PC Boston - Providence After Update - Bugs, Glitches Etc.

To follow-up, when the new DLC self installed, everything started working properly on the Boston route. Thanks everyone for all the insight and concern.

 

I drove an evening service from Boston to Providence, which unfortunately wasn't great. Shortly after Boston, the signals were permanently on "yellow", several times they also showed "stop". The speed could therefore hardly be extended, it was more of a creep.

In Providence there was suddenly a train (without a driver!) in front of me in the station, although the entrance was free for me. It was only possible to end the service after I slightly rammed the train. Almost all the cars were parked outside the station.



And I noticed that the performance has gotten worse!

In some sections with a lot of forest/leaves, FPS drops can be observed several times. This is not the case in Boston itself or other localities. Somehow unnecessary and similar to Kassel-Würzburg.

 

FPS drops / stuttering is the norm for TSW3 branded routes, so no surprise there. That train ahead of you is hilarious though! Another route success story

 

I remember Boston Sprinter having quite bad performance in TSW2 as well. Now with TOD4 it seems a bit more worse as well.

 

It surprises me how the worse TSW3 performance compared to TSW2 is not talked about more.

 

That service (Amtrak #177) does not have "permanent yellows" like you say. You're following a commuter train so you're going to get signal downgrades as you get closer to it. All the behavior from the signals is perfectly prototypical and normal.

List of less favorable signals in that service
1. Slow Approach at Tower 1 when leaving Boston
2. Approach at Cove (after the sharp curve leaving Boston)
3. Approach Limited signal as you approach Hyde Park. All part of getting closer to the train in front of you. But it quickly upgrades back up to Clear since that train ahead is clearing Canton Junction.
4. Advance Approach at block point 206.5 because you're approaching the commuter ahead of you that's at Mansfield. You continue past an Approach signal and get pretty close to the home signal at Mansfield. It upgrades once the commuter in front of you clears the next block point. Then the commuter ahead veers off to Attleboro track 3 and you continue without disruption.

The commuter train that's blocking your way at Providence I have no explanation for at this time. I'll have to look at the timetable playback.

But from a signal perspective, this was exactly by design.

 

Because the topic is usually yelled down by those that feel the sub par performance is acceptable therefore making the point not worth mentioning anymore. It's doubtful it will ever be corrected anyhow, so others like myself have just tossed TSW3 in the bin with a wait and see approach on whether TSW4 brings a better level of performance or if a new player will properly fill this gaming space.

 

As someone who is more used to UK and German railways, I plead ignorance to US safety systems but am happy to be educated. The visual/audible warning for speed reductions due a lower track speed (a tight curve for example) seems a wee bit last minute, often setting off a penalty brake. Of course the drivers will have an intimate knowledge of the route, but they must really need to be on their toes and anticipate as there are not even speed limit signs or advanced speed reduction boards!

 

I thought to myself that a "slow train" was driving in front of me.

Nevertheless, most sections were on "yellow" and therefore a higher speed was hardly possible. Of course, an overhaul would have been nice, if possible. But that's how it is every day on the real railway here in Germany.

I had already wondered why the service takes more time than others (displayed in the selection menu). Now I know it.

 

No overhaul was possible. That's the timetable.

 

Guys, welcome to the world of mixed commuter and long haul trains here in the US. On 2 track lines line the old New Haven out of Boston, this is going to happen more then you want as those pesky MBTA trains hog the road ahead of you stopping at most stations. Suggestion is, when you find this happening, look at the map to see if there is that train you are following.

 

Just completed Amtrak Acela Express #2173 (Boston - Providence), now I wont spoil it for anyone but this was a really enjoyable run.

 

Ran this service in my livestream last night and there are definitely issues with how the commuter train in front of you gets routed. I wholly expected it to allow us to pass at Attleboro, but instead the commuter train routed back in front! I was kinda shocked and that's not intended behavior. By the time I pulled into Providence the AI was just leaving. Yeah...that service took a while.

 

Put this in the "mega" thread but worth repeating here.

