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Poll: Ebula Add-on

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by 7orenz, Jul 26, 2021.

?
  1. Yes

    74 vote(s)
    88.1%
  2. No

    6 vote(s)
    7.1%
  3. Honestly, I don't care

    4 vote(s)
    4.8%
  1. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    Is implementing an EBuLa facsimile really that difficult in terms of hardware resources? Better than a hideous blank screen, right?

    eBULA.png

    #rushhour, #immersion, #authentic, #featurerich
     
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  2. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    #octothorpe
     
  3. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Not as part of Rush Hour- there's more than enough work to get that out on time with even a modicum of polish. Yes I would like to see Ebula, but later.
     
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  4. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Well-Known Member

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    So you might think, Ebula is easy to implement? Not in the slighest. First, there are three different ways Ebula is working in RL:
    1.: GPS-Driven where the Ebula scrolls automatically depending from the milepoints
    2. Static, where the driver has to scroll by hand
    3. timed, where every xx seconds it scrolls to the next point.

    This is the first question: Which to implement?
    Number 1 needs the complete route tracked into a separate database with the timetable data because Ebula also contains the departure times. Then this needs to be linked to every milepoint which is resource-intensive especially for longer routes in terms of cache etc.
    2. Would be the easiest way but would still need the timetable data being in a separate database linked to that screen.
    3. Would be a compromise of 1 and 2.

    Now to the accuracy part: Every german train company uses a different Ebula. DB Fernverkehr (ICE, IC) uses the GPS-Driven, DB Regio and DB Cargo are using either the static or the timed one. So either you implement it accurately which would require big development efforts because this all needs to be coded properly. And given the strict development windows DTG sets to themselves, I doubt they would and can do it properly. So in the end we would get the Static one at best.

    Implementing Ebula isnt easy. Its actually hard, because you would need to create an entire new database for it with links to the routes etc. Its a ton of time and effort and it is actually harder to make than the system looks itself.
     
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  5. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    I wrote: "implementing an EBuLa fac-simile" like the one on the screen. So, also console customers can benefit of it. And is always better than a "hideous blank screen".
     
  6. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Active Member

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    I would not expect DTG to develop a 100% replica of the real thing! It would be enough for me, if it gives me the representation of my route, some timetable times, speeds, tunnels, etc. All the basics that EBuLa is showing, not the fancy stuff like ESF, ZLR or infos on radios.

    if you look at infos you already get from the HUD today, there should a lot of information already be available. LZB also knows what is ahead of you. Admittedly, additional stuff would need to be added to a route, like the info of a last switch in a station etc. Hence, an EBuLa system would probably only be compatible with new routes or would show less information on older routes, but you would need to start somewhere. I am not saying it’s an easy task but it would be possible if DTG would see a business case.

    The question which hardware would be modelled would not really be a complicated question to be answered. Of course the latest one, which is basically the only one you get, nowadays. Not sure where you got your infos from regards the use of the static and timed EBuLas, but I have not seen the static one being used in a long time and the use of the timed one would not change the representation to the driver, at least not for the duration that is played on TSW. But IRL basically all new vehicles have GPS units, which is needed for functions like ESF and ZLR.

    I would really like to see an EBuLa in TSW and would pay for it as an extra feature.
     
  7. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    The problem is that you want this fake EBuLa to be dynamically created. If it isn‘t, then you‘ll have the same problem as the original destination boards - you only have what‘s there at release. For example, if EBuLa had been implemented like you suggest when RSN was released, then the Br 155 would have the fake RSN texture for EBuLa, but not the one for say HRR unless Adam‘s team edits it in at a later point.

    Thus, you want the EBuLa to be dynamically created so that the system adjusts automatically- even if it‘s faked. Even if we were to exclude substitution and layers - you‘d still need to find a way of letting the sim know in which way you‘re traveling to switch to the appropriate texture. Do-able, I guess, but a wasted effort once either layers/substitution come in or once a working EBuLa replica is being tackled. If you need to create it dynamically anyway, you might as well go the last mile and actually reproduce EBuLa (simplified where necessary for the sim).

