Lights On - Pitched Black, Can't Even See?

Discussion in 'Technical Reports' started by cityrail-rulez, Nov 1, 2023.

  1. When will TSC developers fix the lighting at night in this game? I should be seeing a light cone while driving at night!

    In MSTS/Open Rails, BVE/OpenBVE, Trainz I can see where I'm going.. Why not in TSC? Still so many bugs in this game that needs to be fixed..

    This happens for EVERY train I drive at night in TSC...
     

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  2. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    Night lighting is not TSC specific, but depends on the TimeOfDay file the route is using. Choose a 3D weather type and things will look different, adjust scenario date to a full moon phase and it'll be even brighter.

    If you want to, you can have bright daylight at night in TSC - the game gives the route dev complete freedom of choice.

    Additionally, you have three sliders in the Options menu for Ambient Light, Contrast and Sunlight Intensity.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 1, 2023
  3. Oh ok! I will be honest I have absolutely NO idea what your talking about. The only thing I know is the Options menu LOL
     
  4. triznya.andras

    triznya.andras Well-Known Member

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    I like to blame a lot of weaknesses on the fact that this is a sim from 2007 designed mainly around short UK consists.
    True or false, I've seen many posts claiming that in the UK headlights are to see the train, and not for the driver to see anything.

    There have been some attempts at aggressive night headlights, Donner Pass GP9 in particular (same or similar as some others like the earlier Horseshoe Curve GP7). It ended up way too aggressive. I'm also not sure / unhappy with the luminosity scaling (candlelight range) of the game - night scenes are using very low light levels (up to 5-10%) and even daylight often goes to 40-50% (particularly old ones) on a histogram, only to allow headlights to add brightness values surpassing the sun several times - CMP and NS Coal District headlights are turning even black pixels into white.

    I suppose what you ask for is doable - instead of a relatively binary headlight, a wider one that fades out gradually. The actual design depends on a lot, is it bulbs or LED, how strong and focused are the mirrors; our Flirts illuminate OHLE about 200 meters ahead, not to blinding levels, but I've read that with a bit of effort (like in Le Mans) you can illuminate about 800 meters quite well. Fog lights on modern stock gets there I suppose, at the expense of the eyesight of any opposing train's crew.

    Back to Spikee, is it possible to design a preferred headlight cone and just apply it to whichever train with moderate effort?

    ps.: I think Spikee you misunderstood OP, you reacted on night light levels using the correct word lighting, but OP is looking for headlights. I believe their ultimate intent is to add proper ones to their own designs, I'm seeing some Australian liveries produced.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2023
  5. I wasn't claiming that the headlights are to see the train! I was just pointing out that you should see the light cone shining from the cab to say like 100 meters in front of the train making everything visible to the driver. See some cab ride videos you'll know what I'm say ;) Or if you are a driver switching the high beam on 'That's what I'm referring too' ;)

    At least I'm trying to get Australian content into TSC! I'm surprised that ever since the game existed dating back to when it was titled 'Rail Simulator' that still to this very day there's no Australian locomotives or rolling stock 'released'.. We all know the British hates us, that's why DTG loves to me all the excuses on earth to avoid releasing anything Australian...
     
  6. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    There's locos in TSC that have 1000 metres lightcones (Donner Pass GP9), all depends on how the loco is set up.

    You can define the headlights - a spotlight blueprint, modify colours, theta and phi cones, radius etc.
     
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  7. Ah, I used the headlight blueprint. I was going to use the spotlight blueprint, but I was following a tutorial by Tony Nicholls as he explains it all in his Toy Loco tutorials https://www.youtube.com/@tony3133/featured
     
  8. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    Yes, place child spotlight objects on your engine, and define it like you want to. These spotlights can cast light cones, normal headlights don't.

    The light you're using should have a model (GeoPcDx) - this is not necessary but helps adjusting the position as you see them in the Editor then. (Example: Cab Pointlight child object)
    2023-11-02 00_31_55-Train Simulator (x64).png


    Set up their orientation (translation/rotation) in the engine blueprint, and the desired radius/phi/theta and RGB values in the spotlight blueprint. (Phi is the outer cone angle, and Theta the inner full intensity cone)

    Then Activate the child nodes in your engine script, assign a key in your InputMapper and script the "OnControlValueChange" stuff in the script.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2023
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  9. Thanks for the useful tip :) I wished I knew how to script LUAs though :D:D:D I really appreciate you explaining it ;) It is the first time I've ever setup lights.

