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This Is Game Is Annoying

Discussion in 'Xbox Discussion' started by laineshapiro186498, Aug 25, 2020.

  1. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    [edit by Protagonist - this player is just a little frustrated by the game. We all get frustrated. It's fine. I've tweaked the title ever-so-slightly to keep it in line with forum rules, but left the remainder untouched.]

    (OMFG!!! EVERYTHING I JUST TYPED GOT ERASED WHEN I WANTED TO ADD PICS OF THE EMAILS THE CUSTOMER SUPPORT ADVISOR SENT ME!!! NOW THE WEBSITE HAS PISSED ME OFF SO I MAY BE ASKING FOR A FULL REFUND!)
    To try to type what I typed earlier I said I had to email the company twice one about the brake system, because there is no tutorial about the Integrated System, you have to read a manual, which why would you had tutorials then? Second I emailed them about one route where I waited 10 minutes for a 2 Locomotives to move off the track i needed to go on and they didn't, so I had to move the Loco's myself to a siding then uncouple from them, back the train-set up and then continue on my way. NOW my problem is with the Cumberland to Willard route Q353. Which you have 2 head end units and 2 pusher units....only problem is you cant get up the 1.5% grade with the pusher units attached and you have to be breaking the speed limits and go as fast as you can up the grade. The wheel slip is insane and the sand doesn't seem to work at all! If anyone else is experiencing any problems please bombard the customer support with emails about this bullcrap. I wouldve rather waited for the good version then this stupidity!!!
    train 1.png Train 2.png
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 25, 2020
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  2. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Quick some body get some chips and vinegar to go with this mans salt, think you might find realistic physics might be playing a big role here, as i bet in the real world in the snow, trying to get massive trains up this grade is probably resulting in what you call insane wheel slip, just throwing it out there, so I'm guessing you just got to find that sweet balance point of movement and adhesion, just like the real world.
     
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  3. Bryer

    Bryer Well-Known Member

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    Yeah sounds like you're using too much power, and lighting your wheels up. Locomotives don't like too much power through the wheels when the trains are heavy or the weather is rubbish.

    Throttle off, use no more than 50% and feather it, they will move, but you won't be going very fast, it's actually quite realistic now!
     
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  4. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    friction coefficient of polished steel on steel. Too much power and you have a flywheel rather than a wheel.
     
  5. olikas.g

    olikas.g Member

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    A bad attempt at sarcasm:
    TSW2 is too arcade for one and not arcade enough for others.
    In another thread people are arguing that we need more manuals (I agree), in another that we don't even need in game objectives, just a list of things presented to you as in the real life, then in another where people argue that the locomotives are too strong compared to real life, then that the weather is not realistic enough, and that you don't need to flip enough switches, and not enough coupling...
    And yet in other threads the complete opposite...
    Btw, I never contacted customer support, but I like the responses, they are more detailed than some of the answers here.

    Wheel spin in action:
     
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  6. DTG Protagonist

    DTG Protagonist Dovetail Special Projects Staff Member

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    laineshapiro186498 It's clear you're being given a rough time by the game. What isn't clear is whether it is a flaw in the game or perhaps some overzealous use of the throttle that's causing the problem. Having you tried a more steady application of power to avoid wheel slip?

    Also, don't recommend anyone bombards the tech support team with anything - as you can see from the responses they sent, they're just trying to help.
     
