PC New - Western Somerset Dlc Announced

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by hightower, Apr 30, 2018.

  1. Shukiii

    Shukiii Well-Known Member

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    hightower Probably because their market research says that not enough people will for example pay 10 euros more for a route. i personally would pay more, but then I would also expect higher quality standards.

    It's basically a time and coupled with a money issue. Especially now in the early days of TSW when few assets that they can reuse for a route are available.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2018
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  2. hightower

    hightower Guest

    What market research? Has anyone ever seen any?

    I don’t think it’s anything to do with price, I feel it’s all about what something is worth. I’ve paid over £50 for utter crap for the PS4 before, but give or take that’s the standard price on a console and people pay it day in and day out. Nothing that has been released for TSW has so far been worth that. Make something that is and I’d bet people would pay it.

    If they feel it’s a challenge then they’d sure as hell better rise to it, because that is where the future of TSW lies. Not in multiple stand alone 20-30 mile routes.
     
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  3. Corvan

    Corvan Well-Known Member

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    They'll probably stay within their existing license agreements for the time being to keep costs down. I just hope they don't keep to routes they've already done. For example if they did a Southeastern route I'd rather something like the North Kent Line than a rehash of the Medway Valley or Chatham Mainline. At least for now. Those lines can come later.
     
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  4. ProfCreeptonius

    ProfCreeptonius Well-Known Member

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    Hello peepz!
    I guess some of you want to hear my opinion...
    Anyways I'm stunned by the bold decision of DTG to put a signal in a TSW teaser, because TSW is known for not having perfect signalling systems. Their current ones are riddled with bugs, to
    Could this mean that we get a fix to the old signalling systems? I'm hopeful...
    Anyways,
    Cheers,
    ProfCreeptonius
     
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  5. davejc64

    davejc64 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if DTG have some sort of software that can convert routes and rolling stock from TS20xx to TSW, it might do it in some rudimentary form so that all they then have to do is go into it to tweak it to get it to function properly, it would explain why they are doing routes and rolling stock that have previously been TS20xx routes and rolling stock, rather than completely new stuff, just a thought.
     
  6. cActUsjUiCe

    cActUsjUiCe Developer

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    Wrong. It is the development time associated with creating the route. A 30 mile and 90 mile route will perform the same, except the 90 mile route will take 3x longer to develop. This info is straight from DTG.
     
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  7. ASRGT

    ASRGT Well-Known Member

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    From a sheer software engineering point of view id put my money on nope, the amount of dev time required to essentially produce a transform software to enable UE4 to understand even the most basic geometry information from TS is probably beyond crazy from a ROI point of view.
    Its probably far more plausible they simply have 2 - 3 teams if not a few more of artists and the odd engineer ect producing these routes in parallel , for all we know this route was in production before RT shipped. Some people on here seem to take this route as DTG not taking feedback and there welcome to there opinions, but the reality is by the time a DLC is released half that team is probably well underway on the next route/engine, there seems to be an assumption that they only work on one item at a time and id bet my left you know what that is not the case. Btw I'm not making excuses for doggy signaling ect or saying no one should provided feedback negative or otherwise its just it really does seem lost on people that software development especially in games is not a simple task and requires allot of time and there for money and having a dev team sitting around awaiting feedback is never going to be a thing financially.

    Also just food for thought but if you look at the releases so far each one tackles a core engineering challenge, be it EMU and Pzb signaling in RT, and in NEC you tackle another Signaling system you don't need to tackle EMU simulation as you have built that out before, and here again another signaling system, id say the choice there making is probably more about building the foundations of the game its self and the required components to allow for coverage of the core areas they wish to simulate. Then again maybe I'm just been optimistic ;P
     
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  8. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this, I see no reason why they couldn't start out with a shorter route for less money and then add extensions via an upgrade path. For instance start with Paddington to Reading, then add expansion packs for that to Bristol then Cardiff etc.

    So long as the extensions had scenarios that ran over their entire length I would be happy with it, in fact that might even be a drive for more sales.
     
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  9. Shukiii

    Shukiii Well-Known Member

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    They can and they probably will.
     
