activate PZB before you drive a train. You will only get these problems when PZB is activated. If you don’t activate PZB you can drive the train without any of these issues.
     
  12. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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  13. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    Why is ti that no one can explain simply:

    When pressing the CTRL ENTER is get the 85 blue showing, from there what do I need to press to get the rain going, and all the lights or differen light are showing, what need to be done with each, there is no need to explain the shacking of a button or somethong else 500 times a seconds or something like that just
    When 85 blue is ON hwat need to be done
    When Yellow is ON what need to be done
    When Red is ON whatr needed to be done
    etc,,,,
     
  14. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Everything is explained in the instructions we have put on you, as well as in the proposed video by Matt.

    This is not so simple :) Darum!
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2020
  15. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    The instruction are for old version of the game, and no clear at all, it is talking about thing that shake a 1000 itme a second and tinigs that shake a 500 times a second but not what need to be done
    and when
    What you have done is something '''''''''''''' for rocket scentist not for a normal user
    do not tell me that a normal user need to know that some thing is shacking at 1000 time a second, that is bull
     
  16. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    in a video it is absolutely impossible to leanr any thing as everything is done too fast
     
  17. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    1. Oh, this game tries to be a simulation, so... :)
    2. U can turn safety systems off.
    3. U should really try to watch Matt's tutorial-video.
     
  18. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    It’s not something that can be easily and quickly explained in a forum post. PZB is a complex safety system. You don’t have to use it in TSW, you have to physically activate it. The only thing I can recommend is to watch videos on the subject and to read the manuals of TSW German routes to help you to understand it.
     
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  19. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    For tomorrow I can prepare a simplified instruction for you - today I'm already a bit tired :)
    But - matjamca is right. This takes time to learn.
     
  20. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    This is Matt’s video. It’s a great starting point, but you will need to do further learning.

     
  21. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    that is what I mean, I do not want or need to understand it, I want to use it, and you can use it without understand it and to use it you need the very simple instruction
    When 85blue is ON what need to be done
    When REd is ON what need to be done
    When Yellow is ON what need to be done
    When purple is ON hwat need to be done
    if the color of the train as anything to do with the system then what need to be done for a specific color of train
    ETC....

    It can not be simpler than that, instread of bullshit document that means nothing to anyone
     
  22. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    I do not have the money to view a video, unless the video can be ought at a store
     
  23. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    I think we’ve taken a decent amount of time and effort to point you in the right direction. It’s true that you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink.

    If you want to use PZB, watch Matt’s video. I can’t make you watch it, but as I’ve already said, it’s a good starting point.
     
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  24. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    The video is free on YouTube. No money necessary.
     
  25. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Active Member

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    You need to understand PZB to use it. There are no simple instructions. The most simple ones can be found in the TSW manuals for the german routes. If you dont want to understand it, then dont use it. TSW is although its not an arcade game nor an hardcore simulation, it still simulates stuff which needs to be understood by the player.
     
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  26. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    Thank you for your generosity
     
  27. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    You're asking the wrong questions. There is no simple answer to, for example, even one of them - what to do when the 85 is flashing? It depends. Without understanding it is impossible to use these safety systems.

    Haha :) Patience. It's a train-sim.

    hehehehehehe
     
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  28. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    You have to pay to use youtube, and you have to pay for the use of video media on the intenet, we are charge for any kind of multimedia from the intner
     
  29. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Active Member

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    I dont have to pay for youtube.
     
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  30. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    As far as I’m aware, YouTube is free around the world unless you opt for YouTube premium. I use YouTube every day and have never paid a penny. Of course you have to pay for Internet access, so unless you have unlimited data, you will be limited.
     
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  31. Knightfire1964

    Knightfire1964 Well-Known Member

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    The manuals from tsw 2020 can be used in tsw 2 nothing has changed I helped someone learn pzb using those manuals on tsw 2 all that's different is the Hud but the rules and the keyboard functions are the same also not sure why you are using ctrl enter as to mainly use pzb you use the delete end page down keys also don't have pzb bridging on just by the way. Being that tsw is a sim to use pzb it is expected that it works in a realistic way. but once you do a bit of learning and learn from mistakes it took me maybe under a week to understand it on msb. There really is no simplified way of using or understanding pzb
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2020
  32. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    Why do you make thing more complicated than they are, it is like the voice in some train, when it is talking you press Q to shut it up and prevent the brake from being applied
    So it would be the same for the PCB, when a light or a buzzer ocmes ON you do something to prevent the brakes and turn the light/buzzer OFF,

    So it does not need to be as complicated as you make it to be

    PS CTRL ENTER is to enable all safety system in trains in TWS 2
     
  33. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Negative.
     
  34. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    PZB has no alarms for you to acknowledge. Alarms only come on if you miss an action, such as acknowledging a yellow signal.
     
  35. Knightfire1964

    Knightfire1964 Well-Known Member

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    Sifa is a completely different safety device to pzb its like me saying dsd is the same as AWS or AWS should be operated the same way dsd is
     
  36. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I'm afraid rat7_mobile provokes cheaply :D I can't believe someone can be so hostile to innocent instructions.
     
