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Ts19: Main Line Magnificence

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by TrainSim-James, Jul 1, 2019.

  1. TrainSim-James

    TrainSim-James Staff Member

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    [​IMG]

    Scenic commuter and bustling summer holiday traffic shall come to life in the South Western Main Line: Southampton – Bournemouth, which is coming soon to Train Simulator!

    READ MORE
     
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  2. iAspex

    iAspex Active Member

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    Interesting, will be following this
     
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  3. Railfan722

    Railfan722 Well-Known Member

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    Looks great, especially with the new foliage set. Wouldn't have minded seeing the 15-mile stretch of the West Coastway from Southampton to Portsmouth, or even the 47-mile SWML up to Woking. The container wagons look interesting, are we also getting a freight locomotive for the route?
     
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  4. neddyie116

    neddyie116 New Member

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    Finally my local line is coming:)
     
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  5. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Just did a realtimetrains check.
    NO freight runs on a typical weekday, SWR runs to Poole and Weymouth or XC runs to Bournemouth seem to be the main runs on this route
     
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  6. Cat

    Cat Active Member

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    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
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  7. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Disappointing that the latest route is just around 36 miles :(
     
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  8. 52_Western

    52_Western Active Member

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    Finally!!
    Thanks so much, DTG!!
    I would love it if you could maybe release extensions to go to Weymouth and London Waterloo in the future though – you could copy the Woking > Waterloo bit from the new PDL. :)
    (and maybe even the bit from Weymouth to Yeovil/Gloucester...)
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
  9. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    When I saw this initially I was over the moon but it appears this isn't an extension to the existing Waterloo - Portsmouth route from either of the logical points (Woking or Portsmouth) and is in fact a standalone 30 mile chunk of the SWT system through pretty flat forest using rolling stock that we've already got.

    Even another branch line in the London Suburbs with a Class 707 would have knocked this pack out of the park.
    An extremely underwhelming release in every way.

    Hopefully this is a stop-gap before the next big UK TS2019/20 release, it certainly feels like it.
     
  10. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    'Disappointing' is the word I would use for this. I think the main reason for that is because of the 29 miles. Routes seem to be getting smaller now for TS1 from DTG. Yes it looks nice (by the images shown) but route length also plays a big part. If this was an extension to the PDL route (Woking to Southampton/Bournemouth) then that would of been fine. But since this is a new standalone route I would expect to see the line go to at least Weymouth. 29 miles Southampton to Bournemouth and 35 miles from Bournemouth to Weymouth. Weymouth would provide a better terminus station.
    DTG released 64-bit last year which is great for longer routes, bigger scenarios and better trains. This is hardly going to benefit from 64-bit. Definitely not worth £24.99, assuming they stick that price tag on it.
     
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  11. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    I'm still utterly baffled. I've tried to imagine the marketing meeting where this piece of DLC was first suggested and the reactions of those present. At the meeting in my head each attempt to explain the relevance between Mainline Magnificence and what is included in this pack is greeted with "Yes, I heard you but.... is that all there is to it?".

    Or maybe it was a finance meeting and this is the result of "drilling-down on quick-win deliverables, to bandwidth storm-proof value-add in Q3 with increased holistic, oven ready brand-reach solution" and no-one was awake long enough to argue.



     
  12. John Murphy

    John Murphy Well-Known Member

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    Short route and they could have made it up to Woking to connect with the existing PDL route. I'll pass.
     
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  13. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    Did someone walk into the office on Monday morning and say "look what I threw together over the weekend guys"?
    This is way too short to be a full route, there has to be a plan for it's future. Surely they don't think we'll all fork out top price for this...
     
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  14. John Murphy

    John Murphy Well-Known Member

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    This post should be called Main Line Mess. There's nothing magnificent about such a short route on a game that can handle so much more. They're pulling the same crap here as they pulled with the Hudson Line.
     
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  15. SprattyHeath

    SprattyHeath Member

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    Just another moneygrabbing route. Not even an extension to London Waterloo which is something which we have been wanting since the PDL extension came out.

    Not gonna be getting this unless it gets extended towards Waterloo.
     
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  16. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    It would be nice if DTG could give us some reassurance that there's a plan here. And perhaps confirm when they'll have a new release for fans of AC electric traction in the UK. It's been a good couple of years now. DTG?
     
  17. John Murphy

    John Murphy Well-Known Member

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    They're not grabbing my money, that's for sure!
     
