Train Sim World 2 - Nahverkehr Dresden Coming Soon!

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by DTG Jamie, Aug 27, 2021.

  1. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    Ok but that was to be expected. That would still be a license that DTG would then have to buy or do you only mean the tracks if so, that's a real shame.
     
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  2. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Active Member

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    The entire Tramline is not modelled, including the track. It appears it was a lower priority than some other aspects of the route which would of been complicated and took a considerable amount of time to model.
     
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  3. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, seems like a similar issue to what we've seen on HBL, to where the Route Number doesn't properly appear (RE9, RB1, etc.). Is this a true-to-life thing, or is this a sign of the route still being in development/not yet fully implemented?

    TSW2_RushHour_Dresden_Watermarked_Article_Screenshots_1920x1080_13.jpeg TSW2_RushHour_Dresden_Watermarked_Article_Screenshots_1920x1080_2.jpeg

    One thing about this picture though, is I like the new VVO Livery we have on the Dostos.

    This is something we've known in the past, that the IC and ICE services will be coming. Do they have their own lines (High-Speed Lines), where they are able to run with LZB? Also, do other trains like the BR 182 run on this route IRL? If so, is there a possibility of that being included as a layer later down the line?

    One thing this has me wondering is, will all of this work on consoles? We've known how HMA went with the console version and not being able to use the layers, and I feel like this may be a similar situation. Either that or extremely bad frame rates. For some players, this is 7 different trains that could appear on the route. Will we be able to turn some layers off, or are there no performance impacts for console players with these other layers?

    Interesting... most definitely interesting... we know how bad TSW's night lighting is, and I've talked about them hopefully making it to where signs reflect light. Hopefully, this is done correctly. Definitely looking forward to seeing this 'new' Night-Lighting.
     
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  4. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    When have DTG ever done trams?
     
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  5. CrAzZyKiLLa

    CrAzZyKiLLa Active Member

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    I think the point is omitting what some people see as vital scenery as it runs trackside.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2021
  6. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't expect trams to run on the route, but track and tram catenary are fairly big part of the scenery around the tracks for majority of the Dresden section.
     
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  7. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    I suspect the are "new" already - after the last update :)
    It looks 101 is the only one.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2021
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  8. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The article specifically mentions the SKA ICE3M. Since neither ICE3 is really correct for Dresden, the SKA version is the better choice because everyone has it, it's not a separate DLC.
     
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  9. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    No problem. I can drive that loco all day! :)
     
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  10. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    There were times when the S1 was pulled by a DB BR 182.Before the DB BR 146 did it
     
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  11. Swisstrains

    Swisstrains Well-Known Member

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    oh, that’s a pity :/
     
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  12. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    But the new big update for the 146 made it possible to still manually choose your destination. Yes, still only stations from your route. But at least it is not fixed anymore on your last stop, which is a little step in the right direction.
     
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  13. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    The question I'm asking myself right now is How will the new Lighteffect affect the Preservation Crew? Are they already able to transfer it to the old routes? I could imagine that it is too late for PSC and OSD. DTG probably wants to see how the new light is accepted by us before they force it onto other routes.
     
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  14. MYG92

    MYG92 Well-Known Member

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    Did I saw the 143 with destination sign finally working ?
     
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  15. cadeshr6s

    cadeshr6s Active Member

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    No Linenumbers again.... Give us Linenumbers pls
     
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  16. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    Which would be very smart, actually.
     
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  17. marcsharp2

    marcsharp2 Well-Known Member

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    Don't worry, That comment was tongue in cheek lol
     
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  18. Hidden Donkey

    Hidden Donkey Active Member

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    love this loks amazin and perfct in evry way just how i like it be
     
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  19. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    I noticed this as well. It‘s getting rather annoying to see. We‘ve now got dynamic destination boards, but apparently at the cost of line numbers and the actual destinations.

    It very much isn‘t. Not once have I ever seen a German PIS board without line number in real life.
     
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  20. kolesnikvictor

    kolesnikvictor Active Member

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    If DTG didn't cut those branches it would be the best German route indeed. Come on, DTG, please include branches to your roadmap!
     
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  21. Conrad

    Conrad Member

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    I bought yesterday a PS5 to play to Rush Hour.
    Boston runs at 15fps with 2 layers.
    So Dresda I think will be unplayable with 7 layers.
     
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  22. Train Sim 9723

    Train Sim 9723 Well-Known Member

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    Nice to see new dostos livery and some of the architecture of Dresden HBf
     
  23. breblimator

    breblimator Well-Known Member

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    The time has come. The final clash: HMA vs BRD \o/
     
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  24. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    So does this mean we are finally getting retroreflective signage?

    Cheers
     
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  25. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    That sounds like an issue with your PS5- Boston runs great on Series X as does HMA with all layers.
     
