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Tsw Route Proposal - Tyne Wear Metro

Discussion in 'Route Suggestions & Proposals' started by AyrtonS8, Dec 15, 2017.

  1. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    DictatorDono

    So what happens after that. Does TSW need to get involved and make this happen?
     
  2. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    Well once the dev tools are released I can lay track in that, and import my assets into Unreal. But very little is known about the dev tools at present so I can't say very much.
     
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  3. AlexNL

    AlexNL Well-Known Member

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    You should consider contacting DTG about joining their partner programme, maybe they have some more information to share which isn't yet available to the general public.
     
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  4. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    I'm already working with DTG through Partners. At the moment I don't know if I'd be able to sell it, Nexus would need to give me approval for it to be released even as freeware.
     
  5. AlexNL

    AlexNL Well-Known Member

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    Do you need their approval to release it with branding, or for an overall release?

    If it's about branding you could release it unbranded by replacing the T&W Metro livery with a generic one.
     
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  6. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    Nexus has been kind enough to assist me, while I'm not legally obligated to get their permission to release a freeware route I'd very much want them to happy for a recreation of their property to be released.
     
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  7. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    DictatorDono Im glad that you are making it and working with DTG and TWM

    Will you be making the Metro on PC and Console?
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2018
  8. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    PC certainly. Console if the entire network can run on them and I find the time.
     
  9. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    Will it be Freeware and if not. How much will it be? :)
     
  10. EthanPlaysYT

    EthanPlaysYT New Member

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    I was born in Newcastle and raised in Gateshead and would LOVE to see the Tyne and Wear Metro in any train simulator game as a dlc, not some stupid thing to download from the internet. I have always wanted the T&WM in Train Simulator and have tried to create it. (I failed) I agree with this post, give us the Metro!
     
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  11. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    DictatorDono Can you make the old and new metro with sounds effects? :)
     
  12. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    As in the old door opening tones and old station announcements? Depends if Nexus holds the old recordings and if the passenger information system is in TSW by the time the route is developed enough to add that.
     
  13. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    I'm sure Nexus should have the old recordings. If not could you just pinch some videos and take the sounds out?

    Kind Regards,
    Reece
     
  14. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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  15. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, because otherwise, this post is just going to dissolve. Once it's here, it stays, each post has view counts and rating system. Otherwise, simply bumping (Which I'm actually helping by even responding) this for the sake of doing so, doesn't necessarily increase the chances of the content being made.
     
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  16. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    There is many people that want this to be placed in the game and i totally agree with what you are saying. Bumping this post will help this post be more recognisable and will bring more users to give feedback which is good. Not only that it also keeps this topic alive and not dead.

    DictatorDono Any updates since the last time you updated us about nexus?
     
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  17. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Right, but simply bump commenting, is quite a poor tactic, in keeping a thread relevant. There are enough comments, and quite a number of Upvotes, probably one of the highest in the forums (Although, I'd go as far as to say I wouldn't be surprised if there possibly may have been a bit of rigging/steering involved with that, seeing as your tactics is welcomed/supported by the OP of this thread), which should be good enough. Besides, if people come on this site, they're able to utilize a mouse button/pad, or even a touchscreen to find a particular thread that interests them just like the rest of us. Don't encourage laziness, here. It's one thing if you're actually talking about something useful, sharing relevant info regarding the topic of the thread. But to take away the focus of other proposals in favor of one, respectfully, is a jerk move.

    This proposal, whether I care for it or not, is actually put together quite decently, and that should stand well on its own, not wasting screen/page real estate on a "bump" comment. Let's try to be realistic, and considerate of others hopes and wishes here!
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2018
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  18. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    I know, I understand its a poor tactic, Just want to get this post to the top. I am not very good at using forums anywhere on the internet so have no idea how stuff like this works but anyways as long as you keep me right then i am happy!!!

    So i apologise to everyone for the "Bumping"

    Lets start a new adventure and hope this gets made as i cannot wait! :)
     
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  19. Medellinexpat

    Medellinexpat Well-Known Member

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    TicklishPickleWickles you may need to be patient for a long while (perhaps years) even if this is built. Done completely it’s what around 50 miles and 60 stations. That’s a huge project whether someone like DTG with all of their resources or someone like DictatorDono gets working at it.

    DictatorDono seems to be at the research and prototyping stage, but he’s still waiting for tools that will allow him to develop this in TSW whether for PC, console or both. So at this stage he won’t have any idea how quickly the tools will allow him to build it or even how difficult it’s going to be. He’ll also be something of a pioneer. To date, as there are no tools no one outside DTG has any experience in building any sort of route in TSW of any size.

