Peak Forest Railway: Ambergate – Chinley & Buxton Feedback Thread

I concur, I so much want to purchase this route despite it not going to Derby. It looks stunning and I love the detailing which has been put in, clearly a lot of love has gone into this route. The 4F looks great and the banking services are novel.

However I am still irritated that nothing has been done with SOS's timetable after a year so I will wait and see if this gets forgotten too.

 

Map and scenery are utterly fantastic. Timetable is very bad[EDITED - Jan - Language]. Scenario editor is missing several key locations (including the famous Darley Dale on the preserved railway - perhaps the most famous station on the route).

4F were used on local passenger trains - there are none in this timetable. There were many direct trains between Matlock and Buxton - there are only about four here. There were also many stopping local goods trains that are non existent. Even the banking operations are questionable - most of the photos of banking engines I've seen show 8Fs.

The lack of diesels is very odd - one wonders if the timetable game engine struggles with operating diesels and steam together? However there are no problems combining the two in scenario editor.

At the moment most of the fun to be had is in scenario editor. I doubt if I'm the only one to start by taking a Peak and a HST over the route to see what might have been.

Bill Hudson's book Rails through Limestone Hills is a good reference book for the route if people want to know more.

This is a great start but PLEASE give us a proper timetable. Midland Main Line was bad, but this timetable is worse. Why ruin a fantastic modelling job with a poor timetable?

 

The 4F not being layered into SoS was another reason I've decided not to purchase this route for a while.

 

I'm also thinking of a "What if..." scenario using the EMT HST and 158 from MML. HST on the express services and 158 on the stoppers and Buxton trains. Oh if only we had a proper scenario editor to do our own variation on the all day timetable.

 

There is also a Project Rio HST on the sharing platform that would be ideal.

My favourite era is the early 1980s so 40s, 45s, 47s, 101s and HSTs are just right for a scenario in 1981. These locos would have almost certainly been the main power in the route. The only loco that is missing is the 25, although 31s may have appeared - they were on some Manchester Sheffield services during this time.

 

Really impressed with the level of scenery, foliage and clutter in this route. It's quite beautiful. Do we have an increase draw distance and LODs on foliage here too? I've not had any pop in or grass growing in front of me like other routes (PC) so I hope this is a new standard going forwards!

I do wish you'd added a green skinned 101 though for some local shuttles. I hope you can consider doing that at some point?

For those on PC who want to sub the Fowler on SOS (pass and freight) There's an old mod by Shiiba that as a side effect lets you do that.
https://www.trainsimcommunity.com/m...2613-spirit-of-steam-8f-on-passenger-services

 

I think they posted somewhere once that SEHS is the top selling route for TSW. Looking at all the praise Peak Forest is getting on the first day (even bringing in hardcore TS Classic fans like me), I assume it will be a big seller for DTG. Just from the business side it makes absolute sense to bring quick fixes for this route and expand on it with multiple DLC and maybe even an route extension. I think it´s going to become a flagship route for the whole TSW francise just like SEHS.

 

Why are the stop markers so close to the singals? Like this one :-

 

I think this route also shows that historic routes with lots of different local stations with individual character, goods sidings, signal cabins and semaphore signalling are a lot more interesting than today's railway

A lot of people complained that Midland Main Line was bland... well that's because much of it is today. However if they'd set it in 1960 there would have been much more lineside infrastructure, sidings, local stations and signal boxes.

 

It could be a flagship route, certainly of the steam routes. However I cannot see any extensions coming as they "don't do extensions". Certainly there is much scope for DLC both in diesel and steam form. Some carriages other than mark 1's would be nice too.

SEHS is one of my favourites due to the variety both in terms of the two distinct lines and the trains which are about to bolstered by a fourth EMU.

 

Yes I already spotted and mentioned this one, somewhere. In reality for a shunt move that required to approach that close to the signal you would get line clear from the signalbox in advance so you could clear the section signal. That is otherwise a nasty SPAD trap. I'm also sceptical what basis in reality there is for employing a propelling move all the way back into the station. Would have thought there would have been a carriage pilot loco (possibly a Jinty) to take stock to and from the sidings.

