1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Price For Isle Of Wight Is Ridiculous

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by nielsmallant100, Sep 30, 2020.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    Messages:
    2,266
    Likes Received:
    3,486
    I don’t understand the point in arguing in these posts. It achieves nothing but bad feeling amongst individuals in the community.

    People are free to make their own choices for their own reasons. Live and let live!
     
    • Like Like x 3
  2. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    Exactly, and an important thing for both sides to understand. If you think it's good value or not, state your opinion and move on.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  3. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    590
    Likes Received:
    908
    steamdb.info stats, all time peak of players online
    1,933 players for Train Sim World 2020
    3,086 players for Train Sim World 2
    3,821 players for Train Simulator (any edition)

    Now, lets compare those player numbers to SCS;
    61,081 players for Euro Truck Simulator 2
    19,153 players for American Truck Simulator

    I'm pretty confident that if DTG had a player base the size of SCS, they'd be able to afford to sell their DLC a lot cheaper, which in result would probably boost the numbers any further.

    It's not fair to compare a niche (which train simulation is) to one of those casual simulation games that often ended up in Steams top selling charts. SCSs games, although they are simulation games, are a massive hit which probably surprised pretty much everyone. (And for good reason, they are amazing games and I think DTG could learn a thing or two how SCS handles their PR). Pretty much any DLC they release shows up at the top of Steams top selling charts.

    Both ETS2 and ATS are a pretty arcady games IMO, which probably boost their sales as it opens the games to a wider audience. Yet we get upset at DTG whenever they try to make TSW accessisble with a wider audience. How often has TSW been called an arcade game?
     
    • Like Like x 4
  4. longo239

    longo239 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2020
    Messages:
    668
    Likes Received:
    1,076
    Whilst I can't disagree with your figures, you have neglected to include the console players of TSW.

    As for TSW not being arcadey, it is purely a matter of opinion, but where in either of the "arcadey" truck games is the option to run around putting up fences, maps, fire extinguishers etc?

    I appreciate you don't have to do it, but it is, in my opinion, an arcadey feature.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    Even with those figures included I don't think TSW gets near ETS and the other SCS games, maybe in a few years they will get closer.

    I don't think everyone who has an opposing point of view is ranting but when you see posts with words like "rip off" in, or glib one liners like "thanks DTG you have saved me more money" or questioning whether people should be purchasing the DLC in some kind of act of solidarity that is what I call a rant.

    The point is there are good reasons as shown in the figures above why DLC is the price it is and yet next time we will have the same again, yet those who think DLC should be cheaper can never give any reason to justify that view, it is just DTG being money grabbing rip-off merchants, or that is usually the implication.

    I don't think they pluck the cost of DLC out of the air and if you try and force them to sell it too cheap then you will probably just not end up getting any at all. You might want that, I don't.

    With a bit of patience you can wait for one of the quite regular sales if you think a piece of DLC is too expensive.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  6. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    3,979
    Likes Received:
    2,825
    Yup, hopefully the barracking that "the community" give every time anything is raised doesn't do what's happened in the TSx community, people leaving and abandoning projects in droves simply because of the feedback given. Unless the people producing have the resources to work on something 24 hours until every little item is as some random person wants it their case is very much "got on"
    As I've said before, I couldn't care less about £20 and if it supports development, fine by me.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2018
    Messages:
    590
    Likes Received:
    908
    I don't have any numbers of console playerbase. I also don't have any numbers on sales of the DLC, which is probably where most of the profit comes from of both games. I suspect most players of ETS2 and ATS have pretty much most DLC (or at least the map expansions) since they all form one big map. That's unlike TSW/TS, where several players may only be interested in a specific (sub)genre of railroad simluation. But as I don't have any numbers of that, I cannot make a reliable comparison.

    Agreed, it's one of those features that I do not use. But I doubt how much development time actually goes in it. And there may be people actually liking this feature.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2020
    Messages:
    379
    Likes Received:
    542
    The quality of the route is the only thing that matters.
    Rivet will have estimated their costs, including Dtg, Steam, Microsoft and Sony's cut, and will want to make it profitable.
    Otherwise why bother?
    Price is irrelevant.
    If it's good I'll buy it, if not no sale.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  9. ajwilson1889

    ajwilson1889 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2020
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    40
    I dont like the London Underground in TSW2, for me it just doesn't feel very Train Sim, more Tram/Bus driver, so paying that much money to drive the same but on a shorter piece if track, erm, no. Ill wait for Crane Creek
     
    • Like Like x 3
  10. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2019
    Messages:
    1,293
    Likes Received:
    2,991
    If it can maximize its potential...
     
