Question for the BR Blue experts: Assuming for a second JT build a new route with either Preston or Carlisle in the future would it make any sense to save the Class 86 for that instead of making it as a DLC for the Shap portion?
It’s very early to say, but I do wonder if they’re setting up a series of routes that are connected by a location you could “hop” between. It’s certainly an exciting prospect!
The route's set in '86 so it could work..? It would be great to see the APT but likewise I do think the Class 86 is more likely, but I am happy to be proven wrong, JT!
If i could pick i would go for a 25 if not that then a 81, 82, 83 or a 85 and if none of those then an 86 just as long as it’s not some rancid unit.
Gonna guess a first generation EMU, just to be different. Maybe a class 303, 304 or 310, as they were based at Manchester Longsight in the 1980s ?
No EMUs operated around the Preston area. They were all out of Manchester and went South. Would love a 304 in the game though, but we would need Manchester to Crewe for that to be driveable.
A few ex Great Eastern Class 309s were transferred for use on Manchester Airport runs in the mid 90s. And subsequently, once withdrawn in 2000, two were put into departmental service for the development of in cab signalling on the WCML before Railtrack collapsed... But the era would be completely wrong for that.
They got to Preston on a booked Preston - Crewe but the only record i can find of one going north is one got to Carlisle on a relief in 1990.
Please please please let it be the Class 370 APT-P. Another tilting train would be fantastic alongside the upcoming Class 390 Pendelino. I believe that the Class 370 could still be found on the WCML during 1986 being withdrawn shortly after.
I hope it’s the APT-P because it’s such an interesting train and it would look really good on the Preston-Carlisle route. One question though, if they were to make it how would they get things such as sounds? Because as far as I’m aware the only surviving APT-P is stored at Crewe Heritage Centre and is just kept there as a static as it cannot move. I could be wrong but I don’t know.
The CHC have managed to get it to tilt, not too long ago either! There's then two videos on YT I could find of it's horn.. so there's some things that could be used - JT (if lucky enough) could get sounds of it tilting and could try to use the videos on YT of its horn if they needed.. or again if they were lucky enough; maybe record the horn in person assuming CHC can rewire the connection to the air or whatever is needed. I believe the APT is in another train simulator so, if need be, they could just recycle the sounds from that simulator too.... Here's a video of the APT horn; (not my video) (Additionally, the APT is currently being repainted and cleaned.. what better time to try and model it!?)
The issue with this potentially being the APT is that it wouldn't really add much in the way of variation to the route, as it would be only a small handful of services added to the timetable and so you wouldn't even notice it exists most of the time.
I think my heart would sink if it was the APT. never really saw much service, mainly just test runs. I managed to get on one in early 1980 (included a free three course dinner!) and they weren't that impressive. Very bright and harsh inside, particularly second class and the tilted sides were rather claustrophobic, more so than the Pendies. Unfortunately the run I was on the tilt was isolated so didn't get a chance to experience that.
I am hoping it is a 108. It would also fit quite well on the Blackpool lines, I even faintly remembering going to Ormskirk on one, What would be nice if it was an 86 would be in inclusion of Mk2 Air Con carriages. As normally when I travelled on the WCML it was always them going to Scotland.
For me part of the allure is simply how ghastly the interior was, the cab is a simply horrible environment. I think it’s one of those unique pieces of stock that adds a special flair to certain routes, it’s hard to get it in the game because as correctly pointed out, it never really makes sense. For me though this route would be the best opportunity for it. Whilst there is obviously a plethora of BR stock to go, I think the likes of a 25 or 86 is likely to be a headline loco in another route, the APT is best suited to be standalone. It would be a shame to go near a modern Crewe and not see it there, it’s always my highlight of the station. In any case the section that JT are doing is quite bendy, it’s suited really well to a pendolino & as much as I will get most my playtime on this route out of the BR stuff, I’ll definitely be chucking the 390 on it from time to time.
Looking back at the screen shots of Preston - Carlisle, and the Railfreight branded HEA hoppers layered-in from TVL. Possible teaser for a class 56 or 58? Would probably need MGR hoppers to go with those locos, rather than HEAs, but there is a certain hint of heavy coal trains going on there.