 

It is a good looking route. My wanders along the line have turned up a couple of nit-picks.
1. no point or signal rodding/ wires.
2. the canals don't have tow-paths (if they are meant to be canals).
3. there's a bridge just after the tunnel around Cromford sidings where the girder work goes through the stone work.


4. some of the barrow crossings don't line up with the tops of the rails.

I found the Cromford cat, and then spotted that the canopy supports don't touch the platform.


A nice touch is that the escape cut-outs in the tunnels have been modelled (although you can't get in them).

Oh, and based upon the cattle facilities, we need an add-on wagon pack that includes sheep/ cattle vans...

 

The other thing which I just spotted on my Class 45 run in the Up direction and DadRail pointed out in his YT run with the 101, is the missing section of hill in the right hand distance as you are about 4 or 5 miles out of Matlock. It's so obvious driving from a diesel but of course if the testers did all their runs looking down the left side boiler of a steam loco I can see how it got missedd.

Definitely needs to go on the fix list.

 

Probably the falling gradient, but I still question whether IRL you would have been shunting quite so close to the signal. Just wondering what the real formation of the Buxton to Manchester services was - at this point most likely a Class 104 DMU which, oh look oops we didn’t get, or maybe a smaller steam loco on load 3 either of which would have given a better margin.

 

Bit of a glitch at Chinley with the water hoses

 

In January 1963 Buxton had a large allocations of class 104 sets, 3 car sets from what I can see plus the four class 111 power trailer sets. I suspect the latter would have been more likely to be seen on the Millers Dale shuttle and the 104's going to Manchester, how many of services operated by the DMU's went via Dove Holes I wonder though.

I would imagine something like a Ivatt 4mt 2-6-0 would have been used on the steam hauled passenger trains. I wouldn't have thought anything less than a class 4 rating would have been used on anything other than light trains on lines with such gradients.

A black five frankly would be very useful for such trains as well as filling other gaps if DTG don't want to make lots of different locos, including stopping services on SOS, although I know there might be cries of "it is just the same a Jubilee, I am not paying £14.99 for that"! A LMR route without a black five would be a bit like London to Brighton without an Electrostar, they were pretty much everywhere.

 

Extreme caution advised then!
However as noted you wouldn’t have been using a Jubilee, but a smaller loco and maybe 57ft coaches all of which would have given a bit more wiggle room. Perhaps some artistic licence should have been taken with the signal placement, maybe moved it 10 yards further up the line.

Indeed looking at Wikipedia an Ivatt 4MT was a good 9ft shorter than a Jubilee, a Class 24 or 25 another 5ft less.

 

I'm really enjoying the route it looks great I do agree though there are some issues which hopefully will be addressed hopefully we will get diesels added one day make the route more busier but overall I'm liking it

 

A experienced steam driver could (and still can) move a loco forward a couple of inches at a time, just like we can when parking a car. It is remarkable to watch.

 

Hopefully with some future DLC we might get a 4mt of some description or something more suitable to replace the Jubiliee on the local services as they wouldn't have been used for certain, unless in an emergency. It would be good to keep the Jubilee for services they were intended for.

 

Only gotten to play the 4F training and a shunting service at the quarry loader, but quite good so far.

Scenery is top-notch, and full of atmosphere.

Looking forward to driving more today after work

 

I would not be suprised if a DLC with DMU´s and a bigger timetable have always been part of the busisness plan. Can´t blame them for it to be honest. The route out of the box is defintly going in the right direction along with the amazing german Niddatalbahn. I have spent 10 hours in total the past couple of years in TSW. Im definitly going to using the game more in the future if they keep up this type of DLC quality.

 

Not sure what I like more, the route, or watching the mental gymnastics from people trying to find fault with the route.....

It's the route, definitely the route.

 

I do hope so, I just wish they would communicate at least a hint of that, if that is the case. This sort of route should be a no brainer, day one purchase for me. I assumed SOS would get more DLC and services than it released with as it has so much scope yet we have received none and although vague comments have been made on the stream about this release referencing missing services there is nothing concrete just the usual "no plans".

