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Long Island Railroad Network

Discussion in 'Route Suggestions & Proposals' started by rare_common_sense, Feb 1, 2018.

?
  1. All of them

    49 vote(s)
    68.1%
  2. Babylon/Montauk branch

    11 vote(s)
    15.3%
  3. Ronkonkoma

    4 vote(s)
    5.6%
  4. Port Jefferson

    6 vote(s)
    8.3%
  5. Oyster Bay

    1 vote(s)
    1.4%
  6. Port Washington

    1 vote(s)
    1.4%
  1. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    EDE8FFB6-C99E-4E96-B7A8-319DCE3AE1B9.gif Over the course of the last decade, we’ve been offered four routes (NEC: NY-Philly, NEC: New York - New Haven, North Jersey coastline, along with its extension of the Morristown) that consisted of New York’s Penn station, which is one of the, if not the busiest stations in the Northeast region of U.S. that supports three rail operations, Amtrak, NJ transit, and the Long Island Railroad, the latter which has yet to see the light of day in Train simulator.

    The reason I feel the LIRR should be done for TS (as well as TSW @ some point) is because we have yet to been offered a U.S. route with 3rd rail as the primary traction. Sure there’s a small portion of it in the New York to New Haven route. But a 3rd rail route, which I tend to favor more, personally, because overhead wires tend to obscure the scenery a bit for my own liking.

    Now, I’m quoting an article on Wikipedia that says..

    “There are 124 stations and more than 700 miles (1,100 km) of track[4] on its two lines to the two forks of the island and eight major branches, with the passenger railroad system totaling 319 miles (513 km) of route.”

    Now, while that is quite an undertaking, I believe it is doable. As of the last couple of years. DTG has gotten into the strategy of extending routes that are offered, but as separate dlc. But previously there’s been a route that’s been on offer for several years now called Portsmouth direct. Which in a sense has a Network that is unfinished. Which is unfortunate, because it would have given the route a lot of variety as far as scenarios go.

    I think, in an effort to get something like the Long Island Railroad Network into TS, would be to recreate the entire, if not most of the relevant track, implement the most popular of branches, maybe a good two or three of the eight with scenery, and release the route. Over time, the scenery along with new scenarios can be added via updates, or more realistically, paid DLC, along with the possibility of New loco offerings. Something that was done with the London To Faversham line with the Sheerness Branch.

    The city zone I feel should certainly be covered to offer variety of scenarios right out of the gate. Then place scenery along the main popular branches. Other scenery can be added later down the line to the remaining branches in phases, so that it shouldn’t affect the scenarios for the initial release of the network, providing that there are no track changes or alterations.. or whatever may have adverse effects to the network.

    Or.. of course, if that doesn’t actually work. It could be done as it has been done with the recent offerings, though I’m against the idea of having a multitude of routes with the same content. Which is why I think theoretically my proposal could or should possibly work. And eliminate the need to purchase the same but longer/bigger route.

    As far as the loco dlc is concerned. In an effort to save time, identifying and explaining them all, I again will quote the article from Wikipedia:

    “Pictured below.. The LIRR's electric fleet consists of 836 M7 and 170 M3 (2nd from the left) electric multiple unit 2A550DBE-9D26-49A2-9E10-6D478B648310.jpeg cars in married pairs, meaning each car needs the other one to operate, with each car containing its own engineer's cab. The trainsets typically range up to 12 cars long. In September 2013, MTA announced that the LIRR would procure new M9 railcars from Kawasaki starting in 2016.[49] They will replace the M3s, and expand the railroad's electric fleet.

    The LIRR also uses 134 C3 Bilevel coaches (pictured below) A2F1F0B2-B647-47CB-AF50-27905566BE3F.jpeg powered by 23 DE30AC diesel-electric locomotives and 21 DM30AC dual-mode locomotives (pictured below).
    993A3C32-3FDA-473D-A923-87778F0012DC.jpeg
    They are used mostly on non-electrified territories, including the Port Jefferson, Oyster Bay, Montauk, and Greenport Branches.[50]

    So, as stated there are a healthy amount of equipment that can be utilized for the network and released along with paid updates to the network.

