Time To Speculate On The New Uk Route

I mean split the service in-game, ie part 1 be Bath - Evercreech and part 2 being Evercreech - Templecombe, instead of it being a single drive from Bath to Templecombe.

 

About passenger services, we have the mk1 tso, bso and bg. There are so many more types even with buffet, restaurant, etc they could add. There were also uncommon mk1 types, like the griddle car which look interesting in its layout. Seems to be a saloon car:

 

Ah sorry, I misunderstood.

 

Depending on the route mark 1's might not be suitable. They were the front line express carriage when introducted and caused the cascading of many pre-nationalisation designs onto secondary routes. Certainly by the end of the 50's and into the 60's it wouldn't have been unusual so see, for example, Collett corridor stock on western region branch lines.

I imagine the on southern their mark 1's would have been mainly working expresses out of London and probably not seen much on the S & D, the Pines Express likely would have been formed of mark 1's, but not southern region ones.

 

We know the route will be set it between 1951 and 1990 so could be a little e that has long since closed

 

I still think (with the talk of vintage coaching, LNER A8s etc.) that it would be very sensible for DTG to introduce steam locos and stock on the first route that could then easily layer onto future routes.

Any stock IMO should be both numerous and omnipresent in most parts of the UK in the BR era (which thanks to the route code we are now pretty sure is when the route is set, unless the code is erroneous or changes).

So I'd be flabbergasted if we didn't get a new set of either maroon or blood & custard Mk1s which I understand to have been the 'standard' coach at the time.

If I were planning for future steam routes, I'd expect either a Black Five, 8F or BR Standard class for anything set outside of the Western Region, and if it is to be a GWR route then probably a 57xx and Hall or Castle. Also perhaps some sort of industrial shunting loco if the route calls for it - a Peckett 0-4-0ST or WD Austerity 0-6-0 for something a bit more powerful? All of these were numerous enough to layer onto multiple future steam routes.

On the freight side, perhaps a van (adapted from BR Heavy Freight set?), open wagon(s) and a suitably omnipresent brake van. If we're lucky maybe some sort of GUV equivalent or Siphon (for a potential WR route). A generic mineral wagon might also be suitable depending on the setting.

Appreciate it's quite easy to go deep down the rabbit hole for fairly niche / localised stock but DTG might be making a rod for their own back by starting off that way.

In summary, one of the key challenges for the steam route will certainly be getting the variety of locos and rolling stock in place to bring it up to speed with the newer released routes. I'd say there is also definitely an opportunity here for DTG to do several loco DLCs however (or indeed have them produced by a third party) as motive power seems to have been significantly more diverse in the steam period than it is now.

 

I wonder if we might go back not just in terms of the time period of the route, but back to the original launch of TSW.

When the first route was released it was Sand Patch Grade and there was only freight, no passenger models, no stations. Given a huge part of the development time now is on the new tech for the locos I wonder if they would think of a freight only line with no passengers (they would have to re-draw them all in period clothing etc)?

 

Even with no passengers, they will need period autos, trackside equipment, commercial signage, buildings… a vintage route is a job of work.

They already have a blood and custard set, they just have to replace the WSR crests

 

If it is the S&D from Bath to Templecombe, I would prefer not to split the services. With a relatively light service pattern I would hope this is one that would not give too much issue with the save game.

Jumping the gun but this is the line up for a summer Saturday at Bath Green Park (courtesy of the SIAM BA61 traffic game). Sorry about the weird formating.

