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Disappointed

Discussion in 'PlayStation Discussion' started by ildario77, Aug 20, 2020.

  1. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    He isn't going to believe you
     
  2. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    Same for me
     
  3. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    The game runs fine for me but obviously there is glitches which are very annoying but I wouldn't say TSW2 is the best game ever
     
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  4. Rail Runner

    Rail Runner Well-Known Member

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    I quite agree. But it has a lot of potential. So hopefully it can improve those small problems.
     
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  5. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Active Member

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    To be fair, it’s the same on PC. Despite a noticeable overall graphical/performance improvement. There are noticeable FPS drops around Willesden Junction/Harlesden/Stonebridge Park/Wembley area, and I mean the odd stutter.
     
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  6. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    This is on Xbox. And it freezes at 52:27 (it's the external view but it happens to me too in that spot), then 53:27 and slightly at 54:12.

    I just noticed that this stuttering happens also on PC... Definitely a cross-platform feature...



    52:12, and it happens on my PS4 as well, in the same spot... It seems a core loading problem, regardless of the platform. I'm playing just Queen's Park - Elephant & Castle services to avoid this...

    EVERY SINGLE video I saw shows the same problems I noticed. Who says this game runs smooth maybe has a different opinion of smoothness, but TSW 2 is not at all a smooth game. It has an average of 30-40 fps, with a lot of drops (watch DTG live streams), but what really drives me nuts is the large amount of freezing. Game literally stops... Sometimes for a fraction of a second, sometimes for almost a second, and it really kills immersion...
     
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  7. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, you're right. I just wrote it on the comment above :) Noticed that a few minutes ago.
     
  8. matthewbguilford

    matthewbguilford Well-Known Member

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    I still don’t think it’s as bad as you made it seem in your original post.
     
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  9. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    I mean really it's fine for me I usually have an FPS drop when I go next to a train but not always.
     
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  10. Doyden

    Doyden Member

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    I too noticed the poor performance on Matt's PS4 stream the other night. I thought the Xbox ICE stream looked pretty choppy in places but the PS4 version looked worse. I mentioned in another thread that the FPS appeared to jump up quite significantly when he disabled the HUD.

    What's putting me off the most (apart from missing landmarks and far fewer passengers on the PS4 version) are the reports of loud fans. This often occurs in menus in some games where the frame rate is uncapped. I've been playing Mudrunner this last week and that has a 30fps lock available in the options. With it enabled, the game still looks fine to me and runs consistently and quietly (in terms of the console fans). With the frame rate unlocked, yes it looks more fluid on the whole but you can hear the fans becoming faster and faster. I fear for the longevity of my PS4 so I'm keeping it locked. Perhaps an optional 30fps limit on TSW 2 would allow for a more consistent experience and would reduce the stress on the fans and the console.
     
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  11. Deltic00

    Deltic00 Member

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    It must be your system. I’m playing it on a standard PS4 that I’ve had since PS4s were released, the thing is ancient and i have yet to experience any performance issues with it like what you’ve said
     
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  12. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

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    ...I’ve been checking out the forums for all platforms over the last two days, incl all of the new posts filed in the Technical Reports (TR) forum. There are at least some duplicate issues filed in the TR forum for sure, as well as other issues that shouldn’t have been filed there that have nothing to do with an issue with TSW 2. But all of those aside, there’s still a boatload of other issues filed in the TR forum that seem to be legitimate issues with the new sim- ranging from fairly minor to more serious issues that are affecting many players, across all platforms. And seeing so much of that over the last two days definitely worries me.

    And yet we have plenty of other folks here who are apparently not running into any serious issues whatsoever- getting impressive frame rates, running UHD video, having no issues running both TSW 2 and TSW 2020 on the same system, etc. And this fact worries me too- why are so many folks affected by numerous issues, and so many others not? Is it an issue with development, the QC process at DTG, the alpha/beta testing, their testing on representative systems that mimic the typical systems players actually have- or something else? And is it just related to one of these areas, or several of them? I’ve adopted a wait and see attitude in terms of picking up TSW 2, and will probably stick to that for now. There’s far too much ‘chatter’ on game issues right now for it to be a safe bet for me- I have enough issues with my current TSW 2020, but that much I can handle.