    If there is anything I want to add, I’ll be sure to do so in the comment thread or edit it in the OP.

    Hope this will happen soon!

    Should anyone need the source of article..
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Island_Rail_Road
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
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  2. NEC_Male_TC

    NEC_Male_TC Active Member

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    I believe Dovetail Games should make Long Island Railroad content for either of their train simulation games. Although I must say, for Train Simulator 2018, I believe it would be better if Dovetail Games made a Long Island Railroad route as an extension for the existing New York to New Haven route since Long Island is geographically parallel to Connecticut. So maybe the Port Jefferson Line would be good for Train Simulator 2018 since that's parallel to the New York to New Haven Northeast Corridor and ends west of New Haven, but in my heart of hearts, for a Long Island Railroad route [for Train Sim World], I'd like to see the Montauk Line since that's the longest and spans the whole length of Long Island.

    Also, regardless of how it's made for either game, the West Side Yard in Manhattan will have to be included since the Long Island Railroad doesn't use Sunnyside Yard in Queens.
     
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  3. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Whichever branch they make, as long as Jamaica Station makes its way in there, and as a bonus. Atlantic Terminal should definitely be included. That branch should be much easier since most of it is underground. I would be interesting to see how they would do the East New York Station.
     
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  4. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    I can’t stress on how important the LIRR is and how it would make TSW or TS such a game changer. We’ve been so neglected when it comes to these routes and one of these days it will hopefully be done. I would really like to see the Montauk Branch when the LIRR comes out. It uses the both diesel and electric trains and the scenery is breathtaking. It also uses LIRR’s main line which would also be great for the M7s that don’t get grade crossings on the Babylon Branch. On the image I’ve circled what should be released with the Montauk Branch,
    Blue: only electric trains
    Red: electric and diesel trains
    Black: only diesel trains
    I know it maybe sloppy or confusing but I tried to give you an idea of what this incredible DLC would look like. Also I’d prefer if this would be stand alone DLC rather than combined with NYNH route because the NYNH is older now and we need better detail with any existing LIRR tracks and stations (including Penn!!). Again we really need to see the LIRR in the near future and it’s important that we keep the request alive! A27C9D5D-C4E4-4186-AE40-C29287AE74FA.jpeg
     
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  5. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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  6. CJM21292

    CJM21292 New Member

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    Im all for it but they should also make the M1 and M3 railcars
     
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  7. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Definitely include the M3’s but the M1s are not needed because of how similar they were to the M3’s. The M1s are also retired so it wouldn’t make sense to market two trains that are pretty much the same.
     
  8. CJM21292

    CJM21292 New Member

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    oh yea I forgot about that and the soon to be delivered M9
     
  9. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    They should not release the M9s when they first come out because they would be too new. I think DTG should wait a little to release them.
     
  10. NEC_Male_TC

    NEC_Male_TC Active Member

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    New York to New Haven has held up very well and hasn't aged much at all from the looks of it and on a personal note is still my favorite Train Simulator 2018 route to date. But if Dovetail Games did make a Long Island Railroad route as an extension to New York to New Haven, I'm sure they would enhance the quality of the existing route and the new territory, even though there's not too much to do to bring it up to the current Train Simulator 2018 standards.
     
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  11. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Well also the NYNH route doesn’t have AI trains as well as detail that should be updated. I’ve said in the past that I would rather the LIRR for TSW because of the immense detail that would be present, but I’ll take any LIRR I can get!
     
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  12. Mattg17

    Mattg17 Member

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    Considering I live along the Montauk Branch, i'd be interested if Dovetail were to give it a go. I will say that the network might be better off for TSW rather than TS2018, but as long as I get some form of DM30AC to run #2740 from Penn Station to Speonk i'll be fine.
     
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  13. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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  14. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    For TSW, not at this point in the game. The routes they make and the limited amount of assets they have, it will a long time off, before they could pull off something of that magnitude. For TS, which is far more established, and despite the claim that it can't be done, is very capable if done right. I have a route network called "Northern Europe" which is far larger than the LIRR network, as it covers nearly the entire country of Denmark, and Long Island Is much, much smaller than Denmark.
     