Working Timetable for Bath Green Park, Summer Saturday 1961
Difficulty level 5 Saved as file BA61PRT.SAV
Departures
Time To Formed from Type Length Returns?
01.50 Bournemouth 01.40 Kidsgrove Relief 10 No
02.30 Bournemouth 02.21 Sheffield 10 Yes
02.40 Bournemouth Mail 7 Yes
03.15 Bournemouth 02.55 Bradford 12 Yes
03.45 Bournemouth 03.36 Stoke Relief 10 Yes
04.10 Bournemouth 03.45 Manchester 10 Yes
05.45 Templecombe 05.30 Sheffield Pigeon special 10 Yes
06.10 Templecombe 05.55 Crewe Pigeon special 10 Yes
06.20 Bristol 2 Yes
06.48 Bournemouth 06.38 Bristol 6 Yes
07.01 Bristol 3 Yes
07.23 Bristol 2 No
08.11 Bristol 07.49 Bristol 2 Yes
08.15 Templecombe 06.27 Leicester 6 Yes
09.31 Bournemouth 09.17 Derby Empty stock 9 Yes
09.53 Bournemouth 09.48 Bristol 4 Yes
10.10 Bristol 08.22 Bristol 3 Yes
10.25 Kidsgrove 10.16 Bournemouth Relief 9 No
10.32 Bournemouth 10.20 Birmingham 10 Yes
11.25 Bradford 11.14 Bournemouth 12 No
11.40 Liverpool 11.30 Bournemouth Relief 11 No
11.51 Manchester 11.45 Bournemouth 12 No
11.58 Bournemouth 11.39 Birmingham 9 Yes
12.05 Mchr(Pines) 11.56 Bmth(Pines) 10 No
12.20 Bristol 10.59 Bournemouth 4 No
12.26 Bournemouth 12.11 Nottingham 11 No
12.35 Leeds 12.25 Bournemouth 9 No
12.50 Derby 12.44 Bournemouth 11 No
13.05 Manchester 13.00 Bournemouth 11 No
13.10 Templecombe 12.49 Bristol 6 Yes
13.55 Sheffield 13.49 Bournemouth 11 No
14.05 Bristol 13.35 Templecombe 3 Yes
14.12 Exmouth 14.02 Cleethorpes 9 No
14.18 Cleethorpes 14.10 Exmouth 10 No
14.35 Bournemouth 14.26 Sheffield 9 No
14.45 Derby 14.36 Bournemouth Relief 11 No
14.52 Bournemouth 14.47 Bradford 10 No
15.05 Nottingham 14.55 Bournemouth 9 No
15.30 Bmth(Pines) 15.25 Mchr(Pines) 11 No
15.50 Bournemouth 15.40 Liverpool Relief 11 No
16.23 Bournemouth 15.52 Manchester 12 No
16.30 Bristol 16.22 Bournemouth 5 Yes
16.37 Templecombe 08.42 Templecombe 3 No
17.13 Crewe 16.58 Templecombe Pigeon special 10 No
17.32 Sheffield 17.23 Templecombe Pigeon special 11 No
17.45 Bristol 16.07 Bristol 2 Yes
18.18 Bristol 17.39 Bristol 3 No
19.03 Bristol 18.56 Bournemouth 6 Yes
19.05 Bournemouth 18.47 Bristol 5 No
21.58 Bristol 21.53 Bournemouth 6 No
22.08 Bristol 20.50 Bristol 2 No
22.25 Templecombe 19.39 Bristol 3 No
06.20 Bristol 15.11 Bristol 2 No
07.01 Bristol 22.21 Bournemouth 5 No
08.15 Templecombe 18.00 Templecombe 3 No


Arrivals from S & D line
Time From Type Becomes
08.42 Templecombe 16.37 Templecombe
10.16 Bournemouth Relief 10.25 Kidsgrove
10.59 Bournemouth 12.20 Bristol
11.14 Bournemouth 11.25 Bradford
11.30 Bournemouth Relief 11.40 Liverpool
11.45 Bournemouth 11.51 Manchester
11.56 Bmth(Pines) 12.05 Mchr(Pines)
12.25 Bournemouth 12.35 Leeds
12.44 Bournemouth 12.50 Derby
13.00 Bournemouth 13.05 Manchester
13.35 Templecombe 14.05 Bristol
13.49 Bournemouth 13.55 Sheffield
14.10 Exmouth 14.18 Cleethorpes
14.36 Bournemouth Relief 14.45 Derby
14.55 Bournemouth 15.05 Nottingham
16.22 Bournemouth 16.30 Bristol
16.58 Templecombe Pigeon special 17.13 Crewe
17.12 Templecombe Light engine
17.23 Templecombe Pigeon special 17.32 Sheffield
18.00 Templecombe 08.15 Templecombe
18.56 Bournemouth 19.03 Bristol
21.53 Bournemouth 21.58 Bristol
22.21 Bournemouth 07.01 Bristol

