Br 146.0 (and 145?) + S-bahn And Friedrichstadt Route Extension For Riesa - Dresden

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by jolojonasgames, Jul 27, 2021.

?
  1. Yes

    33 vote(s)
    68.8%
  2. Yes, and I would buy Riesa - Dresden because of it (I would otherwise not have)

    8 vote(s)
    16.7%
  3. Yes, but only if both locos are included

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  4. Maybe, if on a sale

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  5. No

    5 vote(s)
    10.4%
  1. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,380
    Likes Received:
    3,460
    Hi all, in light of the recent commotion around Riesa - Dresden losing it's originally announced S-bahn branches I thought that those could be a good candidate for a route extension, and now I'm finally suggesting it. Now I know that DTG isn't really planning on doing extensions, but I really do think this would be a good oppertunity to give it a try, as the branches are in high demand, and many people will own the base route (as it comes in a relatively cheap pack many will probably buy). I can also understand that some people might get upset at the thought of having to pay more for these branches, as they were originally announced to come as standard, but that's why I also included a loco, to add more value.


    The BR 146.0, and possibily the BR 145.
    [​IMG]
    A BR 146.0 at Dresden Hbf

    I originally suggested this loco as part of my Dresden - Děčín suggestion, which is situated east of Dresden Hbf and includes the eastern terminus stations of S1 and S2, and could merge with Riesa - Dresden, but that's besides the point.

    The BR 146.0 is the precusor to the well known TRAXX family of locomotives, some of which (BR 146.2, 185.2 and 185.5) are already in game, although on the inside they're quite different, with the modern TRAXX family of locomotives being of a more modular design, having more on board computers and . The BR 146.0 and the BR 145 were developed during the '90s, alongside the BR 101. Both the 145 and 146.0 are a direct developement from the experimental 12X. The front of the 146.0 is somewhat different from the later TRAXX locomotives, as the later TRAXX locomotives have a straight front underneath the curve, and the 146.0's front slopes slightly inward. The inner workings are also vastly different, resulting in a different sound, with the 146.0 sounding more like the BR 101 (check the trainspotting video below at 10:25 for the sound), and I actually think the base 101 sounds could be reused for this, hopefully lowering developement costs. Despite the similar looks, the gameplay will also be different to that of the TRAXX locos, as the 146.0's performance is quite different. On the S-Bahn of Dresden they haul DoSto coaches in VVO (VerkehrsVerbund Oberelbe) livery. These coaches are the same as will come with the base route, so will not have to be redone for this add-on, lowering it's developement costs compared to loco add-ons that do come with all-new coaches. Having the BR 146.0 on Riesa - Dresden makes a lot of sense, as these engines operate the largest part of S-bahn Dresden services. To make this DLC more interesting, the loco could come with some of its advertisment liveries in the same manner as the Trainbow livery on the Javelin, pictured below.

    [​IMG]
    146 017 with a VVO public transit advertisement, this should be licensable under the current VVO license, so could come in a similar fastion to the trainbow on the Javelin on SEHS.



    A little trainspotting, so you can hear the sound of the BR 146.0 (go to 10.25). Note how similar to the BR 101 it sounds.


    BR 145?
    Alternatively, this loco + route extension pack could not only come with the 146.0, but also with the BR 145, due to their very large similarities and the fact that no new dostos have to be modelled. The 145 is the freight variant of this loco, and differs only in having an axle hung final drive (the 146.0 has a hollow shaft drive) resulting in a 20 km/h lower top speed, and no destination displays (although these were later fitted to some 145's that entered passenger service). Outside of the displays and final drive, the locos are practically identical, with the sound and cab layout differing only minutely (if there are differences at all, I haven't been able to find any, but perhaps door opening controls differ). The BR 145 could come with a few freight services along the line.

    The 146.0 (and maybe 145) could also layer onto different routes, with normal DoSto coaches (or freight trains for the 145), as they operate throughout Germany. More info on wikipedia.

    [​IMG]
    The BR 145.

    [​IMG]
    A Railion liveried BR 145, usually on freight trains, some, like the one pictured above, were used on the Dresden S-bahn as backups. This could make for a fun scenario if the 145 is included.


    The route extension
    [​IMG]
    A map showing the full line with branches. Not my map, I got it from a post by CrazyDash.

    [​IMG]
    My own map, not showing stations, but showing the branches I'm proposing.

