Spirit Of Steam Release Speculation

Discussion in 'PC Discussion' started by jamesthepershing, Nov 21, 2021.

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  1. Xmas 2021

    18 vote(s)
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  2. Summer 200 (like rush hour)

    122 vote(s)
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  3. Other: please say below in the comments what you think

    28 vote(s)
    16.7%
  1. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    "So they can sell us a Jinty and/or 4MT tank loco ..."
    Happy to pay for them, given what they would add to the route.
    If only.
     
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  2. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

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    Although, they could have given us a Black 5 instead of the two similar steam locomotives and include the Jinty or 4MT from the beginning, but since that is the sensible option DTG wouldn't do it.
     
  3. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    What is sensible to you may not be to others. Discluding top expresses and heavy freight would be as annoying to others as their inclusion is to some
     
  4. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Why would that be sensible?
     
  5. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Talking of Steam, how are DTG going to make it feel authentic with TSW not supporting any sort of guard operation and/or platform dispatch with whistles whatsoever?

    I can’t help but feel it’ll be quite an immersion breaker to have to use the [tab] menu overlay to open and close doors, whilst being a Steam driver.

    It’ll essentially be a DOO Steam service.
     
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  6. Rob39

    Rob39 Well-Known Member

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    Solutions- Put train guards on the ends of Platforms in the diorama format seen on Boston or TVL 37 rescue scenario DLC, click on them to instruct opening and closing doors? Make the load/unload objective complete sound a whistle?
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2022
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  7. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    It is how it is in TS1, it isn't great and saps away at some of the immersion I suppose, but overall it doesn't overly bother me. The same could be said for the loco hauled services on TSW, as though the cab of a class 45/47 has a button to close all the slam doors in a kind of blue/grey Mexican wave!

    A guard with a whistle and flag would be a great to see though if DTG are seriously intent on recreating a realistic experience.
     
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  8. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Do you mean Thomas and Friends Jinty & Belle? To turn 4MT Tank into belle you need to use Blue Yellow & Red on the 4MT. German Spirit of Steam DB BR010 Frieda with DB BR095 DB BR086 Bamberg-Hof line. However, DTG might do DDR Deutsche Reichsbahn 65.10 52.80 18 201 for DCZ DRA.
     
  9. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I'm
    Not sure they will. Most people playing the game have probably never know a guard or fireman exist on a steam train for it to detract from their right trigger to accelerate, left to brake (or whatever it is) user experience
     
  10. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Well then are we ever going to get any kind of historically accurate simulation? Some of us don't just want to drive steam trains because they look good and sound good, some of us have a real interest in the period and want to recreate the experience as it was. There are some very good and detailed routes and stock on TS1 and I hope we will see the same eventually on TSW but I hope DTG don't just play to the crowd.

    The difference between the railways of the 1950's and today wasn't just the use of steam trains as opposed to modern multiple units. The railway was a very different place, the way it worked was very different.

    I can see they have done a lot of research to make this route look historically accurate but will it be the case operationally. On modern routes they go to fine detail, including changing the colour of the ballast, I hope this route shows as much attention to detail. Certainly first impressions look promising.
     
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  11. jamesthepershing

    jamesthepershing Active Member

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    Completely agree. I do hope they have a realistic fireman though, at the very least. If not, it'll be super boring.
     
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  12. Rudolf

    Rudolf Well-Known Member

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    Maybe you ask the wrong question. A simulation can be accurate, but it always will be a simulation and not the real thing. The point is which aspects are important for you to be simulated accurately? In every simulation (i have created simulations professionally), you need to make choices on what to represent and what is important. This is the hard point for DTG and they probably will guess wrong and learn from our comments. Also be aware you cannot do everything that might be wished. There will be limits in accuracy due to performance constraints and due to the costs of creating such a simulation.
     
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  13. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Well yes I realise that not every little detail can be simulated, I don't expect that and would never ask for that.

    Something to differentiate the way station duties are performed between the different periods of route setting, I would hope isn't impossible to implement, maybe not now but in the future at least.

    Having to press a key or a command to shut the doors may seem like a slightly petty and rather small point. But it is quite immersion breaking when you are driving a train of slam door stock as it is wholly unrealistic. TS1 didn't do a great job of simulating station duties either but at least you don't have to lock the doors yourself on those trains where passengers themselves operated them.
     
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  14. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    An auto-guard function wouldn';t be very hard to program at all, really.

    Code:
    IF trainspeed = 0 AND trainlocation = memberofset "Platform,"
    THEN opendoors
    
    IF doorstatus ="open" AND currenttime >= departuretime
    THEN closedoors
    Heck, AI trains already do it!
     
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  15. davederave#6508

    davederave#6508 New Member

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    My expection is that it'll be a hybrid of TS20xx. You'll see a second man sat in the fireman's seat, as you do with the class 37, but you won't see him shovelling.DTG really dont do advanced human animations.
     
  16. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Surely you'd need some form of "if trainlocation = memberofset 'stoplist'" otherwise "fast trains" that get held up by a red light that just happens to be adjacent to a platform would try and do a passenger load cycle, and for newish trains this would lock the controls.
    Might be slightly annoying that
     
  17. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Also, if you're late, that code would open the doors and then immediately close them - the instruction wouldn't complete, and would never complete without player intervention.
     
  18. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    The opendoors routine should have a countdown timer and be the one calling the closedoors element of the code, so I look at what they typed as a couple of snippets rather than contiguous code
     
  19. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    The algorithm has a variable called 'departuretime' which would imply to me the scheduled departure time, given it's being checked against a variable called 'currenttime'.
     