    The problem I am having though is that is when I turn on the headlights 'low or high' on any rolling stock/locomotive the route is still pitched black making it very difficult to see while driving at night. That's also way I said 'DTG, should fix up TSC lighting'..
     
  10. Spikee1975

    Spikee1975 Guest

    Uhm. Have you enabled Dynamic Lights in the settings? Without it, no light is cast.
     
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  11. THANK YOU :) That has certainly fixed it ;) I must had disabled the dynamic lighting in the settings.
     
  12. mindenjohn

    mindenjohn Well-Known Member

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    Nonsense. The population of Australia is about the same as Sweden. DTG has no Swedish product but there is a healthy Swedish forum with a number of Swedish producers of routes, Locomotives and rolling stock. Similarly the Czech Republic where there was no product by external suppliers but has a very healthy group producing top stuff and now benefits from the use of the Siemens 193 produced by RSSLO, although that is a universal loco.
    There is still listed in Steam some South African stuff which originated from South Africans.
    There are lessons to be learned and sitting moaning is not the answer. The afore mentioned Swedes, Czechs etc developed their own and made it available on forums. They initially used the “ wrong track” the “wrong catenary” but got something running. Why can’t Australians do the same or is the reality that there is not the demand in which case there will never be any Australian content.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2023
  13. WoodlandTracks

    WoodlandTracks Active Member

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    Are you sure ? I think you are a few hundred percent off.

    Just keep an eye on North Korea, as soon as they get their route and rolling stock Australia will be next :)

    Population per country:
    1. China
    2. United States
    3. Indonesia
    4. Pakistan
    5. Nigeria
    6. Brazil
    7. Bangladesh
    8. Russia
    9. Mexico
    10. Ethiopia
    11. Japan
    12. Philippines
    13. Egypt
    14. Congo
    15. Vietnam
    16. Iran
    17. Turkey
    18. Germany
    19. Thailand
    20. United Kingdom
    21. Tanzania
    22. France
    23. South Africa
    24. Italy
    25. Kenya
    26. Myanmar
    27. Colombia
    28. South Korea
    29. Uganda
    30. Sudan
    31. Spain
    32. Argentina
    33. Algeria
    34. Iraq
    35. Afghanistan
    36. Poland
    37. Canada
    38. Morocco
    39. Saudi Arabia
    40. Ukraine
    41. Angola
    42. Uzbekistan
    43. Yemen
    44. Peru
    45. Malaysia
    46. Ghana
    47. Mozambique
    48. Nepal
    49. Madagascar
    50. Ivory Coast
    51. Venezuela
    52. Cameroon
    53. Niger
    54. North Korea
    55. Australia
    56. Taiwan
    :) :)

    Of course DTG is a company and they need to provide money so people can buy their kids shoes and food. As soon as they think they can make a good buck on Australian stuff they might do it. Same goes for all other third party builders.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2023
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  14. HAHAHA North Korea! Hack, I wouldn't mind a South Korean route to go with it ;)
    If I ever wanted a Vietnamese route, the era has to be prior to the French invasion 'aka the country who started it all'..
     
  15. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure why you think it is False?

    Train Headlights in the UK have evolved over the years.
    Until the 1980s trains either had Marker Lights that replicated Steam Loco lamps and had no forward illumination of the line
    DSCF1268.JPG

    or a Route indicator that had no illumination of the route ahead
    DSCF1244.JPG


    When the route indicators finished the indicator boxes just had a vinyl sticker to allow some light thru
    IMG_3304.JPG
    From the late 1980s - 1990s locos with better illumination of the line ahead were introduced.
     
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  16. triznya.andras

    triznya.andras Well-Known Member

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    Basically the bookends of your post is what I meant.

    The approach is different across regions and times. For a while now railroads invest in strong headlights which clearly go beyond mere visibility. Seeing trackside signs is one.

    Also, I prefer cautious wording. I figured that railroading is arcane business and discussing it is only for the initiated. It probably has its roots somewhere and no point in ruffling feathers.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2023
  17. triznya.andras

    triznya.andras Well-Known Member

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    I believe the official answer is licensing, whatever that actually means. (Revenue share, buildings, liveries, ...)
    The other answer (by Matt iirc) was about trackside assets - architecture, foliage, signaling.
    On the joke side, given the azimuth issues of the original weathers, Australia would be the first where it's actually correct! Then Argentina.