    And all of that said, I’m glad we have a decent amount of folks that are truly happy with the new sim, and that it seems to be delivering on expectations for some. I’ll continue to monitor the chatter in the TR forum and see where things are at in a week or two... maybe things will get significantly better.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2020
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  13. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Again, is not my system. Since TSW2020, I never saw a single YouTube video not affected by the flaws I'm talking about. Defrag doesn't change anything, fps is choppy almost everywhere. If you say it runs fine, I really don't know what to say.
     
  14. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Another video, another user, another PS4. 1:11:59, another big freezing. Another one at 1:14:19. This video is set at 60 fps, so you can see better how choppy fps is from Stonebridge to Wembley Central. Didn't look for stuttering in the german route, but in the same video you can appreciate how fps is choppy at full speed. I don't say this game is unplayable, and my first impressions were a bit harsh, but saying that performances are great is misinformation. If I read this, I would expect F1 2020-like performances. You're clearly less sensitive about such aspects.
     
  15. RealKenny_D

    RealKenny_D New Member

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    Console stress and the demands being placed upon my PS4 Pro are a worry for me, so I am limiting my use of TSW2 and using TSW 2020 instead, which is still pretty damned cool.

    For this reason I won't be downloading any of the preserved collection into TSW2, and a decision on adding any future content to the new sim will depend how my system is running at the time.

    Despite all of the issues raised in the community, I am thrilled at what I've seen so far, and by the road map. Patience is the key.
     
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  16. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, and I even read that shadow render distance is better than TSW 2020... Seriously, guys, I would like to be you... I would live in a fairy magic world...



    1:51:18. Enjoy.
     
  17. simongilford

    simongilford Well-Known Member

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    Kenny, see my other thread about PS4 Pro Fan Noise Fix. It's currently working fine for me. No more jet engines spinning up!
     
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  18. DTG Protagonist

    DTG Protagonist Community Manager Staff Member

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    This is going to be a circular conversation because what constitutes "acceptable" or "good" performance is an entirely subjective point of view. If a player wants high, smooth frame rates without any bumps or stalls there's nothing wrong with that - it may be more than the game can achieve, but wanting it is fine. Equally, being able to put up with an occasional hiccup or slowdown doesn't mean someone is less of a player, they're just looking for the highest quality in other places.

    Please try not to let this thread turn into an argument.
     
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  19. matthewbguilford

    matthewbguilford Well-Known Member

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    One mans garbage is another mans treasure!
     
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  20. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Active Member

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    Only problem I have had with heavy stuttering was on Sand Patch Grade. And boy it was bad. Thank God I am not freight fan. Schnell and East Coastway run smoothly for me but Sand Patch was unacceptable. It even went on loading screen once. Very very bad.
    No idea about Haubptstrecke as I play it on old TSW because of busy traffic and I'm not interested about tube at all so haven't tried that out.
     
  21. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Active Member

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    Arguments between civilized and intelligent people show passion and bring the world forward ;)
    Insults are unacceptable, agree
     
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  22. richard cooper

    richard cooper Member

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    I have basic PS4, I was going to buy a pro console but now I am undecided. Playing over last couple of evenings, I have been impressed how the ps4 has coped with the game. If I could see the pro console v basic console performance together could make my mind up.
     
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  23. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    I have a regular PS4 and according to the YouTube videos I watched there isn't big difference between regular and pro in terms of performances.
     
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  24. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    The problem with Sand Patch Grade is the train lenght. Longest trains affect framerate so much.
     
  25. SBos

    SBos Member

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  26. SBos

    SBos Member

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    Next he will be saying the game is unplayable because of this. I have already played for several hours and yes experienced some of this stuttering but has it stopped me enjoying playing no it hasn’t. Perhaps you would prefer to go back to the standard of games we had years ago. I have a bought games costing more than twice as much as this one and had bugs and issues. According to last nights stream they now have a dedicated team who will purely work on bugs and issues on not only TSW2 but TSW 2020 also.
     
