London Commuter Feedback Thread

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by Ant Craft, Sep 19, 2021.

  1. Ant Craft

    Ant Craft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2017
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    298
    Now that we've started seeing the first Brighton Mainline (or London Commuter, whatever name you prefer) screenshots coming out, I thought I'd make a thread where we can note any issues down in one place for the benefit of DTG, even if some of the issues noted are pretty obvious. Once the preview streams start and subsequent articles are released, we can than expand on that list here. The aim isn't to nit pick or anything, just raise awareness of these issues in the hope that they could be fixed pre- or post-release. Doesn't mean all the feedback has to be negative though, especially if we find stuff that's been done well. I'll start off with some of the biggest things people have been commenting on:

    - Reigate station looks incredibly bad with the assets being thrown together to make it. From what we've seen and how it wasn't originally announced, but the Reigate branch was definitely an after thought, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't represented any differently from the rest of the route
    - Southern branded objects is being used at Clapham Junction, when in reality, this station is owned and operated by Network Rail.
    - The southern logo in use on the class 377s are the old southern logo from ECW, instead of the new logo.
    - The cranes at Battersea Power Station are clearly reused normal cranes angled upwards which makes them very weird to look at, especially once you know they are there.
    - The destination screen on the 387 is a copy of the 377 which isn't the shape as the ones on the destination screens of the 387.
    - General disappointment at the lack of new lighting from Riesa - Dresden come to the Brighton Mainline
     
    • Like Like x 17
  2. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    The screenshots they are showing at moment are work in progress it should be noted, and there already a thread about them.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. smugstarlord#4202

    smugstarlord#4202 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2021
    Messages:
    155
    Likes Received:
    204
    They're the first screen shots for god sake. Not a released DLC
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,013
    Likes Received:
    2,970
    Tell me one occasion, other than SEHS, where we saw a meaningful difference between the screenshots and the final product.
     
    • Like Like x 25
  5. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2018
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    179
    Agree with all the point collated by Ant. Im not so fussed about small details on locos or cranes but I am in regards to totally inaccurate stations.

    For those that say its its only work in progress screenshots, I say unfortunately previous experiences of things shown off in screens and preview streams usually end up being reality

    unfortunately until we get an official response about the ?Reigate station inaccuracies, I dont see anything changing.
     
    • Like Like x 8
  6. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    Given you can see Battersea Power Station from land (rather than from the river), this route is backdated somewhat, therefore the old logo may be appropriate
     
    • Like Like x 4
  7. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    7,321
    It would be nice if DTG could acknowledge whether Reigate is going to look like this in the final release.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  8. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,013
    Likes Received:
    2,970
    The fact they haven't probabily tells the whole story.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. James Sideras

    James Sideras New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2018
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    17
    Just wait for the roadmap stream tomorrow where the most appropriate place to talk about it is and you’ll get the answers your looking for
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    Or that it's been the weekend and nobody from DTG has responded to anything...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2019
    Messages:
    2,013
    Likes Received:
    2,970
    Yep that is probabily true... but I always think that it's better to not expect anything better than the screenshots, more often than not it's just more disappointment.

    EDIT [17:25 UTC]: What I meant with my first post is that if it was something they were already planning to change they would have probabily said it themselves, I'm not saying that because they didn't say anything, it's guaranteed it won't change.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 3
  12. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    Absolutely.
    Deal with what's in front of you even if it's not what you want.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2018
    Messages:
    584
    Likes Received:
    1,724
    To me it says a lot that they think it's more important to add a branch line to a German route that is already out than make sure a model of a station on a UK route that is yet to be released is accurate. Shows where their priorities lie I think.

    It's not a secret that the Executive Producer of TSW is obsessed with German trains above everything else.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 7
  14. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    I would imagine they're different dev teams
     
    • Like Like x 3
  15. Trainiac

    Trainiac Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2019
    Messages:
    189
    Likes Received:
    343
    If Reigate is gonna look like that by release they probably say something like ‘we didn't have enough time get to finished it by release so this is the best we could do’
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2019
    Messages:
    1,683
    Likes Received:
    2,470
    Or maybe they haven't bothered dignifying it with an answer because it's obviously a block of flats placeholder instead of an actual station building asset. They probably put these things in on purpose just to get a reaction!
     
