[guide] How To Legally Install Old Ts Versions Next To Tsc

Hi.

As there's some new compatibility issues with US routes, and routes like AHS Ashford Lille not working, I thought I'd show everybody who has not backed up the core how to install it - yes you can. Steam still hosts older versions you can download.

This guide will create a second (or more if you wish) TSC/TS20xx installation, which is completely independent from your main installation, so it's not dangerous at all. And it will never be affected by Steam updates or file verifications.

Here's how.

First, start Steam. Press [Win]+[R] and enter the following command:

steam://open/console


Now, another tab will appear in the Steam client - CONSOLE. Click in the text field and enter the following line:

download_depot 24010 24009 3515933791864056457

This will download the files for TSC (24010) RailWorks Content (the core, 24009) manifest ID from April 21st, 2022 - before the core got updated.

Finding the manifest ID


You'll now see this:


Steam is downloading the depot (of course only if you own TSC and have the license).
The path is Steam\steamapps\content\app_24010\depot_24009, regardless where your TSC is installed.

Wait until Steam says the download is finished (the core files are not in .ap format, but thousands of single files which take longer to download, expect a few minutes until it is finished.

That folder, depot_24009, is in fact your new "old" installation. It will not interfere with your main installation and won't be accessed by Steam ever.

Move that folder to a convenient place, in my case I've moved it to D:\Games\ and renamed it to RailWorksV72.

Now, to play it, simply start RailWorks64.exe from that folder, or create a shortcut to it on your desktop.

Of course, we need some basic assets. I will show you what you need to play most routes. As file handling is easier I'm using 7zip File Manager here as I don't like drag and drop.

Find your main installation, and copy over the following assets folders:
Kuju\RailSimulator
Kuju\RailSimulatorUS
CastleRock
DTG\Academy
EisenbahnwerkRW
GermanRailRoadsRW
RSC\APStation
RSC\UKLedSignals
RSDL\Foliage01

That's the European Loco & Asset Pack, the US Loco & Asset Pack, RW LegacyFoliage, Signals and the shared station assets.

Edit:
Very important! To be able to play the local version, make sure the file RailWorks\steam_appid.txt is present in your folder - if not, copy it from your main installation. Else Steam will start the default (latest) version even when you click the .exe directly.

 

So, for demo purposes, I want to play the Ashford-Lille high speed route, which doesn't work with the new core, and the author is over the hills it seems.

Copy the Assets, Assets\AHS from my main installation.


Then the route folder:


Start RailWorks64.exe from the folder, not via Steam "Play" button.


Scripts working, setting up the loco


TVM active - off we go!


To find the route folder GUID, use NameMyRoute.exe or TSTools.

Questions (even seemingly stupid ones) are welcome.

Enjoy.

 

Can you do this for any version of TS? I might have a go with RailWorks 2 if I can.

 

You would need to know the manifestID, SteamDB only shows the manifests till Oct 2020.

Wait, checking something...this line will get you TS2014 v42.5b

download_depot 24010 24009 6045241219410404365




Donner Pass at 264 FPS


Have to say that old menu music is a bit... cheesy

 

torfmeister

You could also in stead of copying over Assets and Content folders use a tool called symlink, and create symbolic links in the "older" install to those folders in the main install

 

Haven't thought of that, thank you! Saves space

Though be aware, that any changes you make, by using world editor in an older version for example, will affect your main installation if using SymLinks!

And don't SymLink Assets\Kuju\RailsimulatorCore!

 

Found another ID. That's the oldest manifest for the core that SteamDB lists.

6014700430186911234 will get you TS2013

Note that it cannot handle .ap files - unpack the assets and MainContent.ap for this version.

 

Older versions than TS2013 are using different depots...that was the RailWorks era, using depot 24019.

Here's a RailWorks version that includes Cajon Pass, Castle Rock, Hedborough North, Seebergbahn, all in one depot. Could be RW3.

My Steam key (which I acquired with TS2016) is not valid for access to this depot, likely due to the routes included and the depot not only consisting of core files. If you own RW3, you may have access and enjoy it again, that retro feeling

download_depot 24010 24019 5306408838438652513

So that transition from RailWorks 3: Train Simulator 2012 to Train Simulator 2013 introduced a complete change in file distribution. As RW3 shipped the program and core routes in one single depot, that was changed by separating the core from 24019 into the 24009 depot, separating the routes into single DLC depots, and the core assets into the ELAP and USLAP, only keeping Assets\Kuju\RailSimulatorCore inside the core depot.