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  7. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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    I found the CN Oakville Subdivision manual (OSD) very detailed about how to set the multiple unit and/or use as banking. Because there are a very different configuration that you can "choice" (and I suppose they dont working only on GP9RM).
    https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/ste...ision_Operator's_Manual_-_EN.pdf?t=1582221799 (I mean from page 9)

    And this is a supplement that probably you already know, the old CSX HH manual, with all the setup especially for the "new" AC4400CW ("new" because setup include use of onboard computer...something like the BR Class 66).
    http://cdn.edgecast.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/530070/manuals/Operator_Manual_EN.pdf?t=1489589182 (AC44000CW from page 25)

    Im a newbie in Sand Patch Grade, but since my 1st service I've never found too frustrating to move an about 7000 tons trains (double locos for now, no banking). If the setup is correct with notch 4, sometimes 5 (plus sand on) you are able to move the train "easily" (always remember we are talking about an almost 7k tons train in a high gradient route, not exactly a joke).
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
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  8. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

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    ...just asking this to make sure: You said you had helpers on the back of your train... did you make sure they were configured and functional (i.e. they throttle up and down in sync with the locos up front)? If by chance they weren’t configured properly, that might explain your problem getting up the hill. Try checking those helpers out with the game camera and make sure they throttle up and down in sync with your lead units... the following procedure is what I use to get helpers up and running- not sure you need it, but I’ m adding this info just in case.

    - First, set up the two engines up front at as a standard lead-trail pair, then set up the helper units further back in the train as another lead-trail pair
    - Make sure the circuit breakers for the radio in each of the lead units are turned on (they already should be turned on by default)
    - Finally, turn on the banking radio *only* in the lead unit at the front of the train (by pressing the DISP button on the radio), which will then enable DPU operation. The helper units should now throttle up and down in sync with your locos up front... you can verity this with an outboard camera.

    (Note the last step, turning on the banking radio in the lead unit up front, is not listed in the Train Sim manuals I’ve seen- and the helper units will never come up without performing this last step)
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2020
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  9. Trainmania100

    Trainmania100 Well-Known Member

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    [removed by Protagonist - we don't do that here]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 25, 2020
  10. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    Thats the problem you cant! Play this scenario and tell me you wont get mad! Dont be a LOVE!
     
  11. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    If you read the forums your find people have completed this scenario and not got very salty and angry, so I'm guessing you just haven't got a lot of patience, as again in real life driving trains is about finding the that sweet spot at all times and not just hammering the power and then being angry nothing worked, almost like a lesson in life played out in a train sim!!
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2020
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  12. paulmurphy_88

    paulmurphy_88 Well-Known Member

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    It's obvious from the way you write your posts and your seemingly short attention span that simulators are not for you. Can you enlighten us on what other games you've been playing recently? I'll take a punt with Fortnite and GTA Online.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2020
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  13. Greenroad

    Greenroad Member

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    This service is really something to say the least. I’ve actually been tryin this one over the last 3 days and have yet to complete it. I’ve tried about 6 different times now, each time tryin a different method than the last. Initially when you take off after setting up the lead unit properly you’ll run into an issue where the train doesn’t seem to gain and maintain speed anywhere near where it should for that kind of horsepower (Btw there are next to no real world weather scenarios that would prevent 17,600 hp from pullIng 40 loads out of a flat yard). The lead 2 units seem to start some sort of tug of war sequence with the rear 2 units for what reason I don’t know. You’ll see your speed go from 3.0 mph up to 4.5, then down to 3.5 and back up to 5, then back down to 4.0 and so on and so on. It continues as you try to leave the yard and you’all be lucky to be able to maintain 15 mph leaving the yard with anything lower than notch 4. Even messing with the DPU switch on the panel as well as checking/messing with the rear units before leaving never seemed to help any. The only way I was able to make it to Sand Patch was to switch out the rear 2 units and add them to the front consist before leaving Cumberland. I made it to sand patch just fine with all 4 on the front but since the rear units need to be set out at Sand Patch and having them at the head prevents you from doin so, that is where the scenario cannot proceed. I still have yet to complete it.
     
  14. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    You got it all wrong, you first read the manuals and then wonder why did they bother with tutorials lol.

    Jokes apart it's true that the manuals are lacking but that doesn't mean they should be ignored. You can't expect to play a Simulator without a little bit of studying behind it, and this is one of the more arcade-y.