Arrivals from Midland line
Time From Type Becomes
01.40 Kidsgrove Relief 01.50 Bournemouth
02.21 Sheffield 02.30 Bournemouth
02.55 Bradford 03.15 Bournemouth
03.36 Stoke Relief 03.45 Bournemouth
03.45 Manchester 04.10 Bournemouth
05.30 Sheffield Pigeon special 05.45 Templecombe
05.55 Crewe Pigeon special 06.10 Templecombe
06.27 Leicester Parcels 08.15 Templecombe
06.38 Bristol 06.48 Bournemouth
07.49 Bristol 08.11 Bristol
08.22 Bristol 10.10 Bristol
09.17 Derby Empty stock 09.31 Bournemouth
09.48 Bristol 09.53 Bournemouth
10.20 Birmingham 10.32 Bournemouth
11.39 Birmingham 11.58 Bournemouth
12.11 Nottingham 12.26 Bournemouth
12.49 Bristol 13.10 Templecombe
14.02 Cleethorpes 14.12 Exmouth
14.26 Sheffield 14.35 Bournemouth
14.47 Bradford 14.52 Bournemouth
15.11 Bristol 06.20 Bristol
15.25 Mchr(Pines) 15.30 Bmth(Pines)
15.40 Liverpool Relief 15.50 Bournemouth
15.52 Manchester 16.23 Bournemouth
16.07 Bristol 17.45 Bristol
17.39 Bristol 18.18 Bristol
18.47 Bristol 19.05 Bournemouth
19.39 Bristol 22.25 Templecombe
20.50 Bristol 22.08 Bristol

 

I think if I recollect correctly it was a month or two back on a stream someone asked about big boy coming to tsw, shortly after it released on ts. I’m sure they said it would be a much simpler smaller loco to start with until they got their head round it

 

Yes, about the similar effort when creating a route for a different country. Thats why all about steam looks promising, just too much initial effort for a "one time thing". Matt said on a stream dtg is hiring people, so it does not nessecary mean because we have steam, that we will see less modern routes.

 

They were the new BR standard carriage built for mainline use, bare in mind BR still continued building pre-nationalisation carriages into the 50's. Most of the Severn Valley Railways LMS rake were built in 1950.

It is a bit lazy for a developer to assume that any steam period route should appear with a requisite set of mark 1's in an "appropriate" livery.

I think it is likely they will appear as part of whatever route we get but if they appear trotting up a WR branchline behind a Pannier tank that really will not be recreating the traditional branchline scene of yesteryear!

 

That is something I would love to see in TSW.

 

I hoped you would. And the autocar would just add something extra imo.

 

Aye, I too find it an odd choice, when I eventually get WCL I intend to immediately get the mod which disables the 40 and 45 from spawning. The 47 I'm okay with as it's vaguely right and the Mk2s we have are the only current option so it's close enough for me to deal with. The 101 meanwhile I'm always happy to drive (more 1st gen units please).

The 40 and 45 are too far of a stretch for me though, I want things to be as close to authentic as we can in terms of traction and rolling stock the rest of it is close enough for me at least but these two are just too far removed from reality for the time period.

That being said, I wouldn't say no to a 1970s timetable for the route á la DLGW, that would be pretty fun for me

 

As someone who recently bought some OO Pre-Nationalisation coaches (2 Gresley First Class Suburbans and a Thompson Composite Corridor in case you were wondering) I'd really like to see some Pre-Nationalisation coaches in the game, especially Eastern Region ones but that's personal bias

 

Now again this is all speculation as the route might be the other end of the country, but looking at my old copy of The Modeller's Guide To The Somerset And Dorset, Mark Ones were not indeed that common.
The Bristol to Bath locals were frequently formed from an ex GWR "B" set.
ex LSWR 3 sets or Maunsell green sets were common on the Bristol to Bournemouth stoppers or the Templecombe locals.
Anything and everything could turn up on the through inter regional services, LMS corridor stock, LNER and as noted probably only the Pines was solid Mark Ones.

 

If it must include potential for diesel then 1958-1962 would be the best time frame, as anything later and many classes of steam locomotive are beginning to disappear, the GWR 6000 King class were all withdrawn en masse in 1962 and the Coronation class were starting to be withdrawn in the same year for instance. Also, I don’t see why the grand opening steam route should be compromised specifically just to shoehorn more diesel in. There’s already plenty of diesel content in the sim, with more to come. I’m primarily interested in steam and as it stands currently there’s not a single steam locomotive in the sim. The UK steam route should ideally be in the 1950s, and I wouldn’t be surprised at all if it turns out to be an updated “Riviera Line in the Fifties” since it’s already in TS1, possibly bundled with a GWR 6959 Modified Hall and GWR 5700.

