Schnellfahrstrecke Nürnberg München Suggestion

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by drnicktgm#1259, Mar 30, 2021.

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  1. Of course it's the most important high-speed route on Germany so yes of course

    69 vote(s)
    85.2%
  2. Only if it was cheeper because if they would bring out such an route it might be a little experience

    3 vote(s)
    3.7%
  3. No sorry but I'm more interested in other routes

    9 vote(s)
    11.1%
  1. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    upload_2021-3-30_10-30-18.png

    The Nuremberg–Munich high-speed railway line is a 171 kilometre-long (106 miles) high-speed railway running between the two largest cities in Bavaria, Germany: Nuremberg and Munich.

    Quick Facts: Overview, Native name ...
    The northern section, between Nuremberg and Ingolstadt, is a 300 km/h (186 mph) track built between 1998 and 2006. It is 90.1 km (56.0 mi) in length with nine tunnels (total length: 27 km or 17 mi). In order to minimize damage to the environment, it runs for the most part right next to Bundesautobahn 9. The southern section, between Ingolstadt and Munich, is 19th-century track. Its southern section has been upgraded for up to 200 km/h (124 mph). Between 2010 and 2013, further upgrades to the midsection of the track will be done. The minimum speed on the Munich-Ingolstadt section should then be 160 km/h (99 mph), with 190 km/h (118 mph) in the middle and 200 km/h in the southern section.

    Both long-distance and regional services operate on the line. Intercity-Express trains reach the tracks' 300 km/h speed-limit. InterCity and RegionalExpress trains travel at a maximum speed of 200 km/h. The Allersberg-Express, a RegionalBahn shuttle service, is operated between Allersberg and Nuremberg. The line was officially inaugurated on May 13, 2006. Limited operation with a twice-hourly long-distance service started on 28 May 2006. The line has been in full operation since December 2006. Compared to the former track via Augsburg, it cut off 29 km (18 mi), or about 30 minutes journey time on long-distance and an hour on regional trains.

    Most of the track is equipped with Linienzugbeeinflussung and GSM-R. ETCS was planned to be introduced in 2009, although this seems to be delayed until at least 2017. The total costs (as of January 2006) were about €3.6 billion. The line is part of the Line 1 of Trans-European Transport Networks (TEN-T).

    History
    [​IMG]
    The Irlahüll Tunnel (7,260 m or 23,819 ft) is one of the longest and steepest (20 permille) rail tunnels in Germany.
    The Munich–Ingolstadt line was opened in 1867 and was extended to Treuchtlingen as the Ingolstadt–Treuchtlingen line in 1870.

    The first proposal for a high-speed line dates back to 1983, when the Nuremberg section of Deutsche Bundesbahn proposed a more direct line between Nuremberg and Munich. The project was added to the 1985 federal traffic infrastructure plan. The following years were marked by heated debate on the route of the line, in particular if it should run via Ingolstadt or Augsburg. While the Ingolstadt line is much more direct (171 km or 106 mi) than the existing Augsburg route (199 km or 124 mi), the metropolitan area of Augsburg is considered much larger than Ingolstadt's. Apart from concerns that fewer long-distance trains would run via (and stop at) Augsburg, there were also concerns about the environmental effects of the 75 km (47 mi) of track that had to be built from scratch. Large-scale construction began in 1998, when numerous disputes had finally been settled and the total cost was estimated to be €2.3 billion. The €1.3 billion cost increase arose from numerous geological problems found during construction and additional works required to meet environmental and security concerns.

    On 2 September 2006, Österreichische Bundesbahnen (ÖBB) locomotive 1216 050 (Siemens Eurosprinter) set a new world record for locomotives with a top speed of 357 km/h (222 mph); reached near Hilpoltstein.

