I Don’t Like This Push For More ‘gameplay’.

And yet some people want to see Tehachapi Pass come to TSW. If Clinchfield has problems with its light mainline timetable, I can only imagine how bad the dispatcher can handle the increased amount of traffic Tehachapi has with its single track main....

US freight on TSW is doomed to double track mains with A-B runs with hand holding switching....

 

It doesn't help that Clinchfield handles the passing loops all wrong: northbounds are always routed right, as if it were a double-tracked RR, which means they are routed through the passing loop and thus slowed to 15 mph. In reality of course all trains use the mainline unless a passing situation occurs.

 

I'm sorry but 'la la land layers' seriously?!

I get that your not happy with some of the seasonal layers on Sehs but you are blowing this way out of proportion now.

 

One could argue having all these fictional layers is like being in la la land. This wouldn't be an issue if we just had a option to turn off fictional layers that kill immersion for those that don't want them.

This is something that should be brought up in the next roadmap stream because shoving trains into routes that never ran on a line in real life is not a solution for everyone. A toggle would easily solve this problem.

DTG also really don't build on existing routes as well which leads to mostly major stations being empty or having unrealistic layers on a route

 

I think DTG is struggling with what it is we’ve asked for previously.

As a community we’ve been very vocal about seeing more life in routes, from static stock & AI to playable services.

Some of this is down to us not being able to use our trains on other routes, and some of it is down to lifeless routes & lacking timetables.

I do think the TGV & ICE look silly on SEHS, this is an example of going to far with artistic license.

Omitting over 60% of the timetable on NEC:NJ because we didn’t have the exact type of loco was too far in the opposite direction. The ALP 46 is perfectly suitable for this one.

It’s hard for me to believe that DTG are unable to find the medium they need with this, there is a very clear line between being sensible and being silly when it comes to the layers we have seen.

Frankly though, the issue keeps coming back to underwhelming timetables. Routes are just too empty right now. Maybe DTG need to stop looking at everywhere they can reuse trains & start investing some dev time into making new ones.

Fortunately loco DLC’s are picking up again, but we do need more.

 

Well to be fair NJ Transit only has 10 ALP-46s although then begs the question as to why not just make the ALP-46A which is frankly very similar to the ALP-46 but just has a higher top speed. DTG keep making poor choices that goes and bites them in the behind when they keep cutting corners

 

I've no issue with fanciful layers and new features being tried and tested. But they shouldn't be forced on everyone.

Simply leave the core scenarios and journeys as pure driving experiences and add a simple layer toogle switch.

Its not a big ask and it shouldn't be beyond the skills of team. After all the timetable works fine if you don't own the additional layers parent DLC.

Whilst there's no such option I'll simply be spending my gaming budget elsewhere each month.

 

That’s my point though, the ALP46 is remarkably similar to what it would stand in for, yet that’s where they drew the line on realism - in stark contrast to other decisions.

 

They have a large BR stockist which could fill many routes in the right era. The 47 and 45 are staples for anything 1960s to late 80s. But as we
are told BR doesn't sell. Instead we get one train, huge stations and timetables that are so thin they would fall through a grid. Manchester Picc in this new route is still massively empty. The EMR 158s only run once an hour each way for a start.

There could do with being some investment in locos that could transition between eras. 56s and 60s for one spring to mind. The 142 if its coming is another.

 

Theres 1 layer which is complete work of fiction and there's 2 which are based on a single day in the history of the line (neither which belong in the time period modelled and which incidentally where unannounced "easter eggs" - some easter egg ruining immersion completely), what exactly would you call these fictional layers?

 

The full njt timetable even with the alp46 was not made since dtg ran out of time. Only the amtrak timetable was the complete one on release.

Different sounds, physics and slightly different modeling. May look similar but still big enough differences to take it just as much time as a brand new locomotive.

 

I do agree that BR would be an easy way to solve the issue short term, personally I don’t think we’re far off a BR route.

They say it sells poorly, without trying to sell it, and it’s always asked for with new UK routes “where are the railtours”.

Any route, regardless of era or stock, is going to sell well if it’s busy. BML has got to be one of the most popular routes, whilst having what is arguably TSW’s most boring train as the theme.

 

I'd call them exactly what they are, seasonal layers that only appear on very specific parts of the route which (imo at least) make the route feel more alive.

 

That award is probably shared with the near silent 1442 in the original RT and any or in fact all of the 766 Dosto cab cars. Spending nearly an hour driving the latter on a tedious all stops trip to Meissen (or any other route) makes me want to ring the dentist and arrange root canal surgery...without any local anaesthetic!!

I too am hoping the big summer UK release is a return to BR Blue but not holding my breath.

 

Is there any history in the TSW series that shows DTG that BR Blue does not sell ? I’m sure I’m not alone in saying BR Blue would be a great DLC.

 

Very specific parts of the route?

Well the TGV and ICE run specifically the full length of HS1 between St Pancras and Ashford, the class 45 specifically is in St Pancras (none have ran on the main line since the early 2000's), the Steam Rail Tour runs specifically between Faversham & Dartford, the class 385 is specifically in Ashford depot.