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  26. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    I really hope so! :)
     
  27. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    It does on PS5 too, definitely doesn’t run at 15fps.
     
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  28. erg73

    erg73 Well-Known Member

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    So far they haven't extended any previously built routes in tsw. And I don't have much hope for that to change for now so I will try to enjoy the route 100% from day one without remembering the branches. I am sure that, despite their absence, they are going to offer us a great experience with this route.
     
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  29. Conrad

    Conrad Member

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    Sorry, a misunderstanding.
    I bought a PS5 because Boston on PS4 was a nightmare.
    My little big ps5 arrives at my house next week.
     
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  30. saltychipz#3569

    saltychipz#3569 Well-Known Member

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    Might be worth contacting your retailer and enquire about why your ps5 is running at 15fps
     
  31. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    I suspected that’s what you meant.

    Hope you enjoy it.
     
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  32. saltychipz#3569

    saltychipz#3569 Well-Known Member

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    Aren’t the dostos the same shell just in a different livery ?
     
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  33. erg73

    erg73 Well-Known Member

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    You will already appreciate the big difference in terms of fluidity and textures. I was playing with ps4 slim until last week and I am amazed, it looks like another game. And how little time it takes to load everything in the game, it's hit the button and in a few seconds to be sitting in the cockpit. It seems unbelievable :love::love::love:
    At least as far as the next gen versions are concerned, DTG is to be congratulated for the great job they have done. It's a pity that it has been tarnished by everything that happened with the previous generation, but one thing does not have to detract from the other.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2021
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  34. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    I understand now. You will see a big improvement on PS5- enjoy!
     
  35. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    Sadly we don't have the other branches included to the route, but maybe in the future they will get added
     
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  36. WonterRail

    WonterRail Well-Known Member

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    You know, with this first look, I think now is the time for me to lay my thoughts on this whole saga regarding the S-Bahn branches being cut from this route. The reason I haven't commented much on this is because I want to have some time to think about this before making a comment as I think so many people are too quick to overreact, call this the worst thing ever and make the stereotypical claims about DTG such as calling them lazy or the usual, which is what I try to avoid when making a comment on something like this.

    So with that out the way, let me lay my bit on this.

    I'll start by saying this. I, like most people on this forum, was disappointed to find out that the S-Bahn branches had been cut from this route. I know the original TS Classic version that was made only back in February didn't have these included, but these would made this route so much more of a network that what that original route could ever offer and also make the S-Bahn services a little more complete by allowing them to go all the way to their respective destinations. But now they have been cut, they will probably just be services that go in one end at Dresden and out the other side at either Dresden-Neustadt or Coswig. I guess that's not awful, but maybe not quite as worthwhile services as compared to had the branches been included.

    But for me, what I think made people really angry about this situation wasn't actually the news that those branches had been cut, because cuts in development are a typical thing in not just gaming but in all sorts of media/entertainment such as movies, theme park rides, etc. I wouldn't even be surprised if some of the routes we have been receiving were planned to be bigger than what they turned out to be, but were cut due to budget and time constraints. For me, what really made people very upset in this situation was the way this whole thing was handled by DTG. I remember when the news broke that 'Rush Hour' was moving to be more of a Season Ticket DLC and when I first looked at the description for Riesa-Dresden, I just though. "Hmmm, somethings not right here, I'm sure this was longer?" and I just went scrambling around, trying to find out what had happened to this route, and it wasn't until I looked at the FAQ and saw in one of the question about what branches would be included with each of the routes that the two S-Bahn branches had been cut. There was no info about it on the announcement article regarding all of this and not even a reasoning behind why they had been cut. The only thing they said at the time was on the forum where they said that reason they had cut was because 'They didn't want to risk delivering a product that not up to our levels of quality' or something like that, which by the way, I do not believe that reason for a minute considering how most of these DLC's have ended up like. I actually thinks Sam's reasoning on the Q&A livestream they did the following day made a lot more sense than the first description they did about it. I know these weren't his exact words, but he basically said something along the lines of 'doing the branches would have taken this routes production way past the summer release schedule for this whole thing', and judging by what he said on another thread of this forum, it sounded like this whole thing was running behind schedule, which is ultimately why we have the Season Ticket to begin with.

    But you know, the catalyst for this would situation really comes down to one big mistake that set up all of this to begin with...

    …DTG announced this whole thing far, far, far too early.

    …and before anyone brings this up, NO, this being leaked early did not have a single effect on all of this as this did get announced as planned on May 4th. I mean, one thing people forget about all of this is that DTG first reveal all of this during We Are Railfans Railfan Fest in a section talking about upcoming add-ons for TSW2 way back in April, and you listen carefully to that section, they said during that section that more details about it would be revealed on May 4th, and what happened, more detailed were revealed on May 4th, it was just that someone decided they wanted to leak this out early.... whoops. Also, even when it did leak, while the description for Riesa-Dresden stated that it would have some branches, it didn't specify what they were. It wasn't until it was actually announced on May 4th that we found out what those branches were at the time. So those saying that DTG hand was forced after the leak, trust me, I didn't have any affect on all of this at all.

