Making The Case To Have More Be Shown On The Map Part 1: The Bakerloo Line

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by WonterRail, Jul 14, 2022.

  1. WonterRail

    WonterRail Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to a new thread mini-series that was actually inspired by my recent exploration of the off limits parts of the Hamilton Complex on Oakville Subdivision. I've explained it more in that thread, but as a quick crash course on what I said there, it was a route hyped up as if the whole of the Hamilton Complex was going to be accessible, but as it turned out, only a small portion of it was actually accessible in the final product, with a huge portion of it, that had tracks fully seen on the map at the time, being blocked off. These tracks were later covered over in a post release update, but I've always thought that too much track age was taken off the map in that update. Like the inaccessible parts of Hamilton Yard I get, but you also have tracks leading off the main route, or track age that goes underneath the route like that section leading away from Birmingham Street Yard that I felt like could have stayed on the map, not because the are accessible tracks, but rather to show that they exist.

    But OSD is not subject of this thread, or this entire series of threads, because after what happened on OSD, there was this period where routes released by DTG that huge chunks of tracks hidden off the map in an attempt to be more honest about what was accessible and what wasn't. But all this did was lead to either not being able to tell were anything was because not enough of what's around it was shown on the map, or a map that just looked incredibly thin, with not much else to look at. This would mainly impact three routes in particular; The Bakerloo Line, LGV Méditerranée and Southeastern High Speed. The later two routes we will cover another time, but it's the very former routes, the Bakerloo Line that will be the subject of today's thread and specifically, that WCML part between and Harrow & Wealdstone that is completely covered over on the map as of right now. But I'm not gonna sit here and tell you that these areas should be shown on the map, I also want to actually show you how much extra trackage there actually is that isn't shown on each of these routes maps, show what many of these areas actually look like right now, and debate whether they should be shown on the map at all. So with all that said, let's get into our first route that I feel should have more trackage shown on the map, the WCML portion of the Bakerloo Line.

    Before going further, I just want to say this, I wasn't originally planning to cover the Bakerloo Line as part of this series, as at the time, there wasn't really any incentive to add any extra trackage to the Bakerloo Line map other than for the sake of just seeing where all the tracks where for it. But just recently, it's been announced that the Bakerloo Line is getting a brand new, much bigger timetable (made by Joe of course) and it's while it's not outright been said, it has been hinted that parts of the WCML portion are going to be used in the new timetable, whether that would be static stock at Willesden Depot or (if I think it's what it is) AI traffic running up and down the main WCML portion, and all I have to say on the matter is this...

    ...if that part of the route is going to start being used by AI traffic, maybe it's time to uncover those areas on the map, just for the sake of seeing where these various static wagons/AI services are at anyone time.

    I'm not saying that every part of the WCML should be uncovered here, but just the areas that are going to be used by AI traffic. But then saying that, deciding which areas to uncover has actually been quite a challenge, as this the kind of route that either has to have all of it's covered over areas be uncovered, or those areas should just be left covered over, as you also have to factor in if some of those areas will be populated by static stock at some point down the road.

    Which is why I decided to have a explore around that portion of the route to see how much extra trackage there actually is round there and then go into Google My Maps to plot out all of those extra tracks. I'll first show a map of all those extra tracks down below, followed by talking about some of more noticeable areas in more depth. Plus, I also have plenty of images from the route to show these areas and what they actually look like. So I guess without further ado, here is all of the extra WCML trackage on the Bakerloo Line.

    Map of the Extra WCML Tracks
    Map of the all the extra WCML tracks.PNG
    To break down what you are seeing here, the thick dark lines are all tracks that should be on the map, either because they are prime target for static stock, or they could be used by AI traffic. The dark orange lines are Overground line that are not shown on the map, but might be used by Overground traffic should we ever receive such an add-on in the future and the thin lines are tracks that do exist, but aren't a priority to be shown on the map as probably won't get used much anyway, or are way out of the line of sight of the route. I also have an image of the what the map currently looks like for comparsion sake.