  11. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    830
    Likes Received:
    1,516
    Well guess what - IOW costs 22,99 in €, preordering it applies 10% discount. At 20,69€ I am absolutely happy with the price.
    Source - Steam
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    I shall be pre-ordering it too, very good price
     
  13. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    If they decide to give a discount to consoles, I'll get it. If not, then I'll just wait for the new Munich Route. Hopefully they see sense and arrange a short launch discount for consoles (like they did with TSW2). However the lack of info on their article doesn't instil much confidence.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. jamesonmin

    jamesonmin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2020
    Messages:
    250
    Likes Received:
    275
    Now that pre-order is open I'm going to wait for the reviews to come out instead of saving 2.50 on it
     
  15. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Messages:
    2,672
    Likes Received:
    5,811
    Really? A 10% discount is pennies on a £20 route. That £2 you save won’t get you much of the Munich route. Not really a reason not to buy it if you want it.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  16. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    We have to find something to complain about
     
    • Like Like x 4
  17. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    Perhaps £2 to you is pennies (you probably need to look up the definition). I've always considered £15 to be reasonable for the IoW, but at £18 I'd buy it. £20 is just too much for me really. I really don't appreciate you criticising how much I personally value things.

    Also un-needed. My post was hardly moaning, was simply stating my intention. Your snide comments are un-needed.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    It was a general post not aimed at anyone so I wouldn't be so paranoid if I were you!
     
  19. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    Given that my post was the only once since Saturday to say anything other than "I'm preordering it", it's quite obvious who you're aiming it at.

    Thank you for also calling me paranoid, how polite of you.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    I wasn't just referring to posts on this thread. Just a general observation.
     
  21. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    Then perhaps take your comments to a thread about general observations, instead of making a comment that seemed to be aimed at me?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  22. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Messages:
    2,672
    Likes Received:
    5,811
    I’m sorry, I didn’t know you valued it at only £15 and an extra £3 is an easier pill to swallow than a full £5 more if there is no discount. I was working down from the £20 and 10% is 200 pennies (I looked it up just to be sure).

    I wasn’t meaning it in massively critical way but this is a discussion specifically about the price of the route and I thought that not having a £2 discount was not a good reason for anyone, not just you, to not buy a route they want. £2 is not a lot of money, unless it’s your last £2, and then the only sensible thing to do with it is buy a scratchcard.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2020
    • Like Like x 3
  23. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2017
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    336
    First day on the internet, mate? You'll get used to people saying things you don't like, and after you become desensitised to it, you'll start to ignore it.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  24. edward.gregg

    edward.gregg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2020
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    31
    I agree!!! While we cant compare American Truck Sim and ETS2 to TSW I would have expected Due to its limitations that the IOW route has ,it would not be more than £11.99. The figure you suggest is what I think its worth £8.99.

    I went over to TSW2 the day it came out and did all i could on the Bakerloo line and started on Sand Patch before I got bored, and jumped back into TS2020 then got annoyed so went back to ATS thinking il wait till a few updates have came to TSW2. This evening I did so and started off with the Caltrans route only to find it was crashing on my PC! the initial release didn't crash at all. So I'm now wondering what is going on. I have a AMD Rysen9. 3900 12core, 32gb ram, RX5700 GPU. I saw that AMD processors were having bother, but I didnt, but now i am -.-
     
    • Like Like x 1
  25. edward.gregg

    edward.gregg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2020
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    31
    I used to think the same, But mental health issues affect us all. I spent 20years in customer service and now im a jibbering wreck on the sick and paranoid as hell with major anxiety issues. We need to give each other a break and understand some people cant take all this crap anymore!!! Im not saying this is case with "Lucas LCC" but we need to try and respect each other and gauge peoples limits. stujoy yes we know you like the route and agree with the pricing but you know Lucas LCCs point. So you don't need to keep going on at him or her. Just leave it!
     
    • Like Like x 3
  26. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Messages:
    2,672
    Likes Received:
    5,811
    I wasn’t meaning to have a go at Lucas and my second post was an attempt at explaining that and adding a bit of humour, but maybe a bit reactionary too. I have been getting a bit over excited about the route. I should know better as the way things are meant aren’t always the way they are read and we should all be more careful when posting, especially when we should really just stop and move on to another thread.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  27. LucasLCC

    LucasLCC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2020
    Messages:
    804
    Likes Received:
    1,679
    All, I was having a bit (read as very) of a bad day yesterday, and overreacted more than than I should have! Definitely not my first day on the internet, and normally wouldn't have cared...