    Can you tell me what scenario or service are you having a problem with? What loco should I pick, I am not too knowledgable about US DLCs. I am doing Q353 - Manifest - Cumberland to Willward with the AC4400CW is that correct?

    http://www.twitch.tv/fd1003/v/756292345?sr=a&t=10s

    First 25/30m of the journey can't be bothered to do much more, I apologize in advance to the US fans if my driving is not very realistic or efficient but I am extremely unfamiliar with US rolling stock and SPG in general that's the cause of my (few problems), and I don't really enjoy driving those trains tbh...

    It actually was the first time I tried to depart from that location lol. I really wish there was a Genesis with some Superliners the route itself seems really cool
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2020
  15. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I bought this game because I like trains, not to be insulted by the likes of you because I'm having a hard time! How bout if you dont have anything worth contributing you dont say a word. If I wanted real world train driving I would've gotten a job as a train engineer. I bought a VIDEO GAME simulator to play a VIDEO GAME!!! I know that's a strange concept for you, that people want to experience FUN on a video game, but that's crazy ol' me, trying to have fun! I have a real job outside of the realm of Xbox and have tons of patience for that, just not something Im paying to play and expect to have fun with!
     
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  16. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    How bout you come out with a tutorial on how to do this route and I will offer up a sincere apology. No? How bout you read my reply to paulmurphy then, about how this is suppose to be fun, not real world. I don't hammer out the power I'm literally running sand and in notch 2 when Im trying to get up the hill passed Hydeman, but the trainset goes NOWHERE! Lets see a video tutorial from you smart guy, then I will apologize!
     
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  17. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I honestyly dont know how to do any of that, I bought this game to have fun. And just followed what the tutorials have trained me to do, i didnt even know theres more to do...
     
  18. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    The tutorials are enough to get you moving but they do leave out quite a bit of information about the more advanced procedures, such as setting up DPUs (Distributed Power Units). Check out breblimator's DPU setup table here which tells you how each unit in a multiple-locomotive lashup needs to be configured. For the AC4400CW, you will find the Cutoff Valve and MU-2A valve settings on the MFD computer screen. The others, you will find on the fuse wall in the back of the cab and then below and to the left of your control desk. The Banking Comm (radio) will be above your head. The older EMD units have the Cutoff Valve and MU-2A valves in different locations, as pictured on the spreadsheet. If you need further help I can record a video for you.

    Cheers
     
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  19. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    At least yourself a very few others have been helpful and polite. If i decide to play again I will try to read the manuals first. And the info you have sent me. I appreciate the time you took to answer my thread.
     
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  20. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    You reap what you sow. If your post is offensive and angry in tone you can expect people to make fun of you or answer in the same tone. Try to be more calm in the future and you will see people here are very understanding and willing to help (which to be fair they are still as seen above). The issue that you have is one that most people here had once, it is not intuitive on how to properly set the locos up, the tutorials are missing a few very important steps.

    That being said, I understand you bought a game in order to have fun - but you need to understand that this is a simulator first and foremost. To which degree is quite subjective, but you have to expect it to be more complicated or in depth (time consuming as well, Sand Patch Grade climbs usually take 2 hours at least).

    Not to drive you away from this game, but maybe you should have looked for something more arcade-y.
    To a degree you won't just start up Microsoft flight Sim 2020 and expect to get an airbus moving with WASD because you just want to have fun - that is the wrong game for that purpose.
     
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  21. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Even your response was a angry salty one, that just goes to prove my point in my earlier post, its says way more about you as a person dude, and it's not exactly painting you in a good light......
     
  22. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the mention, Callum B., nice of you \o/

    It's all in the manual, of course, but they could already start correcting these errors (e.g. cut-off valve issue). People get stressed unnecessarily. Instructional videos are always a good idea! :) GL
     
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  23. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I wasnt "Salty" to anyone at first! I was mad at the game, Im able to get the trainset moving, but once i get to the 1.3% grade the set slows down and even stops. Everyone came at me, first. I NEVER went after anyone. If i was being a jerk to someone that would be understandable. But I didnt. Am i not allowed to be mad at a game? Show me where I was rude to someone and they came back with a even ruder tone. I was mad at the game, and vented my frustration out and then had people insulting me, because I was mad. Calling me satly. Im new to this world and wanted to try something out and I came here to vent out and try to get help, and the first person to say something tells me Im a salty person. Feels like a great community right off the bat. Clearly they can see Im new because it says "New Member".
     