    • Like Like x 5
  17. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2020
    Messages:
    833
    Likes Received:
    829
    I'm no expert on the BML but like others have said the state of Reigate and the cranes do stick out. Hopefully they are just placeholders and the cranes can be touched up. I think it was more disappointing that the lighting from the Dresden route was not going to be used.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  18. trainsimgaming1001

    trainsimgaming1001 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2021
    Messages:
    319
    Likes Received:
    341
    • Like Like x 2
  19. James Sideras

    James Sideras New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2018
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    17

    In theory for that conclusion they could just say we’ll get it done in a patch that’s not light years waiting for it same with the Meissen Branch that’s coming when BML comes out that’s the least they could do but tbh I doubt they’ll leave it like that the uproar here and discord about it csnt have gone unnoticed & they’ll surely address it in tomorrows roadmap, probably one of the first things they’ll talk about same as the fences on SEHS when that happened so I wouldn’t worry just wait till 8pm tomorrow!
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. mldaureol2

    mldaureol2 Active Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2019
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    122
    Just announced that Thursdays stream will NOT be London Cummuter.
    Mike.
     
    • Helpful Helpful x 5
    • Like Like x 1
  21. James Sideras

    James Sideras New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2018
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    17
    Yeh big shame looking much more likely 7th October release could still be 14th as well but 7th I reckon will be the one
     
    • Like Like x 1
  22. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    5,201
    Likes Received:
    7,427
    Clinchfield. SD40. Wrong railing. Was fixed between preview screenshots and release.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  23. Ant Craft

    Ant Craft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2017
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    298
    Ah interesting, didn't realise that the SD40 railing was wrong on there originally. But that's exactly what this thread is meant to do. Provide a centralised place where we can put all the issues from all the news articles and previews when they come so DTG can see it, and hopefully fix it, either before or after release. If we bring said issues to DTG's attention, there's a higher chance DTG will see it and fix it.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  24. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2018
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    179
    FYI for those that might not still be following the article thread. Here's a reply from JD about some of the current points raised.

     
    • Like Like x 6
  25. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2019
    Messages:
    1,468
    Likes Received:
    1,787
    I knew it. Im thinking ECML or WCML through services will layer in here, BML is the start of a bigger uk network now
     
    • Like Like x 2
  26. cloudyskies21

    cloudyskies21 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2021
    Messages:
    281
    Likes Received:
    657
    Yeah definitely, if the Thameslink Class 700 ever got released, would be a great stepping stone. First add in the South London Line (not forgetting a possible 455 DLC) with London Bridge and maybe the Thameslink core, then have the ECML route (also featuring Great Northern 387s) between Kings Cross and either Stevenage or Peterborough at a later date. All this would certainly make the Thameslink services originating from BML feel extensive to drive.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  27. Ant Craft

    Ant Craft Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2017
    Messages:
    125
    Likes Received:
    298
    That's brilliant news. There's still some other issues ofc, but they are definitely the biggest issues identified, especially Reigate, so glad they are taking a look at that. And I'm glad the 387 pantograph is fully simulated, although I personally didn't have any doubts about that being the case.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  28. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2021
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    347
    It sounds to me like they’ve simply responded to the points raised by people on these forums because they’ve had to.

    The problem with Reigate isn’t just that station building itself…the whole ensemble looks nothing like Reigate. It’s one thing putting a placeholder asset in whilst awaiting an accurate 3D model to be completed, but why would you build the whole station incorrectly to then have to do it again?

    History has taught us that if that shot of Reigate hadn’t been a pre-release screen and pounced on by the ‘community’, that is what would have been released. Same for the cranes. They’re cranes, so why make them so wrong the first time that you need to go back for a second pass and create more work for yourself? If you’re waiting for an asset to be created, why put incorrect ones in at all? It takes time to put them in and time to take them back out again.

    In almost every release for TSW, WIP means release candidate. On 1 or 2 occasions the outcries of horror at screenshots have led to changes (albeit botch jobs just so there is something in place) but more often than not WIP does not mean WIP.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2021
    • Like Like x 7
  29. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    So work in progress pictures are exactly that, work in progress pictures who would have thunk it. :cool:
     
    • Like Like x 4
  30. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2021
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    347
    Do you honestly think someone mistakenly shot that picture of Reigate and released it by accident?

    Just because it says WIP doesn’t necessarily mean that it is, but it sure is a handy get out clause for DTG. At this stage in the route’s development do we really think that they’re still at the point of having to effectively rebuild stations from the ground up to make them accurate?
     
    • Like Like x 7
  31. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    Well I do believe that some people are human and do occasionally make mistakes, but what would I know I'm just a human who occasionally makes mistakes, cant all be perfect.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  32. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2021
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    347
    I completely, 100% agree. However, people should strive to learn from their mistakes. Even better, learn from someone else’s. It looked that maybe DTG finally had done, as they have released some really good content recently. Seeing these disheartening screenshots makes me think now that is not actually the case.

