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Business Practises At Dtg!!!!!!

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by TrainSim_Fan, Jun 1, 2020.

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  1. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Tell me when was the last time we got a full route not half a route with trains copied and pasted from previous. Its despicable that DTG can charge £25 for a route that's 18 miles long like HRR. It's not good enough RSN to MSB trains were copied and pasted. The M3 didnt work prior to release, meaning it clearly wasn't tested on an xbox before the release. It wont be tolerated. Spread the message about the despicable business practises at DTG. It's not acceptable! The sooner DTG learn some people are fed up of this the better. DTG works like a machine releasing short poor quality routes. Before someone replies to this saying that they do want these routes to be good, yes some people at DTG probably do want this to be good, but trust me it doesn't show. Spread the word that we fed up of this. Sort this issue. It wont be tolerated. Let that be known.
     
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  2. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Your username is TrainSim_Fan but it turns out you’re not a fan after all. Maybe now is a good time to change your username to TrainSim_Hater so as not to give the wrong impression ;).
     
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  3. steammaster4449

    steammaster4449 Member

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    Does anybody else smell something burning or is it just me?
     
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  4. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    If stujoy you read it says train sim not train sim world. Read it next time. XD
     
  5. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Although are you capable of reading it properly sure as hell doesn't seem like it. Honestly all you do is complain I'm allowed an opinion so deal with it if you have an issue just dont have anything to do with anything I post.
     
  6. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Did you not see the winky face at the end of my post? It was a joke. I could have written a proper response to your post but I’ve pretty much covered all that ground very recently on another thread which I know you’ve read and you wouldn’t have liked or agreed with any of it, so I went with a lighthearted prod instead. It’s only a week ago you were telling me you were a fan, and now you’ve jumped on the bandwagon of hatred, hence my joke. The underlying message of a serious response of mine would have been that if you don’t like TSW then go and use the train sims you are a fan of instead. There must be at least one, if I have read your username correctly this time round ;).
     
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  7. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Fine, I thought the face was just a regular smiley face. And the reason I'm on the TSW forums is because I also play TSW and enjoy some routes but when there's routes that are 18 miles long and take no more than 20 minutes to complete it's kinda a joke to me that I'm paying £25 for an 18 mile route that debatably has no better scenery than last kind of makes me annoyed.
     
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  8. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    I am going to try to give you an answer - it's just based on observation....

    The "route length" and "DLC value for money" issues often flare up because people often compare TSW route length to Train Simulator (TS1) route lengths, and DLC to the cost of DLC for other games..... but the thing is....

    TSW is not TS1. You cannot walk around in TS1, and explore stations, or walk a route. And this matters, because if you look at how TS1 is built out, the routes are usually like a "film-set", where nearly everything you look at from the driver's cab into the middle distance is just a facade (and often 2D). They do make some effort to allow you to use a free camera and get some screenshots... ... and if the train is included in the angle of the screenshot, then the detail is enough... just about. Any other perspective/angle and you will start seeing the cardboard cut-outs...

    But in TSW....everything has to be built out in 3D. Everything. This means more content is produced and mostly to a far higher standard.......more content....even if it is over a shorter route (compared to TS1). That said - some of the newer TS1 routes are stunningly detailed.... and better looking than some of the older TSW routes.

    If you want long routes and at a cheaper price, and you just want to drive from the cab.... then your best bet is to get some long routes in TS1 (on PC), when they are in the sale.... But if you want first person perspective routes, right now, as in TSW.... then the prices are as marked... But.... if you are prepared to wait... then the TSW routes are usually about £8 each when bundled in the annual pack (next one in August or September 2020....). And on PS4 you can get eight routes for £32 (so £4 each) - and this is fair value for the content, even when compared to big budget platinum selling AAA games... which some people will spend £100s on over the years.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2020
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  9. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Your points were valid and fare and justifies some actions. Although despite the graphical differences I could get a £20 route in TS1 that's in excess of 100 miles, whereas in TSW I get an 18 mile route for ,£25. Which when you compare what you get in terms of gameplay makes this difference even more staggering.
     
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  10. Olaf the Snowman

    Olaf the Snowman Well-Known Member

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    There are some things about the game that are starting to annoy me.

