Train Sim World - Roadmap Update 21/09/2021

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by DTG Jamie, Sep 21, 2021.

  1. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    For the long distance routes, yes.
    Then maybe something(s) else for regionals including Northern, Scottish, Welsh, South West (and I don't mean SWT which is South West LONDON rather than South West England for the most part)
    Would just save so much money on repainting trains when most people couldn't care less about whether their train is red, blue or polka dots so long as the seats are comfy (and numerous) and the train arrives where they want to go within a certain amount of time
     
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  2. Blacknred81

    Blacknred81 Well-Known Member

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    And still no word from Skyhook on whether or not they will fix the bugs with Cane Creek.....
     
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  3. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    Skyhook is Terrible and worse like Rivet.
    I don’t trust none of them
     
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  4. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    That’s not the issue on the old 143. On that model there is no screen graphic where the screen should be but a luminous pale grey blank panel with no interoperability of any kind instead.
     
  5. grdaniel48

    grdaniel48 Well-Known Member

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    Ohh... Ok. I mentioned I was not specifically sure about BR143 Thanks Stujoy about it!
     
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  6. CC Johnson

    CC Johnson Active Member

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    No, it's a bug, I think the textures are missing. The screen is just blank white, not the actual ebula screen with white background.
     
  7. moofeen#2182

    moofeen#2182 Active Member

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  8. schorni

    schorni Well-Known Member

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    I take it from the roadmap stream that it is too much effort for DTG to do routes from other regions, so? To refer to external developers already seems very amusing, since no one is in sight. And the only two currently doing anything aren't delivering new regions either and are no longer trustworthy. Both refuse to fix their current routes.
    So we will see over and over again "the same" from England, USA and Germany, instead of that one wants to offer times variety? Ok, then in the future many DLC will no longer be on my buy list.

    Why are announcements on trains a licensing issue? From my point of view, it is more important to have announcements at all than to have any original speakers or texts. This is not needed.

    Updates should become easier, it was once said. What do we experience now? Nothing has changed. We have to wait forever until we get bugfixes.Sorry DTG, but you don't give me the feeling that you really care that the customer has fun with your product and that you really take him seriously.
    This is also shown by the fact that you just accept that the RH routes will not be released "in summer", although we have always doubted this and you were not tired to say that everything will be released on time. Even a proper apology or explanation would probably be too much for you, after it has been delayed on the one hand and on the other hand has become more costly than originally announced?

    Credibility and trust are the things that a company that wants to sell products should not put at risk. Unfortunately, you, DTG, do that again and again. That's a shame for the normal workers and a shame for the product. But you don't give me the feeling that anything will change and therefore the company management obviously doesn't care, as long as someone buys something.
     
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  9. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Calm down, i really dont need any rushed out content. It has be told many times. A product should keep up the quality. So you wish a release on the exact announced time. First after release the bugfixing is more complicated, second the forum would be spammed of all people complaining.

    No sorry, but i really want devs take their time. Its not that we had to wait 3 months..

    About other regions: there is a thread here, which focuses on just trains. After i made a ticket, i got a reply that they plan to bring content for tsw 2. Nothing official announced, but i have hope. We have our first tool from the community, which can be called an editor. So if devs are lazy enough to not look into other regions, this routes are gonna be made by a modder for sure.

    I totally agree with the announcments. Better have them implemented with different voice or message than nothing.

    To me the working pis screens are a giant step forward.
     
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  10. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Well-Known Member

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    It's DTG's duty to release a product at the time they said it would come. I suggested a little while ago that they give us dates close to release. That way the likelihood of a product coming out at the announced date is increased, and they also have time to work on the product and make it a high quality. You can't be upset because someone is upset that a DLC wasn't released when it should've. If DTG set expectations, then we expect those expectations to be met. Nobody (as far as I know) forces them to announce routes/locos so early, and also then give a release date early too. I'm happy for a product to take years if it needs it, just don't lie about it being released at a particular time.
     
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  11. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    Very unjust way of wording it. "Lie" means that they tell us a date while knowing that this won't happen. I see no logical reason - not at all - why they should do that willingly? What kind of benefit will be granted with that?

    What they do: As soon as they feel confident about something, they announce a date. But sometimes a big bug or something else is found - would you want to release them anyway? Because i think the more logical way would be to say "Sorry, we thought we could release this DLC on this date, but then something happend and now we postpone it. It is what it is, there you go".
     
  12. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Well-Known Member

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    "Lie" was too extreme, and so I take that back, however I think it gets my point across. Big setbacks or bugs that delay release are usually found early enough. In my opinion, the release date should be announced when the product is in testing. So as they're doing thorough testing, at the same time they can start building the hype and teasing.
     
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  13. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    LWDAdnane But this is exactly the case, isn't it? When QA and testing looks like it's done, they usually put the DLC in the "upcoming" section of the roadmap.
     
  14. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Well-Known Member

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    Yep, that would be the perfect time for them to announce a release date :)
     
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  15. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    LWDAdnane you see, it's a learing curve. Back in 2017(?) they announced steam, multiplayer and the editor waaay too early. They learned from their mistakes as of now, they do not announce a date until they are 99% sure that it's ready (of course, a big issue can still occur - QA can NEVER find all the bugs. Only like 20 people for QA vs. thousands of players: of course players will find bugs that QA never came accross because everyone plays a bit different)
     
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  16. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    They put out release candidate pictures of BML and within five minutes the community had reported issues that put back release.

    The problem with your argument is that it leads to NO release date ever being given, mainly because DTG know their in house processes don't catch what we do.