    If DTG work on this they’ve been releasing a route around every three months or so. Whether that will be more of less in the future we don’t know, but hopefully more. As they’ve got a worldwide audience about one in three of those routes will likely be a UK route, taking its turn alongside US and European DLCs. There will also likely be releases for China and perhaps other areas like Australia and Japan. And that’s a release every three months. I don’t know how long it actually takes them from the planning to completion phase for a project. It would be interesting to know.

    Even in the UK there are lots of other routes that could be popular. For example there’s no Steam locomotives in TSW so many people would like to see that.

    All of this means that even a really good proposal like this, with lots of votes to do it, has a lot of competition and if it’s started is a huge amount of work to complete. So patience is going to be a virtue here...
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2018
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  20. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    I don't care how long it takes, I just want my Metro in a train sim. :D
     
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  21. DictatorDono

    DictatorDono New Member

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    For DTG routes tend to take 2 years from starting research to launch from what I've heard. A hobbyist team isn't going to do it so fast, however my plan is to release a short but operationally viable section of the route and then release updates. Even Regent Centre to Pelaw would likely take a year to build (and for those who think that is too optimistic, I do have assets at an early stage in development, I just expect enough progress on them to speed up development when the TSW tools release in the next few years (hopefully months)
     
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  22. TicklishPickleWickles

    TicklishPickleWickles New Member

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    I'm glad that you keep us updated on the progress :) hope their tools get released soon
     
  23. iAspex

    iAspex Active Member

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    Sorry to bump the thread but I just thought I’d say that I’d love this route to be in TSW!
     
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  24. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    Nothing to be sorry about. Some people obviously don't like it when replys to threads cause the main thread to go top of the list but that is how Dovetail have made the forums. Its a way to help people find recent discussion, as far as i'm aware.

    I would love to see this route in TSW too :)
     
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  25. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Well, for one, it's not about what people like, its the manner of which it is being done, simply bumping the thread for the sake of just bumping is quite a childish tactic, not that it would concern you much being that it is thread you started and may even have allegedly steered people into upvoting, and commenting as a way to keep it relevant. It doesn't necessarily increase the chances of it getting done. You'll soon find this out.;)
     
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  26. Lawjester

    Lawjester Well-Known Member

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    To add to what rare_common_sense is saying, you’ve showed many times in the past that you outright think your content requests and desires are the most important on these forums and going to other threads and voicing opinions uncalled for and definitely not wanted/asked for. This also doesn’t imprint a good image on yourself and if I were DTG or any other dev of that matter and I see people bumping threads and even admitting to doing it on purpose, I’d immediately cross off any chance of whatever content is requested for on this thread because it’s just absurd and a total waste of time.
     
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  27. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    Just to add, sadly, while we are actually helping this dude's proposal remain relevant with each comment, I personally believe everyone is entitled to what they would like, and hope that they will one day get it. But when you have those that want to make it a competition and try overshadowing everyone else's proposal who would like to get theirs noticed, it makes them seem like jerks. Every post on here deserves equal recognition.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
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  28. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    What is wrong with people commenting? If people were not aloud to comment, then what is the point of the forums or any other social media Dovetail is using? If you don't like the system were comments cause the thread to go to the top of the list, tell Dovetail. There is no point arguing with me or anyone else who has commented in this thread as it won't fix the issue you have.


    I certainly don't think my proposals or things I would like to see in the game is important. I am simply just another customer voicing what I think. Like I said in the past, I don't think any proposal in the forums will be made for TSW as I think Dovetail have already got a plan on what to do for TSW. When and if the route editor tools are released is when I think we will start seeing peoples ideas for the game being made.
     
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  29. rare_common_sense

    rare_common_sense Well-Known Member

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    You seem to be clearly and electing on missing the point, Sutton. Try reading what I said again, slowly this time, and maybe you'll understand what it is I'm saying, and not what you want to take out of it. While I'm on the topic of reading comprehension, I think "allowed" is the actual spelling you're trying to use.
     
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  30. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    Well firstly, apologies for the bad spelling. I wasn't good at spelling in school.

    My point still stands though, why argue with me about bumping the thread? I wasn't the one doing it in the first place. You have already discussed this with the person doing it and they apologised. If you still have a problem with this thread, talk to Dovetail about it and if they think there is a problem, they will delete it or take whatever action is needed.
     