    Current Map
    [​IMG]

    Now I want you to keep in mind is that this is rough, so this might not be 100% accurate, but it does give you a good idea of how much extra trackage there really is around this section, and there is quite a lot as you can see. I should also say that the Bakerloo Line tracks are not shown on the I made, because you those are the tracks that you can see on the map right now in-game.

    How we are going to tackle this is that we will be following the 4-lane highway that makes up the WCML, which starts at Queen's Park and heads up to Harrow & Wealdstone. I will be making stops at some of more interesting places that have extra tracks along the way to discussion them in more depth and also show off images of what these areas look like in game right now. So with that said, let's start this off by going to Queen's Park.

    Area around and heading east of Queen's Park
    Extra Tracks around Queen's Park.PNG
    Now the first obvious tracks that could be added to the map here is the outer platforms at Queen's Park, that are used by London Overground. These I feel would be quite handy if a London Overground Add-on was ever to come to this route. But even if that didn't happen, having them be shown on the map would still be helpful or identifying that they do exist, and if these platforms were to receive scenario planner support (as in being able to start/end a service/AI train from these platforms in scenario planner).

    Now it helps that those tracks are accessible on foot at least (as they are literally right next to the Bakerloo Platforms), the same story cannot be said of the 4 main line tracks directly next to the station. But I would be handy to have them be shown on the map, as these are tracks that could be used by AI trains in the future. These also tracks would also extend all the way up the WCML to as far as Harrow & Wealdstone, and whether any other additional tracks alongside it get shown aswell would depend on whether they either going to be used by AI trains or whether there the kind of area that could see static stock get placed there.

    Now you are probably wondering how far back the track goes heading east of Queen's Park, and by looking at the thin line on that map I made, it goes to about where South Hampstead Overground station would be, which where the endless AI spawnpoint is. I don't expect the entire AI runoff to be shown here (which is why it's only showing as a thin line), maybe to about where the invisible walls are, which can be located via where the thick lines of the Overground/WCML portions end and the thin line of the AI runoff begins. If you want to see what the area east of Queen's Park looks like in game, I have a few images of that down below.
    [​IMG]
    ...and before anyone asks. No, Kilburn High Road station has not been represented in any way shape or form on this route.
    [​IMG]
    ...but there is this wall that is extending across the tracks just further on.
    [​IMG]
    We've made it to the AI Spawnpoint.
    [​IMG]
    View looking back towards the route.
    [​IMG]
    So now we've covered Queen's Park, let's move to probably one of the more noticeable areas of contention on this route.

    Area around Willesden Junction
    Extra Tracks around Willesden Junction.PNG
    When looking here, there are two things that immediately pop into the mind here, the tracks that make up Willesden TMD and the High-Level overground platforms.
    [​IMG]
    So starting at Willesden TMD, it has been confirmed that the new Bakerloo timetable will have static stock parked here, the details of what that stock specifically is remains to be seen. So of course it makes sense to make that area appear on the map for the sake of seeing where all those pieces of stock are located. But I also feeling like showing the depot tracks would also come in handy if we were ever to receive an Overground add-on, as those services would make full use of this depot. Plus, as this area of the route is overhead catenary and the rest of the route is third/fourth rail, it would provide a unique gameplay challenge of transitioning from shoe-pickup to overhead powerlines as you enter the depot. But that's this area is made accessible, which it isn't at the moment, but if routes like Riesa-Dresden have proven that you can areas that weren't accessible before accessible, then nothing is impossible I guess.
    [​IMG]
    Then we come to the high-level platforms at Willesden Junction station. They do exist in the route, but are not accessible on foot. But that's the point here, like with the depot tracks we talked about, these tracks would be a prime target for AI services should we ever see an Overground Add-on come to this route, as while you wouldn't be able to access the upstairs platforms, you would be able to see AI trains serving the North & West London Lines running over the top of the Bakerloo/Watford DC Line platforms above you. There's also a freight line right next to the station if you look north of the station, which connects onto the WCML. This would be ideal for AI freight trains joining onto the WCML from the North London Line (Which I feel is right now, what we could see in regards to AI traffic on the WCML part of the Bakerloo Line).