    A semi-historic route could be a good start as I've read a lot about import stock. A couple reskins for the most overused models in TSC could unironically work (EMD stuff), just like India with Alco.
    Also the ore trains which use SD70s and run through plain desert. Bare ground, 100mi straight track, three grass patches, one bush, done. (Just kidding. Or am I?)
    Quite possibly we have Cajon Pass because that's why they could achieve back then (except it was modeled as UP).

    That said I agree with your sentiment. Just do it. Which he does!
     
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  18. mindenjohn

    mindenjohn Well-Known Member

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    If official licensing is the problem what is the point of constantly carping on about lack of product in htis forum because it cannot happen other than by individuals for their own use only. (Hint)
     
  19. I think licencing is just an excuse! You don't really need a licence to model Australian foliage, buildings, bridges, locomotives or anything else for that matter. There are over 1000 3d artist that sells their work and also hasn't ever obtained permission/or even has obtained a licence to sell their models I guarantee you. When I created models for MSTS, I'm the only one who has obtained permission to use the L7/RailCorp/SRA/Countrylink and Cityrail logos as for liveries there's really no permission or licence required.

    The point of all that if 3d artist can get away with it, so can DTG! That's how I see it.
     
  20. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Then you don't understand how things work in the real world - ie outside Australia.

    Most companies have no problem with 3d artist using their logos on things - providing it is free.
    That is why you see a lot of liveries for locos and trains that you cannot buy.

    If is when company A - in this case DTG - makes an Add-On to sell using a companies logo they don't have a license for is where you get a problem as most companies object to others making money off what is their property.
    Until a year ago there was a restriction of selling BNSF locos and routes outside North America
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/bnsf-routes-and-locomotives-now-worldwide.52340/

    Two options -
    DTG release a route that has DLC but without any logos - the current Welsh Marches is like that.
    Salop.jpg No DB/EWS logo on the 66, no logo on the 175 and no logo on the Freightliner 70.
    The community has made a patch but it cannot be included.

    Or DTG include trains with the Wrong Logos like Just Trains.
    60 BB Shenker.jpg BB Shenker?

    FWS.jpg
    FW&S

    DTG won't release a livery unless it is correct and they have License for the thing they are releasing.

    Peter
     
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  21. cunningn#3154

    cunningn#3154 Well-Known Member

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    "BB Shenker" - PRICELESS!! I must have seen that fake logo in tens of screenshots and never realised that it didn't say "DB" - superb job and no copyright infringement!
     
  22. I already know about the process and how it all works! I've looked into creating payware add-ons before, I was in process of a licencing agreement with a rail operator for some freight wagons I still have but never released as I am required in Australia to have a business number before selling any products! So, I decided not to continue.. But clearly you didn't read the part where I stated there are over 1000 3d artist who NEVER obtains a licence or permission to SELL their models.

    WOW! How dare you accuse me of NOT being able to buy any of the routes, trains for TSC? I've brought a few! I like to buy them when there's a special on, because every route for TSC is super expensive ranging from $40 to $70 AUD on Steam. Comparing with the prices for Trainz routes, trains ranging from $15 to $50 AUD. I've also brought a few add-ons for other games, so DON'T ACCUSE ME FOR NOT BEING ABLE TO BUY NOTHING...
     
  23. Peter Hayes

    Peter Hayes Well-Known Member

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    CityRail
    It's very easy to apply for an ABN in OZ - 15 minutes or less. https://abnregistration.com.au/?gcl...CnAZszx_XqfVhYoQgcmlrDYck1xBxYC6EaAlZYEALw_wc

    If your annual turnover is below the $75,000 threshold, then you are not required to register for GST. You are not required to charge GST on the goods or services sold. However, you can still choose to register for GST if you wish. There are some exceptions to this rule.
     
  24. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I did not accuse you of not being able to buy a route or anything else - I'm not even sure where you read that - it is not in my post?

    I was pointing out the problem why trains routes are not released unless there is a License in place.
    For years nobody outside the USA, not even in Canada could people purchase Union Pacific DLC as they would not grant DTG a License to sell products with their logos for outside of the USofA.
     
  25. I was referring to this: Most companies have no problem with 3d artist using their logos on things - providing it is free.
    That is why you see a lot of liveries for locos and trains that you cannot buy.
     
  26. I decided not to proceed with it because MSTS Australia was dying, it would had been pointless to even start!
     
  27. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    The point I was making is you can get free reskins for trains that you cannot buy in the livery you want.
     
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  28. Big misunderstanding on my part
     
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