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  31. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    A thought popped into my head today - were the Metro to be included in TSW, would we get to see the in-progress new interchange at South Shields? Given work on it will be ongoing into August 2019 I don't expect it to be completed in TSW but even the little bit that's been done thus far could be interesting.

    Similarly, a scenario could be included mirroring the recent 5 week closure of the line from Chichester to South Shields, with trains being turned around at Chichester to return to Newcastle bound services (not too unlike the "Christmas Closures" scenario in GWE). Just some food for thought!
     
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  32. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    I guess that would depend on if and when the route would get made. But I don't see why it couldn't be made as a future dated route if they get there hands on plans and images of the new buildings. Dovetail have made a couple of routes for TS20XX that have and are based on future ideas and plans.
     
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  33. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    True, I mean Great Western Express is set in/around 2013. So a late 2017 spec Metro wouldn't be impossible I suppose.

    Speaking of thoughts that came into my mind:

    The route wouldn't be a one trick pony in terms of service length either. During peak hours (6am-8am and 3pm-5pm or so) shorter services run between stations - so often, trains from the Airport and the Regent Centre will terminate at Pelaw, whereas St. James bound trains from South Shields will terminate at South Gosforth, Benton or Monkseaton. Near the end of a service day too, there are also shorter services including termini at Sunderland, so there's plenty of variety in route length.

    Also, the Metro suffers from low rail adhesion (or, as we Brits put it, leaves on the line) more than most rail systems due to the light construction of the Metrocars. The end result is a different driving style in autumn and winter, and if this could be simulated in a TSW route it would really put the icing on the cake. All you'd need is a hot bake from Greggs and you'd basically there for real! :D
     
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  34. jamesbaby286

    jamesbaby286 Active Member

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    Just bumping the good proposal so it is above the one liner.
     
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  35. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    Been having a poke about the Internet and found this brilliant album on Flickr, has loads of quality photos of the system and the 994s from all eras, 70s, 90s, the lot! Maybe we could see an interpretation circa 1985? ;)

    Of course I'd prefer the modern Metro but there's some seriously handy reference material in here, such as interior photos and cab photos, for DTG/third party modders. I found a technical drawing of the Metrocars too so I might post it later. In the meantime here's the album, check it out!
     
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  36. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    Some useful information here about the Indusi train protection system the Metro uses. It seems to be a cut down version of PZB, so hopefully wouldn't be too hard to implement.

    I've also noticed (from inspecting pictures and from many, many passenger rides on the Metro) these have DSD as well, so it's certainly not lacking in the safety department :)

    Also, another potential scenario note: sometimes, the line between St. James and Tynemouth is closed for overhead line renewal work (more often recently) so a short yellow line service terminating at Tynemouth or reversing out at the start, or perhaps going from South Gosforth to Tynemouth and returning could be possible :)
     
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  37. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Active Member

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    Don't you mean a Stotty cake full of bacon?

    I talked up a Metro proposal in the TS forums on Steam a year or more ago. While the purpose built sections are interesting much of the Metro runs on the old suburban commuter lines around Newcastle through stations built by the NER so, for my money, a DLC set any time when BR, the LNER or even the NER was running those lines would be worth doing- for me personally the electric or early Diesel age would be most tempting.

    I think a Metro DLC might lack some variety there being only the one type of service (apart from the odd maintenance trains) but it could be argued that building either would do some of the groundwork for the other.
     
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  38. David Forster

    David Forster New Member

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    I would love to see this route for TSW some day.

    But not as the OP described it.

    I would love to see the Metro added as part of a wider North East Network.

    But set in the Mid-1980's

    ECML
    Newcastle to Darlington

    Durham Coast Line
    Newcastle to Middlesbrough via Hartlepool

    Leamside Line
    Washington to Ferryhill

    Stillington Branch
    Ferryhill to Stockton

    Tees Valley Line
    Middlesbrough to Bishop Auckland

    The Sunderland Extension of Metro would not be in my idea, with Seaburn, East Boldon and Brockley Whins going back to there BR days.

    It would see need the following Stations

    ECML
    Newcastle, Chester-le-Steet, Durham, Darlington

    Durham Coast Line
    Newcastle, Heworth, Brockley Whins, East Boldon, Seaburn, Sunderland, Seaham, Hartlepool, Seaton Carew, Billingham, Stockton, Thornaby, Middlesbrough

    Tees Valley
    Middlesbrough, Thornaby, Eaglescliffe, Tees-side Airport, Allen's West, Dinsdale, Darlington, North Road, Heighington, Newton Aycliffe, Shildon, Bishop Auckland

    The Leamside Line, was mothballed in about 1991, but served as an important diversionary route while the ECML was being wired in the mid-late 80's.