    Note: When I say fake EBuLa, I‘m referring to using a static texture instead of a system that reads timetable information to build EBuLa in real time.
     
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  8. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    Exactly! If we really can't have a plausible Ebula, a static timetable printed on the display is always better (as in the photo above, where, among other things, I was using the timetable of the RSN on the RRO, just to try the mod) than a horrendous empty display . And that's exactly my proposal for this pool. How long will it take to apply the correct Excel sheet (?) Or static Text (?) file of the route we are playing so that it appears on the Ebula display of the train we are driving? On a visual level, this small "feature" is more immersive than something we can only benefit from the Pause Menu. With mods it is done in an instant, without mod it takes an eternity to develop a static sheet to print on the display? This is the question I asked myself.
     
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  9. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    You Need to ask Matt to include this, he is the Senior Producer
     
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  10. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Well-Known Member

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    The thing here is that DTG, if they ever to decide to implement it, they may want to implement a proper version of Ebula and not a cheap fake version of it. And I would have a proper version implemented properly rather than having a static texture. Or I just print the Ebula sheets out for a route, for RSN and SKA for example, the german community already created printable PDFs.
     
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  11. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    On Pc ok. But on consoles?
    You see, the RSN was only released 3 years ago. So maybe-maybe it's always better to settle for a static sheet printed on the train display than to have a blank screen. (IMO)
     
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  12. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Well-Known Member

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    Which is hardly readable on a big TV screen. And if you put a sheet on there, it not Ebula. As I described earlier, the easiest version to develop and to implement for a proper and correct version of Ebula is the static scrolling one. So its basically what you want, you just have to scroll through the milepoints and markers manually via clicking on a button next to the screen.
     
  13. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I am all for having as many functional systems as possible, to really do justice to the "Sim" part of "Train Sim World." Obviously, it will not all come at once, but a small amount of work toward it each time a German route is added, it could eventually lead to a functional system.
     
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  14. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    Sure, ok. But I am ready to negotiate with DTG also to get the static sheet even without scroll function. For pure visual pleasure.
    Like you said "a fake Ebula".

    After all, little is always better than nothing.
     
  15. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Well-Known Member

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    I think we all agree in the desire to having Ebula in one or another way in the game. But it needs development effort in any way and given the strict deadlines they might come to it at a later point in time. For the moment one has only the PDFs being printable from the german community.
     
  16. cwf.green

    cwf.green Well-Known Member

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    Maybe a compromise: DTG does something similar to what Virtual Railroads and 3dzug has done in TS1: give the functionality of a static EBuLa system with several "folders" and each folder having maybe 15-20 pages and functioning up/down/left/right arrows (cycling through route folders or through pages in one single folder) and then make it relatively easy to upload pages to each page-slot in a folder.

    Then the kind and talented modders on this forum and elsewhere can do the rest of the work :D
    Basically a Bethesda approach to developing lol.
     
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  17. FeralKitty

    FeralKitty Well-Known Member

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    Not everyone uses mods or can use mods (console players).

    I’d rather see DTG (eventually) develop a system that works for everyone, out of the box.
     
  18. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    This must be done because if you turned off hud for German Routes you're not going to know when to drop speed or increase speed. Useful for Main Spessart Bahn since speed limits go from 75 mph (120 km/h) to 100 mph (160 km/h) around Hosbach. Even the Ebula can also display the Brh for Goods Trains for correct PZB Modes.
     
  19. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    Funny, because thanks to the Lf 6 and Lf 7 boards I always know the upcoming and current speed limits. The UK with its Morpeth boards and the U.S. with its speed announcement boards are far more sparse and so (without route knowledge) I must rely on the HUD to be aware of upcoming speed changes in those regions.

    Cheers
     
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  20. Eugenio

    Eugenio New Member

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    I don't think it is very difficult to implement ebula in TSW2.
    Today there are applications such as TS-MFD with which ebula works very well in TS 2021, in a separate window.
     
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