    Regarding the M3, why wasn’t it part of the LIRR route to begin with? It only came with the M7 yet most other routes have multiple traction- 2 if not even 3- on release. There is no reason why M3 couldn’t have come out alongside the M7 but instead they’ve released it as a separate DLC so they’ll be getting an extra $20 per purchase of the M3. Also, out of all the additional traction they could have chosen for the LIRR route, they chose one that is almost identical to the M7 and I mean this both aesthetically and operationally from a driver or engineers point of view (e.g. handling, etc...) Unless you live in New York or familiar with both traction in real life which I suspect very few users of TSW are, there’s no that you’re going to appreciate them both because they are practically the same. The diesel locomotive (can’t remember the name) that Mr Chuck keeps going on about would have been a much better choice but it was probably too adventurous for the developers because it would have required more effort and time to develop.
     
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  11. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    The latest UK route on TS1 is currently on sale for £27. A pack of eight routes for TSW on PS4 including GWE, NEC, RT, RSN, NTP, LIRR, MSB and PC costs £32 (and will eventually cost about £20, for the lot....).

    But I agree with you on value at release. I won't be buying any TSW routes as single items on release... not at £25 each (or maybe £27 is the near future....). Not when I know I can get four routes for £25 in August. Apart from anything else, you know that the routes will probably be defective upon release.... which adds to disappointment.

    I am relatively new to TS1, but I can say that I bought TS2020, TS2019, TS2018, TS2017, TS2016 and TS2015 for an average of about £7 each, with each pack containing three/four routes.... so about £2 per route... And I have finally managed to track down an imported DVD of TS2014 from Germany, which is costing me £12 (including VAT, postage, currency conversion, etc...). So.... about x25 routes for just over £50.... ;-) Routes from these packs seem most popular with Workshop Scenario designers.... so there's literally thousands of scenarios available for these x25 routes.... ;-) ;-)

    But there is a standalone gem in TS1 -> South London Network includes four/five distinct routes, with two or three loops, plus a number of short spur routes, and numerous chords, ramps, fly-overs, two mainline termini and depots, sidings..... and in the sale it was £6. It makes East Coastway on TSW, as a single purchase for five times the cost look ridiculous, in my opinion. So, I haven't bought ECR on TSW - it's pointless to me.

    But train-simming, with an eye on value, is clearly possible. But if you want TSW, and you want it now, then you will have to pay a premium price now... or....... just wait a bit. If they make a route that runs past your house, and you want it at full price, on TSW, and now... then go for it.

    You have choice. With two very different products, from the same company.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2020
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  12. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    In regards to the M3, simple they know they'll get more money, which is questionable as if both locos were there to start off with more people would buy the route in release. I'm getting frustrated of this aswell. It's a shame all they care about is there cash. :(
     
  13. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Plastic Pal trust me they wont make a route that goes past where I live. Especially the full line as it's around 90 miles long. :(
     
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  14. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    LOL - this did make me chuckle... but... more seriously...

    1. Other than with OSD, the route length and product description for any route/loco in TSW, as a proposition has been reasonably clear, even if disappointing, and ridiculously hyped up... with descriptions that are more moronic than iconic.... and more brassic than classic...... But.... usually end up as good fun for a few hours if you make the purchase....! ;-)

    2. It is possible to have a long route that is very poor value. I feel sorry for anyone that bought Bristol-Exeter or York-Newcastle on TS1 when they were released (or at any time at full price).... both of these are very long routes... and they are both devoid of any real content..... when judged by current standards..... "Doncaster Works" however, is maybe one mile long.... and it is about x100 more interesting....

    Value is a complex equation. How much does it cost to have a day-out shopping where you don't buy anything, but you end up getting a Costa Coffee, a McDonald's meal and two hours in a cinema watching a film you wish that you hadn't bothered with, as you try to not throw-up the burger on the way home when diesel fumes flood into your lungs from the dodgy bus taking you home........ about £25 per person, maybe.....?
     
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  15. Sam7736

    Sam7736 New Member

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    As a person who does take the LIRR often, the M3 sounds completely innacurate except the bell and is narrow in the game inside the train. In real life it's a bit wider inside. If they were to add the DE30AC diesel train to the LIRR route, they would have to add a diesel line cause they are there because the emu LIRR trains don't run on the diesel lines like the Oyster Bay branch which turns left when you leave Mineola because it has no third rail afterwards. The oyster Bay branch would be perfect because it runs From Penn Station to Oyster Bay. It's splits from the main line at Mineola turning left heading to Oyster Bay. The line is 32.9 miles and the distance from Mineola to Oyster Bay Station is only an additional 14.3 miles.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2020
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  16. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Active Member

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    Weird is u spawn walk on those tracks branching off the Main Line u jus bout CLOSE to reaching East Wilinston smfh......I didnt buy M3 cuz its jus another substitute option for lack of existing services in the game plus the route is boring now...why isnt there Port Washington line in the game(i hate that NYP-Woodside only drive)....and the route shouldve been extended at least to Huntington....too many errors on that LIRR DLC
     
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  17. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    MrBKlegend how much effort is it for you to write, you instead of u, or to write, cause instead of cuz.:o
     
  18. Gilly

    Gilly Active Member

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    The word is 'because' not 'cause'.
    You want to be careful throwing those big stones from that glass house....
     