 

That you managed to find this info and put it in a format a non tech person like me can understand is Amazing

Well Done Torf.

 

some folks with less trust in DTG and more knowledge of their product history have kept each 'year' version of RWxx,TSxx and TSCx in separate directories, either under their active Steam install, or on archive, or 'cured' with a certain medicine.

By using symbolic links, one can try to 'mount' Asset and Route folders in different versions and find out what works and what doesn't.
There is probably no need to downgrade below v72.3b.

Anyway, I hope this lua/out mess gets sorted soon, for the performance increase on my computer was substantial with the introduction of v73

 

You should try and make this post a sticky.
Great workaround until DTG decides to reorganize stuff and allow us to start pretty much any version.
At most we need two from each year, 32 and 64, so it shouldn't take up too much space. The main issue is how the bin folder would need to be moved one level deeper, causing everything else to be like ../Assets and similar. Unless symbolic links can resolve it nice and easy.

 

Wow torfmeister, this is fantastic!!! I will hopefully find the time to revisit my beloved TS2014. Thanks so much for this info. But before I do, I want to know some stuff about this. Does this replace your current TSC version? Or is it a separate download that you can play on, if so, can it / how does it access your current DLC? I doubt it can access your current DLC in the first place but if so, would it break anything? (Apologies if you have already mentioned this, I was only able to read over your post quickly as I am currently on the move.)

Do not diss the legendary TS2014 menu music!!! I will not accept this!!! I am a TS2014 / 2015 menu music defender till the day I die.

The Lua mess has been sorted though, hasn’t it? There has been a recent update to fix almost all of the issues and everything has been working fine on my end. No offence to you at all because you are not being rude or disrespectful about it but I am frustrated when people still complain about the game being “broken” even though there has already been an update out to fix all this… unless I am mistaken. If so, please correct me. Just please keep track of the updates!

 

^^ As I have it, the "Lua mess" has been sorted, although there are now issues with numerous US Routes.

You can download older versions of TS, and have them as separate folders, so it will not affect your "main" install. And you do not need to copy over Assets and Content over, you can create symbolic links between the main install and your older versions

 

What bin folder? Like I said, just copy Assets and Routes you need ore create a link. I only use the vintage versions for single routes that I quickly transfer or remove again.

For me, this is mainly of use for research - when did stuff get broken, what features were introduced in which version.
Will have a go and play Norfolk Southern Coal in TS2014 - the depot download method is the same for any DLC, so I'll look for the NS Coal manifests and download the appropriate version and see if the timings can be achieved.

Interestingly, the handling of all DLC is consistent (since TS2014 !). And each version recognizes my career progress correctly.

In TS2013, all DLC is listed in your Collection that you OWN, no matter if the files are actually there (as opposed to the TS2014+ SDBCache.bin which shows only installed stuff in the Drive menu.).

Again, don't be afraid - your main installation won't be touched (though by using symbolic links, the exe has access to your main assets and content).

 

DLC is accessed normally. It is only being checked at runtime (license check for decrypting GeoPcDx shapes), regardless of the folder it sits in, that's why you can put your RailWorks folder anywhere and start Railworks.exe from that folder. The only thing the official path enables is that Steam can access the files for verifying and updating - what we do not want, that's a reason against using SymLinks.

You can use the TS2014 menu music in TSC if you copy

TS2014: Assets\Kuju\RailSimulatorCore\Audio\UI_FrontEndLoop.dav to the respective TSC folder

 

Who are you talking to? I never flagged anyone. You are highly aggressive and insinuating. I've always tried to help you with your issues.

Steam allows these downloads based on your legally owned license (key). You have the legal right to access an older version of the game and DLC you have purchased, nothing more or less. Because it is the same game.

And if you do not own the appropriate DLC, this method will refuse to download - it is not shady in any way, because it is an integrated Steam function, allowing advanced users to revert to older versions in case of broken updates or for any reason.