    The Stillington Line is still open today, though it is a freight only line, but it still sees use when a diversions are needed between between Northallerton and Durham.

    In the timeframe I am proposing as well, there was still quite a few of the freight only Colliery Railways open as well.

    To finish off, this proposal may be awkward, due to the detail involved, but would love to see it even if it was drip fed to us.

    Failing my idea, I would most definitely like to see the Tyne and Wear Metro in some form, whether it be set in the past or a modern day recreation of it
     
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  39. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    Very interesting idea! I'm aware DPSimulation are working on a North East England route for TS20XX, including the Durham Coast Line from Seaham to Northallerton (I've seen Durham Coast Line proposals in these forums too) and also other modern lines in the NE, but this would be an interesting idea.

    There's a possibility perhaps for a 1980s rendition, with termini at Bank Foot, Pelaw, and South Shields, using the 4 colour coded lines they had - with Pacers in TWPTE livery perhaps covering the line from Pelaw to Sunderland. Naturally I'd prefer to to see a modern Metro but even a historic one is a good idea!
     
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  40. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    Yes I do! Yes I do. :D

    As mentioned above, I'd be equally interested in a North Tyne Loop era metro, 1980s etc with Pacers filling in the rest of the Sunderland route. The only thing is the 994s got a cab refit circa 2003 so you'd need to look for original cab photos but if it's doable it's doable!
     
  41. Rail Master

    Rail Master Active Member

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    This route proposal includes Passenger Information System, so it would be a great effort for the Devs to synchronize this with the "filled" schedules of a London subway
     
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  42. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    As soon as UE4 gets it (I recall seeing that Epic actually have to code such a system in before TSW can use it) then infoboards would add so much!

    Metro service isn't nearly as jammed full as the Underground - at non-peak times you'll see trains approx. every 12 minutes on the green/yellow lines between So.Shields-Hebburn, Airport-Regent Centre and through the North Tyne Loop from Longbenton-St.James. Through the "central belt" from Pelaw to South Gosforth it's roughly one every 6 minutes, though it's more like two in 4 minutes then a 6-8 minute wait for 2 more. Below pictures taken from Metro site for Haymarket station at non-peak and peak times (though with it being a metro service, these are working timetables). Also included is the 4-station "pretzel" configuration Monument at peak times!

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  43. Rail Master

    Rail Master Active Member

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    How long is the proposal?
     
  44. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    To my knowledge the entire route (both lines) is 47 miles long, so not much longer than some existing TSW routes IIRC :)
     
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  45. AyrtonS8

    AyrtonS8 Well-Known Member

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    Article updated 12/03/2019.
    - Removed Grand Central HST and replaced with Class 180
    - Added video of Hunslet Battery Locos
    - Added extra infomation across article
     
  46. raildan

    raildan Well-Known Member

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    I knoew I'm over a year late (I upvoted this already, at least) but nice proposal!

    Some of it is underground, too, which makes the scenery thing easier for Dovetail.
     
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  47. Cd1990

    Cd1990 Member

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    Can't believe I haven't upvoted this already, would love to see this as I travelled on the Metro a fair bit when I was over from Australia visiting family, those metrocars have a certain charm to them too. Fingers crossed this makes it onto TSW! :)
     
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  48. dskxalive

    dskxalive New Member

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    The Tyne and Wear metro honestly seems like a no-brainer that is should be recreated in a train simulator of some sorts. Wether it be TS1 or TSW (I hope for the latter!) it fits in perfectly with DTG’s currently releases (roughly same length, same number of locos [994 and battery]). If they can make a DLC like Rapid Transit for TSW, then I think they could easily do this as well.

    Knowing DTG though, they’d probably only do one of the routes (green or yellow) and they won’t include the mainline stock.

    Either way though, I feel this would be a very good route for train sim and one that is sorely missed.
     
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  49. cosmo

    cosmo Member

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    Indeed, indeed :) I'd hope they'd do both lines, since they've proven with the Long Island DLC that branches are possible. For sure it's a missing link, no one has really done it and I would hope it's time now!

    To be honest - the lack of updates on the partner programme modding project as mentioned above has me optimistic - almost as if NDAs were in action... :)
     
  50. mmmcnally4472

    mmmcnally4472 New Member

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    I think this root will be fab one to do
     
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