    Now as for how far the North/West London Line tracks go in either direction in the route, heading north, it goes as far as a bridge before you meet the AI Spawnpoint. What I find hilarious here is that in the route, the area has some really badly placed row of houses that are floating right above the tracks here, as seen in the images below.
    [​IMG]
    Edge of the route here.
    [​IMG]
    View looking back
    [​IMG]
    Heading south, Willesden Junction is the place where the North and West London Lines split and head off in their respective directions (North London towards Richmond and West London towards Clapham Junction). In the route, the tracks for the West London Line goes as far as a junction for freight/Southern services coming to and from the WCML.
    [​IMG]
    It's also worth mention that around here, would be the GWML and Old Oak Common Depot, which hasn't been represented here, probably because it was deemed too far away from the route to notice it.

    As for the North London Line, in real life, it would connect up with a freight line heading off the WCML and carry on down to Richmond. But in the route, the connection isn't even represent here, probably because it was deemed to be too far from the route to be represented. It seems to only go as far as where a river would be in real life for both sets of tracks before stopping. As seen in the images below.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Where the two tracks you just saw should meet in real life.
    [​IMG]
    What's more is that these tracks would also join the Dudding Hill freight line a little further on in reality, but in the route, as a result of the connection not being represented, they don't. But more on Dudding Hill in the next part.

    Also worth mentioning here that there is also the old Eurotunnel sidings that are located next to Willesden Junction. They are represented in the route, but I don't think they should be shown on the map as I don't think anything really uses them nowadays, not even static stock can be seen in these sidings, which is why those tracks are marked as just a thin line. If you want to see these sidings up close, here's an image of it.
    [​IMG]
    Maybe the new timetable will surprise me and there will actually be static stock here, but who knows? Probably for the best that this area remains covered over on the map for now.

    Dudding Hill Line
    Dudding Hill Line tracks.PNG
    Believe it or not, this is the only part of the WCML portion that actually does show up on the map ...well, the bottom but does, but not everything else you see above you, and for reference, this is what that area currently looks like on the map.
    [​IMG]
    I'm still amazed that this area is still showing even to this day, I would of thought that DTG would have covered over this area by now. But I guess with this thread being about uncovering sections like this on the map, we might aswell uncover the entire Dudding Hill Line on the map just to show that it exists.

    Now for those who don't know what this line is, it is mainly used for freight traffic which connects up with the North London Line heading South and heads up to the junction with the Midland Main line at Cricklewood. It may not be an accessible area, but this feels like the kinda of area that would actually be ideal for AI freight trains, and provide quite a site seeing those services crossing over the WCML/Bakerloo Line above you as something visual to look out for. I've already mentioned that it's connection up with the North London Line isn't represented (heading south, the track goes as far as that section shown on the map, which is actually the point where the line connecting the WCML joins onto this section) but heading North, the line goes up to where a road bridge going over the line is in real life, before coming up to the AI Spawnpoint, as seen in the images below.

    View of Dudding Hill Line from southern end (AI Spawnpoint is behind this image)
    [​IMG]
    Dudding Hill Line crossing over the route.
    [​IMG]
    View of Dudding Hill Line from northern end (AI Spawnpoint is behind this image)
    [​IMG]
    Now we have covered all that, let's move on to what is probably the biggest area trackage wise, of the entire route. Which we will cover in the next post of this thread.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2022
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  2. WonterRail

    WonterRail Well-Known Member

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    Area around Stonebridge Park/Wembley Depot
    Stonebridge Park Extra Tracks.PNG
    I'm not gonna lie here, this area is probably the toughest when deciding what to put on the map, as there is just so much trackage here and I'm having a hard time deciding what should be shown on the map and what shouldn't. So to better digest this, I will break this area down in little segments and we will take it from there. I also have plenty of images to share with you of each area, so let's get into it.