    Perhaps £20 isn't so bad, but it would have been nice for them to offer the 10% off pill to their entire player base as opposed to being selective with it!
     
    • Like Like x 5
  28. OnlyMe1909

    OnlyMe1909 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2019
    Messages:
    314
    Likes Received:
    383
    I'm with LucasLCC on this one. Don't really care about the amount of the discount. For me, it's about the principle. If DTG can't offer the same discount over ALL platforms, it shouldn't offer said discount on any platform. All platforms should be equal when it comes to pricing.

    We'll see, maybe tonights stream will bring more info.
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
  29. LT586

    LT586 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2018
    Messages:
    542
    Likes Received:
    630
    Always appreciate an opinion but the pricing aside the fact we have a route not made by DTG i am getting it to support the third party effort or second party according to some, I doubt pricing is down to Rivet but I look forward to more of their work for TSW.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  30. nielsmallant100

    nielsmallant100 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 4, 2019
    Messages:
    167
    Likes Received:
    325
    It's an illusion that Rivet is 3rd party, long story but its almost like a branch. Its an entirely separate company, but they are connected
     
    • Like Like x 3
  31. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    2,471
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    I ain't buying this route at all, $24,99 is a rip off for just 8 miles. What was rivet thinking. Maybe if the route is on sale I would consider it but $24.99 is too expensive for 8 miles and one train
     
  32. zawal.belili

    zawal.belili Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2019
    Messages:
    147
    Likes Received:
    414
    • Like Like x 4
  33. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    2,471
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    I assume those numbers don't account for console players since console players account for a majority of sales in tsw and Amerrican Truck Sim and ETS are pc only. So I don't think 500 people are playing tsw2, that number must be way higher
     
    • Like Like x 1
  34. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    2,471
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    That's for pc players only, console won't be getting that for now
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2020
  35. 2martens

    2martens Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2020
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    74
    The price is what it is. One reason DTG can develop bigger routes (though still relatively small compared to what some real routes are) is their bigger team. And the cost does not increase linearly. Rivet had to learn quite a bit and even the smallest routes requires the same quality level of research. You don't really save that much time and thus money when developing a smaller route.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  36. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    There is that word rip-off again, classy way to make an argument.

    More proof that some know the cost of everything and the value of nothing!
     
    • Like Like x 3
  37. georgegamerfc2

    georgegamerfc2 New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2020
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    17
    you dont have to buy the route if you dont want to.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  38. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2019
    Messages:
    1,293
    Likes Received:
    2,991
    If you know how much work had to go into that loco to get it to the quality it is at, you would understand why it is priced so high...
     
  39. matthewbguilford

    matthewbguilford Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2019
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    2,230
    2A248D07-A200-4AF7-9023-D5E63D2A200A.jpeg BEF42215-E0F7-4332-BA03-52B5EF5247FE.jpeg
    Just from the numerous screenshots and previews it’s looking like it will be a very detailed and gorgeous 8.5 miles. 65 services and the class 483. I’ll pay $25, even more so if it helps support the first 3rd party developer for TSW.
     
    • Like Like x 9
  40. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2017
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    336
    The texturing alone looks to be a solid five or six steps above what DTG themselves produce. I know I had previously stated that I felt the price was too high, but on seeing the quality of the modeling and texturing so far, I've decided to pre-order it.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  41. edward.gregg

    edward.gregg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2020
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    31
    I don't want to detract from the good work put into this route. From the screen shots it looks epic. However how do you put a price on such a thing which is related to what we can say is art. I think the high price is related to the limited audience for this route. Nobody is arguing that the workmanship is crap! Far from it and i suspect a lot of time has gone into this. With exception of the craftmanship and man hours what other costs have gone into this? At the end of the day people see a fantastic piece of top quality art work, but a route of limited use. At the price quoted, Im sure the cost will be recovered in some ay by those who buy it. I may buy it in future once TSW2 works with AMD hardware and this route is in a sale.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  42. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2018
    Messages:
    380
    Likes Received:
    483
    What i've seen looks really good, and i quite enjoyed their BR 204 (hoping it will make the transition over to TSW2 soon), so i'll be picking it up to support them. I personally don't care about route length as long as it's well done.