Purchasing DLC means you get a license to use it, and technically that is for the according depots regardless of their version or manifest (= list of files). Buying TSC means you get legal access to app 24010 and depot 24009 (and all manifests related to that depot!), and any DLC you've added.

But only DTG/Steam are legally allowed to distribute these files, which was not the case in your thread (I've just looked it up). The report was correct, and the post with the illegal download link was flagged - no reason to take that personally. It was correct, period.

DTG are respecting and allowing the upload of user-created fixes and patches here - which they could legally prohibit, because even if I upload a cab camera or brake fix it is legally Intellectual Property of DTG. Consider this before starting to argue.

 

Hi torfmeister, just a quick aside. You can change your Steam App shortcut on your desktop (if you have one) to read like this:

"C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\Steam.exe" -console

This will allow you to use the console directly from your Steam App

 

When designing deployment, the bin folder is where the binaries reside.
Static stuff is normally outside of it. If you have it, check Euro Truck Simulator 2. As tidy as it gets.
This allows to have multiple binary folders, e.g. bin72, bin72b, bin74_x86, bin74_x64.

Many people wish for a convenient solution and I was thinking what DTG could do to allow us to use earlier versions.
I see the main issue being the folder structure and the naming scheme of many files. So only your solution works for now.

 

I think it is not in DTG's interest (certainly not in the Tech Support team's) - and almost no game offers this, ETS2 is an exception (due to the many map mods around which rely on a certain state of the base maps). The latest version should naturally be the thing to use.

You see, I'm working with what is there, not what "could be" or DTG "should do". Makes life easier

 

I know. But I go for the easiest method that does not require changing anything. Most people will not permanently want to use this function or have that tab.

 

Thank you so much!

 

Can't make it sticky, and the original post only has one like which won't make it sticky either

 

torfmeister - Great investigation work, really helpful. I had one minor issue when I tried it which I‘ll post in case it helps anyone.

After downloading the files and copying my routes etc across. Whenever I launched the copy, steam would overrule me and launch the new version. It looks like it needed to reaquire the license for the old version.

To work around this I renamed my current Railworks folder. Then copied the download folder to the same place and renamed it Railworks. Then I launched it and it would run. After that I renamed everything back and it all launches fine. I can then put my old version anywhere I like and it continues to work.

It‘s important not to let Steam do any updates while you’re doing this. It tried to update me back to the latest version on my first attempt.

I‘m sure there is an easier way, but that worked for me.

 

Yes, I've come across that too, thanks for mentioning.

And there is a solution:

Copy RailWorks\steam_appid.txt to the other RailWorks folders. This file was not present in the past (It's a textfile containg the text "24010" and a NULL terminator). Without it, steamclient.dll/steam_api.dll can't properly launch the game and reverts to the path it knows RailWorks.exe to be located.

So this little file is what basically allows us to run TS from any place. Did the trick for me

Additionally I would advise to backup your progress data - which is NOT SDBCache.bin (which is what it is, a cache only - holding no original data.)

To do so regularly save the folder: (manually or create a simple batch file)

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\userdata\<yourID>\24010\ (Adjust path if you have Steam installed to a different location)

to a backup location. This file (career.xml) is where SDBCache.bin retrieves its progress data (medals, scenarios completed) from. Though I have not seen issues, I cannot rule out an older version could cripple this file (does not look like it would, but who knows...)

Note that your overall XP score is remotely tied to your account and cannot be reset. (Only a Steam employee could do this.)

 

For quickly finding a route folder GUID (and workshop scenarios), I recommend using my friend's, the highly TS experienced and skilled WarwickRail, brilliant menu:

https://www.railsims.com/TS/workshopmenu.php

Be sure to bookmark - the Steam workshop search function filter is completely useless.

 

Quick question.

(I cannot test this right now). I use RWE2, but would torfmeister's method and symlinking work with RWE2, ie, does RWE use functionality that is only available in the updated TSC, or does it work on Assets and Routes only. What I am trying to ask is can my RWE point to the "main" install, and I can use the Railworks executable from the "old" version?

I hope you guys understand my question.

Thanks a bunch.

 

I think to find out you need to test. I don't have RWE but it seems to dig into the system very deeply.