  20. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, but all should be based on the door cycle having completed in the first place for AI. Obviously players can override, but then the passenger load cycle task doesn't complete
     
  21. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    It was just a sketch of the idea, obviously it's not working code.

    The important thing is that AI trains are already programmed to open and close doors at passenger stops, and exactly the same routine could be used on player trains which IRL are guard-operated.
     
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  22. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Yep, and then all that would be needed is the guard buzzer functionality. Presumably that doesn't happen on AI
     
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  23. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    For Spirit Of Steam you wouldn't even have the buzzer - you would be looking back from the cab for the station staff or guard to give "right away" with either a green flag or lamp handsignal.
     
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  24. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    In some routes in TS, the " guard " actually buzzes the driver and speaks those immortal words.
     
  25. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Or go back to MSTS days, one developer had sourced a very dour voice, "Right away, driver..."
     
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  26. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, OldVern, senior moment there. It was indeed MSTS. I think I was recalling the Cambrian Coast Route by 3DTS specifically.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2022
  27. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I remember that well. A northern accent if I recall, sounded perfect for the Thames-Mersey route.
     
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  28. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I loved that route, it was my second payware route purchase. I loved the DMU in particular and the Prairie was the first steam driving experience.

    Funny how in those days we were satisfied with relatively little and now with several simulators and hundreds off add-ons available we never seem so contented.
     
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  29. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Well you can already glitch the game into thinking your train is AI controlled - you can drive it but the AI does things like doors etc (think it even sets up the cab for you).
     
  30. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    I was actually the route builder on that one, with a lot of help from other members of the team. Of course it looks rather old now and quite a few things grate, like the gap between platform and rails. However IIRC it was done when things were at quite an early stage, we didn't have much UK DEM so most of the terrain was done by hand and markers had to be referenced off the paper sheet OS maps!
     
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  31. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it was partly to do with expectations, partly the novelty of train simming but very much the result of numerous talented individuals and small studios being drawn to the creative opportunity presented by the full editor. Not to forget the support and outlet offered by UKTS and other sites.
     
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  32. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    That is good to know, it gave me many hours of pleasure I can tell you. At the time it was one of the more detailed routes for MSTS from my recollection, certainly of the payware ones.
     
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  33. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

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    And not long ago a really useful bug (thanks DTG for fixing it) meant you'd have it when driving trains. jamesthepershing said it might have been the game getting confused about what was AI and what wasn't; either way I wish it was evolved into an actual feature.
     
  34. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Oh they fixed it?
     
  35. fabristunt

    fabristunt Well-Known Member

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    They haven't. To trigger it just make sure NOT to be seated at the exact moment the service starts, and you'll have a ghost controlling the doors.
     
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  36. alexjjones6024

    alexjjones6024 Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking about this but from Liverpool Lime Street's perspective, are we to get light engine/ECS runnings for the loco/coaches that have arrived from Crewe perhaps? Then return later to form a new service back? I do also hope there are plenty of services to choose from though...
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  37. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    As I’ve mentioned previously, the SIAM traffic control game for Lime Street set in 1958 would probably reveal all. Just that no-one (including myself!) can quite bear to part with £30 for old DOS based graphics to check it out!

    However in theory yes, all the relevant in and out workings, stock and light engine movements should be included.

    On a separate note though, looking at the mess that seems to be the Harlem Line and now issues with Horseshoe Curve, I am starting to have doubts that DTG can pull this off quite as we would hope. Perhaps we need to lower our expectations a few notches.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
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  38. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    This was leaked on twitter yesterday in regards to SOS……not sure of the source or accuracy

    upload_2022-4-21_13-28-52.png
     
  39. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Couple more that have gone live. I do not take any credit for these. I am just sharing from a source I follow

    upload_2022-4-21_14-57-15.png

    Is that a fireman

    upload_2022-4-21_14-57-41.png

    OldVern you might appreciate these. These are rather exciting!
     
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  40. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I imagine that is the fireman as he is on the right hand side of the locomotive.

    They look good, I like the detail of the footplate and the wagons too.
     
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  41. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I’m not a steam fan as such but my god does that loco look amazing!, the external and the light casting inside on the pipe work. Beautiful
     
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  42. Suryaaji#2369

    Suryaaji#2369 Active Member

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    I hope something about SOS announced at the next Roadmap.
     
  43. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Have to say those screenshots look very enticing, this could be back on for a Day One purchase.
     
  44. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The first pic is an artist's rendering, and so will probably be the "Box" illustration, and the advert splash sccreen.
     
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  45. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    The first picture is very reminisant of the Terence Cuneo railway paintings
     
  46. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    Funny how the exact same figure in the foreground on the right is on the far left as well.
     
  47. Mich

    Mich Well-Known Member

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    Gotta say I'm not a fan of those smoke effects if that's how they're going to look on release. With how old TS Classic is I would've expected a much bigger leap forward than what we're getting here. As is I'm not sure if I even prefer them to the smoke effects the TS Classic Bossman engines have.
     
  48. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    In the End if its a hard decision because of the Hardware Framerates, i still prefere an advanced simmugraphed steam locomotive, than high quality smoke to simplified steam physics.

    But im sure DTG will make it look better. Maybe in this particular case it makes sense for an option in the settings menu for the "Quality of Steam particle effects".
     
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  49. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    That would be their advert artist, the guy who did the two javelins in front of the Dartford bridge for SEHS...
     
  50. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    That's Tom Connell for anyone interested.
     
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