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  18. antony.henley

    antony.henley New Member

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    Great that Finally the SWML line gets a look in (only taken 10 years!)
    I am stoked that its coming.
    But for the love of trains why have you gone from Southampton - Bournemouth only?

    30 miles only, and most of that is through the New Forest!
    So lets see whats in the route in real life between Southampton and Bournemouth
    Northam Train Care
    St Denys
    Southampton Eastern Docks
    Southampton Central
    Southampton Western Docks
    Marititme Freightliner Terminal
    Millbrook Freighliner Terminal
    Totton Yard
    Marchwood Military Port
    Fawley Branch Oil Terminal / Refinery
    Brockenhurst Yard
    Lymington Branch
    Bournemouth Train Station
    Bournemouth Depot Further down the line.

    So how much of that will be included in the route?

    You have missed out on running between Eastleigh and Poole

    You could have had the whole of Eastleigh works and the Yards, Southampton Airport, At Poole you have the Yard, the reception sidings,you also have Hamworthy and the branch line to Poole Quay less than two miles down the line.

    i can see the scenarios now. Take this Freightliner train from Soton Maritime to Southampton Central .

    Why didnt you go for Eastleigh - Poole you have better operational scope between those two points. Words fail me. To be honest if you are going to do Southampton - Bournemouth you might have just done Weymouth Hamworthy!!

    The pictures look ok but words fail me. So dissapointed in the choice of start and end points.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
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  19. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    It's times like these that get DTG a bad name with the community. Even if they responded to say "We've taken your comments on board", "We feel this will be an excellent addition because......." or even just a "Don't worry, we've got loads more UK content coming out, so there's something for all of the community". This could be an opportunity to manage expectations, show us the positives in this pack and maybe reassure enough of us to invest in this DLC because it will be a useful addition in time.

    I'm not someone who expects every release to be what I would like in the game, sure I have that little feeling of disappointment when something like another beast of a US diesel is released but I bottle it up because it'll be my turn for excitement next, right? Sometimes I am surprised too, North Wales didn't seem exciting, then I played it, loved it and bought the expansion because it was something different. But this time, no excitement and a sinking feeling that "my sort of thing" (a new UK electric route under the wires) is never coming again.

    Come on DTG, it's not a community if we don't all talk. Work your charm on us, bowl us over and make us never doubt our commitment to your Train Simulators again.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2019
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  20. Cat

    Cat Active Member

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    This is happening a lot in retail. It's either keep the price the same and put less in the tin, OR hike up the price but put same amount in the tin. I suspect the marketing psychology is that less for the same price is marginally more acceptable to the consumer than a rise in price.

    Of course this is pure speculation on my part but I think that this is what DTG are doing, putting less in the tin for the same price. (If it sold at the usual price for routes).

    Also, shorter routes means shorter development time, they can get it on the shelf and out the door quicker which helps their revenue stream. Then later they can extend the route and we will buy it.

    I'm not condoning this practice, but unless I am wrong, TS is financing the development of TSW and we are paying for it.
     
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  21. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    Thanks Cat, some astute observations there. I think some commercial operations are a little better at disguising or mitigating this practice. I hope I'm wrong, I'm sure I am. I want TSW to be successful and I also want DTG to lead the way with exciting content in TS. I have a pretty good eye for spotting when recording artists have run out of steam (I'd be happy to share that experience at another time elsewhere),I immediately got that feeling from this release from DTG and it worries me.
     
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  22. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    It's called inflation... It's not "a practice", it's a reality of the financial world where everyone wants more and more money in their bank accounts.
     
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  23. Cat

    Cat Active Member

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    Yes inflation, which seems to be increasing especially over the last couple of years. To think that my first wage packet 50 years ago :o wouldn't even buy me a loco here today. All relative of course.
     
  24. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    Been pretty stable for a while in the UK
     
  25. Cat

    Cat Active Member

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    It does seem that our weekly supermarket bill has increased over the last couple of years although our buying habits remain the same. I blame the cat, she prefers tuna and only if is fresh straight from the tin.
     
  26. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    I disagree though not the bit about everyone wanting more money in their wallets. That's been the case for millennia

    Normal inflationary price increases provide the same or similar profit margins for the vendor. Their margin remains the same, the product stays the same but it costs more. That's what Economists call "inflation. "

    If the product is downsized to keep the retail price the same or the double whammy of smaller unit, higher price (Supermarkets take a bow on that one) then that is "Shrinkflation".
     