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  27. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Active Member

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    As I’ve mentioned already;

    There is definitely more noticeable stuttering in the game (tile loading?) the worst place being Harlesden/Stonebridge Park/Wembley area on the Bakerloo Line, it’s a bit frustrating. I assume the reason being of the detail of the area? Masses of sidings/Stonebridge Park depot etc?

    However, despite this, there’s a noticeable performance & graphical improvement in TSW2 and for me personally this outweighs the stuttering.

    Köln-Aachen, runs incredibly smooth for me even at 250 km/h with the odd small stutter.
     
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  28. DTG Protagonist

    DTG Protagonist Community Manager Staff Member

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    This is the perfect example of a subjective, and therefore entirely correct in opinion of the writer, view of how the game perform. It is both "incredibly smooth" even though it has "odd small stutters". For Shaun (sorry to pick on your here Shaun) that level of performance is fine if not better. For others it is not acceptable, and would fall some way short of "incredibly smooth".

    You won't convince anyone that their subjective view of the game is wrong because their taste and requirements are different to your own. Please try to bear that in mind as this conversation continues.
     
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  29. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Active Member

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    No problem! ;)

    But you’ve hit the the nail on the head, it’s all going to be subjective! For me, does it affect me playing the game and turning it off and never playing it again?! Definitely not!!

    I’ll sum it up, as I’m not looking to change anyone’s opinion!

    Are they more noticeable stuttering/loading issues than in TSW2020? Yes.

    Is overall performance and graphical quality improved? Yes.

    Am I enjoying TSW2? Stupid question, but without a doubt - Yes!

    One thing worth mentioning to finish is that I had TSW2020 running with all sorts of Engine.ini tweaks to make it look better. For me there’s no need for these in TSW2 (apart from Bloom being set to 0!).

    And just to finish my PC specs to give context - not a high end gaming system, but a fairly decent one that does the job.

    Radeon RX 580 Series
    AMD Ryzen 7 1700 Eight-Core Processor
    Asus AM4 PRIME X370 PRO Motherboard
    8GB Ram
    Windows 10 64bit.
     
  30. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    No. A one second freezing is not a subjective thing. It can be more or less important for a player, but it's a fact, not an opinion, and it should be fixed. As Shaun noticed, between Wembley and Stonebridge is very very annoying. Nobody forced DTG to enter the console market. Are you in the business now? Great, try to improve your game. A forum full of adoring fans, ready to happily accept every single mistake (they're the first ones, nobody did it before, I should buy a 3000 euros PC to play simulations decently, so I'm happy with that) doesn't mean the game is good. Take a look at TSW 2020 Metacritic score...
     
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  31. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, so funny. It was just a remark. Longest trains affect framerate, especially with banking locos. Did I say the game is unplayable 'cause of that? No. I was just replying to kennyjamesscott.
     
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  32. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    Why are you posting in the PlayStation section saying how smooth the game is on PC? I’m sure it is smooth on PC but this thread is about how poorly certain parts perform on console where we can’t fine tune the graphical settings to improve performance.

    Could somebody, anybody, who says that Schnellfahrstrecke Köln-Aachen runs smoothly at 250kmph on their console please upload a short clip? All the footage of the game I’ve seen of the German route on consoles is choppy but I’d love to be proven wrong.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
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  33. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    This is interesting because, as I already noticed, freezing (not fps drops) is noticeable on PC also, always in the same spots. It means it's a loading issue, regardless of the platform.
     
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  34. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Active Member

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    I thought someone would ask, I saw the thread title and was intrigued because from my own experiences and watching Streams and YouTube videos of PS4 content, I was interested in the comparison.
     