  24. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    What, that if Im insulted that i should just let you insult me. You still havent offered any supportive feedback. You called me Salty for being upset at a game. Instead of saying "have you tried.....", So how bout you try to do it, and show me and I will write a paragraph apologizing to you for me being salty. Until then, beat feet.
     
  25. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    And thats what I was feeling, I tried so many other things like even disconnecting the pushers to lighten the load, still cant make it up the grade. And I didnt even know there where more manuals, until I reached out to support. I honestly thought this was gonna be a regular game, and it turned out to not be as fun as I thought it would be, especially when I tried asking for more help.
     
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  26. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    My Supportive feedback would be have a better attitude when so say asking for help and not screaming and throwing a tantrum because it isn't going the way you want, we all had to learn and figure it all out by ourselves, so it's very clearly doable, and just for the record dude i haven't insulted you once, i only said you were a angry salty person, not a insult, just a fact that you yourselve has proven with all your messages so far.......
     
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  27. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

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    Apart from your nice triple post, let me again get back at that. It does not matter if you are mad at the game or at the people, the way you wrote out your post in the beginning makes people think "why bother he is just here to vent, we see that every day", which you just stated was your intention anyway. In this forum you will find people who enjoy this game, yet you decided to storm into it, shout about how nothing is working and everything is a piece of garbage, and then expect people to hand you tiny perfect bits and bites that help you. That is not how social interaction works. The people here are very helpful but are not obliged to help you. Like you are not talking to a salesman who ripped you off.

    So I say again, calm down a tad and stop getting into arguments already and while at it get your entitlement toned down as well. Half of your posts include "show me X then Y" as if you were trying to get into fights. This way no one is gonna bother helping you because they don't see you being open to help at all. One has to wonder if "OMFG ALL MY GUTTER LANGUAGE GOT EDITED BY MODS!!! AND I WANT REFUND!!! BOMBARD SUPPORT FOR MISTAKES I MADE MYSELF I DON'T WANT THIS STUPIDITY!!!" is such a great basis for anyone to bother at all.
     
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  28. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I'm just wondering about your avatar...
    I understand, TSW can be counter-intuitive, but ... you definitely fly something, virtually. Admit it :)
    Hope you finally made it uphill. However, my (not only) instruction (signature >>> DPU) may be helpful.
    Let me just add: in the rain, sometimes it is impossible to get to the Sand Patch from the Cumberland side!
    I wish you perseverance :) The game is worth it if you like the so-called simulators!
    PS Today is the premiere of the F-14A (DCS)!
     
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  29. KyleL

    KyleL Well-Known Member

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    I just have a tip when you start off a thread like this expect the moderators to delete the message because you sound rude & un friendly.

    Just say this

    Hello I'm having a problem does anyone know what to do. I'm doing this route & this service can anyone reproduce this issue?

    That sounds a bit more friendly :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2020
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  30. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    Dude calling someone salty is an insult. You dont know me so to automatically form an opinion on me from one thread is not justification to call someone salty. For all you know I couldve been having the cruddiest day of my life wanted to play TSW2 and couldnt get passed a scenario. You didnt, and I'll repeat this, you DIDNT have to say anything to me to me, that felt to me insulting or degrading. You couldve been this guy is salty and kept it to yourself, instead, you chose to come into a thread I created and call me Salty. I obviously do not like you, yet here you are continuing to come back to my thread, because you know I am right and now want to justify your actions.
     