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  15. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Just updated this article to look a little better. I love how we have the option to of editing just about everything. This forum is going to prove to be quite successful.
     
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  16. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes I’ve totally ditched the Steam forums at this point.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
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  17. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. Mostly full of people repeating the same things over and over. DLC pricing, multiplayer, trying to have discussion amongst people who actually have spent enough time to have valid criticisms, and some trolling here and there.

    Not really missing it too much at all.
     
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  18. Randallator

    Randallator New Member

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    NYNH does have AI
     
  19. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    What has you against this idea? If you care to share your feelings about it.
     
  20. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    I’d take out the Port Washington branch from the poll and add Long Beach or Far Rockaway. The PW Branch is the most hated out of all the other branches because it only goes to Penn so that means no Jamaica or Atlantic Terminal and there is only one grade crossing and a recent law has been made that it qualifies for a quiet zone crossing so no horn. Also LB and Far Rock branches use the Atlantic branch which is only used by them and it is the small trackage from Locust Manor to Valley Stream.
     
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  21. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Well. Not many have voted anyway. I don’t know about PW being the most hated because it’s the only line that doesn’t go to Jamaica. But it could be included with any branch of the network/route altogether just for the sake of having the option to go to another point other than through Jamaica.

    Whichever line they do, as long as it includes Penn and Atlantic. And go from there. It’s just so much options with LIRR it would be one of the best Networks created in TS because there are so many branches. The scenario possibilities would be endless.
     
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  22. NEC_Male_TC

    NEC_Male_TC Active Member

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    That's not fair to remove the [assumed] least popular route from the poll. Keep it in there and see where it goes is what I say.
     
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  23. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, as I had already mentioned in my previous comment. It would be nice to just have that included with any other mainline branch they do for the sake of variety.
     
  24. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    I guess that’s fair to not remove it but the PW branch provides the least amount of LIRR experience you’ll get on the Babylon/Montauk or Port Jefferson branches. I just want all of it!!
     
  25. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    That is indeed true. Which is why it should be included as default with either choice they go with. I would hope they do it all.

    And the way I would hope they would tackle it, is by doing all of the track. Lay scenery on the portion they plan to release. Of course with the scenarios as they usually do.

    This, they can do in phases.

    When they get around to finishing more of the scenery, they can release that as dlc along with more scenarios as well as any other possible locos that they don’t release from jump.

    I would be fine with scenery extensions and more scenarios, and they can charge about around 10-15USD, whatever amount that translates to in other foreign currency.

    Seeing as DTG have gotten into the habit of doing extensions with routes. They should definitely do so with this route. But at least with them laying the track it helps give people more of an idea as to what to expect in the future as opposed to have people asking about extension or being surprised with the announcement of one and then worrying having more than one route with the same assets, like they’ve been doing with all other route extensions.
     
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  26. Mattg17

    Mattg17 Member

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    My argument about the Babylon/Montauk Branch would all come down to this: The Central Branch connecting the Mainline to Babylon that the peak trains (including #2740 IIRC) use. To me if they were to just to the Babylon/Montauk, it would make sense to at least the Mainline from Jamaica to BETH Interlocking and down the Central Branch to Babylon to allow for the alternate route from Jamaica. Regardless, I rather have the entire network though.
     
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  27. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Well getting the Central Branch is an absolute MUST. Many Montauk Branch trains run down the Main line and Central Branch and it will enable drivers to run down the Main line to Hicksville (which is a terminal on some peak hours) or Bethpage. Also when they make it it will open up some new possibilities for the Port Jefferson Branch or Ronkonkoma Branch since they solely use the Main line and it will be done already.
     
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  28. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this. If they don’t wanna do the whole network, at least make the route to where we would have alternative routes to get to one particular destination such as the sections you both spoke of. I’m with it. For it. Just hope they bring it.
     
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  29. Mattg17

    Mattg17 Member

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    Another thing I might add that has me wondering, will Dovetail actually make a correct layout of Penn Station with West Sode Yard and the Empire connection? Considering that the other routes with Penn don’t have those.....
     
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  30. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    We definitely need a rework of Penn and GCT. I hope they will!!
     
