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Train Sim World 2: Cinematic Cane Creek

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by DTG Jamie, May 28, 2021.

  1. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    +1. The dynamic brake issue has never been addressed since launch and two US releases in a row (C40-8W and CRR) lacked the banking comm.
     
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  2. Snek

    Snek Well-Known Member

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    The entire route just looks incredible and the environment very well captured, you've done a great job there Skyhook. I'm really looking forward to driving the AC4400CW in a different livery on a route like this. Also, 12 scenarios? That's perfect for a branch like this to make it more interesting.
    Locos look ok and I'm fine with that, but there is room for improvement for the liveries.
    The only big downside for me is the wrong wagons. It would be great to have them, as on a route with only 2 types of trains it's very noticable if one of them is wrong.
     
  3. MetrolinkF125#916

    MetrolinkF125#916 Well-Known Member

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    There might be alot of flaws on the trains, such as the road number font on both locos, but hey, its skyhook's first entry into TSW. Of course they're gonna get stuff wrong! Don't expect the first try to be perfect.

    I just hope they don't take the Rivet approach when it comes to the inevitable bugs on release day.

    I also hope they actually listen to the community and don't repeat the same mistakes, they should learn from these mistakes and build up from there.
     
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  4. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Skyhook made the route and trains but dtg is the game publisher and would have to oversee the content for any new route but if skyhook had wanted to make the correct rolling stock why would they not,was there not time to do it,was it not worth it,dtg didn't make the route but they knew what was going on either way so for knowone in either company to be bothered by the use of incorrect wagons show that someone somewhere didn't care,and as we have seen dtg has recently made this very clear to everyone,dtg shouldn't get a pass,they know what was in development even if someone else was making it.
     
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  5. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Looking really nice. Wonder where this will fit in the release schedule? After CC, but before Rush Hour, or after RH?
     
  6. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I bet on June 24 :)
     
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  7. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    When you look at the liveries of the SD40-2 and the AC4400CW, then you look at the GP38-2 from Peninsula Corridor, it makes you wonder where Skyhook went wrong. Its obvious that DTG had the correct reference materials on hand for an accurate modern UP livery. Hopefully DTG can lend a hand to Skyhook Games here and fix the inaccuracies.
    20190817141604_1.jpg
     
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  8. matjamca

    matjamca Well-Known Member

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    All the photos DTG use to get the detail just right are either being studied by blind people, or all the talk about the level of detail is a marketing ploy. A bit mink coat, no knickers. Silly mistakes happening time and time and time again. It’s exasperating.
     
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  9. MLP Derick

    MLP Derick Active Member

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    the route looks good the only thing I'm not happy about is the 2 bay hopper being used for the uranium train
     
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  10. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    PC is well done.but it's like someone at skyhook was playing with the livery editor and to took a selection of UP makings and applied a asortment of differnt UP items to the AC4400&SD40-2 and totally forgot why they where doing it.
     
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  11. james64

    james64 Well-Known Member

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    Normally freight only American routes are the complete opposite of what I like in TSW2, however I am interested in this route now that I've seen screenshots. It looks so different to anything that's come before. I've only played the tutorials for Sand Patch, and I haven't even bought Clinchfield, but I might just give this one a shot.
     
  12. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    It's not wrong, other than the labeling. UP's OG SD40s were long ago either retired or upgraded to Dash-2s (or relegated to MOW).
     
  13. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    What I mean is, some of us see Rivet, TSG, or Skyhook as saviors. I'm afraid most DLCs are some form of symbiosis between these companies. I don't think the locomotives are made from scratch, and certainly not to prove the superiority of non-DTG products over DTG products. I just hope that the reused trains are working fine this time /o\
     
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  14. MetrolinkF125#916

    MetrolinkF125#916 Well-Known Member

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    And that the audio (cough cough SPG AC4400CW horn and engine cough) isn't the same as the other models, we need a more accurate horn and engine. Oh, and the horn better not lag out when I hold it for 15 seconds while going over a crossing at 10mph!:D
     
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  15. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    It's looking very good to me. I wasn't expecting new locos and, although the stock for the tailings would be nice, I don't spend a lot of time staring at the wagons, so it's not a major issue for me. What is major are properly working dynamic brakes and correctly operating DPU functioning (banking com) on both locomotives. Those are absolutely sine qua non for me. I'd want to be sure those are working before I hit the "buy" button.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2021
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  16. LiquidShadows

    LiquidShadows Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, and that's a big issue when you're talking about people putting up their hard-earned money for something that they want done right. I mean, as excited as I am for this route and as much as I'd love to play it as soon as possible, I'd MUCH rather them be able to take their time and get everything absolutely perfect than for them to cut corners and rush it out just to beat a deadline. I'll gladly wait the extra couple months or whatever it takes for Skyhook Games to be obsessive about this route and drop an amazing product. I don't know about everyone else, but to me $30 is a lot of money to spend just to get a broken DLC that needs numerous future patches and updates when it could have just been done correctly the first time around.
     