Use SymLinking with care for the reasons I mentioned above, because you're giving the old RailWorks access to you main files (no issue with v72.3b as of now, but I'd be careful with really old versions, where I don't need all my content to play, as I use these for testing only). Also newer versions of assets and scripts could also refuse to work on very old TS versions, but you can use the download_depot method to retrieve older route/loco DLC versions as well.

I'm pretty much a vanilla guy - though I enjoy AP Weather I would not apply it to every route. SAD's Brennitzer Linienstern for example has a very good skybox, clouds and a sophisticated dynamic weather system using track linked triggers even before AP did in V2. I'd say this route uses every known trick to create immersion. And the ambient sounds and scenery detail, vegetation are fantastic. But it tends to crash now and then (also on v72.3b, so not related to the update).

 

I think the problem for DTG content has been sorted but people are still reporting problems on other forums with Third Party Payware.

The 3DZug/RWA Class 1216 is broken and people are awaiting a fix from the makers or DTG.
I have still to try the DB BR101 to see if the AFB has been fixed.

 

Dear Torfmeister,
I thank you so much for this elegant solutions I would never have found myself!

 

So, my TS history started with Train Simulator 2016 - Steam Edition on 21st September 2015 - including Cologne-Koblenz, Sherman Hill + UP Turbine, Riviera 50s, Norfolk Southern Coal, and TS Rewards goodies FlatCar, PumpCart, Castle Class and BR 155 Press.

After downloading the depot, something was off - it still used the older UI and TS2015 background. After doing some research in the DLC Manager I noticed I've got a DLC called TS 2016 User Interface Overlay - which currently just creates an empty folder called EmptySteamDepot (as the files are not needed anymore, an update deleted these from the current depot. As a depot can neither be empty nor deleted (because Steam guarantees access to what you've purchased once), it contains this dummy folder).

So I checked for older manifests and I found that this app had the additional files for the UI we're still using today. TS2016 still had the 2015 core files plus an additional folder in data\Scaleform (named 325996 - that is in fact the depot id). (Note: If you have purchased TS2017 or later, you'll probably have no access to this depot - check your DLC Manager if it contains the 2016 User Interface Overlay)

So to cut it short, to install TS2016 Steam Edition as of Sep. 2015 you need to download two depots:

Code:

download_depot 24010 24009 2258348317969349486
download_depot 24010 325996 5517391212415061493

Merge these into one folder, and don't forget to copy steam_appid.txt from your main installation.

I want to thank Steam user "xPaw" who created SteamDB.info - without it none of this would be possible.

 

How can you not see the difference between the two?

I will try and explain it in as simple as terms as possible, not to be patronising or antagonistic but to hopefully clarify the difference for you.

1) Doing anything laid out on this thread will only work IF you already own the relevant product (Base game and any relevant DLC) through Steam, i.e. have purchased a legitimate key from Steam or a Steam keys vendor..

2) The link you shared (which no one blamed you directly for btw, the content linked was reported, not you) IS illegal because it gives people access to full DLC content that they weren't required to have purchased, this is Piracy (whether intentional or maliciously or not) and DTG are entitled to know if their products are being shared illegitimately are they not?

If it was your content that you'd made and sold you'd be outraged and pursuing legal action I'd imagine, right?

See the difference now?

 

rwaday Have you seen this thread
You can roll back the game to how it was before any update from DTG knowing it won't get affected.

 

I have decided for the moment to let this fix, review, repair, fix (FRRF) methodology play out. The last of my issues seem to be with JL and G-Trax using BNSF signaling that affects several of my favorite routes and this is on track to be rectified soon. I will revisit the rollback option later, however the recent performance improvements in the editor are worth keeping the current version. I can now move long consists of 100 cars or more without crashing.

 

It's not a rollback as it downloads to a seperate folder, and it does not interfere with your main installation.

I've found it interesting to play all the NS Coal District Career scenarios on TS2014 where the timings did work, and you don't need to push the light engine out of the way on Running the Manor. Of course the locos were overpowered then.

 

Can I import my current Railworks folder or just the Assets and Content folders into this without any issues so I can add my newer content?

 

I've described it above. It's a bare installation with only Kuju\RailSimulatorCore installed and no routes or Academy.

Just copy the route folders you need and required asset folders. If you need help on what exactly is required by each route, just let me know.

