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Train Sim World 2 - The Definitive Dash 8

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by TrainSim-James, Nov 26, 2020.

  1. TrainSim-James

    TrainSim-James Staff Member

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    [​IMG]

    Written by: Gary Dolzall.

    General Electric produced more than 1,700 “Dash 8” diesels and the definitive version of the Dash 8 series was the C40-8W, which now comes to Train Sim World 2 in CSX livery!

    READ MORE
     
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  2. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Ok. Here are my thoughts on this. I am very disappointed in the sounds. Why did you not use your sounds that you recorded from the Amtrak Dash 8?
    I have noticed a couple of bugs, one big one is that after using the dynamic brakes, when you put the throttle to idle, a few seconds later the amps kick in as if you applied power. Also, the brake pipe needle immediately jumps back to 90 psi regardless of train length, and it jumps around a bit. Another thing I noticed is that I can't seem to figure out how to set up MU headlights. Not sure if it's a bug, or if I'm doing it wrong.
    I haven't played with this yet, but it seems that you can cut out traction motors, which, if so, is a cool feature.
    Overall, aside from the sounds, it's not bad.
     
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  3. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    From what I've seen, it looks and sounds pretty good. I'm really disappointed the same awful horn was used. Also in the release video, the coal loads look really flat and textureless.

    There is a switch on the back wall of the cab to set up MU headlights. I don't know if it works properly, but I know there is a switch.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
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  4. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    How can you say it sounds good? Do you know what they are supposed to sound like?
     
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  5. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    The problem is, I think, that they’re making money either way. Most people that want this will buy it, even when it doesn’t meet their expectations. Maybe if people would not buy this until it gets better sounds, that would force them to make a change. Another thing is, Dovetail pretty much has a monopoly on good train simulators. They don’t have to be up to high standards because they don’t lose out to any competition when they do something wrong.
     
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  6. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    The Amtrak Dash 8, being a passenger locomotive, has HEP which alters the overall sound. Would not be good for a freight locomotive.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
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  7. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    I’m sure they could have got something from those recordings. Maybe they could switch the HEP off? They at least could’ve used the horn sounds from it instead of reusing the horn that I’ve heard was supposed to be a placeholder. Or they might be able to get somebody in the US to get new recordings, I do understand that it’s not a good idea to travel right now.
     
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  8. Agent Qracle RUS

    Agent Qracle RUS Well-Known Member

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    And that why i never buy dlc or games right now , only exception is Cyberpunk 2077)))
     
  9. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    It was a video (not really the best way to judge sounds I know).
    And yes, I do know what they sound like. I live very near CSX tracks where C40-8Ws were the number one locomotive running on the line.
     
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  10. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Searchlight Simulations are jerks and refuse to help DTG.
     
  11. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    The Amtrak B32-8WHs had different horns installed than the C40-8W, iirc.
     
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  12. Challenger3985

    Challenger3985 Well-Known Member

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    Here's my thoughts on the Dash 8 and it goes like this:
    • Model - Pretty good, especially in the cab. (except for a few details that aren't working properly or just missing)
    • Livery - only the Yn2 (I know a few have Yn3 and fewer with Yn3b. Just a thought for the future.)
    • Rolling Stock - Very well done (except for one of the wheel axles being funky.)
    • Scenarios - Slippy Decent is pretty fun (That's all I can say, you'll have to play it yourself to see why)
    The only issue that I'm disappointed about, it's the sounds. Reused from the old AC44 (both engine and horns) without improving it.
    That's all I have to say about the Dash 8. See ya.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
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  13. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, maybe an audio engineer could do that. I'm not an expert. I don't know if it is a separate engine or part of the prime mover on the Dash 8 32BWH. I think they said in the writeup that they had used sounds from "the real locomotive ".
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
  14. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    What does Searchlight Simulations have to do with any of this?
     
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  15. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    That’s what I was gonna say, also, where did you hear they were jerks? I just know they have good horns, and I hope DTG can get their horns up to a similar standard.
     
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  16. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Great. Just a quick question, are the physics the same as the AC4400? If they are I am definitely not going to buy it
     
  17. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    So I won’t be able to watch the stream today due to it being at the worst possible time (come on, an American stream at 3:00 Eastern on Thanksgiving?), but I assume they will address the sound concerns. Based on what I’ve seen, I will definitely purchase this if the sounds get a large upgrade, it seems like a decent loco with a ton of interactive things in the cab. And if this one gets a sound upgrade, maybe they could update all SPG sounds, that would be nice. Man, I wish I was on PC and I could get mods to fix the issue...
     