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  19. UnlimitedMagic

    UnlimitedMagic Well-Known Member

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    You remind me of TallBoy
    Where is he anyways. He’s seem to disappeared
     
  20. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Gilly stones get pretty big, and my house is made of bricks not glass. Simply no one cares.
     
  21. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    I can’t be 100% sure but I think he’s still around but with a new username, similar to one of the usernames he used when he, allegedly, had several accounts on the go. This one I spotted may well also be one of several accounts he currently has but I’m not getting involved this time round. It can be fairly obvious if a new user pops up and immediately says the same things but it can also be spotted if someone takes a few days posting one line replies to as many threads as they can, to get a high post count, and then BOOM back to the same massive single long paragraph rant as their other profile(s). It’s great fun to look out for these things but I’m not naming any names in case I’m wrong.
     
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  22. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    For your interest I'm not TallBoy. :)
     
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  23. Gilly

    Gilly Active Member

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    Oh the irony! You cared enough to pull someone about their use of U and cuz but get arsey as soon your own lazyness is pointed out.
    As for not caring, you did enough to reply while throwing your toys out of the pram.
     
  24. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    I can walk atleast 3 metres. I know impressive right.
     
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  25. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    They did the same thing with the MP36 caltrain and I own the deluxe edition of tsw. So you would think for people who own the Deluxe edition, they would've given that train as a free update when it was realeased. It was nothing more than a cash grab. I'm glad that some people are starting to realize the shady business practices that dtg does with the most ridiculous excuses. It's time a conversation is started and we do need to hold dtg to a high regard when it comes to their decsions and them not fixing the bugs of the game.
     
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  26. npalmer405

    npalmer405 Member

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    Really. They did that to you I feel bad for you. I personally refuse to buy anything from them unless it’s on sale. There should be a max price of $7 for a locomotive. (They really should be free) And they should let us have the scenario editor so they can stop charging us for scenarios. Because then we can get as many scenarios as we want from the steam workshop. Or why don’t they give us the map editor and they just focus on making high quality locomotives for the routes we make. Or the other way a round
     
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  27. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Maybe the Dovetail employees have bills to pay and children to feed and insist on being paid for the work they do. I’d hate for the bosses to expect them to work for free so that they could give everyone all this free stuff they deserve.

    Maybe the prices are a little high but wanting stuff for free is going too far. Ask your mums for more pocket money.
     
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  28. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    It's for anybody who owns the Digital Deluxe edition for tsw, gotta buy the mp36 sepreate
     
  29. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Now I can afford the routes and trains, however dtg has made hundreds of thousands of dollars in ts1 for the past decade and made a lot of money in tsw. Now of course it can't be free but can you really justify $29.99 for routes that can be lacking and are short and $19.99 for trains with three scenarios and the m3 that just supplement services instead of adding services which is unrealistic. Can't defend that. And if you own the digital deluxe edition of tsw, the mp36 should've been free. It makes sense because it would make the digital deluxe edition have more value instead of getting one new route (peninsula corridor) and two trains. It's a classic DTG cash Grab like rapid transit was when it came out and Flight Sim World. The cash grabbing I'm Flight Sim World was one of the reasons why it failed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
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  30. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    I don’t know how you can come to that conclusion. Why would they give anyone something for free? It’s a separate DLC, a new product. Whether you had the digital deluxe or standard bundle makes no difference. Anyone who bought PC as a DLC would be livid if they saw that people who got PC at a discount in the deluxe package were then given an extra piece of DLC for free several months later. Your arguments are getting more bizarre than ever. You baffle me, Sam.
     
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  31. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    If it was a different company, they would've given it as a free update for the digital deluxe edition but hey it's dtg, all about the money just like EA.
     