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  17. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    So, finally home from work so I can take a better look at these photos on my PC, and man, it isn't pretty.....

    #1 The lead SD40-2 is missing its front coupler in this shot.....
    1.png

    #2. What's going on with the numbering here? The loco is clearly UP 7109, but the rear numbers show 923, and they are not even the same font or color...... Other photos show the same issues as well. Hope this is just a placeholder and not there on release.....
    2.png

    #3 The SD40-2's seem to be missing their rear numbers as well....
    4.png

    Except in this shot (Which was the one with the missing coupler)
    [​IMG]

    Now for some really nitpicky stuff......
    Here is UP 6590 in the preview shots, in comparison to its real life counterpart. One major thing I've noticed is that the door on the nose has had its window removed (Or the door replaced). This apparently happened whenever it went in for its repaint sometime between 2016 and 2017. Seems like all units in this series that got repainted also had their doors replaced too.
    4.png
    [​IMG]

    6590 before its repaint Nov 2016
    [​IMG]

    Another example is UP 6889 as seen in this shot....
    3.png

    However in real life, UP 6889 is an AC4460CW. What is an AC4460CW? This was a convertible unit that was an AC6000CW, but delivered with the AC4400CW 7FDL prime mover, as the original 6000hp 7HDL motor was unreliable......

    Here is 6889 in real life, showing the larger radiator that was part of the AC6000CW car body.
    [​IMG]

    Also the front handrails are not correct for a UP unit, as seen in this comparison shot with a CSX AC4400CW, they are clearly modeled differently.
    [​IMG]

    I really hope that alot of this is just placeholder or WIP stuff, and will be fixed before release......
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2021
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  18. 59321747

    59321747 Active Member

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    When will there be more than 100 miles of US routes? For America's huge railway empire, DTG is really shabby.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2021
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  19. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    One thing I’d like to bring up is potential for layering. We should see the UP GP40-2 from Peninsula Corridor used on this route for shunting and stuff like that. Also I’d like to see the occasional CSX AC4400CW as foreign power, and vice versa for SPG.
     
  20. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    This one is interesting. If you look at Skyhook‘s GP40-2 model in this thread (see quote below), you‘ll notice that it‘s also missing the front coupler. It’s possible that the SD40-2 is coming from the same source (some external rendering software - not TSW) as that GP40-2 model. This could mean that the locos are still work in progress and just put on the rails as placeholders. But I‘m just speculating here.


     
  21. Costpap

    Costpap Member

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    That doesn't look like the SPG SD40-2, if I'm being honest. The headlights on the SPG SD40-2 are placed on the nose, the ditch lights are different, same goes for the trucks. While it may have been originally made by Skyhook and provided to DTG in that picturized form, it's still far away from the final product which was shipped with SPG.
     
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  22. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    It‘s not the SPG SD40-2 in the picture. If you compare the pictures, it‘s obviously the model for TSW2020s GP40-2:
    B3D0FD16-177D-4381-99EE-54E2EA37E10F.jpeg
    Steam
     
  23. rabid

    rabid Well-Known Member

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    Whilst the route looks generally above average to me, the track is by far the worst aspect, visually. The rails look too new and the sleepers (ties) and ballast look almost 2D, like model railroad track with foam underlay ballast. Please Skyhook sort this out before release! :begging:
     
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  24. Daniel Bloch

    Daniel Bloch Well-Known Member

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    The track imposters (2D rail under the 3D rail) also looks horrible even close up they are visible. But that is something I can fix ☺️
     
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  25. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    Scenic landscape, the Colorado River, AC 4400 with "Building America" decals = I like it very much.

    Sure there could be the container cars for the dirty dirt trains. But if you want the loading procedure for them 100% authentic than you need portable cranes that get the container from a truck and load them immediately to the train. I don't know any TSW route which has that.

    So we should be happy that we don't have the potash trains only even the dirty dirt trains are not so realistic.
     
  26. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I'm worried about Cane Creek. I really like what I see, despite the "little" flaws. Hopefully, I won't have to get upset about the brakes or whatever. I feel sorry for Skyhook. If I like something, it usually gets very low ratings on Steam... :D
     
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  27. Challenger3985

    Challenger3985 Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully indeed.
    Not to disrespect Skyhook on this, since this is a beautiful route (as well as other locos for DTG in the past). But looking in the details on the locos, yeah there's a lot of work that needs to be done on them. And hopefully, before they would announce its release date. Otherwise, it would be disappointing to have them as is, and not to have them in the right UP model (not just livery) as accurately as possible.
     
  28. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    I see everyone mentioning the banking comm issue. Why doesn’t dovetail actually implement DPU control as it is in real life? It’s all controlled by one of the MFDs at the control stand. You can have the dpu in sync with the lead engine control or you can do what’s called « fencing » which allows you to have the dpu(s) in a different power or dynamic setting than the lead engines. It’s essential for running long American trains. Run8 has implemented it and it would certainly solve the silly banking comm situation.