    “Those that fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.” - Winston Churchill
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2021
    • Like Like x 2
  33. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    Indeed!
     
    • Like Like x 4
  34. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2019
    Messages:
    1,683
    Likes Received:
    2,470
    Could easily be that the whole station area is being modelled separately with the underpass and whatnot, so they've just cloned in a few buildings of around the right size quickly while people are testing other elements of the route.

    This isn't just one guy building the whole route in isolation, and the people who were squeezing in the task of taking some screen grabs may have been focused on the trains and not been part of the team still finishing the station buildings. Work in Progress means just that; wait till it's released, then get cross about the details!

    Likewise the cranes. As I said in the other thread, they're all sitting at the same wrong angle so it's probably just a relationship value is out by 45°. What we should take from it is that they're separate parts which can move independently – that's a good thing. Moving cranes will add more life than a static model.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  35. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2021
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    347
    If people had done that with SEHS there would be no walls/fences to this day…

    I’m afraid we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  36. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2018
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    179
    Even then the HS1 section is missing a large amount of scenery beeing missing, ehich has led to some people calling it one of the worst UK routes to-date. following that people are worried about quality.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  37. caspargray

    caspargray Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2020
    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    129
    Why is Reigate such a big deal? It looks slightly off to real life, yes. It still looks like a perfectly good station for TSW. If you are local to the area, you have a right to be angry. Everyone else claiming the end of the world is among us because one station looks slightly off one irl photo that the majority of people have no idea when it was taken I think is a bit much….
     
  38. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2018
    Messages:
    584
    Likes Received:
    1,724
    Slightly off? There are whole assets missing, the platforms are the wrong depth and the station as a whole looks absolutely nothing like the real thing. The station building is a block of flats with a canopy attached. It is shockingly poor. I was at Reigate last year and didn't even realise that screenshot was of the same station until I saw the PIS.
     
    • Like Like x 8
  39. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    7,321
    I think you have misread the situation entirely. Reigate station was not slightly off, it was completely different in every way possible.
     
    • Like Like x 5
  40. JetWash

    JetWash Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2021
    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    347
    Agreed!

    The only thing that that model has in common with Reigate are the two lines running through it.

    The reason it’s a big deal is because many of us have ridden this particular Merry-Go-Round many many times before. At this stage, a station being of that standard does not bode well for the rest of the route.

    It’s as simple as that.
     
    • Like Like x 6
  41. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2019
    Messages:
    1,468
    Likes Received:
    1,787
    I can’t help wondering what we’re feeding back on at the moment. 5 pictures?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  42. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    Well they have said they are looking at the issues raised so lets see when the route is released.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  43. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2019
    Messages:
    1,683
    Likes Received:
    2,470
    "They're saying something about the pantograph not being on the train."
    "Yeah, it is. It's not raised though - there are no wires."
    "Then they said something about one of the stations being a block of flats."
    "Yeah, we're still working on that; it's a placeholder."
    "And something about a wonky crane..."
    "Yeah, we haven't finished that bit yet. Did the web team forget to put Work in Progress on the pics?"
    "No, it's definitely there..."
     
    • Like Like x 2
  44. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    The point is that it DOESN'T look like a good station for TSW
    If I look at Gravesend station in game, I can tell it's Gravesend
    If I look at Lewes station, I can tell it's Lewes
    If I look at Reigate... Erm
     
    • Like Like x 6
  45. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    But who is to say these are all issues that wouldn't have been put right anyway before the route is actually released, maybe they just shouldn't bother releasing screenshots until they have actually finished the routes it would certainly have saved them a lot of grief. :D
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    6,566
    Likes Received:
    6,003
    Or, if they hadn't have released a dodgy screenshot the forums would have been a lot quieter this weekend...
    Works both ways. Nothing like a controversy to make sure the punters keep coming back to the socials...
     
    • Like Like x 5
  47. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    Of course who's to say they didn't plan to release dodgy screenshots just so they could have a laugh at the forum going into hissy fit mode. :D
     
    • Like Like x 4
  48. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    7,321
    DTG says it wants our feedback. From the pictures released, feedback was given. DTG has acknowledged this and said it’ll be addressed. Win win. DTG produces a better route. Players get a better route.
     
    • Like Like x 7
  49. Mat_Jam_Ca

    Mat_Jam_Ca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    3,756
    Likes Received:
    7,321
    Ha ha. I can now imagine TrainSim-Matt sat at the head of a desk with his little finger up to his mouth and laughing (Dr Evil style) as he authorises the release of said screenshots.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  50. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2017
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    387
    Maybe it was done as a lets see who is paying attention exercise.
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page