    • [​IMG]
      Construction of the route had a large environmental impact; shown: Kösching Forest near Ingolstadt in 2001
      • [​IMG]
        An ICE 1 running at 250 km/h (155 mph) near Kinding.
      • [​IMG]
        Schellenberg Tunnel
      • [​IMG]
        In July 2006, a French TGV undertaking a 330 km/h (205 mph) test ride for technical approval in Germany.
      • [​IMG]
        Geisberg Tunnel
      • [​IMG]
        At a top speed of 200 km/h (124 mph), the München-Nürnberg-Express is the fastest regional train in Germany.
      Operations
      Besides high speed ICE trains, the line is also served by regional trains and (since the 2020 schedule change) S5 of the Nuremberg S-Bahn which is operated with DB Class 1440 (Alstom Coradia Continental) trainsets. Due to scheduling concerns, regional trains need to be capable of speeds in excess of 160 km/h (the limit of the German legacy signalling system) and are thus equipped with LZB which allows higher speeds. Regional services are often operated with DB Class 101 hauled former Intercity coaches. Those aging coaches and locomotives are planned to be replaced with Škoda Transportation produced DB Class 102 locomotives hauling bilevel coaches. The new rolling stock with a top speed of 190 km/h was ordered in 2013 and initially planned for an entry into service in 2016 which suffered numerous delays due to teething problems. They finally entered service in December 2020
    If you would add this route to TSW2 than we would have one part of the VDE8 (Verkehrsprojekt Deutsche Einheit 8) and with continuing this route by connecting the other parts than we could have the full route from Munic to Berlin, with regards this is a very important high-speed route in Germany and would perfectly fit for these players who love high-speed and modern routes.
    Best regards Nicholas
     
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  2. mc_pater

    mc_pater New Member

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    I think DTG isn't going to make this route, it's too long. It also can't be shorted, because the ICE only stops in Munich and Nürnberg, so if the route was shortened, it would be impossible to drice an ICE service. So maybe in a few years if DTG has developed a way to make longer routes profitable.

    It seems like a cool route with some decent traffic tho, are there also freight trains running on the line?
     
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  3. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    Actually yes, between Munic and Ingolstadt there are cargo services
     
  4. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    This needs to be in game and introduce us to another locomotive that runs on this route DB BR102 and it's Skoda DostoCab car. Own Schnellfahrstrecke Nürnberg-München and own other German routes like Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden DB BR102 can be substituted in there for DB BR 146.2 and same will apply for Rhine Ruhr Nord & Ruhr Sieg Osten where the DB BR 143 & DB BR422 can be substituted by DB BR102. Furthermore if this route contains DB BR407 then it can be layered onto Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden as the ICE Line 41 Köln-Frankfurt-Aschaffenburg-Lohr-Würzberg-Nuremberg-Munich. One benefit of using DB BR407 on Main Spessart Bahn is that when you play off the rails mode you don't encounter wheel slip situation and roll back into the station this happens on DB BR 146.2 when you do Aschaffenburg-Gemünden all stops with fully loaded passengers.
     
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  5. Ravi

    Ravi Active Member

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    I would be ok with paying a little bit more if this route ever happens. Hopefully DTG will figure out how to make larger routes in TSW. They have gotten up to 57 miles now. Hopefully once they gain enough experience, they can figure out longer routes.
     
  6. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    I don't think they'll replace 146.2 or 143 services with services by the BR 102. The 102 was specially ordered for the High Speed line, and only runs there. It would be very unrealistic to have it anywhere else as far as I know.
     
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  7. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good to me. On the other hand player base in the community will start complaining to why DB BR102 isn't used by other German routes. Remember Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden can use RSO RRN RT locomotives BR 155 BR182 & BR143 from those routes. If that option is chosen for DB BR102 then you have two locomotives capable of 160 kmh 100 mph
     
  8. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good to me. On the other hand player base in the community will start complaining to why DB BR102 isn't used by other German routes. Remember Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden can use RSO RRN RT locomotives BR 155 BR182 & BR143 from those routes. If that option is chosen for DB BR102 then you have two locomotives capable of 160 kmh 100 mph
     
  9. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    Yes but still,in Senario Planer it could be possible to add the Br 102 normally the Br102 only runs between Munic and Aschaffenburg, DTG Wants to be realistic and want to keep all the trains there where they belong to
     
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  10. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    I also think a lot of players would hate unrealistic rolling stock on routes. I'm all for having the choice, and I think that scenario planner is ideal for that. (Scenario planner needs work, but that's a whole other topic)
     
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  11. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Play that Regional train out in game it needs Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden up to Lohr just like ICE Line 41 which starts at HRR Bochum Hbf and ends at Munich Hbf via Frankfurt Aschaffenburg & Nürnberg Hbf which is also featured on this proposed route SNM
     
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  12. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    Br 102 itself is nowadays also inaccurate to be featured on this route. Out of six trainsets made one or two sometimes pop up on the route, but it's still a test phase (and not very successful). Most of the time they're being pulled between a testing circuit and Skoda factory because of technical problems. My guess is it will be years before all six will be capable of running in regular service... IF ever. So I would happily go with 101 + red IC coaches as that's something you see frequently and will see for quite some time. Though I have to admit it would probably make players upset if they had to pay for 101 again even if it had a new train behind it (even with the cab car)
     
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  13. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I do like the idea of this route but I think it will be a while until we get 100+ mile routes
     
  14. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    That is true. Heck dtg added the 422 in ska when the DB S-Bahn Koln DB BR 423 runs on that line in reality. If people want to add unrealistic stock on a line, scenario planner is the perfect place for that
     
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  15. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you on that one but for some German routes you do end up getting AI Driven Services that you can take over with a DLC locomotive pulling it for example Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden DB86109 gets a DB BR182 or RRO RSN DB BR155 same can be said for SNM getting HRR DB BR101s
     
  16. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    Yeah but I'm happy they did. Image the route without the S-Bahn-Trains. The 423 wasn't there when SKA was released. I don't think anyone had a biiig problem seeing the 422 instead of 423.
     