  27. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Yup, all comes under inflation. As DTG's costs go up they pass that onto us either by smaller products or bigger costs. Either way the baying wolves will bay
     
  28. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Where have you been whilst now?
     
  29. Wivenswold

    Wivenswold Active Member

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    I do fear that this is it from now, smaller segments. It could work if it's part of a strategy, but I'm yet to be convinced. It would be nice if DTG could work their charm and perhaps give us a tempting reason to buy this other than the limited thrill of a quick 1/2 stop run that in no way represents a normal crew working.
     
  30. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    After 10 years of Train Sim we are reduced to 20 odd miles of track.
    I hate to think what the next decade will bring.
    OUT NOW for TS2029, A siding complete with a buffer stop, also includes a shunter and 1 wagon to shunt up and down all day.
     
  31. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    30 plus miles of track actually if you read the info
    And the Gotthard Bahn route will be 110km or just under 70 miles
     
  32. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    According to the internet,
    the distance between Southampton station and Bournemouth station is 23 miles. That falls in the 20 odd mentioned.
    The 30 odd would include the branch line.
     
  33. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    You might have 23 miles by Car but this is a Railway.
    Look at the train in this link
    http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/W31708/2019/07/31/advanced
    The train stats at 0m0ch at Bournemouth and is at 28m 63ch by Southampton and almost 31 miles by St Dennys where the line ends.
    And not including the 5m29ch of the Lymington Branch

    Peter
     
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  34. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    My information came from https://www.thetrainline.com/train-times/southampton-central-to-bournemouth
    Clearly says the distance traveled will be 23 miles.
    I looked really hard at your link and could not see the miles traveled in the tables you picked. Maybe you have the wrong page.
    P.S...please feel free to click on the link provided and tell me where I'm going wrong....
     
  35. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately the Trainline is rubbish and an outside agency not connected with the railway and one that charges people to make bookings

    This is the page as you open it - on the left side is the Mileage column with the Miles & Chains adding up from 0 at Bournemouth to 28m 63c at Southampton and 30m70c at St Denys - it is not a list of distances between stations
    2B24 0700 Bournemouth to London Waterloo.jpg
    Peter
     
  36. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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  37. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Left hand two columns, miles and chains
    So according to RTT Bournemouth to Southampton Central is 28 miles

    And if you look at https://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between-bournemouth_-dorset-uk-and-southampton_-hants.htm and go from Bournemouth to Southampton it says straight line distance is 25.187 miles, so I would be guessing that trainline is possibly good with times and fares, less good at mileage
     
  38. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    So we are in agreement that my original post of "20 odd miles" stands correct? ;)
     
  39. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Yo might be in agreement with yourself but 30m70ch to St Dennys from Bournemouth and 5m29ch of the Lymington branch is nearer 36 and a bit miles. :)
     
  40. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Unless you add on the branch line. I mean if you want to be a complete pedant most of the track is dualled so it's almost 60 miles but it depends on how much of a pedant you want to be
     
  41. DeanO55

    DeanO55 Member

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    Well I certainly do not have an excessive concern with minor details and/or rules (it's just a game)
    and clearly I'm not showing an ostentatious and arrogant show of learning.
    But your use of the word in a train game forum clearly shows you are and probably getting a kick out of it too.
    Let me remind you once more, it's a train GAME.
    My son also likes to play the Train game when he comes home from school but would never think of coming onto the GAME forums to try to put people down with the new words he learnt at school today .
    And still the new route is only 20 odd miles from station start to station end.
     
  42. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    It has been pointed out to you the route is longer that 30 miles but for some reason you do not wish to believe what other people tell you.
    In the Network Rail Sectional Appendix for the line they record St Denys as 77miles and 10 chains from Waterloo and Bournemouth as 108 miles and 2 chains which is 31 plus miles not including the Lymington Branch.
    The Game as you call it is a Simulation of the real railway operating in the same conditions and therefore the route is the same length as the real railway that is it simulating.

    Even showing you the running of a Real Train with it's mileage in the column you dismiss as a minor detail as it proved you were wrong.

    Maybe you should put a fault in to DTG as your route is only 20 miles long and everyone else has a 30 mile route?
     
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  43. nachman.pecos

    nachman.pecos New Member

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    SWR runs to Poole and Weymouth or XC runs to Bournemouth seem to be the main runs on this route .Maybe you have the Nox Vidmate VLC wrong page.
    P.S...please feel free to click on the link provided and tell me where I'm going wrong....
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  44. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    I clicked on REPORT to let somebody else tell you where you are going wrong
     

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