 

torfmeister
I created the 24009 download and moved it to a empty drive.
And I copied a number of assets & routes across as you suggested.

The 24009 is on my F: drive compared with my G: drive where the current installation sits.
And it looks like my Railworks folder on my main drive but something is not right
But if I try to start the 32bit game from the railworks64.exe in the new folder it starts the 32bit version in the current folder.

Should everything remain in the 24009 folder on the new drive?
I moved everything out to the root of the folder but it does not have a Railworks Folder.

I have done something wrong but I'm not sure what?

 

24009 IS the RailWorks folder. Rename it as you please (just don't put a dot in the folder name!)

What line exactly have you entered in the Steam Console (what TS version?) - or what does 24009\version.txt say?

For some older versions, you need to copy "steam_appid.txt" into their main folder, else Steam will start current version. If you do that, everything works fine. I now have every version from TS2013 onward installed and can play each of these independently.

 

I copied in what you mentioned in the first post - download_depot 24010 24009 3515933791864056457
And I thought I had copied the "steam_appid.txt" into the new main folder but I hadn't. Doh!

Having copied the file when I try to start the game the correct 64bit splash screen appears very briefly and then disappears
I also tried the 32bit start but that don't work either.

 

And you started the RailWorks64.exe directly from the new folder? Steam running in the background?

Copied at least one route (Academy will do)? To the correct location?

Academy:

depot_24009\Assets\DTG\Academy\AcademyAssets.ap
depot_24009\Content\Routes\00000050-00.....\MainContent.ap

And note for playing a DTG route, it must of course be installed in your main installation (check DLC manager) - if it is deactivated, it will not run, no matter which RailWorks.exe you're starting.

 

Does in need to be in a folder called depot_24009?

I put mine in F:\Railworks\

 

That's perfectly alright. As I said in the first post, put it anywhere you want and rename it as you wish - I've renamed depot_24009 to RailWorksv72 to avoid confusion and moved it to D:

Maybe you have accidentally created a subfolder "24009" in F:\Railworks ? It should look the same as your main installation (only some different filesizes - and steam_appid.txt should already be there for the v72.3b version)

 

The DTG Academy works ok in the main folder.

When I try to start the game the small TS2021(?) banner appears for a few seconds then the screen goes black but instead of the big version and the game loading it just returns to the desktop. Happens with both Railworks.exe Railworks64.exe files in the railworks folder

EDIT - the version text shows v72.3

 

Delete the playerprofiles.bin from F:\RailWorks\Content\ and try again. (Will not affect your main game)

can you post a screenshot of F:\RailWorks folder ?

 

Tried that - same result
It created a new PlayerProfiles.bin file when I tried to start the game
The mini splash screen is the UP - Pendolino - ICE3 version

 

It seems you have mixed up some files somehow...

Start over.

- Delete Steam\steamapps\content\app_24010 folder to make sure it's clean for the new download
- Download the depot. (~400 MB): download_depot 24010 24009 3515933791864056457
- Move "depot_24009" to F:
- Copy Assets\DTG\Academy\ over (create the Assets\DTG folder first)
- Copy Content\Routes\00000050-... over (create the Content\Routes folder first)
- Start F:\depot_24009\RailWorks64.exe and play an Academy scenario

If that works, transfer more assets and routes. You can still freely move or rename the folder. Steam makes the connection between RailWorks64.exe and its internal app name 24010 via the steam_appid.txt (which should be present already in v72.3b depot)

 

I still have the depot_24009 download - I will start again.

 

I think was the acronym was EBUAC

Thanks for you patience Torf

 

You only need to import those assets you want to use.
I purchased the BMG Welsh Marches Route after the update and it transferred across to this version

 

If you transfer you whole RailWorks folder and overwrite all the core files, you'll play the newest version again...

Only Assets\... and Content\Routes\...!

Use SteamDB.info or RouteProperties.xml to check dependencies.

For example, Canadian Mountain Passes needs these assets: ELAP, USLAP, RW Legacy Foliage and of course JL\CP

I'd just transfer the stuff that absolutely does not work on v74.8a at the moment. I can still play Springfield or Montana on 32-bit, so no need for me to add them to v72.3b.

This method is also good for adding a plain vanilla install next to an AP/RWE modded installation, by using the current manifest id of 24009 as a parameter.