    Hoping Munich-Augsburg isn't far behind.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  43. edward.gregg

    edward.gregg Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2020
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    31
    That is a lot of money for a TS Classic loco. I don't doubt the amount of work that has gone into it, but it needs to be priced reasonably to get custom. How did they come to that price?? You need to understand your customer base and what they can afford . This clearly is not the case here. If you put that much effort into a project, its your hobby something you love. To make a few Quid or Bucks is a win win. Otherwise its shear greed or a mis guided perception that they can make money from a community desperate for content at any cost.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  44. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2018
    Messages:
    3,979
    Likes Received:
    2,825
    Maybe they're going on past history in train sim routes, almost all of which are £24.99 from steam (and AP)
    Given those routes do sell (especially the higher quality ones) they probably do know their customer base and what they can afford. They also realise that down the line their product will be on sale so the people who cannot afford it full price may then buy it at a lower one
     
  45. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2019
    Messages:
    243
    Likes Received:
    129
    I don’t understand £20 for 8 miles or whatever it is. It seems pointless to me. If the train has a max speed of 0-30mph it’s still not going to take long to go along it.

    like with bakerloo you can add hundreds of services but you’re still in a tunnel and youre still on an 8mile line. I can’t see how much variety you can actually have.
    It’s a hard one as the scenarios are what makes the route to me ,the services get a bit samey as nothing particularly unexpected happens in them.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2020
    Messages:
    379
    Likes Received:
    542
    If you change ends it will double in length!
    Long routes with high speed have as much play value as short routes at slow speed.

    I’m waiting for the webstream first before making a decision, but feel the pre-purchase reduction was silly and completely unnecessary.
    If people like it they’ll buy it, if they don’t they won’t.
    Ballsy call on Rivet’s part.
     
  47. longo239

    longo239 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2020
    Messages:
    668
    Likes Received:
    1,076
    We do know the cost of it because it's been published. You on the other hand have no idea of the value to anyone else other than yourself. You have no idea what anyone else's financial situation may be. £20 may be pennies to you but may be a lot of money to someone else, especially on what is ultimately a luxury item in that it's not essential. You also have no idea as to what value the route has in playability to anyone else. You may enjoy the, on the face of it limited, 8 miles of predominately single track doing passenger services. Others may find more value from freight or shunting, of which this route appears to have neither.

    Maybe the use of the term rip off may not be appropriate for your purposes, it's still someone else's opinion on how they value the route and doesn't make it any less valid than yours.

    We know that and I won't be at this moment in time, but it still doesn't mean that we don't have the right to express an opinion and it doesn't make that opinion any more correct or incorrect than yours.

    If this thread didn't exist and everyone just continually posted good, nice, positive, non critical things and there was never any criticism, there would never be feedback like the post from Sam saying they are monitoring the feedback on pricing, there would be no roadmap, you would just get what you are given, "like it or lump it" as my mum used to tell us as kids.

    Some people, and they know who they are, constantly go on about haters and toxic people who are in any way critical of DTG, but they can be just as toxic and intolerant of anyone who doesn't share their opinion.
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
  48. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    I have pre-ordered it. Looks great from the screenshots. I think £20 pre-discount is fine value for a well made route if it is the sort of route you will get use out of it. If it isn't your thing then fine, obviously it is then not value at £20.

    But this constant valuing of a route merely on it's length is completely missing the point.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  49. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2018
    Messages:
    2,240
    Likes Received:
    3,858
    Well I would like to know where I said no-one can criticise or be negative? I have no right to stop someone airing their views and never would I try to so I would appreciate it you would stop using that phrase as some kind of diversion or smoke screen to delegitimise others from having a view different to yours.

    Rip-off is a very emotive and quite frankly belittling term and I suspect the people using it have not even try to look deeply into the reasons why a route costs what it does and the work having gone into it, it is easy just to see a price you don't like and type rip-off because you think it is worth less then a tenner, even though you may have no basis for that figure as you have no idea of the costs and sales figures involved.

    I have had many periods of financial hardship and don't have much money to spend now so I very much understand about financial priorities and when I have been very short of money I wouldn't be looking at purchasing any trainsim add-ons whether they were full price or half price.

    And again, I have never stated that everyone should buy it because it is worth it, I have said that if it is the sort of route that appeals then it is worth it, if it isn't then it probably wouldn't be worth it with a 50% discount.

    Still if you want to keep following me round the forums picking up on everything I say, feel free. I have better things to do today!
     
    • Like Like x 5
  50. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Messages:
    734
    Likes Received:
    728
    This thread is a car crash.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page