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Line Speed For Freight

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by puternut, Apr 22, 2021.

  1. puternut

    puternut New Member

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    It would seem that the freight market must now go at passenger line speeds on some - if not all - lines.

    Just seen the update and they have added a few freight services to the SouthEast High Speed line. I got into a class 66 hauling trucks from Strood to Faversham via a Hoo Junction runaround. Timetable 6G09.

    As soon as you pull out of Strood there is a 45 over 70 sign so I need to max out at 45. The HUD jumps to 70. I'm not sure if you lose points for going too slow but for the sake of reality the speed limits must be set right.

    If they are unable to change line speed then refer back to an earlier version (TS2020 I think) where an experimental freight loco pulling a passenger train was reduced to the freight speed just to go over a 20 yard bridge somewhere near Great Yarmouth.

    A similar state is on Arosalinie where in a scenario you are taking timber from Chur up the hill, Despite differing speeds for freight and passengers applying in a few places the HUD always shows the higher one.
     
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  2. involvedmass

    involvedmass Member

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    I get where you are coming from, but the HUD displays the line speed. And the line speed will be the highest allowed, regardless of the type of train you are driving.
    You can still stick to the speed you're supposed to, i.e cruise at 45 when the HUD displays 70. You won't be going to slow since that's the speed you are supposed to be doing, and the schedule should reflect that.
     
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  3. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    At present, the game engine doesn't support multiple speed limits, so necessarily it only uses the highest that any train might use. Ergo, one can be trundling along SKA in a BR 143 freight run with a nominal 250 km/h limit........

    If you want to be realistic, for your own immersion, pay attention both to split line speeds, as on GWE and SPG, and also to the regulated VMax for the train you are driving (for example, many UK freight wagons are limited to 60 no matter what. The Class 66 is limited to 75.)
     
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  4. Hiro Protagonist

    Hiro Protagonist Member

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    Unless something has changed very recently (ie the last week or so), I've definitely noticed SPG handles speed limits differently if you're light-loco compared to hauling freight...
     
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  5. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    That's interesting
     
  6. Hiro Protagonist

    Hiro Protagonist Member

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    Did some experimenting, and it seems it isn't as simple as I thought.

    Did a Timetable scenario on SPG w/ a freight consist and the speed limit in the HUD was based on the passenger limit. On the other hand, a freight consist Journey scenario used the correct freight limit. HOWEVER, the Journey scenario stayed at the freight limit even with I disconnected the wagons and ran light-loco. Conversely, the Journey scenarios that have you running light-loco (returning the bankers back to Cumberland) run at line speed. So it seems that it is a scenario-specific limit rather than an actual variable parameter based on the current makeup of the consist.
     
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  7. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    AI trains often don’t even stick to the speed that the train is capable of. This can be seen at one point in NTP when a Class 08 (max speed 15 mph) hurtles between two yards at the line speed. I was messing about on foot running alongside this particular loco as it was doing some shunting and after it had finished it shot off into the distance and I couldn’t keep up (max running speed of the character is also 15 mph) I watched it on the map as it broke the sound barrier on its way to a different yard.

    I know on peninsula corridor that some freight trains use the freight limit and others use the passenger limit but can’t remember the specifics of which ones do and don’t. It may well be only scenarios that use the correct ones. I’ve definitely seen the AI freight going at passenger speed in timetable mode.

    There doesn’t seem to be a consistent approach to it between routes, from what I’ve noticed. I always try to keep to the correct speed limits, so it would be helpful if the HUD always had the correct limit for the train in use, although I don’t know how easy that would be to implement and have AI trains follow the rules too.
     
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  8. cwf.green

    cwf.green Well-Known Member

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    TS2021 has the capability of demanding two different speed limits, one for freight and one for passenger, it also has the capability order speeds that are given by signals (although this is more buggy), so I don't think there is any reason why this couldn't be implemented in TSW2.
     
  9. OsamaBinLiftin

    OsamaBinLiftin Member

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    Yes, throw an AI class 483 from IoW onto LGV Marseille-Avignon and it'll go mentally fast; if you can set up the scenario such that you can ride in it as a passenger, it's even more hilarious.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2021
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  10. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Some older UK freight vehicles are still restricted to 45MPH, i.e. Class 7. It should not be beyond the capability of the game to recognise rolling stock speed limits in addition to line speed and display the lower of the two.
     
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  11. RestrictedProceed

    RestrictedProceed New Member

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    Thanks for actually testing it, I've never noticed that, as I mostly run w/o HUD.
    My question for everyone is, which behavior is correct? Obviously, freight trains must observe freight limits, but what is the limit for light engines on SPG? I've spent some time looking for an answer, but I've only found out for BNSF, NS and UP... It was different in each case, so I suppose CSX has it's own rule as well. It's quite possible that even DTG does not know the answer, that could be the reason for having it differently for each scenario/service.
     
  12. J.T.

    J.T. Active Member

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    I can confirm that on the Sand Patch Grade route, most freight trains have correct freight speeds (the lower ones) in the HUD. However, some freight trains have speeds for passenger trains (the higher ones) displayed in the HUD for unclear reasons.

    So it doesn't seem that the TSW2 does not support multiple speeds limits.

    I guess TSW2 just can't always tell if a train is a freight or passenger train. Although there is an appropriate checkbox in the scenario editor, despite the clear indication that this train is a freight train, it can still be seen by TSW2 as a passenger train.

    So I would classify it as a bug.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2021
  13. OsamaBinLiftin

    OsamaBinLiftin Member

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    Not necessarily true, Peninsula Corridor freight trains (at least the GP38-2 in timetable mode) show the correct freight speed limit, being 50mph in most of the route as opposed to 79mph for passenger services.
     
  14. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    On CSX tracks, light locos and all-loco consists use the passenger limits (subject to engine vmax, usually 70).
     
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  15. SonicScott91

    SonicScott91 Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't East Coastway support multiple speed limits? Pretty sure I get limited to freight speeds when doing the Class 66 timetable services. It's been a while since I've touched ECW so I could be wrong.
     
  16. RestrictedProceed

    RestrictedProceed New Member

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    Thanks. Just out of curiosity, this is what I found for the three forementioned railroads.
    Union Pacific:
    • 8 locos or less = passenger speeds, up to 70 mph
    • more than 8 units or insufficient dynamic braking = up to 45 mph
    BNSF:
    • freight speeds, up to 70 mph (even passenger locomotives capable of more)
    Norfolk Southern:
    • two or more units = up to 50 mph, (P/F not found, but such low limit would probably indicate freight)
    • single light engine = up to 30 mph, must be protected by an absolute block, must ensure automatic RR crossing warning devices are functioning properly, otherwise flag them - there seems to be concern that single engine will not trigger track circuits
    By the way, the same 30 mph speed restriction applies to single light locomotive on CSX as well: Link
     
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  17. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Interesting!
     
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