    The route extension this pack will come with consists of two branches. The S1 branch to Meißen Triebischtal, and the S2 branch to Dresden Flughafen, which is an underground station. Together (out of the top of my head) these branches make up about 23 km of route length. The branches will provide for a terminus for S-bahn services, where drivers can change ends. Both have their own distinct character. There is also a third branch possible, the line over Dresden Friedrichstadt, including the large freight yard. All three branches together make up about 55 km of track length, but no all of this needs fully new scenery, due to the proximity to the mainline large sections of the branches have. Dresden - Friedrichstadt yard however, will require some effort, as will Dresden Flughafens underground stations.

    The airport branch runs as a mostly double track line through a bit of forest at the edge of Dresden's suburbs, before diverging from the main line and making a sharp turn onto a single track line that has a passing loop at Dresden Grenzstraße, after which it goes into a tunnel under Dresden Airport, to its underground station, which is a terminus with two tracks.

    [​IMG]

    Dresden Flughafen station.

    The branch to Meißen diverges at Coswig. It is double track, with lower speed limits compared to the main line. It features a number of stations in close succesion in Meißen, where it also crosses a river on a beautiful bridge. Then, at Meißen Triebischtal, the S-bahn services terminate.

    [​IMG]

    The railway bridge at Meißen.

    The line over Dresden Friedrichstadt, with it's large freight yard, could also be included. If the BR 145 is included, this will be a great area to have it start and end freight services. At Friedrichstadt yard many incoming freight trains from the Czech republic, or outgoing freight trains from Germany, are shunted into new consists for further distribution. This leads to the line being populated with a lot of freight services. The line also has a few stations, which are serviced by the hourly RB 31, which is operated by the included Talent 2 EMUs. The line runs on the south bank of the Elbe, before rejoining the Riesa - Dresden base route from the south at the large junction east of Coswig. I think this branch could lessen the amount of outcry at the fact that people have to pay for the originally announced branches, as this branch was never announced and would therefore offer something completely new.


    Some trainspotting around Dresden. At 16:08 trains at Dresden-Stetzsch, which is situated on the line over Friedrichstadt, are shown. Note the high amount of freight locos and light engine runs on this line, I think it could be really interesting. (Sidenote: note that some BR 112s are used on RE 18, I hope we'll see layers from HHL.)

    Pricing?

    I think around 20-23 euros would be reasonable for both a loco and a significant route extension, with a few scenarios and possibily a timetable rework to accomodate the newer longer S-bahn services. If the BR 145 (which should be relatively easy to make by altering the 146.0's base model) is included, and/ or if more liveries such as the VVO advertisement are included (besides all three branches and the 146.0), that price might raise slightly, to 25 euros. However, I'd like to hear your thoughts on pricing.

    Final words
    I think this pack, consisting of the route extension, the BR 146.0, perhaps the BR 145, a few scenarios and the neccesary work on the timetable, could provide players with the much desired S-bahn branches, and an interesting loco, if not two, while providing DTG with added revenue, but also a great experiment for route extensions, which have been in demand for quite a while. The pack is also a great oppertunity for moddeling two very similar locos at once, that could provide passenger and freight substitution and layering on many other German routes due to their widespread usage. All in all I think the three branches and two locos really round out Riesa - Dresden, giving it a lot of branches and a network like feeling, while also providing the S-bahn services with the for Dresden typical BR 146.0. Please let me know what you think about this suggestion :).

     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021
    • Like Like x 18
  2. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2021
    Messages:
    2,630
    Likes Received:
    1,574
    Bring it on because it's going to accomplish the original plan of DTG for Riesa-Dresden a true rush hour route with these Branches. For the DB BR145, it can also do selected Passenger services like the DB BR143 on existing german routes if Ruhr-Sieg Nord was purchased to which it can do selected freight services when needed. Also for the DB BR182 Passenger service on Rapid Transit and freight on all other German routes. Same for it's Austrian cousin OBB Taurus Fleet
     
  3. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Messages:
    4,126
    Likes Received:
    10,265
    DTG don’t do extensions.

    If they did decide to do them, doing it with this would be a very bad idea. Imagine them promising something in a route, then cutting that part of the content and increasing the price and then, shortly afterwards having the cheek to offer the bits they previously promised and cut to buy as a DLC. Their reputation would be in tatters. A loco that is indistinguishable from all the others isn’t going to make anyone feel better for having to buy the bits of the route they thought they were getting originally. There might be a few people who would accept that to get their hands on a couple of branches but not enough to warrant it being made. You’re clutching at straws with this suggestion.