    The main issue isn't with DTG though. The issue is with people building their life expectations around a game and then getting irate if things get delayed by two weeks. I'll say that again, they build their life expectations, around, a GAME
    If people just chilled a bit, realised this is not an important thing and just got on having a laugh poking fun at DTG's wonky cranes and an apartment block for a station building then they'd likely be happier.
     
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  17. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Well-Known Member

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    I think the best case scenario, which I've mentioned a little while ago on here, is to either 1) release some sort of public beta, or 2) do streams which are meant for us to catch stuff out and bring them to DTG's attention. I think my first point would the better one. After either of these things, then we can have preview streams which is intended to showcase pretty much the final product
     
  18. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I think number 2, and if you do number 2 you don't need release streams to show the route off, because you've already done that
    It brings the community on board and lets people see that their input IS valid
    Think about it this way, if they'd done dev screenshots of the 387 PIS before finalising the train we wouldn't be getting incorrect PIS and people who notice such things would feel they're getting an accurate train rather than a recycled one

    Personally I don't think public betas work, mainly because people play the beta to death and don't buy the full version, because what are they getting by paying again for a few tweaks? (says someone who's bought a few betas this year and not gone full price on any of them)
     
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  19. LWDAdnane

    LWDAdnane Well-Known Member

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    Very good point. You've pulled me to agree, a beta would make more sense if it was for an upcoming general update, for example. I agree with you logic
     
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  20. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    Some companies, I think EA do it, invite people to play the game at their offices. Would be good PR for DTG to do this and protect their code at the same time.

    My biggest problem with DTG is with the length of time it takes to fix the bugs and when they do fix the bugs they don't release them. No-one minds a delay here and there for DLC but for bug fixes?
     
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  21. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    Which is impossible at the moment as all the DTG staff works from home.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2021
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  22. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    DTG have done play testing. I went to their offices pre-release a few years back and had a session. Obviously COVID put paid to that but they do (have) do it
     
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  23. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    The point is I don't think they are doing it enough. Yes Covid obviously has put paid to that but are they not opening up offices now and returning to work?
     
  24. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    They've been working from home so unless working in an office on a dockside is more productive (haven't seen any proof of that)
    Either way they keep saying about their beta team and QA team and still put out pictures like "Reigate", so I don't think it's about who plays what and when, and it's more about having a perspective NOT linked to their production system.
    Hence thinking that some output of the line a month before they stop developing would be more beneficial to them than waiting until they think it's done. That way we can rip it apart and tell them what is important to us.
    Think about it, in every single release in 2021 there's been at least one issue, major or minor which they could have fixed before release had they fallen over it sooner in front of an audience.
     
  25. mattwild55

    mattwild55 Well-Known Member

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    Fully agree that opening up a little bit sooner and inviting some constructive feedback from a fan perspective on a route would be far better than waiting until they can see the whites of our eyes before doing a preview stream.
     
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  26. moofeen#2182

    moofeen#2182 Active Member

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    I couldn’t agree more but I am excited for the bml preview
     
  27. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    Did Summer get extended into October? Rush Hour is a joke. Ive never seen such incompetence. Even CDPR could do better.
     
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  28. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    I say it's good that they actually learnt from past mistakes and decided to postpone the certain route releases, than trying to rush out all of them during the summer in an unfinished state. I would always wait more for a good route than get an unfinished one "in time".
     
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  29. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    A rushed out product would be a joke indeed. Im glad dtg take their time to produce a quality route.

    There is nothing incompetent on this. Do it better by your self or be at least constructive.
     
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  30. dhekelian

    dhekelian Well-Known Member

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    You are forgetting it was DTG that put these deadlines on in the first place. Summer 2021 they said and they confirmed this later on, did they know it was going to be delayed while still confirming summer? Being sceptical I think they did but I doubt they will let us know.

    And then the people on this forum trying to warn DTG not to release the 4.26 update alongside RH but were fobbed off. They should of released the 4.26 update months ago if ready then release RH and the routes one by one and seeing if it breaks but for some reason they had to do it all at the same time, nothing could go wrong right? lol.
     
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  31. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Can't remember the last instance of "all summer long" being said (probably by JD) but they did confirm in a roadmap late in August that Brighton would be a longer gap

    They've acknowledged that they should have done the core separately to the annual package (I would suggest moving core to March personally) but they're working as they always have with TS1, with core and new routes each year. Of course with TS1 they're not dragging the old content with them, but live and learn. Well Live, hopefully
     
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  32. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    I can almost guarantee you from the state of the screenshots we have seen that BML will NOT be a quality route. Plus there'll be the usual bugs etc. Once again delay =/ better quality.

    SEHS had at least double the amount of time in production but was still way worse than Munich-Augsburg. The scenery on SEHS is atrocious. Spending lots of time on something and then it still being bad is literally the definition of incompetancy.
     
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  33. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    The scenery on SEHS certainly is atrocious and no signs that’ll it be improved.
     
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  34. bart2day

    bart2day Well-Known Member

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    After watching last nights stream I've got to embarrassingly retract my initial statement here. After two poor (in my opinion) English routes, judging by the stream this one has been knocked out of the park. Scenery looks good in most places and will feel so alive with Joe's timetable.
     
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  35. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    Personally I have no issue with SEHS bit I’m not an expert on the route. I know London-Brighton better and agree that it looks good. I’m also familiar with the West Cornwall route and am mostly pleased with what I’ve seen on the screen shots - OK Penzance and St Ives Scenery could be better but Jasper has said they are revisiting these. I have high hopes and hope that I am not let down.
     
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