  31. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I didn't like one scenario and from some other people I'm hearing that they are having problems with it too. I don't do gutter language on here, most of my language has been PG. (Holy crap, Now I look back at it, I think he deleted comments where i said the game was terrible and just dissing on the game.) But those posts to and from a certain person, have been insulting to me, where they offer no real insight just name calling. Last I checked no one likes to be called names when learning or being taught something. Had there been more polite interaction, i see this thread going a completely different route. But yes I was upset because I had tried doing multiple things to make it passed this one area and nothing seemed to work. And this game could have gone into better explanations on how things work. But i had to go to customer support for them. I treated this like a game because that's what Dovetail calls it a Train Sim Game. Had i known there would be manuals I would've taken a completely different approach to this game. But this thread was meant for a way to vent out frustration not be called names as you see in the first post I received on here, so yes I went on the defensive, just like im sure many people would have. And I never expected anyone to hand me perfect bits of anything. I honestly thought this would have been read and done away with. But a few post people did offer help and, the best part about it was, THEY WERE POLITE. They asked have you tried this this and this, or try this and have you thought about doing this. Not, hey Salty here's some sarcasm and you being an idiot to see if this helps.
    No matter how dumb something is to someone and that same thing is amazing to you, doesnt give you the right to treat that other person like a jerk, you explain to them why you like it and perhaps show them a better way to enjoy it or even move on and not give 2 cruds about the person who doesnt like it.
     
  32. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I originally didnt have in mind for help, I just wanted to vent and see if i wasnt alone in this case. But now its turned into a big thing.
     
  33. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    I dont fly virtually, I fly in real life. I mean I have been in simulators the company sends me to, to get checked out so i know how to fly them. But I fly Cessna 182 and Cessna Caravans for a private company.

    But the Scenario Q353-Manifest starts you in snow and you stay in snow, so theres a lot of slippage in the beginning getting the trainset moving but once it is its cake, till the grade gets more then .8% then you start losing speed and end up coming to a halt right past Hydeman, and the train even while in forward and in notch 4 continues to slip backwards.
     
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  34. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Oh, super-cool!
    SandPatchGrade is very steep from the Cumberland side.

    It is impossible to develop high speeds, and it is even very probable (e.g. in snow), the train will not be able to do it. It is a bit of DTG's fault. Adhesive physics has been added in TSW2 (the previous one was TSW2020). Weather conditions (and not only) affect train parameters. These, once insufficient, lead to problems today, as the total weight of the wagons has remained the same (the total power of the locomotives has decreased relatively). I will check this service. I'll let you know.
     
  35. krustynuggets

    krustynuggets Well-Known Member

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    Its funny how your still being all aggressive in your posts dude, almost like your trying to over sell that we should be feeling guilty about telling you to stop screaming and throwing a tantrum, well got news for you, nope don't feel a thing, manners, now there's where you horribly went wrong, also again just from your posts people can work out what type of person you are, the way you phrase things and the tone it carries........
     
  36. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    Welp, I don't expect this thread to last much longer.
     
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  37. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    1. The entire SPG Journey is doable. Missions can get annoying because of bugs. Yeah ...
    2. Manifest trains are relatively light - services described in this way should be possible to perform in all weather conditions. I didn't check all the combinations. There is a bit of it ...
    3. It's a simplification, but the hardest part of the SPG is the Hyndman - Sandpatch part. It can be very steep. 1% is steep. 2% is very steep.
    4. Weather can make it impossible to reach the mountain pass. Sand may make this easier, but it is not a remedy for all weather conditions and insufficient power.
    5. The total power of the locomotives divided by the train weight is HPT (HPPT) or horsepower per ton. 1 is a lot, as long as we don't climb the hill. 1.5 usually suffices (dry track). I did not find data for SPG, but the corresponding grades in Mojave Sub require ~ 2.3. The weather can complicate things a bit. Q353 is an overkill. Four AC4400 locomotives (4x4400HP) and wagons weighing 5,474.1 tons. 3.2 HPT. Much too much. Even in such weather.
    6. To obtain these parameters, the correct configuration of the locomotives is required.
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1o7zeIn-Nshe7_bzqkd7hQg2QrV0G9xNvBevPoxTunA8/edit#gid=0
    7. Go to the second locomotive and check the settings. If you turn on Banking Comm you will solve your problems, but only partially (bugs, the behavior of the AC4400 lately ... a lot to tell).