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  17. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Some like me did
     
  18. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    It definitely should be an option for us to replace 422s completely with 423s on SKA. Especially considering how broken 422 is. How the hell can it show like 15 different destinations on the boards throughout the train? :D
     
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  19. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    I wish they would make a S-Bahn Köln skin for the 423. But that would need to be on a different thread.
     
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  20. flol26

    flol26 New Member

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    This is Not correct. ICE trains stop at Ingolstadt as well. Only Sprinter ICEs run through ingolstadt. The Short Version NBG-ING is already available for TS2021
     
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  21. mc_pater

    mc_pater New Member

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    Oooh then I must have looked wrong, thanks!
     
  22. anas.hera

    anas.hera Active Member

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    Way too long. I would prefer Munich - Ingolstadt for the variety of services, but if you want the raw 300 km/h you’d be preferring Ingolstadt - Nuremberg, either way a good suggestion.
     
  23. anas.hera

    anas.hera Active Member

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    Be warned, that route is filled with bugs, scenery problems and isn’t the best of routes.
     
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  24. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Well Said and this route will work wonders for the Taurus DB BR182 because it's designed to run 230 km/h max speed record speed 357 km/h. If you decided to use US UK MPH Train speeds then 145-220. DB BR182 needs a reskin for ÖBB1216 with the 4 pantographs
     
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  25. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    It's not just a reskin, they're very different locomotives. You have 1016/1116/182 being similar to one another and then 1216/183 being a very different kind of Taurus with more systems, different cabs, side vents, roof, etc. Reskin won't do it here.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  26. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    You mean the Nuremberg-München Regional Train which has the Intercity Cab Car at 200 km/h 125 mph on the Schnellfahrstrecke
     
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  27. elaineedwards2013

    elaineedwards2013 Active Member

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    The DB BR 101 does pull the white IC Coaches too. But, yes, I also meant the Nuremberg-München Regional train too.
     
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  28. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    The real high-speed is between Nürnberg and Ingolstadt but between Ingolstadt and Munic there are any kinds of trains
     
  29. creeperblox2710

    creeperblox2710 Well-Known Member

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    Whats the length from Nürnberg to Ingolstadt?
     
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  30. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    The length is about 87 km long
     
  31. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    This route would also be good for ICE 1 and ICE 2
     
  32. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree but over the weekend but starting May 8th Schnellfahrstrecke Nürnberg-München got DB BR102 in regular service by replacing DB BR101 with IC Cab Car painted in DB Regional Service Traffic Red Paint. Video is in German language .
    If DB BR102 and this route is owned I do have a feeling DTG will layer DB BR102 with Skoda Dostos to all Dosto German routes
     
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  33. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I've heard some of them started running there about a week ago. Was pretty surprising to me, half of these consists are still in testing with some issues. Well, maybe they're finally getting it somewhat running.
     
  34. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Good news and if DTG were to be on Schnellfahrstrecke Nürnberg-München they should be able to get exact sound recordings and data for DB BR102 post covid-19 pandemic. If DTG does make SNM the DB BR102 in DTG fashion will end up giving layers the other German routes like Haputstrecke München Augsburg Haputstrecke Rhein-Ruhr and Schnellfahrstrecke Köln-Aachen but not Hamburg-Lübeck since high door Dostos are required. Saw this on the Hamburg-Lübeck live stream where Matt fell off.
     
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  35. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    These sets are only to be used on SNM (there are only six of them made), they have their own custom cars which are very different from dostos, this train literally wouldn't be able to layer anywhere
     
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  36. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    Does this route have ETCS?
     
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  37. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    upload_2021-9-26_16-16-48.png
    Sources say "no"
     
  38. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    What website did you use for this and we can see that Hauptstrecke München-Augsburg is LZB PZB equipped like Schnellfahrstrecke Nürnberg-München.
     
  39. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    https://www.openrailwaymap.org/ my favourite
     
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