    Princess Royal Distribution Centre (and surrounding area)
    [​IMG]
    This was the former Royal Mail hub for TPO trains serving vast areas of the country (and I believe still gets used on some fashion to this day) and is probably one of the more recognisable landmarks along this. In-game, the building is represented and there are tracks leading into and all the way down the length of the building, as seen below.
    [​IMG]
    However, I can't really see this being used by AI trains, as firstly, we don't have the stock to do such a thing with this area and secondly, it would look rather dumb to have trains no-clip through the building as it has no interior in-game. But as for how much of the trackage that makes up this area should be shown on the map, I would say only show the tracks leading up the building and not the ones inside of it, as you can't see the inside tracks if you are just looking at the Distribution Centre from the confines of the route.
    [​IMG]
    There are some other tracks around this area, which are mainly small yards and the freight line that's right in-between the Bakerloo Line running tracks and the PRDC, but whether they get added to the map will depend on whether any use can be found for them like AI trains or static stock, but I think adding AI freight to that aforementioned freight line seems like a logical choice to me considering how close it is to the main route. One area I want to particularly focus on is an area right at the bottom of that whole PRDC complex that we saw on the map earlier. You see, there is this aggregate siding of some sort that's completely hidden from view if you are looking from the route. The tracks for it do exist in game, but there doesn't seem to be much scenery around it, as seen in the images below
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    It's an area that I probably won't put on the map as it deemed it too far away from the route and if it was to receive AI services, you probably won't be able to see those services anyway from where you are within the confines of the route.

    Wembley Depot/Stonebridge Park Train Depot
    [​IMG]
    I was going to do this area in two parts, but I decided to do these areas together as A: they are very close together and B: they both would serve a similar purpose. This area would be prime for either static stock parked in these yards, or AI freight trains passing through or making a stop here. I mean, it seems that AI freight trains is about as much as AI traffic that we would get on this section right now (as that's about the only stock we have in TSW2 that actually runs here in real life) so it would be incredibly surprising if this whole isn't utilised in some shape way or form when it comes to what AI services to put on this portion of the route.
    [​IMG]
    Alstom Train Care

    This area is located in-between the Stonebridge Park Underground Depot and the Bakerloo Line heading towards Wembley Central. But what is particularly interesting is that this area is actually entirely accessible on foot. Unlike most of WCML that we have already talk about, this area you can actually go and explore most of the area on your own accord, the only part you can't explore is the big maintenance building which is blocked off. Down below are some images of what I was able to explore around here.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    View inside of the building (you can't go inside of it).
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    View of a passing train and all those trains stored in the depot (very soon, I feel like that depot is going to be much empiter around the time I was doing this).
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Each of where you are allowed to walk around here.
    [​IMG]
    It seems easy for that reason to put the tracks for this area on the map, but there also needs to be some kind of usage for this area, even if it's just static stock. I have seen in real life images a Class 08 that usually works around here, so maybe we could take one from the ones we already have and place it here as a bit of scenery to look out for while passing through this area. But I don't know, let's see what the new timetable actually offers before we start speculating too much.

    So that concludes the whole Stonebridge Park/Wembley Depot area and the vast networks of tracks around there. One thing I do want to briefly mention before continuing on is that at the Northern end of Wembley Central station in real life, The Chiltern Main Line passes over the route on it's way into/out of London Marylebone. In the route, the bridge where the route would go is there, but there are no tracks to be seen anywhere here, probably because it was thought nobody would be able to see these tracks any ways, although if you just pop your camera over the bridge, you will be able to see the lack of track here in all it's glory.
    [​IMG]
    So clearly we are not adding these tracks to the map as they don't exist, so let's move on.