 

Pleased that the next route is looking to be Steam era with a steam loco - how long have the guys wanting that waited! However, for the guys who were hoping for the next UK route to be a biggie, i.e WCML/ECML/GEML etc it looks as if they've a long wait.
Going by the cycles (US/German/UK) it could be way more than 6 months? Blimey.
How to solve? Route editor please!

 

Well, with Just Trains in the equation the gaps between British Routes will almost certainly be getting shorter throughout this year

 

They have made or at least published some non British routes. There was the Three Country Corner route for example so it might not just British routes they supply. I would certainly imagine their first offering will likely be though.

 

Sam said this quite a few weeks ago now. Months even.

 

Somerset and Dorset would definitely be my choice, with a Bulleid pacific as a first locomotive or perhaps a Fowler 4F

 

Would be cool to have a graphics option to play in black and white or sepia
Like in TS https://live.dovetailgames.com/live/train-simulator/articles/article/ts20-features

 

Somerset and Dorset would be cool because it was probably my first TS1 steam route.
It had the Black 5 in it as well, hope we get one of those no matter the route

 

I have this nagging doubt that the route for Steam will not be anywhere near what we would like it to be. I hope I'm wrong of course and it is brilliant.

 

If it is the S&D, DTG actually have quite a difficult choice to make. As well as the Bulleid Pacifics, the long distance trains tended to be worked by 9F's, Standard 5's (occasionally Standard 4's), Black Fives and of course the eponymous 53xxx class. It really wouldn't be the S&D without one of the latter though of little use to layer on subsequent routes. The 2P's and 4F's were used either as pilots or on the locals south of Bath. The Bristol locals were usually tank engines.
Yes, I've played the SIAM traffic control to death, even got 100% at Difficulty 5 (once)!

 

I’ve got my fingers crossed for Thomas the Flying Mallard.

As you can tell, I know nothing about steam, so I can’t really join in with the speculation now but this is a very interesting thread to read now it has gone full steam.

 

How dare You! hahaha. I'm not that knowledgeable either. I love the Mallard and the Princess Elizabeth oh and the 1444, lol. Other than that my interest in Steam was when it was in it's early days with engines like Locomotion No.1



Not only was it a two man operation but look at where the driver had to perch himself!

 

I wouldn't be against any of the BR standard classes especially the 4mt 2-6-4s (personal favourite)

Although I do wonder how they'll handle consists as you'd probably have more variety than we've had in current UK routes with Brake vans etc? Maybe as said they can layer in some from the BRHFP as well?

I'd love to see Pick up and drop off goods trains implemented but thinking that might be a bit complicated to implement along with a whole new traction method?

Hate how all we can do is speculate lol! We've waited a year since it was announced and it feels so close now despite there being at least a few months left!

 

A pick up goods could be such an immersive experience, especially if they get the sounds of old unfitted wagons spot on with the clunking, creaking, banging and screeching. This is something I love doing on TS1 setting up a freeroam on a branch line and just shunting wagons in station yards and then going to the next one, you do need to have good sounds though to make the experience complete.

I certainly hope DTG put their heart and soul into a really immersive steam experience, they certainly seem very enthusiastic about it.

 

I've said this elsewhere but there's so much scope for new gameplay using the pick up goods train with a little bit of creativity.

Aside from the challenge of the drive (loose-coupled wagons, constantly starting and stopping, giving way to faster trains when necessary, coupling and uncoupling stock), how about taking it even a step further? Many pick-up freight trains would include a van or siphon on the locomotive end of the train for milk churns, parcels etc.

Why not have the player load them into the van themselves from the station platform? I don't think it would be wildly difficult to achieve (UE4 seems like a good engine for simple activities like picking items up and loading them) although happy for a developer to tell me otherwise!

I'm sure there are other examples too.

Not as a mandatory thing but just to add a little gameplay variety and immersion into the setting.