  37. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    I believe that he may be a younger member of these forums, and as such, we are patient with him.
     
  38. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah! Tomorrow I will try to somehow condensate these difficult issues for him, as I have already promised :)
    EDIT: Mission impossible maybe...
     
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  39. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    For your information to all, I am over 50 years old

    And now that someone said it is about a yellow light that need to be aknoledged, I did try to press all 3 PCB buttons, the DEL END PAGEDOWN, and even the Q whr the long light which came ON as soon as I had activated the system with the CTRL ENTER, but I could not make and of the buzzer stopped then the train stopped and could not be re-started until 5 minutes after it cmpletely stopped on the track and then on for a very short distance, before the yellow light was ON again and it would not do anything no matter what I was pressing, and again I ha to wait 5 minutes before it could be re-started.

    And the only way I found that the train could go any distance was if I was not going faster than 20KM, unless I dsiabled the PCB using the CTRL ENTER key

    But if the system is there it is because it need to be used, so c;lear simple instructions should have been provided before getting this in the game
     
  40. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    PS, if you do not want to do it, then do not, it would be appreciate, and most likely by more people than just me, but I will not upset if you do not want to do it
     
  41. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    This is really strange. My last try for 'tonight' to help You:

    Are You pressing all that PZB keys on numeric keyboard? If so, You have to turn NumLock OFF.

    This is not about WANT but CAN :)
     
  42. Knightfire1964

    Knightfire1964 Well-Known Member

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    PZB is not a clear or easy system to use that's why train drivers have to learn signals on all the routes they drive on including safety systems before ever stepping on same applies to this sim
     
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  43. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    First of all, it is the keys bet ween the letters and the numeric keypad

    And again whether you mean want or can, if you do not do it, the offer is still appreaciated, and so was the help
     
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  44. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    Siganl on the route are easy

    RED = stop
    Green = go
    Yellow = slowdown to crawl , because you have to stop soon, meaning no given distance as there is no clear distance between signal, I have seen yellow and seconds later a red, and then many yellow and never a red, but if you slow to about 20KM or lower when there is a yellow light, you would not have any problem to stop most of the time
     
  45. ShaneS89

    ShaneS89 Member

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  46. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    So I might as well tape the aknowleged key down, since I am always under 100KM, and can not keep the speed steddy, I am always going up and down every few seconds to try to keep with the red dot on the HUD
     
  47. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    The system does not need to be used. You can drive the train without it, and my best advice to you is to do so.

    PZB is about you reacting to things on the track, like speed limit boards and signals and taking actions such as pressing the acknowledge button and slowing down to specific speeds, which are different to the track speed limits, at the right moment. There are also other specific speed restrictions that occur under certain conditions that you need to learn. There are three sets of these speed restrictions depending on which of the three modes of PZB you are using. If you get anything wrong, like missing a speed limit board or signal, or not slowing to the correct speed quickly enough, that’s when the brakes come on and you have to reset things, using a different procedure, to get the train working again. There are no warnings that the train will stop itself, it will just do it, if you make one small mistake. You need to know exactly what all the signals mean, not just green and red being go and stop, because it is certain other signals that you need to react to when you have PZB on.

    That’s why you need to learn all of it and all the circumstances in which the different rules apply. There are no shortcuts or simple ways to do that.

    If you really want to learn how to use PZB then you need to read any advice given to you here and follow it, not claim that we are making it complicated for you. It already is a complicated system, the most complicated thing in TSW. Again my advice is to just drive without it activated.
     
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  48. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    Ooooff my brain hurts after reading this thread.
    Just turn pzb off.
    This game is mean’t to enjoyable, if it isn’t stop.
     
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  49. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    PZB is a very complex safety system that you need to understand the theory of how it works to be able to efficiently use in in practice. Your questions so far in a flight simulation forum is equal to which button do I press to fly, forget about the theory of aerodynamics.

    Several people have provided excellent references to help you understand the PZB system. Please take the time to review those references. Until you understand the theory I would suggest leave the safety system disabled (that is the default configuration) and only enabling them after you have been able to educate yourself on the theory of PZB.

    Just to clarify - in PZB there are no warning alarms - only alarms for not acknowledging track side signals — which signals need to be acknowledged and when is covered in the theory of operations that others have referenced both on YouTube and in route manuals for TSW2020 which works the same as TSW2.
     
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  50. rat7_mobile

    rat7_mobile Active Member

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    First off, I would like to thank everyone here for the help offered by all, in one way or another, it is much appreciated

    It is too bad that there is no help in the game, like a few optional tutorials to teach those skills to new people ( not necessarily new to the game itself but new to the train system).

    Lately as I became more at ease with the game, I have start to use the SHIFT ENTER and CRTL ENTER at the beginning of a run to get all the system working and so far only the PCB is not working for me, even with the lack of documentation I was able to use the British and American systems
     
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