    Let me make a simplified summary:

    Variant A) Banking Comm to ON - 2x4400 HP available (loco # 1 and # 3)
    Variant B) Banking Comm to ON and trip to the second locomotive - 3x4400 available (1, 3, 2)

    That (2.4 HPT) should be enough. Should ...

    8. You are playing on Xbox. It's not good at this point. A walking tour is waiting for you. A little over 870 yards. We want to visit the last locomotive. He has the same disease as friend # 2

    A.png

    These switches should be ALL on the bottom.

    B.png

    9. This ...
    ... is enough only for the [..A..][..consist..][..B..] configuration. [..A..][..B..[..consist..][..C..][..D..] it's a completely different story. Yeah, I know ...

    Whose fault is it, the documentation contains errors? Whose fault is it, in-game options are not working properly? I do not know. Nobody knows! DTG knows. Do you want to take this train to the mountain pass? Instructions above. BR

    PS Treat the throttle gently and patiently.

    UPDATE A little bonus - short version:
    irony-free zone
     

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    Last edited: Nov 19, 2020
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  38. CowBoyWolf

    CowBoyWolf Well-Known Member

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  39. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    Why are you still here?
     
  40. laineshapiro186498

    laineshapiro186498 New Member

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    Its lasted almost 3 months, idk why either ‍♂️‍♂️‍♂️
     
  41. DTG Natster

    DTG Natster Community Manager Staff Member

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    Beyond the fact that this thread was grave bumped it is becoming nothing more than a bickering match.

    I'm not going to lock the thread if you remain on topic, however if I continue to see everyone being aggressive towards one another I will.
     
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  42. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Welp, that's me never attempting to complete a SPG service, unless you can acces those switches through the window in visual 3 I'll have to try that. But why isn't this whole ridiculous thing treated as a bug? Having to walk for 10 to 15 minutes IS game breaking
     
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  43. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I confess without hitting: only recently someone helped me discover [Ctrl] [+] / [-] Be brave! :)
     
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  44. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    I have been brave and loaded one of the lightest consists, made of an SD40-2, GP38 and then 40 cars, I only had to set the Gen. Field on the GP38 (apart from my cab setting of the M2 valve, cut-out valve and my own gen. field) and now if I look into the cab the amps dc dial is indicating power and braking correctly, so this means the loco is ok and is helping me along?

    Everything done through the window in visual 3
    16058113600553261017820745921629.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2020
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  45. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    This is a reliable measurement method in my opinion :)
     
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  46. Doomotron

    Doomotron Well-Known Member

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    laineshapiro186498 I could have written a guide to setting up the train, but I don't know enough to do so, and even if I did, there are people who have replied to these forums who know much more than me who have already helped you. I leave you this brilliant post Winzarten left on the "This Is The Worst Game Ever. I Need a Refund" thread that really sums up this whole situation and I think you can learn from it.
    That is all.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
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  47. VividS550

    VividS550 New Member

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    Hey just out of curiosity, where did you find that operating manual for the ES44DC? It was awesome to read through and I was interested if there are more manuals out there for other locomotives.
     
  48. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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  49. VividS550

    VividS550 New Member

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  50. fizpix

    fizpix Well-Known Member

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    First with end DPU's you have to change the brake valve on left bottom by independent brake front to Lead or dead secondly we all have frustrations like mine are crashes but I deal with it I know why it's my console being 2 years old BTW you spamming the tickets will maybe get you banned Also Have a little patience with the trains if you don't want to deal with waiting use senario planner also be careful with the throttle if you can keep it in the 3-4 area if possible not a guarantee it will work perfectly but try
     

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