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  32. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Active Member

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    As much effort for you to reply to my.comment mr "cause" so know ya roll as well since u cant have much PROPER spelling as well....dont worry bout my language, worry bout the message...
     
  33. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Active Member

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    Lol!!!!!
     
  34. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Active Member

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    Btw it's "at least" not atleast....learn to space your words in sentences
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
  35. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Well I dont know what country your from but trust me its 'atleast'.
     
  36. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Active Member

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    Well if you're curious to knowing I'm from USA so we say at least and whatever country u from if its "atleast" then cool I learn something new
     
  37. Olaf the Snowman

    Olaf the Snowman Well-Known Member

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    If you check online, it’s 2 separate words and is the same throughout the world. I’ll confess that I used to think it was one word as well and was always surprised to see it get flagged by spellcheck. But it does appear that it is 2 separate words.
     
  38. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Does it matter if this person says u to mean you (that's what we do in the u.s when typing things sometimes) or mispells things or doesn't type words accurately. Why are Europeans so critical about spelling in a public fourm, not a big deal
     
  39. owenroser19

    owenroser19 Member

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    It is the right impression, it's all true.
     
  40. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    MrBKlegend I'm from the UK trust me its 'atleast'.
     
  41. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    You are wrong. Don’t go giving the impression everyone in the UK doesn’t know their own language, it’s embarrassing for us.
     
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  42. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    As an avid Scrabble player I can assure you that "atleast" is not a word. There are only three words in English that start with the three letters A, T and L, that are not proper nouns, and they are:

    - atlas (the thing with maps in it)
    - atlatl (a weapon mod for spears/arrows/darts/etc.)
    - atlantes (a carved figure used as a column)

    There are also derivatives and plurals asssociated with the above. At least, that is to the best of my knowledge. If you know any more... I'd love to know.... ;-)
     
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  43. Olaf the Snowman

    Olaf the Snowman Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you. You will never see me criticise or ridicule someone for mistakes in grammar/spelling, etc... The only time I may say something politely is if there is a problem with the terminology you’re using because this is a Railway/Railroad related forum after all. For example, wheelslide instead of wheelslip I commented yesterday I think on a different thread.

    On a personal level, I do see a forum as more professional than other social media such as Facebook or Twitter so I try to write posts as well as I can and avoid slang particularly when I’m trying to give an insight into railway operations in real life.I appreciate that others may not see it this way so as above, you will never see me ridicule anyone.
     
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  44. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    This is the right approach. Apart from anything else, if you set an impossible standard for others to meet, then you must apply that standard to yourself as well - and I can't guarantee that I would always meet the highest standard. And I write for a living and often proof-read for others.
     
  45. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    In all seriousness I get your all your points, but it doesn't say I can't criticize others, if I have an opinion I'll share it. BTW PlasticPal you dont need a comma after 'meet'.
     
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  46. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    Thanks - yes - I tend to write in a verbose style, with commas. This is partly because I used to do a lot of speech writing, and commas indicate a breath or pause, or change in pacing.

    I know that it is also not good "American English" to use too many commas, unless it is explicitly to construct a list. Short sentences without commas are preferred State-side, without multiple phrasing. But I am not American, so I don't use that standard.

    I don't ever write solely for American audiences. If I wrote a book for a purely American audience then I would have to get a professional American editor to strip out all of the commas.

    My writing would look horror-show to most Americans. ;-)
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
  47. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    The irony.
     
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  48. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough then it's easy to see why you added an extra comma in that case. I'm from the UK (I assume seeing as you said your not American you are too) and as far as I'm concerned commas are for lists or a change in pace as you said and in some cases a change in subject if you dont wish to use a new fronted adverbial. If your writing a speech to be read aloud though then commas signify a pause as you said.:)
     
  49. Plastic Pal

    Plastic Pal Well-Known Member

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    Aaaah. Well. Not using commas at all is a good discipline. It forces you to write short sentences. Although.... maybe not in your case.... LOL.... ;-)

    I am just jesting and japing.....! ;-)
     
  50. TrainSim_Fan

    TrainSim_Fan Well-Known Member

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    Stujoy I feel like I'm being stalked by you every TSW post I've made you always respond in a negative way. My opinion simply would be to get a life and stop complaining. Sorry if you started whining as soon as I told you to get a life, to be honest you are the most annoying person on these forums. And you say I'm rude/ignorant looking in a mirror are you ; oh wait the mirror would break my mistake there. BTW if you didnt notice I want a medal for rhyming break and mistake.
     
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