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  18. RommieG

    RommieG New Member

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    Even without HEP, the sounds from the Amtrak Dash 8 would not be accurate for this locomotive. Amtrak's B32-8WH are fitted with GE 7FDL12 prime movers, whereas the C40-8 family is equipped with the larger 7FDL16 prime mover. All we can hope is that if they eventually do a locomotive with the 7FDL12, they use those recordings.
     
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  19. Big Papi34

    Big Papi34 Well-Known Member

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    Just got it. Other than the horn being udderly sad and it sounding like the ac44, I love it. Took me a year to get moving due to forgetting to turn on the generator . However, I hate, and I mean absolutely despise one feature: wheel grind. Its a very realistic feature that absolutely kills me. My review is a 9/10, due to the horn. Ive surprisingly never been bothered by how the engine itself sounds.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
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  20. Trainmania100

    Trainmania100 Well-Known Member

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    Wish someone would do something about the dovetail games website it's so slow, caching definately needed
     
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  21. Challenger3985

    Challenger3985 Well-Known Member

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    Well, I've done the Slippy Decent Scenario (Which is with two Dash8s at the front with coal loaded 3-Bay Hoppers to pull). And while the sounds of the Dynamic fan is the same as the AC44 (It's just too sucky to say), I can say the HP is a little less powerful (Which is accurate). But, it's still manageable driving downhill on Dynamic Brakes. Like an SD40-2 does on eastbound trains (But I'm playing TSW2 on Xbox so the result may vary if on PC). That's all I can say about that.
     
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  22. Big Papi34

    Big Papi34 Well-Known Member

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    Funny thing I had the dash 8. I got a intermodal rolling to track speed with it allot faster than I have with an ac44. Glitch maybe?
     
  23. Richard CZE

    Richard CZE Well-Known Member

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    Hi. Can you explain to me what the AFM indicator is for?
     
  24. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you DTG for bringing out the Dash 8.
     
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  25. wxtr7

    wxtr7 Active Member

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    Why? Just why...
    I've only tested it out enough to hear the sounds used, so that's all I'm going to focus on...
    Within 2 seconds of hearing the engine audio, it just reaffirms my idea you don't care about the quality of American DLCs. The German stuff in the game is really, really good probably the best. I don't own any UK stuff other than GWE (it doesn't interest me), but from what I've seen its up there too. And then there's the US and Canada, well separated from the rest. And don't get me wrong, I enjoy the German routes I own, but I live in the US and have lived with a CSX track about 100 ft from my house for 13 years. I know the sounds of the locomotives, the deep rumble as its approaching, the horns, and that's what I'd like to see replicated in game. Nothing will ever replace the real thing, but you can get close with time and effort.

    Searchlight's AC4400 for TS1 is absolutely amazing considering it works on the archaic engine of TS1 and that is the quality TSW should be striving to meet, for all routes and locos. I'm not suggesting a partnership here, but merely making a point. TSW isn't TS1 and the standards used for that game SHOULD NOT be applied to TSW. This should be a new era where instead of settling for low quality best we can do sounds, graphics, etc..., you strive to make it as realistic and immersive as possible. In many areas, you've achieved this, but not audio.

    Reusing the AC4400 engine audio that you know isn't good (because there's plenty of forum posts on it) is the epitome of being lazy. I realize we're in a pandemic, which makes sourcing things difficult but there are ways you could've done it. You've shown on other DLC you're willing to reach out to and work with third parties, it would've been nice if you'd could establish some working relationships here in the US/Canada too to make some much needed improvements.
    I'll let others rant about the pathetic horn, but same idea applies...

    I posted this on another forum post, but reposting here...
    This is what the 7FDL-16 engine (AC4400 & the coming C40-8W) should sound like from a compilation video I found on youtube. Notice, the 4 stroke engine means it has a much more bass-y feel chug sound, and the turbo DOES NOT overpower the engine, even in the higher power notches. It doesn't end up sounding like a vacuum, or as the other forum described, a jet turbine. it sounds like a big 16 cylinder diesel engine



    **NOTE not all in this video is 7FDL, some are GEVOs, but AC4400 is found at...
    2:50-3:10
    3:50-5:17
    5:45-end

    Hopefully Skyhook will pick up the slack and provide us some hope...
     
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  26. Railfan722

    Railfan722 Well-Known Member

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    Really? Because that's not the story I heard.
    [​IMG]
     
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  27. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    My favorite part of these locomotives is the amazing chugging sound of the engines. That video made me so happy inside :D
     
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  28. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    It would have been better than what we have now!
     