    To explain about this being announced early, take a look back through the years at when DTG announces either big core updates or new games and you will find that they typically get announced around June/Early July time. For starters, the first time TSW was sold as a three route bundle was first announced at the beginning of June, TSW 2020, which swapped out the bundled and added some new features, was announced around the beginning of July and which TSW2, that was announced on June 9th of that year (I remember this as it was the day before my birthday). This on the other had, got fully announced right at the beginning of May, a whole month earlier that usual and I wouldn't be surprised if the details they revealed that weren't all concrete. I get the feeling that DTG was considering the S-Bahn branches at the time and whether it would be possible to do it in timeframe they had, but later decided to cut them as they found out that it would require a lot more work that would of taken the development of this route way past the planned August release. Now if I was in charge of this situation, I personally think this whole situation and the uproar that came with it could have been avoided if DTG did one of the following:
    1. Not have announced it in May and save it until the usual time in June/July: Now say what you will about what happened on that faithful day in July, but imagine this... What if that was actually the first time we ever heard any information about all of this? Now I'm sure there would be those people would have complained about the Season Ticket Idea and I'm sure people would have moaned and how Riesa-Dresden is another 'boring' German Route, but I don't the reaction would have been as hostile and toxic as it ended up begin.
    2. If DTG does do another reveal in May, maybe don't reveal quite as much that maybe isn't final: This I think was another part of the issue as, like I said earlier, DTG did real quite a lot of info in that May announcement that I don't think was locked in. If they were to do another May announcement, I think they should keep the initial details about each route to a minimum. They don't have to reveal what the route are, just say that it would consist of one route from each of the main three countries represented in TSW2, or even giveaway a idea of where each route is located. for example, the first route is set on the East Coast of America, the second is set in the South of England and the final route is set in Western Germany. I remember DTG did this when they first talked about Peninsula Corridor, saying that it would come with the Deluxe Edition of TSW 2020 and that it was a route set on the West Coast of America and said nothing more for a few more weeks. After that, they can gradually reveal what each routes are via the roadmap which would eventually lead up to a big announcement where DTG would reveal all the routes included in full detail. That way, you would keep people in the dark and finding out about each route other the coming weeks would be much more fun that finding it all out in one big shot, only for it change down the line in development.
    3. If DTG does do a big reveal in May and reveals as much as they did back then, maybe put in a disclaimer saying along the lines of 'The details shown here are not final and are subject to change': I think that this is something that DTG maybe needs to consider if they are to try and pull off something like this again in the future. Now I don't remember if there was a message like this when they announced it back then, but if there was one, it would make people a lot more weary about the details being shown and I also think that if something was cut from a route, they should also give a statement saying why this change has been made.
    In the end, I don't think DTG will add those branches back onto this route, or at least not in the short term. But if the biggest thing they take from this is not to be so eager to announce a big new update when they haven't finalised most of the details about it, then that would be something that would leave people just as satisfied as if they had actually gone back and added the S-Bahn branches to this route. But even after all that has happen, do I think this route is now all of a sudden going to suck?

    …well...no, actually.

    One thing I have not liked about peoples reaction to all of this is that people are acting like DTG took all of the branches out of this route. Well, not really. Even if the two S-Bahn branches were taken out, the spur to Großenhain is still included, as is the high speed line that runs alongside the main line. I know they are not much, but a few small branches are still better than no branches at all. But besides that, this route still has a large variety of traffic running along it, has quite a busy timetable especially around Dresden, travels along two different paths between it's two main destinations and even includes some shunting services with the 363 (something that's sadly be lost in all of this), and even if most of the locos coming with this are reused from other routes, this routes timetable still offer some much more variety of traffic than say a route like Hamburg-Lübeck could ever offer.

    We will find out next week what this route will really be like when it gets shown off for the first time in two preview streams (including one that was delayed from this week) but for now, regardless of how it turns out, this is looking like a route that will be good, not great, not brilliant, not amazing, just good, and sometimes that's fine...

    …it's just a shame this whole thing will forever leave a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths.
     
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  37. Mkdog45

    Mkdog45 Well-Known Member

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    Heres a cab ride in a talent 2. (Video is not my own.) Whole video is Leipzig to Dresden and Riesa to Dresden starts at 36:26.
    Enjoy.
     
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  38. drnicktgm#1259

    drnicktgm#1259 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not disappointed, that we don't get the beaches for the route, but still these beaches would be really interesting to have and would also be fun, and as more route we get as more there is to explore
     
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  39. Shaun123

    Shaun123 Well-Known Member

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    How did you get that from an article, without even seeing a stream first?