Yet the 4F could easily been used to run the local services, even if the coaches would be unsuitable, I would have bought it there and then. This is now the fourth route with a poor timetable (one wasn't a DTG release of course).

 

I love the route but I wouldn't hold your breath... SoS has only two locos and is the emptiest route imaginable, but there is still no sign of DLC. Not even a layer for the 4F.

 

Bill Hudson's book shows a 2MT on locals on the 1950s - they loaded very lightly and, of course, several local stations had already closed by 1963.

I'm still unsure about 4Fs doing the shunting. They may have done this work, but Jinty 3F tanks were very numerous and generally used for most shunting on the LMR. 4Fs were 'road engines' for the most part, used on a range of freight work (and passenger when nothing else was available).

Rebuilt Royal Scots also appeared on the line in its latter days- that might be an attractive DLC project. Some Stanier coaches would also be nice. Both could later into SoS.

Interestingly I checked and Matlock Buxton locals had been quite heavily cut back by 1963. So for a 1963 setting there may only be a few services to add.

It really is great that DTG have revived one of the UK's great lost railways. Dare we hope for a Great Central London Extension in future (Rugby - Marylebone) A portion of the Somerset and Dorset? Or the saddest loss of all, the fantastic Midland and Great Northern route to the Norfolk seaside?

 

This is my worry. There is so much potential for additional steam, or a classic diesel. Give me a Class 104 DMU, Class 25 and a green Class 45 and here is my £30 straight up. Throw in a buffet car and here's another £5. But I just have my nagging fear that this will join the ranks of released and forgotten routes once the next latest and greatest project looms over the horizon. You've given us our model railway, which for the most part is very nice, but actually give us something to run on it (and fix the lighting plus missing hillside while you're at it).

 

Okay that is interesting so an Ivatt 2mt "Mickey Mouse" mogul could be possible. A Royal Scot would be lovely.

There were about 20 Buxton to Millers Dale services still in the June 1963 timetable. There are a few Buxton to Derby services but can't see any Buxton to Matlock. There were also a couple of Bakewell to Derby services.

 

Wheres the missing hillside I haven't noticed?

 

Yes, sorry the services between Matlock and Buxton originated in Derby.

 

I love the scenery and the route building it is beautiful just needs a lighting tweak.

It does once again feel like a canvas for more stock like SOS did. I bought SOS under the impression (like many) more dlc would be coming for it and was disappointed by the result.

In my experience Peak Forest runs much smoother so I'm hoping theres nothing to really stand in the way of a gameplay pack with something to run some local services perhaps with some Stanier coaches as has been pointed out or as many have mentioned a diesel pack to add variety and much needed services to the timetable.

 

Are the 10mph and 15mph speed reductions at the turnouts between Buxton & Millers Dale and Chinley & Chapel-en-le-Frith accurate? I'm new to steam so still learning the optimal braking pattern for speed reductions but struggling to keep to time on the Buxton-Chinley local run (ran the one in the journey mode chapter and only managed a bronze as I was best part of 5mins behind)

 

Driving in the Up direction about 4 or 5 miles before you get to Matlock, if you look towards the right distance it is immediately noticeable, driving from a diesel loco or DMU. If you watch the DadRail YT route video he mentions it too. Might not be apparent from a steam loco as the boiler blocks the view.

 

Oh fair enough I will have a look when I go back on hopefully that's fixed in a patch

 

Okay for the benefit of everyone, here it is. DTG Matt in case the route builder isn't already aware, please pass on with his/her tea and biscuits chat!

 

I see there are yet again many complaints about a poor timetable with many missing services.

What's the point in releasing routes with rubbish empty timetables?

 

So this route went from a not interested, to a maybe and now having watched TrainSimulatorDriver and DadRails streams and the Game Pass discount showing up, it's in my collection. I can only echo what has been said already, the route is absolutely beautiful, there seems to be quite a lot of variety of services and I really like the new loco. I'm not even bothered about the timetable, it could be a lot better, but there is enough for me to do at the moment. BUT...