Where specifically is there no made up layering exactly? The short section between HS1 and the traditional line perhaps? Don't shout out too loudly if this is the case or DTG will stick a 1972 stock service on this section.

Look no one is wanting too take your Narnia layers off you if they bring you enjoyment, all we're asking for is the option for them to be turned off without the need to constantly uninstall and reinstall DLC. Don't force your idea of satisfaction onto others.

And quit harping on about the "seasonal" part of these services as unless you've taken the effort to go out and research when these run these nothing in game to help avoid them. And SEHS now has so many silly layers on it, its probably the minority of months where you can get away without bumping into one or another of these.

 

Dude please for the love of stop with his whole 'la la land' or 'narnia layers' thing as you call, you hate these layers, that's fine I get it and in one of your other posts I agreed with you that there should be an ability to toggle layers but I stand be what I said, you are blowing this way out of proportion.

 

Perhaps if they took more time with the route, it wouldn't have been one of the most negatively reviewed routes and one of the worse routes in tsw3 right now. Heck, if they had added a full timetable before release, there would be no need post release to make a full timetable and those efforts could've been allocated for something else

 

Maybe the next feature could be filling the tender of the jubilee with a bucket from the viaduct over the Mersey AKA Thomas Goes Fishing.

 

A game I love is being ruined (IMO) in the quest of gimmicks and make believe and you think Im blowing it out of proportion?

I brought SHES back in the TSW2 reiteration, had I known then it was going to end up a joke of route I'd never have purchased it.

I can handle new routes not meeting my criteria because I can make an informed decision to buy or not to buy. But when they start messing with older routes I already own to the point I'm uninstalling and deleting them from my collection its simply not acceptable.

 

OK I've made my point and I'm not gonna reply to any more of your posts in regards to this matter because your just ranting at this point, good day.

 

Please, nobody tell this guy about the holiday express DLC... Not without a defibrillator on standby.

 

I was replying tongue in cheek to peterchambers post but for some reason it didnt pull the quote over.

 

Again I can make an informed decision over such a route, but when they start messing with older routes I already own, I can hardly go back in time and reverse my descision to buy.

 

Lol good one, but in all seriousness though, Sehs is actually my local route irl, so if anything I should be the one getting annoyed with all these extra layers but I won't because unlike some people here I can actually look past the less realistic layers and actually enjoy Tsw for what it is, my absolute number 1 favourite single player game to spend the evening chilling out on.

 

Again happy for you, like you I also enjoy TSW (although the number of routes I enjoy dwindles with every patch it seems) and up to recently purchased every route, every Loco DLC and every game play pack. But with the current direction of the game this will be no more and once DTG ruins the last route I own (which are the current rate is looking before the end of the year) I'll uninstall the last DLC and the core game.

 

More traffic and layers the better for me.

[EDIT - Jan - Quarrelsome]

 

I think it depends on the amount or frequency of layers. I can live just about with the TGV on SEHS as it only occurs once, although I still wish it was selectable. But then you have WCL and the layers on there go too far.

 

I get that the TGV is a bit of a stretch but honestly, I've never seen it once as AI when I've driven along HS1. It's 4 services out of 600+ and also set to appear during certain months, it's going to be extremely rare to see.

The other stuff, like the ICE, I'm fine with as the ICE did go to London at one point and as someone who prefers vintage stock, the rail tours are a must for me. I suppose another option would be to do a Diesel Legends-type thing and make alternate timetables based on different dates/years where a 385 was sat at Ashford Depot or the ICE was at St. Pancras though that would be a lot more work than maintaining a singular timetable for the route.

Personally, I'm happy with SEHS' timetable as it is. I just want them to fix what broke in the recent patch asap so I can get back to playing it!

 

Why would you not want everyone to enjoy it? Why is the enjoyment of someone who doesn't care about unrealistic layers more important than for those of us who don't want to see unrealistic layers? Why not have selectable layers, then everyone is happy?

 

Personally, I think SEHS is the right balance - I think the seasonal services spice things up a bit and stop it from getting stale and the timetable is now the best in the game (to be added to with the 700). I really enjoy the rail tours and I like seeing them by surprise when I'm operating other services.

I understand where some folk are coming from with regards to the TGV/ICE but I'd rather see them than not if we're never going to have Eurostar added as an operator, which I understand is likely the case due to licensing issues. If Eurostar was ever added, I'd get rid of the TGV/ICE layers.

The only route I think has gone too far in terms of layering was probably including the 40 and 45 in WCL - just layering the 47 instead would have been the right call instead. (WCL was a bit of a mess in many ways though and the occasional tinkering around the edges wasn't going to fix it - IMO the track laying, scenery and stock all need a thorough review.)

Obviously the ultimate solution for all of this is to introduce toggleable layers in the UI - I'm not really sure why that hasn't happened yet.