    And thought you’d given up with TSW2 anyway?
     
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  40. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    I agree, it would be great to have some accessible beaches in the game, maybe some proper German Strandkorb to use there as well. :D

    (sorry, I had to)
     
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  41. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    And i thought not introducing the branch lines would've annoyed the german players the most
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2021
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  42. grob-e

    grob-e Well-Known Member

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    Well, on the Elbwiesen, you can find some Strandkörbe, even a Strandkorbhotel, not sure if it was modellen on this route...but now for something completely different...

    Back to WonterRail

    1 and 2) I think the problem began much earlier. Somehow, most people expected the announcement of this years routes in january. Plans changed between christmas and new year, and the announcement of new routes were postponed week by week, just to present us the rush hour bundle. At this point with four month "delay", there has been much pressure on DTG, and they needed a big announcement. According to that, they revealed almost everything, that was planned by then, even they haven't been sure if all of that they announced could be delivered. Maybe it would have been better, revealing in January something like, for steam, we need a engine Upgrade, which will come in summer, as usual, and alongside of it, there will be the typical route bundle out of the big three, which would be commuter orientated.

    Revealling or uncovering more and more of it would maybe had been the better strategy, then having the "blow away"-announcement they had on the 4th of may. They hyped something beyond and then answered to the pressure they have been building up for themselves. Not the best way, but not reversible.

    Looking forwards, what stays on Dresden Riesa? It will be the longest german route counted in drivable track, it contains all possible service types from shunting with the 363 to iCE services. It adds more content to the BR 101 DLC, the Hl-signalling system has it's premiere in TSW and finally, "old" locos will be updated to the "state of the art". And this for 12 Euros, can't pay one hour of work for a single programmer with that amount of spendable money. .Well, so why not just relax, watch the streams, ask your questions, and decide afterwards, if you'll buy it or not.
     
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  43. Cd1990

    Cd1990 Active Member

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    Wondering if the 143 on Dresden will also sub-in elsewhere? Or would one still have to purchase RSN?
     
  44. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    In general, locos only layer into routes released after they are, because the layers for them have to be built into the route. Therefore none of your existing routes will have layers for any Dresden-version locos, just the older versions. (The one exception so far is the revised RT, where Adam built a new timetable from scratch)
     
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  45. Callum B.

    Callum B. Well-Known Member

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    It is possible for new trains and wagons to sub in on old routes if they are similar enough in the eyes of the substitution system. For example, Cane Creek hoppers sub in on Oakville, the DB BR 112 subs in on HRR, and the ECW Class 66 subs in on GWE.

    The primary question is not whether the trains are compatible to be subbed, but rather will Dresden unlock the substitution. It is possible to have trainsets that will substitute to another route but won't because the user does not possess the correct route to unlock the layer in the first place. Example: WSR has a Class 101 layer which will sub in both the Class 101 from NTP and the one from TVL. However, even though I own NTP, the layer is not unlocked for me because I don't own TVL.

    The point I'm making is that it's very likely that the Dresden trainsets will behave in such a way: the Dresden sets will likely substitute onto other routes at launch but perhaps only as a variant of the existing substitution available—not a replacement.

    Cheers
     
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  46. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    I get from what is the standard of DTG. And already lots of people are ponting innacuracies like i predicted, typical dtg. Poor last gen consoles that will get slowly abandoned and will have more bad treatment costumer, because dtg is getting confortable with the new gen, and will put even less work than they did, last gen got more scamed than all of you. And you're right, TS > tsw
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2021
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  47. Conrad

    Conrad Member

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    Thanks for the infos.
    I'm excited. It was a real adventure to buy it here in Italy :D
    Are you playing with a 4k monitor?
    I have a fullhd and I'm planning to upgrade only at the end of the year.
    What Do you think about textures and graphics at 1080p? Is there much difference with a 4k?
     
  48. JonnE

    JonnE Well-Known Member

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    saltychipz#3569 and solicitr :

    Of course I meant the right livery for the DoStos, but that should be enough this time ;)
    Unfortunately I know the real route only from MSTS days (it had branches in Leipzig back then! :D) and videos but there seem to be no high entry Dostos in use there.
     
  49. bobbobberdd

    bobbobberdd Well-Known Member

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    I can assure you, the VVO uses low entry DoStos
     
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  50. Matěj Houska

    Matěj Houska New Member

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    Will there be AI BR 101 trains on the upper platforms at all as a replacement for EC Berliner? EC Berliner consists of ČD Vectron locomotive, ČD Ampz wagon, ČD Bmz, ČD restaurant car ?. EC Berliner runs on the route Praha hl.n - Berlin hbf and stops in Dresden Hbf and Dresden Neustadt. [​IMG]
     
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