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Option To Enable Free Substitution

Discussion in 'Feature Suggestions & Proposals' started by Thelonius16, Oct 18, 2019.

  1. Thelonius16

    Thelonius16 Active Member

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    My understanding of the substitution feature is that each loco or train car has certain variables set (length, type of power, what it carries, etc.) and that other vehicles that match those variables can sub into the service when this is enabled.

    Currently each route has a predetermined set of options so that the "right" cars end up running in service mode. This way you don't see CSX engines roaming around Peninsula Corridor or certain German trains running where they don't belong.

    Some people think this is great. This setup as it currently is now should stay as the default.

    But it would be nice to have a toggle to allow for anything you own to sub into service mode. I'm not saying we have to see a 182 pulling into Penn Station (although I'm not opposed), but I would at least like to use the Class 33 and 52 on the other British routes even if the purists know this is unrealistic.
     
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  2. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    They'd probably just have to mark more services as "compatible with loco XYZ", but set the chance of that swap happening randomly to zero.
     
  3. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    DTG will always want to do things authentically. If others want to change that then they might have the option if ever an editor is released, but I actually prefer that DTG do what they do and leave the rest to others
     
  4. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    Lol definitely not in Germany. I've done the maths in another thread the other day, about 15% of Germany's rolling stock in TSW is accurate to the route and era they mean to depict.
     
  5. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Want to... not that they actually get it right LOL
     
  6. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    Yes. DTG wanted to make the best trainsim there ever was. Then it turned out, that would require them to do work.
    Though, to put it in more positive words: They can't keep up with their own ambitions.
    Or, as a great dictator once said: Aim higher in case you fall short. Which is an attitude I admire to be honest. Only, please try not to fall THAT short again in the future, DTG. ;)
     
  7. DominusEdwardius

    DominusEdwardius Active Member

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    There are several reasons why free substitution can't really work:

    1) The Coupling systems have to be compatible, you're not going to get anywhere trying to connect a US buckeye coupler to a German/UK screw coupler
    2) The braking systems have to be compatible, you're not going to be going anywhere if the braking systems aren't the same. Try attaching an air braked loco to WSRs vac only coaches and you'll do absolutely nothing, or a UK/DE loco on US stuff since the US run at 90/110psi, while UK/DE only run at 72.5psi (and vice versa as that would cause the UK/DE coach/wagon brakes to go rather haywire).
    3) With modern coaching stock the locos have to be compatible, if the loco can't talk to the coaches it can't really open the doors and do other functions like that.
    4) MU compatibility is also a thing, if two locos can't talk to one another then you effectively have one loco (or more) acting as dead weight so you probably wouldn't be able to finish a service if It required two. This would get especially annoying if you spawned in the correct loco and the second loco substituted as an incompatible loco
    5) Electrification compatibility is also a thing, you can't run an overhead loco on 3rd rail, nor can you run a UK/US 25kV 50Hz loco on DE 15kV 16.7Hz overheads.
    6) If a loco free subbed was less powerful or slower than what was expected it would cause utter chaos, either being potentially unable to complete a service or running very far behind that it just makes a mess of everything.

    There are probably plenty more reasons but I think that covers most of the issues.
     
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  8. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    This is based on people giving a damn about realism of course. There are people who have no qualms about such things and just want to make anything
     
  9. DominusEdwardius

    DominusEdwardius Active Member

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    and my point is it flat out won't work for the above reasons
     
  10. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    If TSW has enough systems depth, that is.
     
  11. DominusEdwardius

    DominusEdwardius Active Member

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    It does
     
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  12. Thelonius16

    Thelonius16 Active Member

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    As I mentioned in the first post, the substitution feature must already be aware of all these factors or it wouldn't work at all.

    I'm simply asking that they provide a toggle to ignore the flag that says: "This never ran on this route at that time period, so don't let it run here or we will get complaints on the forum."
     
  13. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    Agree. Obviously, we can't run the electric German trains on WSR, but at the very least, it would be nice to run some of the WSR trains at full speed on NTP or even GWE. They did at least exist at the time the route is set, wouldn't require overhead power and it wouldn't have been impossible for one to have passed through, even if it wasn't running regular services. You could maybe add in a couple of services for the crossover, the way that the regional services only exist on RRO if you have the 146.

    Guess there's no reason GWR couldn't send a HST along to a diesel gala day at West Somerset, though it would be pretty dull running it at 25mph!

    It also needn't be a complete free-for-all with carriages; to avoid any compatibility issues with coupling and braking systems, the trains could run as complete units with the correct coaches, just on a different bit of track.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
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