Pick-up goods more generally I think should be a high priority to include in the timetable as they are part of what makes the vintage steam setting distinct from other routes - I can't think of any others that have anything similar, whereas most other routes at least have a combination of express and stopping passenger and high speed freight.

Given that they only typically ran once or twice a day for most routes, that would hopefully go some way to offsetting the time necessary to program the different elements of the service. It would also benefit the route by naturally varying the content of the yards depending on the time of day, and even if the player never even drove the service themselves, it would form part of the 'World' aspect of a variety of AI trains going about their business. I'm sure it would have been common as an express passenger train to pass a pick-up goods train waiting in a loop or yard!

(As you can tell I'm extremely enthusiastic about this)

 

Or something similar to Snowrunner where you can use the crane to manually load and unload your truck. Most UK Goods Yards in steam days had a small fixed crane which was used to load and unload heavier items. Another widely carried commodity was livestock so stations and yards would have pens and ramps to load cattle, sheep etc into the wagons. Not forgetting horse traffic either! In fact I'm fairly certain on one of the old SIAM games you had Class C (fast, fitted) freight conveying racehorses!

 

I would love to see the Flying Scotsman or Mallard. As two of the most famous I'd be really surprised if they didnt make an appearance before the end of next year. Really would love to try Big boy too (the train, just to be clear you fiends ).

 

Lol I am sure no-one would think otherwise!

I am sure iconic steam locomotives like that will make it into the sim sooner rather than later.

 

Hopefully DTG might have access to some steam period working timetables.

I would love to see some animated animals but not sure we will get to that level of detail.

 

Diggers, animals, anything really In addition to planes, cars and people

 

Yes more features are needed to add life to the routes which is something TS1 often does better than TSW, some TSW routes feel very dead. I noticed particularly on WSR, a tourist line along the coast. When driving on it, it feels like the developers had prior knowledge of Coronivirus lockdowns, empty beaches, no enthusiasts to be seen, just no life in general.

Although, there are very irritating diggers on TS1 which make such a jarring sound I end up going into the route editor and removing them !

 

One other function that would be cool for the steam loco driver is manually operating the water crane to replenish the tender or tanks - similar to the refuelling function on the US diesels. Going around and oiling the bearings every 50 miles might be expecting too much but then again, why not!?

 

I would love to see that, can't see a reason why that wouldn't be possible.

You could have cleaner/fire lighter mode where you arrive at 5am in the morning to prepare the loco for the days work ahead.

 

Having a layer of soot and grime build up over the course of a day on a well-worked locomotive that you could scrub off when on shed or between duties would be great.

 

So not long to wait now until we find out - new steam route to be announced next Saturday at 8pm UK time.

Festival of Rail Announced! (dovetailgames.com)

 

Nice spot Matt.

I really hope it's the S&D.

 

Just read this and I can't wait!
Buzzing!

 

I have no clue what route it will be, but I'm gonna say that something close to Riviera or Somerset in length is likely. I don't see them doing something short like the Falmouth branch, simple reason being that such a route would have a more niche audience. We see complaints all the time about routes that are either slow or short in length, fact is such routes have more limited appeal. And I think when it comes to the first releases of Spirit of Steam I think they're gonna want those routes to have as broad of appeal as possible. Making a 40 mile steam route with two locos might take more effort, but those types of routes will have broader appeal than a very short 10 mile route with only one loco.

 

We really need a "Grand National" thread...
My three would be S&D for the win with an each way bet on Riviera Line and Fort William to Mallaig,

 

In the spirit of Matt's stated wish to visit more of the nations of the UK, perhaps the North Wales Line with a Black Five and Standard 4 Tank, and maybe a Jinty if they're feeling generous?

All good options for layering onto future steam routes and my understanding is that it's quite a scenic route too.

If they instead decide to go WR, then the Riviera Line is surely a strong contender, or one of the Welsh GWR lines of which I know a lot less about.

So much potential for future loco DLCs in any case!

 

I notice they are doing a North Wales preview for TS1 on the same weekend and it made me wonder if that made it more or less likely that TSW will be getting a similar route. (Less likely I thought but I wouldn't be disappointed if it was a North Wales route, particularly with a Black 5).

 

Very exciting. This next week will be the slowest ever no doubt!

If I was a betting man my money would be on a Riviera Exeter to Kingswear route.