    I’d forget about the branch lines if I were you.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  4. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,380
    Likes Received:
    3,460
    Not this far. They didn't do high speed or subways before TSW2, they didn't do packs with more than one loco before the Heavy Freight Pack, there is always a first. DTG do extensions for TS, so who know, I would never say never, definitely not with there being a demand for it.

    Yeah I understand that some players might be upset, but reality is that those branches simply require more time, and thus more money to produce, it isn't gonna be a free thing, and many want them regardless. People are upset anyways about the branches, and always will be upset for something when it comes to DTG. I myself am very unhappy about the branch lines not coming, but I still want to see them, hence why I am suggesting them as the first route extension. I think that looking at it without thinking about the original announcement of the branches, ~20 euros for two locos, a few scenarios and ~20 km of route with multiple stations is still a good deal.

    With that, I think you're seriously underestimating the 146.0 and 145. They're not like the TRAXX locos in game, being developed way earlier, with only certain components and ideas being reused in the more modular and computer controlled TRAXX locomotives. The sound is entirely different to boot. Even though it looks more unique, the 187 being developed by skyhook is more like the things we already know from the 146.2 and 185 than the 146.0 and the 145. I think that any German players would surely take an interest in them. To me at least, they're very different from the things we have in game, being a direct developement of the 12X (built in 1994) with which it bares the most similarities on the inside, and a distinct step between that prototype and the TRAXX locomotives (compared to the 187, which is just a TRAXX with a new body shell and even more malfunctioning computers).

    This is my last ditch effort to get them anyways, so I'm nearly there.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  5. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2020
    Messages:
    526
    Likes Received:
    725

    Here is the full ride from Meißen to Schöna, the route to Schöna could also be included in your pack
     
  6. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,380
    Likes Received:
    3,460
    The part to Schöna is beautiful, there is a reason I suggested it even before Riesa - Dresden was announced. I think it is probably among the most interesting and beautiful railway lines in Germany, being very scenic due to the surrounding Sächsische Schweiz, with it's steep rock cliffs and green vallies, but also seeing a lot of cross border rail traffic, with steel, cars and many other products going to and from the Czech republic. However, I fear it's too long to be a route extension, as Dresden - Schöna is about 50 km. The full Dresden Neustadt - Děčín route, including Friedrichstadt yard, where a lot of Czech freight gets shunted, could be a really good standalone route still. It could come with some Czech rolling stock to make it more interesting, and also has a very different charachter compared to the flatter and faster Riesa - Dresden route. So hopefully we'll one day see that route (although the need for Czech systems might be an issue), and then we might (just maybe) see a merger, so full S-bahn services and long cross-border freight services could be a thing.

    [​IMG]
    The full Dresden Neustadt - Děčín route, as you can see there is just too much route between Dresden Hbf and Schöna for a route extension.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  7. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,380
    Likes Received:
    3,460
    I was thinking about your feedback. To lessen possible outcry, I've included the line over Friedrichstadt, with it's large freight yard. As this line was never announced, people will also get something new out of this pack, hopefully making them less upset. The line should offer a good start and end point for freight services (possibily operated by the BR 145 suggested in the main post). It also sees a few Talent 2 operated RB services.
     
  8. Hidden Donkey

    Hidden Donkey Active Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2021
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    76
    Exactly also i can think of others that would be better to do first like great western expresway
    i completly agree
    yes definetly i agree
    please do
    this has gon way to far we know youre angry but can you stop making hudnreds of posts and threads now
     
  9. Rybnicki

    Rybnicki Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2020
    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    216
    You say this but then I've just logged in to Train Simulator and been offered a one station extension for 8 quid. Never say never!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. York Man

    York Man New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2021
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    1
    Wrong game.
     
  11. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2021
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    3,967
    It's in context, it's alright.

    I would quite like to see this. Yes, it's DLC on DLC, but a lot more people are likely to have this, saying as there is RH:Deluxe Edition, The Season Pass and the route itself. I would certainly buy this to add to Dresden, I don't want it being Deadsden (Where's my points for that one, also i'm probably going to just get the season pass for NEC, a shock for me considering I've not got much interest in the US, it just looks good, and I'll get to have a look at Rush Hour earlier, hence why I'd be interested in this)
    Great suggestion as always.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. Rybnicki

    Rybnicki Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2020
    Messages:
    176
    Likes Received:
    216
    It would be the wrong game were I making a suggestion for it, yes, but I wasn't doing that. It's another game made by Dovetail, whose likelihood or otherwise of taking particular business decisions is the topic of discussion. Thus, it's relevant. Is that allowed by you?
     
    • Like Like x 2

Share This Page