BREAKING NEWS: Just Trains, the renowned maker of flight simulation products, have announced they will be releasing an unmodified, standalone loco, the class 150. This comes after the shock acquisition of Rivet Games by Just Trains, and is explained by Dr A. Non, Just Trains' entirely fictional spokesman as "We're releasing this especially for Spikee1975 on the basis that he will autobuy anything from Just Trains" A Spikee1975 quote, yesterday Spoiler Some or all of the above may be entirely untrue
Blimey. Thinking twice, I'm making it too easy for them! Let's see if their crucial "second album" will be a hit again. You gotta impress me again like the very first time! A bus on rails won't do, gimme loco power!
I would absolutely love a 56, definitely more than I would the APT.. more usage, and I've seen them in real life a lot more, obviously. Would they be area-accurate though? Although in saying that; freight locos go all over the place, no matter where really.
I used to watch 56s and 58s come through Wolverhampton station from Bescot or Walsall on MGR trains in the early 1980s, so they were extremely common on the WCML. Class 56s would haul both HAAs and HEAs, and a pair of 20s or 31s would substitute if a class 56 was not available. I don't remember ever seeing a class 58 haul HEAs though, they always dealt with HAA MGR trains.
This is interesting. Doesn't list locos, but it is Lancaster freight timetable 1987/88. Large % are electric hauled. https://www.rmweb.co.uk/forums/topi...cml-early-80s/?do=findComment&comment=5441518
There were barely any 56s on the north WCML until the 90s, and never any 58s in regular service. The only 58 I did see was on a railtour and came off at Carnforth.
Well 56s would work well then! I really hope that's what this DLC will be, I feel like there's a good chance it could be but I'm not gonna get my hopes up....
Well, it is impossible for electric locomotives to run MGR coal trains for obvious reasons... Catenary underneath a coal loader just ain't going to work. So why would Just Trains layer HEA hoppers from TVL and upload screen shots if all the freight on Preston - Carlisle is electric hauled? Not trying to argue with you here, so don't take it the wrong way.
Not my list, just a thread I found talking about 80s freight around the north WCML. MGR on that list are shown as diesel hauled. Most pics I can find around that time seem to be Class 31 and 47s on duty for diesel. Class 86 for a lot of the electric hauled stuff (Speedlink/Freightliner).
If there is only class 87s, then its impossible for the full timetable to be done, there isn't enough of them to fulfill the services Preston to Carlisle. They also worked South of Preston and were common on Liverpool and Manchester trains. It's making sense for the next loco DLC to be an 86 simply because it could be on the remainder of trains. 81s and 85s also still common.
In the early 80’s it was not uncommon to see an 87 and Mark 3 stock on the second Cobbler loco hauled service they introduced 0720 ex Northampton and 1745 from Euston. The 0746 Up/1723 Down were solid Mark Ones with any old wreck that Willesden decided to put out.
86 is a strong possibility for timetable filling purposes although I'd be happy to see classes 81-85 too.
To be fair this had been an issue with BML too, so they just made fake fleet numbers for the 377. (Well that and some fakery with with another subclass). Obviously with JT I’d wonder if they’d actually consider doing fake unit numbers.
Also the possibility they will just drop the 47 on secondary services such as Scotland to South West and South Coast and freight. Though at the time it was general policy on BR not to run diesel hauled under the wires if at all possible, unlike today. Which is where the hoped for traction pack DLC to follow will add the 86’s to displace whatever JT are using on services not diagrammed for an 87.
Without looking at Timetables for freight, there was Container trains, Metals, Limestone, Speedlink, Oil and a whole host of random trains such as ballast and Timber. It would be good if some more wagons for TSW were to be produced. JT already have Cargowaggons and VGA vans in their TSC line up which would be right at home on the WCML.
We have Blue Mk2s (non AirCon) already, and are getting blue Mk1s with the EC Diesel pack, and with the 87+Mk3s coming with Shap, an 86+AirCon Mk2s would fill the BR era gap. Maybe even an 86 ‘pack’ with multiple variations and liveries.
Sometimes used to get 60s and 58s around With all that fugly gubbins on top of the engine. "The flying Substation" would be apt.
I hope so haha !!. Actually with the Route Hopping feature that would be pretty insane. That would be a hell of a journey. I support that !!!.
I think they are saving that nickname for the class 74. Those things drew so much power from the third-rail, they could make lineside equipment boxes explode from 3 miles away.
Remember, the game doesn't care if they're working south of Preston. Once a train leaves the map its loco can be assigned to a train entering the map a minute later. There only needs to be enough 87s to cover all the services on the map at any given time - I can't imagine the number of electric-hauled passenger services on the map at one time exceeding 30, and from that freight timetable linked there's only going to be four or so electric-hauled freights at most on the map at a single time.