Doors on the MBTA rolling stock when driven from the cab car are not responding to keyboard input or the pop up dialogue. I literally had to fold every trapdoor step and close each door manually before the objective moved on. At the next station the doors wouldn't open, I had to again manually open a door platform side to start the loading prompt. That is going to get tedious on an all stations run from Stoughton into Boston.

 

Environment PC (steam).
Timetable mode at 16:00 in the evening leaving Boston garage by CAB.
The worst situation is at the first junction after departure, when another train is over the limit and goes under, bumping into the train at the stop.
Then, at the junction with the main line just before the station, an endless red light prevents you from entering the platform!

 

That's a classic! That's a sickness of Unreal Engine! These are artifacts from the temporal process for AA. That is a core Engine issue.

 

I've found one way to be on time and that's to leave early, load passengers and leave.

 

Personally I don't find performance worse than TSW2, TSW2 had performance issues too, especially toward the last few months before TSW3 (I guess I can't compare it now because I've since ditched it).

TSW3 is also actually smooth as butter on Xbox Series X. This goes for the intense TSW2 routes (BML) as well as the new TSW3 ones. It gets the odd momentary stutter but FPS are smooth as hell.

Comparatively, on my PS5 FPS are noticeably lower and it has more stutters. It isn't terrible though and varies by route.

I am not sure the exact reasoning, since the 2 consoles are pretty close in hardware and most games run identically well. I bought a Series X for other reasons and wasn't planning on moving any of my TSW stuff over but I tried it anyway since it was on gamepass and it was surprising the difference. Now I am moving my stuff over slowly.

Playing Boston-Providence yesterday on PS5, I did feel a few more slowdowns than it had before. I would assume that's to do with the volumetric clouds and the fact that an entire new train (Acela) was now on the route. Things like volumetric clouds will drop FPS vs the old ones. But also look world's better. They need to keep working on optimization particularly for the PS5.

I can't comment on PC but there are a lot of variables there.

 

You basically answered your question there. The way the US systems are set up, is the driver is expected to know the route inside and out, and where the speed changes are s that they can drive accordingly. They are meant to initiate the slow downs on their own based on that knowledge, and the safety system is there to give a last minute warning or at worst a penalty brake to avoid an incident.

I know some people consider using the HUD speed limit ahead warnings as "cheating", but in the US routes it makes sense to consider them, because we probably aren't going to put in the amount of hours on these routes it would take to know by heart when to start preparing for a speed change.

 

That's exactly what I meant, but good if you've confirmed it now.

 

Driving MBTA service 904 out of Stoughton, signal #2164 is set to fully restricting just before Route 128. Checking far up the line, I couldn't spot any train that would cause this aspect to be displayed. Although the dispatcher did permit me through at restricted speed, I was then hopelessly late for no apparent reason. So then I restarted the service without safety systems. I was now able to blow through the restricted signal at line speed (disconcerting), and thought all was well, until I encountered another one just before Ruggles. I didn't get the number for this one, but it is in the tunnel just before the station. I got permission to blow through this one as well.

Also, at both Route 128 and Ruggles, I got a more favorable aspect as soon as my doors closed and the objective was complete. I didn't notice any line traffic ahead that could have caused this, and in any case it's a little too coincidental that the signal upgraded both times exactly when my doors closed. This is very reminiscent of the dispatch beyond issue that still apparently plagues this route.

At Tower 1 it was the same situation where the physical signal is at stop but the cab signal is ACSES 15. You can't get permission to ignore this one because it's usually correct, so you have to wait and not SPAD. As I said before, this is not new to the latest update, but it used to be that ATC would hold you at Tower 1 until you could proceed. Now, the cab signals does not display ATC 20 (restricting) until after you pass the signal gantry. Which of these is prototypical? And, if Tower 1 is not in ATC territory, shouldn't the cab signal read ATC 20 instead of ACSES 15? I have also observed unusual behavior at the signal that guards entry to the NEC from the Franklin Branch, which is also not behaving as if it is in ATC territory, although I need to research this a little more.