  29. wxtr7

    wxtr7 Active Member

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    I don't know much about the full story of the DTG-Searchlight relationship, and I don't like basing ideas off of quotes out of context/without knowing the whole story, but assuming there's nothing else to this, I am livid.
     
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  30. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I'm waiting for a big sale before picking this one up, but I have to praise the weathering. From the screenshots in this article, both the interior and exterior look fantastically textured; it really looks like a locomotive that's had a hard, well-used life.
     
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  31. JGRudnick

    JGRudnick Well-Known Member

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    I think I'll get it. It seems to have a few issues, that will hopefully be fixed. I can deal with the sounds not being great. Although I may wait until the Christmas sale before buying it.
     
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  32. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    I hope you have some fun with the AC4400 CW and the SD 40-2 in the meantime.
     
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  33. rhysrobinson336

    rhysrobinson336 Member

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    It’s just an air flow metre like on OSD.
     
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  34. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

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    I agree with all of this. For me, I no longer give DTG any of my money... I can’t see rewarding them with any more of my hard-earned cash for code that doesn’t live up to their promises, or my expectations. I expect they’ll continue to do what they’ve been doing: hyping up their products, under-delivering on the promise, fixing only a fraction of the issues in their code, then moving onto the next ‘new’ product.

    The writing is on the wall at this point with DTG- you get what you get with them, they’ll only do what’s needed to keep the money stream coming in.
     
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  35. feuer1998

    feuer1998 New Member

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    Hello,

    I have a question, how do I use the Dash 8's distributed power when I have both front and rear locomotives?
    At least with me, the radio cannot be operated.

    Is there another way to control the rear locomotives?

    Greetings
     
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  36. wxtr7

    wxtr7 Active Member

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    I finally got a chance to watch today's stream, now that Thanksgiving is done, and I like that there's some hope and they are very clearly open to working with 3rd parties for source material. Hopefully that will be some motivation to get that train rolling (excuse the pun).
    I do find it a little worrisome that they have some things on their list to still look at to implement with the Dash 8 as that gives off a "rush the bare minimum and maybe come back later" feel (nothing new however), considering the only "coming back to it" so far has been the launch of a new game. I'm taking everything with a grain of salt, but I am encouraged by DTG continuing to move in this new direction that's come with TSW2.
     
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  37. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    On stream they said that anyone who has sounds for American locos, to please let them know. They also announced a possible partnership with Searchlight Simulations for better sounds, which might be finally answering my prayers of this happening. I'm not keeping my fingers crossed though, since we've all been disappointed in the past. But I keep going back and looking at TS Classic content, and all I can see is better sounds, better quality. The "next gen" sim, TSW 2 should be at least up to those standards, if not better. It really makes me want to get a good PC, maybe then I could at the very least install mods for TSW 2 (I still think it's the superior simulator overall).
     
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  38. docsnyder1911

    docsnyder1911 Well-Known Member

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    A provisional solution for the horn issue could be, that the horn from the F40 would be used till DTG has original recordings. I know it would not be the same horn like that from Dash 8 and 9, but it would sound much more impressive than the actual horn sound of the Dash's.
     
  39. niveous

    niveous New Member

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    As nice as the car body appears on this model, I can't believe the HOTD doesn't even function and Matt P. in the stream states no idea when or if it might? How is releasing incomplete add-ons moving in the right direction DTG?
     
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  40. jeremydunn8

    jeremydunn8 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, it seems strange that these add ons which supposedly passed through beta testing with the QA team would have so many issues. Either the people working for QA know nothing about trains, or DTG wasn’t listening to them. But I don’t see why we need a beta when the DLC is incomplete either way.
     
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  41. jörgen Näslund

    jörgen Näslund Well-Known Member

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    I think this is one of the best locomotives they have made.
    It really feels right when driving it. Drove coal train. It feels really heavy in uphill and if feels heavy downhill.
    It feels "Run8" But I agree with sound. This loco with engine real sound would be awesome.
    Sound it is very important. so it is impossible to get the highest rating.
     
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  42. 4-COR

    4-COR Well-Known Member

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    their QA team seems to be non existent at this point. pretty much every release has at least 1 or 2 glaring issues that could have been identified by playing the product for 5 minutes
     
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  43. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    They did ask for the community to provide sounds if they can. I was surprised to hear that to be honest. There was a post on the forum recently from someone who had obtained the real recordings for the voice commands in the cab of a train, offering them to DTG to fix what they had put in. I can only assume they took him up on his offer if they are receptive to this approach. I only wish I could help too.