  35. Fig

    Fig New Member

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    Yes there are stutters and the occasional 1 second freeze on my PS4 Pro. But I am very happy with TSW2 because I have yet to hit a time table or scenario breaking bug. I’ve played quite a bit (level 19) and very pleased. I gave up on TSW1 because it was too frustrating with all the bugs. Looking forward to further improvements.
     
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  36. matthewbguilford

    matthewbguilford Well-Known Member

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    I agree, I can’t speak for the PC audience especially ones that could run TSW smoothly. But someone who plays on console, TSW2 is much improved over TSW in terms of performance on console. It’s a big difference and the fact that it is performing better and that their hasn’t been any major bugs or really minor bugs for me is great. That alone is a huge improvement over TSW and that’s not even mentioning the overall improvement to things such as lighting and skies and pop-in. I’m really enjoying it.
     
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  37. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    Matthew, would you mind posting a clip or link to a clip of what you are experiencing playing the Koln-Aachen route as I would like to see what the performance you are experiencing is like? Mine is simply awful on Schnellfahrstrecke.
     
  38. matthewbguilford

    matthewbguilford Well-Known Member

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    Yes I can try to do that when I can, I’ll try to upload it through my PSN account. I did complete the first ICE3 scenario and even when pulling into the full station in Köln I didn’t have any performance issues from my cab, I have noticed when you are in the exterior camera it’s much more likely to stutter as it is having to load in a lot more scenery. I am playing on a PS4 Pro and comparing how TSW performed and how TSW2 is running it’s a big difference. I
     
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  39. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    Having read all of your ranting (yes it is ranting), my opinion of your views is as follows.
    1. You are being over critical of a newly released title, which has been finished during a UK lockdown with the work force working from home.
    2. Every console is different, no matter what people say about them. Every single component will have different behaviours within a set of parameters set out, in your case, by Sony.
    3. The upkeep of your console will reflect performance. The Unreal 4 engine puts console under extreme pressure, if you've got a few blocked air vents preventing perfect air flow, you might see a degraduation in performance of your console, that another PS4 user might not get.
    4. The milipauses you seem hooked on are literally Unreal Engine 4 bugs, due to the way it processes loading of assets between the HDD of your console and RAM and GPU, there are severe restrictions on internal drives on the PS4, its well documented at USB drives load quicker on that system. I have a Xbox One X and have the game installed on a SSD, and I get minimal issues and mini pauses.
    5. I think you just need to either step away from the game and wait for some patches, or as I expect, keep on your negativity, until no one listens and you end up bitter and twisted.
    These are my observations from your posts, and not an attack in anyway, just trying to provide another view of your problems for you.
     
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  40. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if you really read what I wrote. I'm starting to doubt about my english (I'm italian), 'cause it seems 90% of people here don't understand what I'm saying. As I said a lot of times, what I'm criticizing is clearly shown in dozens of videos on YouTube. I don't think all those Ps4s or Xboxs are faulty. The only difference between me and the vast majority of this forum users is that they just don't care. Ok, I will live with that, but please stop saying that could be a problem related to my unit, cause is not.

    Other UE games I played, even racing games, don't show these milipauses.

    TSW2020 wasn't developed during a lockdown, and is plenty of bugs, some of them never fixed in over 2 years.

    I was too harsh with some users, and I'm sorry for that, but mine aren't opinions. And I would be glad if my console was faulty, cause I should just buy a new one to 100% enjoy this potentially good game.
     
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  41. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    But a racing game doesn't have 40 miles of track, rolling stock and scenery loaded in to the RAM of your console to reduce loading times etc.

    UE4 shooters don't have lots to load in, they load in one level at a time.

    There are limits to what the game engine can do and I think TSW is pushing what can be achieved with it. It will take help from Epic Games (which will cost big money), to get them to help DTG reduce or remove those pauses etc, as it might need the people that built the engine to fine tune it for the purpose it's being used for.

    I get your frustration, but the game does run better on the Pro and One X, so I'd hope with the backwards compatibility of the next generation consoles that you'll see the raw power of those machines make those pauses go away, but I highly doubt that, as you say it happens on all platforms in the same place, which leans towards the game engine.
     