  31. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    It would make sense of they were doing the LIRR at some point. But they don't even have LIRR content in the game. If they were to include it for some reason, it would probably give some sort of indication that they may do it sometime in the future.
     
  32. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Of course, the only reason they included Long Island City, and Woodside, is for scenery purposes mainly. Something they do with quite a number of routes when there are stations in close proximity.
     
  33. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    I’ve always wanted the LIRR preferably for TSW, but seeing how they did with the NEC on initial announcement and soon to come release, it doesn’t have that much to it. That’s why I’m probably reconsidering just wanting the LIRR to come to TS, although I’m just worried that they won’t do the audio correct and there will be issues with scenery. Maybe when 3rd parties can make routes we’ll see a difference in route releasing in TSW. I just hope someone will pay attention to the LIRR at some point whether it’s for TSW or TS because of how it’s on such high demand. We shall see and hope it comes ASAP!
     
  34. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    I’ll take it in either. Of course for which ever comes first. Which would more than likely for TS for void filling purposes.
     
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  35. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    I hope so. It always seems to me that DTG doesn’t even know the LIRR exists and it’s pretty annoying. We haven’t seen much happening with TS lately so I’m starting to think if DTG just wants to solely focus on TSW.
    This could be some good strategies for selling the LIRR:
    Babylon/Montauk Branch: $40, M7 and DE30AC Free, $20 for M3’s and Atlantic Terminal and soon to come M9s.
    DLC for Montauk Branch: Port Jefferson Branch: Owner discount for limited time, $40 without discount.
    Oyster Bay Branch, or the Long Beach branch: Owner discount, $30 without discount.
    Of course I know that not all of this stuff won’t all be released but that’s what I think it would look like on the store. Maybe they won’t sell ATB with the M3’s and just leave it standard with the route but again it’s just another strategy for DTG to earn as much profit as possible. I think they’ll make such great business off of the LIRR regardless on what they choose!
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018
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  36. USRailFan007

    USRailFan007 Well-Known Member

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    This man really wants his LIRR! haha. Got the marketing strategy down and figures, figured out xD. What a guy. Let's hope they follow through and make it happen.
     
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  37. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    What can I say, I really do want it and I’ve done a lot of thinking over the years that DTG made all of the other NY routes that go in through Penn but the LIRR. Hope DTG will benefit from that post and let’s hope for a great near future, hopefully.
     
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  38. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    However they do it. As long as they bring it, they have a customer.

    Just imagining how Jamaica station would look. And Jay Interlocking. That would be the stuff dreams. And it’s needs to include the Atlantic Ave Branch as well.
     
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  39. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely! I can’t wait to see Jamaica and when I come from Penn I pull up next to the train from ATB and we have the passenger transfer, I’ve always loved the Jamaica transfer system. Also when the NJT routes were requested like the LIRR, DTG did it, that’s why I don’t understand why the Long Island Railroad hasn’t been done yet. I wonder if it’s a license issue, although I hope not. I hope like the NJT we get at least two route like the NJCL and Morristown, we’ll get Montauk and Port Jeff. or something like that!
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2018
  40. LimitedEdiition

    LimitedEdiition Active Member

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    I don't think they should do LIRR because it's about to look drastically different in the next few years with 3rd mainline track and reshuffling of stations and surrounding area. Definitely something to look into the future considering they can just add onto the upcoming New York area route, but they should hold off until 3rd mainline track project is done, and instead look northward for the Hudson Line or something that's more concrete until then.
     
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  41. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    That doesn't mean they shouldn't do it now. Not like we'd be really missing out anything by them doing it now. Any changes that are made can be done in the workshop if that's the case.
     
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  42. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    That’s not a reason to back out of doing the LIRR. These projects are projected to finish in many years and they keep getting pushed off so if they do the Montauk Branch or Port Jeff. Branch on the main line it’s not a big deal. I get not doing Ronkonkoma though, because the double track is supposed to be finished towards the end of this year.
     