    I thought it might get a but dangerous asking the community for sounds as anyone with a smartphone would be offering their own recordings of doors closing on trains and it would get overwhelming for them sorting the wheat from the chaff but if someone can provide decent professionally recorded authentic sounds for anything already released or on the roadmap that leads to better sound in the game then I hope they get the offers they require.

    On top of authentic sounds, well recorded, those sounds need to be implemented well in the game. That’s as much a problem as the sounds themselves. They have definitely heard from the players that it needs to improve so hopefully this public request for sounds is part of a whole new approach to making the sounds as good as the visuals. Giving the devs enough time to get it right, and having the right people doing it, seems to have worked with the UK preserved collection trains. That attention needs to be across the board.
     
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  44. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    The issue the QA team face is that they’re probably well aware of all the issues raised, however the list is probably so overwhelming, that they have to pick and choose what to fix. Coupled with the fact that they’re quite literally forced to release a product regardless of its condition, it doesn’t make a good combination.

    Long story short, there’s not enough staff and too little time to do things as we’d like them to be.
     
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  45. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    The poor sounds of the Dash 8 now make me worried for the F7 thats gonna come with the Clinchfield route. Wouldn't be surprised if they either copied the old sounds from the Kuju F7 or use something else that doesn't fit....
     
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  46. Big Papi34

    Big Papi34 Well-Known Member

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    I have an idea. Why don't they reach out to model train companies like Scale Trains Intermountain and Athearn and ask to use their sounds? I mean, they can't be any worse than the ones we already got.​
     
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  47. treid09

    treid09 Guest

    Hi everyone,
    I don't usually join in on threads like this, but I figured that I might chime in on this one.

    First, everyone is entitled to expressing their own opinion, but bashing DTG, Searchlight Simulations, or a third-party developer does no one any good. This is something that has irritated me about the train simulation community for a long time. I have seen some pretty foul posts on social media (not usually on these forums), by developers aimed towards everyone from individuals who are trying their best to develop their own content, to the main developers of the games themselves. Just because someone's content doesn't measure up to the highest standards doesn't mean someone has the right to deride another's work. There is fine line between simply stating your opinion, and just being rude. (Stepping off my podium now...)

    Now for my opinion on the matter about the Dash 8 and the sounds....
    I don't think it sounds too bad. Not great, but not too bad. I have listened to 7FDL16 many days while railfanning, and this is not extremely far off. It is missing the authentic feel though (needs more of that four-stroke clatter and rattle, it also needs traction motor sounds, which is the high pitched whine at medium to high speeds.)

    As for the bugs, I think we should all remember that even the most highly-held locomotives ever created for TS, all have bugs when released. Even Searchlight's vaunted AC4400CW (a reputation rightly earned), has had bugs. When it received its massive update recently, they had several weird issues to be fixed. DTG will fix the Dash 8's issues in time. They don't have a roadmap for nothing.

    As for a SS/DTG partnership, I won't say much besides that I am hopeful that they do indeed partner together on North American content. Searchlight has already reached to out DTG before (according to what they have said), and Anthony Wood, their sound engineer, did the revamped sounds on Train Simulator's Sherman Hill route. I am not saying that they are perfect, but they have earned a great reputation in the train simulation community and bring fantastic content to the game.

    While there are issues with some of DTG's content, lets all be thankful for the fact that DTG has a passion for this community. They put a lot of effort into their products. These guys are under time and budgetary constraints that third-party developers aren't always under. Instead of complaining about every issue and whether the product is exactly what we want, lets give DTG our support and help improve their products. For example the sounds: I think that it is amazing that DTG says they are wanting to work with third parties and individuals to improve sounds! Dovetail Games is across the Atlantic Ocean, and they just can't pop on over to the US to record sounds for a particular locomotive, as this costs $$$. However, they can partner with people like Searchlight Simulations to get those sounds into the game, and I think that they are beginning to realize this.

    Sorry for being long-winded folks, thanks for the time!

     
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  48. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    That's what they did for the CSX locomotives.
     
  49. Big Papi34

    Big Papi34 Well-Known Member

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    They obviously didn't pick Athearn or Scale Trains then...
     
  50. Trainmania100

    Trainmania100 Well-Known Member

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    Driving a dash 8 / gp 38 double header with a double stack no bankers, struggling to get above 25 on a flat surface notch 8, can't see this getting up the hill...
     

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