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  10. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    But they haven't in the past with TSx so this would be a departure
     
  11. Wilbnil

    Wilbnil Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this too, if they can't make long routes to fit the deadline, atleast we would end up with a full route. This will hold TSW alive for me.
     
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  12. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    Here's a graph to explain why DTG make routes the length they do.

    sales_route_graph.jpg

    Maximum sales are generated by a route that is 50-60miles long, however the sales are diminishing after 30miles after an initial large increase in sales from 20miles. Simply put, by creating two 30mile long routes they will generate sales of £270,000, which far exceeds the sales (£165,000) of a single 60mile long route, despite the labor time being about the same, given that both options involve 60miles of route building. This is why they don't create longer routes, despite longer routes being more popular.

    From a business point of view it's a good decision, and honestly I have no issue with it as a way to support the base game financially, so long as there is a way for Third Party creators, driven by passion not profit, to produce routes which are longer or cater to smaller niches within the hobby. TSW's big issue at the moment is the lack of content creation tools, which effectively cuts out the passionate developers and strangles the interest and enthusiasm towards TSW. If this situation persists then TSW will likely go the way of FSW.
     
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  13. ProfCreeptonius

    ProfCreeptonius Well-Known Member

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    Hello there
    You all are going to obliterate me but hear me out:
    I actually like shorter routes.
    OKAY Here's why:
    I, personally, have no intention on sitting in the cab of a LZB-driven 300kph train whizzing along a ridiculously long route doing nothing but acknowledging SiFa alarms in a game. Shorter routes are more action-packed and i think 30-40 miles is just perfect to get that feel of high speed but not get bored to death. Furthermore, if the decision lies between more but shorter routes or less but longer routes, I'd take the former choice simply because it adds more diversity to gameplay and is more likely to please a wider spectrum of players. TSW, unfortunately, is still a game and not supposed to be identical to real life (where you sometimes have to undertake boring runs).

    I hope you understand my opinion.
    ProfCreeptonius
     
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  14. pschlik

    pschlik Well-Known Member

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    What does this "sales" axis mean? Is that graph in average sales of each single DLCs at that length, or total sales overall for all DLC of a particular length? Because that can significantly change how you interpret it.

    If it is total sales of all DLC ever made that fit this length, then the only reason 10 mile routes make less money is because there are less 10 mile routes compared to other routes (which is why I think this might actually be showing all time sales of every DLC added up, as I doubt a single 10 mile route does that much worse on average)...and then there are also less 60 mile routes than 40 mile routes, yet 60 mile routes overall still made a bit more money despite their lower numbers... From this interpretation, the data would suggest that making longer routes is actually better because they make more money per route. The number of routes at each length standpoint is a very important confounding factor!

    And if we stick to the assumption that the "sales" are not total sales of all routes but rather average sales, then your explanation fits just fine. But without knowing what the data is actually saying, what on earth is the correct interpretation? This data is just so ambiguous and very much open to interpretation that it's kinda useless.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2018
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  15. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    It's an average as you correctly ascertained. Overall sales would be well into the millions. These numbers are projections from a Train Simulator DLC feasibility study I did a while back. The numbers are probably on the conservative side and DTG's sales are likely higher across the board, but still in proportion to the figures on the graph, so the principle stands.
     
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  16. Rudolf

    Rudolf Well-Known Member

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    Can you clarify the points at the graph? Are these actual measurements? Where did you get these figures from? Your statement sounds reasonable somehow, though I think it also may heve to do with performance, but I miss the evidence on which it is based.
     
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  17. Coppo

    Coppo Well-Known Member

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    A potential solution to this might be for DTG to create route extension packs (similar to the Koln Airport Link in TS2018) for existing/ new routes that allow them to go beyond the 30 mile limit. If these were also created as standalone routes (with an extra loco/ rolling stock) then fans could have the option of having a new short route or one that plugs onto a route that they already have.

    I'd also like to see DTG move the barriers preventing access to those parts of the routes that are currently "out of bounds" as this might allow us to explore a bit more...
     
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  18. Wilbnil

    Wilbnil Well-Known Member

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    As time has been said to be the biggest factor to the small routes, extensions is definetly needed.

    I really want longer routes, and extensions is a pretty good alternative
     

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