I do hope this is a route that will be built on as far as traffic is concerned. As others have already said, it's crying out for some BR Green Diesels. Adding these in would make this route really quite special. So I'm really hoping this comes out in a Loco Pack at some point in the near future. I'd happily pay for that with some new scenarios and a better timetable with a mix of diesel and steam. It would be excellent.

Oh and just about everyone has said it, but, turn down that safety valve. It's made such an improvement to the 8F and Jubilee, it's really quite annoying that it wasn't applied here as well.

Well done DTG, In my opinion, after some of the recent releases this is a big improvement. I didn't expect to like this at all, I bought Spirit of Steam due to the hype and ultimately was really disappointed, so I'm really pleasantly surprised with this. Never thought I would like Steam Engines.

 

Oh yes the route (bar the lighting) is fantastic. Scenic, challenging to drive but plenty of space for thrash - far more than NTP - though heading north you are climbing more, running in the Up direction becomes a test of your braking skills.

There is just so much that now needs to be done to build on the initial release and I really do hope it doesn't become another fire and forget project.

I reaaly hope we can see more scenic UK routes like this - imagine the Mallaig extension, Settle & Carlisle, Stainmore or the Kyle Line built akin to the style here (again with more subdued lighting).

 

Any updates on the banking services brake vans at the wrong end? Currently spawn behind the 8F at the front, with nothing between the 4F and the ICI hoppers. Thank you.

 

Most types of safety valves have a partial opening mode which triggers before the full opening does. Those based on springs, such as the Ramsbottom type, just open gradually as the pressure goes past the setpoint, and close gradually when it goes down again. The Ross Pop valve, very common on later types and particularly on BR Standards, opens slightly in a "feather" mode just before it blows wide open, then shuts completely in one go once the pressure reduces. So this might not be as unrealistic as you think.

With that said, it's abundantly clear that steam locos in TSW are presently operating with a "placeholder" boiler model. There is a great deal of inaccuracy in how this works. Until DTG get around to putting in the proper model, we'll just have to put up with it.

 

Is either the 4F able to be purchased separate or through the use of scenario planner can it be used with passenger coaches?

 

Huge mistake going lazy with timetables..., so what are we heading back to the tsc "you get 6 scenarios era"? So again, whats the vision with all that? Timetable tools are not made public, so the entire supporting player base is stuck with DTGs minimalism.

Personally i would be ok if there are 5 loco dlcs in the pipeline, which enriches the timetables with services like the ntp freight dlc, but TSWs direction is highly fire and forget currently.

Maybe the did good work with the route (cant judge, ), but TSW is taking a really concerning overall direction. Even worse it passed the point with repeated poor time tables. I really like the pics from peak forest, and i have to say the team did a nice job on that, but looking at the bigger pictures of TSW, this is neither fish nor meat. (of course just my personal opinion)

 

It's a really nice route well made, and with beautiful steam engines at that.
I'm really hoping to have some fun and interesting times on here.

I bought SoS on release but never really played it due to the issue with the safety-valve, rendering it unplayable for me using headphones. At the time I was about to suggest lowering the sound volume, but in the end I just stopped playing it instead.

Therefore I was glad to hear it has now been done. However, after playing it for a while I'm not sure it's enough. I'ts such a relief when the thing finally stops blowing. Even at a lower volume it drowns out all the nice sounds that a steam engine makes, which is a real shame. And the new 4F still has really loud sounds, even though it was pointed out during the roadmap stream a week before launch ...

Perhaps it should be considered to temporarely remove this "feature" alltogether until it can be made to work the way it's supposed to?
Or maybe now, with two steam routes and three engines out, is the time to really focus on getting steam right once and for all, fixing the issues with safety-valve, AI trains not chuffing and so on.
Please ....

 

Playing scenarios on the route the 4f is actually pulling passenger services as ai shame we can't do passenger services with it that would of been really good

 

Glad (relieved) to see so many people here enjoying the route. I also like it, and this was a last-minute purchase after seeing some early feedback.

Is there a way to remove the Driver Assist spam, though?

 

only interested in buying it if we can use the 4f on passenger. either on the route or custom Semeraro

 

Ok thanks for confirming, so I just need to get better at driving the steam trains then and improve when and how much braking I use