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  42. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    I will repost my short clip here that I originally posted in another thread of extremely poor performance of Schnellfahrstrecke on my ps4 slim and have two questions for you, or anyone else who wants to pitch in:



    1. Do you experience these same stutters on your console?

    2. Do you think they are acceptable for a game in 2020? In my opinion they completely ruin the Koln-Aachen route.
     
  43. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    In answer to your questions:

    1. Do you experience these same stutters on your console? Yes, but not as bad as that, as stated before, TSW pushes the limits of the UE4 streaming engine to the limit, the pauses are caused by assets loading in. Play GWE and go through Hayes and Harlington (past the Cement works), you go through a similar tunnel with the same effect. Recommendations are to get yourself a SSD and that "should" improve things.

    2. Do you think they are acceptable for a game in 2020? Please see my above comments about the Unreal Engine 4, it's absolutely pushing the limits of your PS4 Slim. You will not get a fully smooth experience as said it's due to the Unreal Engine 4. The pauses happen on all 3 platforms, and the devs have yet to figure out how to optimise it. They will probably need assistance from Epic Games to do that, and will be charged for the expertise.

    If those stutters ruin the game for you, then that is unfortunate. When they release a few patches, you may notice they reduce or go away. It's a new route, and needs optimising further, as no 2 consoles will give the EXACT same performance.
     
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  44. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, but I don't agree with that. Take a look:



    Plenty of stuttering (just a bad example at 1:01:09). I have the very same freezings at the very same spots (I look at the distance to the next station on the upper-left corner of the screen). Consoles are very standardized machines, they're not Pcs. I can accept some difference in terms of fps between a PS4 and a PS4 Pro, but nothing to justify a console change.
     
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  45. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    That's where you are wrong. Consoles are not made in just one factory, they are made in many different factories. Each contractor to MS/Sony will use different solders, thermal pastes etc, they can source different memory chips as long as they meet the right specifications.

    You are now focusing TOO HARD on the stuttering. Your point has been acknowledged and taken onboard by the developers, you've been given advice on what causes it and what you can do to reduce it.

    It will not be fixed on this generation of consoles.
     
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  46. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Ok, right, but we have found 2 consoles that behave in the same way, at least with Bakerloo Line ;)
     
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  47. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    Hey Bart. I was focused on Bakerloo Line these days, because that's by far my favourite route (I love the real London Underground), but today I played the german fast route a bit. Well, I experienced every single problem you noticed. And by the way, Matt's stream on Xbox One X shows exactly the same issues. Look at this video, especially when the train reaches 250 km/h. Not so smooth, isn't it? And that's a powerful Xbox One X. So, it seems some of this forum users are secretly testing the new PS5 Über F*cking Pro Pro or the extrapowerful Xbox Master of The Universe Edition. Lucky people ;)

     
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  48. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    Yes you are right. I honestly don't know how anyone can say the German route is smooth unless they know something we don't. The stutters completely ruin it. Thankfully I bought the game for Bakerloo (also by far my favourite route) and for me it's just about acceptable. I am very worried about the upcoming London-Faversham route though considering its also high speed and if that is laggy too, which it probably will be, then I will be sorely disappointed.

    I did watch that stream before I bought TSW2 but wrongly assumed that the stutters were due to the game being streamed live and was hopeful it would be different for me on ps4. Silly me. :|
     
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  49. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    You have both been given ways to reduce the stutters, but you haven't acknowledged them.

    Get yourself a SSD, get yourself a USB 3.0/3.1 housing for it, and you should see the stutters reduced.
     
  50. Bryer

    Bryer Active Member

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    Again, I've been part of the Train Sim World console edition since Day 1, I know what has worked to reduce the stutters and what doesn't. I have offered you advice on what to do to reduce them and the limits of the Unreal Engine 4.

    I've not denied there are stutters, I've just said that I've encountered very few as I have set my console and games up in a way that allows for faster read and write speeds than the standard 5400rpm internal hard disks on the PS4 and the Xbox One and Xbox One S.
     

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