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  43. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    The only real major thing they're doing now really is that ESA, which they could put bits and pieces of. Doesn't even need to be finished.. Just evident that something is going on there if they want to base it on the current state the route. Something like what they've done with the GCT, how there are tracks going to the Lower Level (I really wish they could have somehow work that in there, though there is a lot of track with the upper level already), but nothing else further. But if they decide to omit it, that's fine too. Just as Long as they give us something LIRR, and with as much variety as possible. This project is too awesome to not have been already made or at least heavily considered. This would, hands down be the best network to have ever been made, There's not a huge variety in DLC, as the equipment(s) currently in operation are the M3/7's and the DE/DM30AC locomotives. Even the just branches themselves released either in phases (paid DLC/updates) would be popular amongst those who are familiar and/or just fans of American Commuter operations, especially surrounding the NY tri-state area.

    There's no good reason why they shouldn't be, and as I said before, shouldn't have been made, save for licensing agreements if they have the ability to get it done.

    I really hope that they just somehow get a base office here in the states and pull together some really talented individuals who can produce this content, instead of having to juggle projects under one roof.
     
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  44. Mattg17

    Mattg17 Member

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    This seems like a good idea, although is it too much to ask for M9's (regardless if they haven't even begun testing on LIRR property)?

    In terms of DLC, with the little equipment that LIRR runs, it would definitely make sense to include all of it with the route. This now brings up an idea about future DLC packs such as the older equipment like the GP38-2's and the P72 coaches, maybe even the C1 railcars and the FL9's they breifly had.
     
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  45. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    I personally wouldn’t mind the M9’s. Bring em’ on!
     
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  46. USRailFan007

    USRailFan007 Well-Known Member

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    Heck ya!
     
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  47. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Just give us the LIRR already!! I’ll literally take anything at this point.
     
  48. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, if Brandon and his crew could make the full NEC for TSW, their is absolutely no question DTG which is a company, can make the LIRR. DTG has all the means to do it and if they realized they’ll get more money then they would with any other route I’m sure they’d do it in a heartbeat, the question is how do we really get the message to them? If the LIRR and Hudson line is not done soon, I’ll be quite disappointed with DTG because I know it can be done and it’s been neglected for too long!
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2018
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  49. USRailFan007

    USRailFan007 Well-Known Member

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    I'm proud of you Lawjester. You happen to insert the Hudson Line in this forum topic of yours and via this very post Q.Q <3, haha. I agree though with what you said. Its shocking that to this day, of all the routes made for the US, neither of these made the cut (any specific LIRR branch as well as the MN Hudson Line), along with the remaining left out portions of the NEC back in TS 20xx. I doubt it has anything to do with licensing issues on behalf of the MTA. Unless they decide to make some sort of road map depicting the direction they plan on taking TSW, for the remainder of the year (if they've even thought ahead that far, which, i'm sure they have), we won't know.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2018
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  50. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    It’s just crazy to me how NJT was requested for years. Yet Metro North was done first. Then a year and a half later, we get NJT. And then another year and change, we got more NJT than MTA stuff.. so far.

    I do believe and hope that at some point in the very near future we get some more MTA stuff. And something tells me by either Jay from DTG or whoever it was that mentioned how “very interested” they were in the Metro North Hudson route via the TSW content proposal section, that we may actually see it soon, but probably in TS 2018 instead. Which is fine by me. Because as I’ve said, TS20xx is a far mor established product and would help to fill in the holes that is still left in it.

    I’m still baffled at the fact that there are no M2’s for NYNH. I just cannot seem to wrap my brain around that. Because with the FL9, there’s not much to give authenticity to scenarios as I believe they were taken out of revenue service and retired before the M8’s came along.

    Those earlier M series to me are iconic to the MNRR and LIRR. And if they do ever get around to doing another MTA route, they will have those ready or in the process of being made.

    Now don’t get me wrong. I’d love to see some M7/A’s for sure, because that’s what’s dominating both rail networks. And it would be something fresh. Because as much as I love the M8’s and the unofficial liveries that have been provided by a couple of folks within the community. I’m getting a little bored of them and want to see some actually variety.

    If the US got as much attention to the content that’s been given to UK. We’d have more MNRR and LIRR to keep us busy by now. And when I tend to play scenarios on the Brighton and Chatham lines. It’s like, this is sort of their version of the LIRR and MNRR.. and it’s filled with variety. And that’s just what we want for this area as well.
     
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