Train 904 is also one of the services that I had previously gotten a gold medal for, that was then downgraded to silver after the latest update. After playing with safety systems off I was able to get gold again. Other longstanding problems of note that I can verify still exist include the PIS on Ruggles Track 3 displaying Track 2 info, no NPCs present at Hyde Park, and the missing pedestrian bridge at Route 128. All the trains at the Readville yard are still backwards, and F40 service 815 is still utterly confounding and impossible. Forest Hills does look much better with the improved tunnel lighting, I would say going from looking completely abandoned to somewhat abandoned. And, the HUD is now holding my MBTA equipment to 80 mph, which is correct.

Unfortunately for the timetable, it would probably have to be rebuilt from scratch because it was not designed for an accurate signal system. The trains were able to run closer together at higher speeds before, but this is not prototypical. In reality the trains are probably spaced farther apart, so that the speeds are higher on average. In any case the current timetable no longer has a schedule you can keep, but most services can still be done at least with safety systems disabled, and there was always a lot of schedule padding so that gold medals are not out of the question.

It sure does look nice though.

 

The performance question is quite easily answered. DTG doesn't know how to optimise their game (apart from really dumbing down the scenery) else they would have done something about it long ago. "Good enough" is likely their slogan before pushing things out the door.

 

Dispatch beyond instruction likely not ticked. That would be a timetable issue.

 

Over on XBox, I've uninstalled the TSW3 version of the route and gone back to playing it in TSW2, where it joins the likes of Peninsula Corridor. The tunnel entry flash was too much for me.

 

The whole TOD4 system is a mess on this route. Tunnel flashes, broken F40PH interior, objects either completely white bright or pitch black dark.

Honestly, can we just revert back to TOD3?

 

Good I waited a few days before installing TSW3 and uninstalling the DLC in TSW2 (limited disk space, so it's either / or). Are there similar lighting issues in the updated Sherman Hill?

 

Havn't got time to try Sherman Hill yet, but I would like to. But I assume Sherman Hill should be mostly fine, as it doesn't have many covered/tunnel sections, it only has Hermosa Tunnel.

 

Biggest problem I still have with Boston Sprinter is that each and every "Journey" element is set during winter with snow on the ground and more often or not a blizzard, or rather that white sheet that looks more like fog blowing periodically across the front of the train. For goodness sake, would it hurt to have recast some of the services in Spring, Summer or even Autumn - you know, New England Fall colours and all that.

 

I mean, nothing as drastic, we do want to see improvements only possible in the updated system, but the system does need a complete ground-up rework.

 

Query: in the F40PH, where are the switches for ATC/ACSES? (Yes, I know I can use the keyboard, but where's the fun in that?)

 

I'm on playstation but this seems to be the most relevant place to put this.

I was driving the F40PH on MBTA Stoughton #909, and I noticed that whenever accelerating at max power after a while all sound would completely disappear from the cab. Exterior sounds still fine, but the interior is dead quiet. Notching back the throttle makes the sound return, but accelerating it again causes it to fade again.

It's really irritating. Needs to be fixed ASAP because the train is completely unplayable with such an obvious bug.

 

It's in the back panel. Open it and there's 3 switches. One is alerter, cab signals and there's a 3rd I don't know the name of. Basically any switch that is down, turn up

 

Same thing happened to me the other day. I was leaving the tunnel out of Back Bay Station, went full throttle and the engine sound just disappeared.

 

IIRC, each of the Rush Hour routes was optimized with a "best season of year to play" in mind. For Boston it was winter, so that is why there are so many winter services in the journey.

 

Is anyone from DTG going to look into this? Because this is a major bug and something that needs to be fixed now, not in two months.

 

Surprise derailment, Stoughton branch (PC/Steam)
Stoughton #916
MBTA Cab Car

You're rolling along just fine, until you reach first siding on the right, just after the third level crossing (sometimes freight cars spawn there, sometimes not). Run onto the switch, instant derailment every time. Signal is proceed clear, line speed is 40. The shunt signal on the siding is at Stop, which would imply the switch is aligned to the main line.

Oops.

 

the hell? lmao i've got to test this

 

That's correct. Unfortunately, the NPC's were not " apparel-adjusted " for the New England winter in many cases. You can see this on a number of stations.