    Metropolitan Line/Aylesbury Line
    Metropolitan Line Tracks.PNG
    Skipping forward to near the end, in-between South Kenton and Kenton, the lines passes underneath a 6-lane main line that comprises of the Metropolitan Line and the main line heading towards Aylesbury. What is most surprising here is that, while we saw that the Chiltern Main Line tracks at Wembley Central aren't represented at all, the tracks for this are represented. Although the tracks for the Metropolitan Line are very basic and don't have any details like the third/fourth rail, as seen in the images below.
    [​IMG]
    Track sinks underground heading west (but does continue for a little bit).
    [​IMG]
    For those reasons that I've just mentioned and considering that it would be much more worthwhile to go and make a full version of the route seen here, it's highly unlikely that we will ever see anything use this part. But for the sake of seeing where it is, and offering a waypoint for the route, it would be somewhat helpful to have this be shown on the map. But I don't know, you tell make what you think of this one.

    Area around & heading north of Harrow & Wealdstone
    Harrow & Wealdstone AI Runoff.PNG
    Here we are at the end, not just of the WCML portion, but also the northern terminus of the Bakerloo Line. The story here is very similar to what we had with Queen's Park, the Overground tracks that pass around the turnback siding need to be shown, as this I feel will be used by an Overground Add-On should one ever come to this route, and also the WCML tracks right next to it, as these would be used by AI services running up and down the WCML.

    On and side note, I also want to get this out that I feel like the decision to block off the access on foot to the WCML tracks around not just here, but also all the way down to as far as Wembley Central is rather dumb. I know these tracks aren't relevant to the main route (as this is a Bakerloo Line route, not a WCML route) but come on, what's stopping us trying to access those tracks, at least on foot? Even if nothing is using it right not, at least open them up so they can be accessed on foot so we can explore this part at little more. Because right now, it just feels quite restrictive in the way that you can't go and walk along the WCML tracks that are right next to the Bakerloo Line ones, regardless of whether that part of the route is up to the same standard or not (I know people have done mods that remove the invisible walls and have been able to access this area on foot, but not every platform that supports TSW2 has that luxury).

    But back onto Harrow & Wealdstone, the only question remaining here is how far back does the line go north before coming into contact with the AI Spawnpoint? We unfortunately, there's no line to Watford Junction secretly hidden away behind invisible walls, but the line does go about as far as where the line goes under a road bridge just as the route would come up to Headstone Lane overground station in real life, as seen in the images below.

    Edge of the route looking north.
    [​IMG]
    Where the AI spawn point is.
    [​IMG]
    View looking back towards the route
    [​IMG]

    So actually quite far away from the route, and I think with that, it concludes our little adventure of exploring the extra WCML tracks of the Bakerloo Line.

    Conclusion

    You might be wondering by now, what's the point of all of this? Why uncover the WCML part of the Bakerloo Line on the map now? Well, I've already talked about the fact that supposedly, we are getting AI trains on this part of the route as part of the new timetable coming soon and as much as I'm going to enjoy the shock of finding out what all that extra AI traffic is, I feel like that after a while, having those tracks be shown on the map would massively help to find out where all those AI trains are located at any one time. There also the fact of adding more detail to the map, as right now, it just looks so thin with the impression of not much going on, when there is actually so much more going on that area that what appears to be at first glance. Like, if DTG covered over many of the inaccessible yards of Liverpool-Crewe, how different would that map look? It just wouldn't have looked so interesting.

    But for me, if you were looking at this route from a driving point of view, adding these extra tracks would offer a source of waypoint for the route. The problem I have with covering over vast portions of trackage on the map is that it because quite difficult to identify where certain areas of a route are, especially if that area has a lot more trackage than what is shown. But this doesn't affect this route too much, so this is something I'll explain in more detail with the other two routes as it does affect affect those routes quite a bit.

    That's the end of this first part , so what do you think of all of this? Should any of the WCML portion of the Bakerloo Line be shown on the map, is there anything else that I may have missed? Be sure to let me know in the replies below.

    That's all for now and I'll see you next time when we will cover the next route in this series that has a lot of tracks covered over, LGV Méditerranée.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2022
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  3. jack travers

    jack travers Well-Known Member

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    I’ll be real I read the first paragraph then got bored but I 100% agree with what you said here
     

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