 

Meanwhile, I'm still wishing Cajon Pass had playable UP layers from the Cutoff to Barstow, instead of just AI traffic on the cutoff, and no option to turn off the ATSF F7....

 

[EDIT - Jan - Quarrelsome]

 

SEHS is my favourite route atm purely because of the additional layers.

Yes, they might be unrealistic, but I am after immersion, and a TGV on HS1 adds to that immersion

 

Okay maybe it's time we all just calmed down a bit now, instead of arguing with each other over this unrealistic layers vs fun gameplay experience (which ok I admit I'm guilty of myself) instead we should all as a united group call on Dtg to introduce a toggle layer system, that way everyone's happy.

 

Even so blue/grey non airconditioned mark 2's would not have been seen in 1990's Cornwall certainly not on class 1 express services. I would say by then the few left were used on secondary loco hauled services. And most of those, like those on the NWCL were repainted into regional railways livery. Also, the fact they are running without brake coaches which was against regulations makes them even more laughable.

I don't mind the railtours, it gives you a chance to give some older locos a better run out but I have seen those without brake vehicles and many are so short, when did you last see a steam or diesel railtour with five carriages?

Why not create a pool of reskinned loco's (not dirty blue ones) with TPWS fitted so you can create some realistic railtours.

Layers have been very beneficial to the sim but when they are fanciful for some they ruin immersion.

 

Well I agree with that, but I have mentioned it before and have never seen or heard it addressed.

 

Yes I know you and several others here have called for it but we'll just have to keep trying and hope for the best.

 

I say that whenever I buy a lottery ticket!

 

The truth is the volume of us who care about the layers is probably a drop in the ocean overall, but I'd be prepared to guess that we make a good proportion of the hardcore fan base who buy every route, every loco and every game play pack. But DTG are happy to risk alienating us by refusing to address the concerns and requests for user control over layers whilst they chase joe blogs who might be tempted to buy 1 or 2 DLC a year based around their favourite route who wants to drive as many different trains on it as possible.

The hardcore will just suck it up and continue buying is their hope and expectation.

 

Your preference on layers doesn't define if you're hardcore or not. I own everything currently released on both PC and PS5, I'm generally happy with layers. I'd say I'm a extremely hardcore supporter of TSW. My main complaint with the game is generally with the lacking fps performance on PS5, it's playable but the fps should be on par with XSX, which it's far from it but that's another topic...

 

I never said if you was hardcore youd automatically care about layers, what I said was if you care about layers then youre probably within the hardcore bracket. You can be hardcore without hating unrealistic layers still.

 

This is very unfortunate.

Companies have stopped making products that people want and need and now make stuff that will bring them the most amount of money the fastest. They are ok with customers grumbling and complaining (and even provide forums for them to do so) as long as hype and marketing keeps enough of them buying and the coffers full.

I am not a gamer and TSW is the only ‘game’ I really play. AFAIK there aren’t any other rail simulators out there worth playing and since DTG owns both TSW and TSC I just hope they don’t dumb down the simulator experience completely.

 

FUN! Good times! A delightfully whimsical addition! A great way to get more out of my TSW purchases!

In the past, the very vocal "no fun police" portion of the fanbase has complained about something and shifted the direction of DTG's development.

When SEHS came out, the 465 services were being done by 375s. People complained and the response was "in the future we will just leave those services out of the timetable instead of adding the wrong train."

So basically, a person buying the base route gets less content than they would have before. That is a giant negative towards the majority of the player base who don't care or don't know what train actually runs those services. They literally said they would have less stuff to do in the future. Not a good result in my mind.

(A bit of a moot point since the 465 was rolled into the new version of the route, but it was a specific shift in philosophy that meant the "no unrealistic services" people won.)

I think those of us who prefer more gameplay compared to a strict dedication to "realism" need to continue to speak out.

 

Well then surely you wouldn't mind DTG putting the acs 64 on munich augsburg? Perhaps DTG should dump a class 377 on LIRR and maybe add the 1972 stock on the harlem line. Should we also add the ACS 64 on scotrail express as well? Maybe we should add the Amtrak Acela Express on Kassel-Wurzburg? Perhaps even add the DB BR 612 on New York-Trenton. Maybe we should add a gwr class 43 hst on Koln Aachen

 

Absolutely no one is wanting them to turn off the make believe layers, what we ask begging for is simply a toggle so we can control what we see.

Surely a toogle is better for everyone as DTG could get really inventive with the layers and upset next to no one?

Win win eh

 

In other words they can reach everyone and not have to upset anybody if they add a toggle for layers?

 

Yes. Having a option is a win win for everyone

 

Yes, obviously a toggle would be the best solution, but that doesn't seem to be anywhere on the horizon, so we're left with the status quo.

DTG have made concessions to the fun police before (axing the UP SD70 on SPG) when complaints like this get raised, probably because it's an easy way to quiet things down on here.

I'd just hope that since there IS a workaround (temporarily uninstall content that provides unwanted layers), DTG won't be too quick to remove content that others are happy is there and wish to continue enjoying.