 

Followup: it only happens northbound. Headed to Stoughton there's no issue.

 

Noticed southbound Acelas don’t show proper destination on PIS. The on board train and station PIS say destination is Providence. And station PIS at Providence says “terminates here”. They should be showing the actual destination which is Washington DC.

 

MBTA #913 Boston-Stoughton: after Ruggles keeps me on a steady 45kph/yellow signal. Makes it very hard to maintain times, looking down the track on map I don’t see an obvious reason for it… not sure if a bug or intended behaviour and I’m missing something. Don’t get a green/track speed until almost at Rt 128. And then back to 45mph shortly after until Canton Junction.

(All said and done I was only about 2-3 min late though)

 

The first instance (after Ruggles) is most likely due to dispatch beyond at Hyde Park, I assume the train makes a station stop there. If not then I'm not sure. The second is due to slower speed switch to crossover to the Stoughton branch. The difference is the new (accurate) signals slow you down sooner than the old ones did. However, the timetable was not updated to reflect the new slower speeds; this, combined with the pre-existing dispatch beyond problems that have never been fixed, is resulting in some tediously slow services, especially outbound Stoughton trains. Don't expect any of this to ever get fixed. The best you can do is drive without safety systems enabled, or turn them off when you have reached a problem area.

 

If it’s realistic signalling then I am not bothered. I’d rather be late with them on then meet the schedule with them off. (I am not 100% sure what the “dispatch beyond” issue is)

I read somewhere else that MBTA considers a train “on time” as long as it’s within 4 minutes of schedule so that made me feel better.

 

It is a way of programming train pathing, where for each stop or waypoint there is in effect a toggle for the programmer, a "box to tick:" dispatch beyond means keep running this train's path beyond this point. The problem is that if the box is not ticked, then the game assumes the service terminates there and puts up a red signal- which cascades back through the signal progression.

 

Wonder if it is the service? I just ran 906 and did not have the derailment problem leaving Stoughton.

 

The new signals are not the problem, however they are exacerbating the existing problems. For instance I recently drove another Stoughton service and got a slowdown before Hyde Park, so much so that a trailing Amtrak service due at Route 128 three minutes after me, ended up passing me. Then I had to follow it, making for even more slowness. When I had previously driven the same service under the old signals, dispatch beyond was still there but the old signals kept me fast enough that the trailing service didn't pass me. I like adverse signals in the correct context, but driving slow for no reason (other than bugs) is not realistic and also not fun.

If we are being honest, there was really no point in "fixing" the signals in this way, the correct order would have been:

1) fix dispatch beyond
2) fix signals
3) fix timetable

If you didn't do #1, and aren't planning on #3, then you are probably wasting your time with #2. It has been suggested that the Acela would not have worked without the new signals; whether or not that is true, the best you can say is that DTG did the minimum necessary to get a new DLC for the route out. Although I respect and appreciate all the work Brandon did in regards to the signals, I would have thought that more work would have gone into these other issues, in order for him not to have wasted his effort. I was definitely wrong. Now it is an open question whether or not the new signals have made driving on this route a better or worse experience. I would say worse, while also acknowledging that the Amtrak services are probably the least-effected but the most popular to drive. This fact, combined with those players who don't even activate safety systems, means that there are plenty of people who don't think this is really a problem.

 

Brandon has said the is going to be looking at the dispatch beyond setting.

 

That would be great. MBTA services are being slowed down way too much due to improper routing.

 

I didn't know that. If that's the case then of course it's a good thing; also, Brandon clearly has a passion for this so I have a lot of confidence that if he does look into it, he will certainly be able to make improvements. He is like a one-man show saving Boston Sprinter from itself. I am also of the opinion that, if dispatch beyond is fixed and with the new signals, the timetable might be okay for the most part, with some late running but nothing too extreme. Time will tell.

 

Ok! Well that might explain it.

And as you describe it, it sounds dreadfully easy to fix. If it’s just literally a checkbox. With that in mind I hope it’s addressed soon!