    Additionally, where are the PTC screens?? Are DTG American trains apart from Peninsula corridor simply always going to be from the past? Even non functional it would add to the realism. Dovetail has usually done a great job with PZB, and PTC is more or less a visual representation of what you’re acknowledging in PZB.

    To truly get the modern American trains feel I think the computers are essential, and they show up in most class 1 engines nowadays, from gp38-2s to SD70aces. PTC, Trip optimizer(fancy cruise control), dpu fencing, these are all things that are lacking in all the North American trains I’ve seen dovetail put out.
     
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  29. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    If there going to use totally recycled 2 bay hoppers from PC that have no lids to cover the dirty dirt they at the very least should put some kind of barrier car between the engine and the frist hopper car so at least it looks like your trying to do something that looks correct.
     
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  30. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Not all US modern freight locos are DPU capable eg SPG (TSW) variants are not, IRL :)
    Someone, in another thread, put some great data about this. Maybe I can find it.
    I am curious about Cane Creek DLC ones.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2021
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  31. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    Only the AC44 should be DP equipped, I don't think the SD40-2/SD40N are equipped for it, nor do they need it as the Potash Local has no need for them.

    However the "dirt" train should be equipped with 1 DPU unit.
     
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  32. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    I should have specified, I don’t believe any sd/gp locomotives are DP capable in real life. In game though only the AC4400CW should have that as the dash 8’s are not.
     
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  33. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Depends which RR. Norfolk Southern's SD40-2s were backfitted for DPU operation years ago, and I believe CSX's SD40-3s are.
     
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  34. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I should have specified too: not all ACs are DPU capable IRL :)
     
  35. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Well, the screenshots show multiple lash- ups of both AC44 and SD40-2 locos, so how are they remote controlled? Can't imagine they are all individually manned in this day and age.
     
  36. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    We‘re talking about DPU, not MU operations. MU is what you see in the screenshots - multiple locos directly linked together. DPU operations have one set of locos in the front, and one or more sets of locos in the middle/at the end of trains. For that situation, you either need remote control or one crew per set of locos. MU sets are just controlled by all of the cables and pipes you see connected between the locos.
     
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  37. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    The no traffic part is technically how the route is in reality. In reality there are only 2 trains that run on this route per WEEK. They had to add additional services that wouldn't exist in real life so you just wouldn't have 2 services in the timetable mode and so the route doesn't feel completely dead
     
  38. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, of course, you're correct. Had a senior moment there.:) But can we assume there will be no pushers on these consists, given the gradients mentioned in the article?
     
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  39. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    Part of the article :)
    EDIT This was the reason for my considerations. I don't judge realism. I'm worried, "DPU" won't work as it does with CRR.
    There, mainly on consoles, it had unpleasant consequences. Matt promised to see to it this time :)
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2021
  40. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    The Potash Local doesn't run with any, as all of the power is on the head end, as the trains are not heavy or long enough to require any helpers.


    The "dirt" train as I specified above does run with one however. But I think it runs like this to avoid having to run the locomotives around the train since it only runs point to point from Moab to Cresent Junction.
     
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  41. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    If maneuvering is the only reason, I'm less worried now :)
     
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  42. BennyP92

    BennyP92 New Member

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    I am looking forward to this route. Be nice if they didn't use recycled sounds from SPG.
     
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  43. nberneck99

    nberneck99 Well-Known Member

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    Please don’t reuse the SPG sounds, that would completely turn me off from buying it.
     
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  44. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    Searchlight simulation sounds is what this game lacks, there's no loco in game which has the same immersion as their golden beaver loco for ts classic
     
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  45. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I have one more big appeal to Skyhook / DTG (except Dynamic Brakes & "DPU"): initial reduction 6 PSI :) Thank You \o/
     
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  46. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    As I said before I like that DLC very much. And with the UP AC4400 there is a possibility of an Ac44 layer at Peninsula Corridor (PC) with around 50 gravel cars and at the other side substitution of the UP GP38-2 from PC at Cane Creek would be very nice. Especially the most of the potash trains could be easy pulled from a duo of an SD 40 and a GP38-2.
     
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  47. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Yup i really hope that the NA routes start getting more layers.
     
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  48. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    Is that something you can see there? The route doesn't seem to be made for that kind of trains. I would probably prefer UP locos to randomly (with a low chance) substitute on SPG, you can sometimes see locos mixed on freight trains outside their territory, so that would be interesting.
    [​IMG]
     
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  49. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    At most the Penn Corridor only sees local freight to and from South San Francisco, rock trains that originate from a quarry south of Gilroy, and the dirt train from San Fransisco.


    As seen in this video, modern 6 axle power is still relevant on the Peninsula Corridor, even an appearance from a CSX locomotive is possible.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
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  50. KoeleKoen

    KoeleKoen Well-Known Member

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    Would have been nice if they added the gilroy extension like they did in ts classic
     

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