Uk Route Recommendations Pls

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Nick Y, Mar 19, 2021.

  1. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    I'm here asking the community for some route recommendations for TS21.
    I'm mainly interested in UK routes with commuter trains and some high speed. I'm not keen on freight and haven't even attempted to drive steam locos yet (oh, and no class 101s, lol).

    I currently have:
    Fife Circle Line
    Welsh Marshes
    South Wales Coastal
    WCML South
    Portsmouth Direct Line
    Chatham and Medway Valley Lines
    Chatham Main Line
    GEML: London - Ipswich
    Edinburgh - Glasgow
    Settle - Carlisle
     
  2. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Portsmouth to Waterloo is a newer version (and, presumably, better) of the Portsmouth Direct Line. For starters, Woking is not the terminus, but you blaze through Clapham Junction instead to get to Waterloo, right next to London Victoria, the route terminus for London-Brighton (by the way, another good route, but scenarios often don't add up to 1,000 points, so be mindful of that and a couple of other quirks such as being marked late for being on time in Smitham Snoozer). This version can also merge with Chatham Medway through some shared track for any of those more extended journeys.

    Peterborough is part of the Great British Railway Journeys pack, in addition to the Waterloo route. So is Settle to Carlisle, which you own. So is Chatham-Medway. So is Ipswich. So you are missing two of those, and you may consider getting the pack if it's cheaper than getting those two individual routes to finish the group. That pack got a huge discount, so it's a really good deal the more that isn't already owned, but provided you are missing at least two routes, it's worth considering now. If taking my advice, make sure to get the one with TS DLC, and don't even bother with the GBRJ version, which can sit eternally in your library.

    London-Faversham is another option. It has a lot of Workshop use as well, being from TS2014 route bundle (which also includes the US Donner Pass, home to a GP9, Dash 9, and SW1500 - worth noting because packs for all three of those trains are locked to only US customers!).
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2021
  3. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    London - Peterborough is a good route if you like both commuter and high speed. Nroth London & GOBLIN is a nice route too I find. London to Brighton is a good shout, and I'll throw in South London Network too, and atomicdanny has merged them on Workshop (I believe he's also merged SLN, London-Brighton and GOBLIN?)
     
  4. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply Cyclone.
    I do indeed have the ECML Peterborough - London and the Waterloo - Portsmouth version of PDL.
    I already own the GBRJ game and I did make sure it included the TS routes.

    I'm trying to mix my time between TSW2 (PS4/PS5) and TS21 so that if I want good graphics (ish) I can play TSW2 and if I want to play other routes, I can play TS21.

    Cameron's Gaming, I would consider London - Brighton as I have ECW on TSW and do enjoy driving that route.

    Any northern routes with modern(ish) stock that I could buy (I'm thinking pacers, sprinters etc)?
     
  5. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    You are correct. It includes South London to Brighton in addition to North London and Goblin. The initial route turns from Victoria and curves up to the West London Line before Clapham Junction to travel to Willesden Junction, at which point the player is in North London Line proper with access to St. Pancras. Goblin includes that West London Line segment and extends the northern section to Barking, which terminates the route. A couple stations exist beyond Barking and a long stretch of track that would extend to Faversham, but I don't think it does here.

    Also available is a version that uses the West London Line but chops off the northern part of Goblin Lines, and extends the Stratford and Barking line to Faversham. Sadly, GEML or ECML South cannot be merged due to different starting points (it could be done, but it involves moving points of origin, and might also be so much to add that it could crash the game anyway - though -fastload might resolve that). That route is marked as being "on hold", so I'll assume atomicdanny just hasn't had time to get back to it with various other projects (like the SWC and Welsh Marches merge, among others). Worth noting is that I've seen a Brighton to Bedford train drive on Youtube; you could recreate that on this merged route. Make sure to grab Sheerness, because the branch is included from the Faversham line.

    There is also a final version of "North London, Goblin & Chatham Main Line 2016", a merge of - well - North London/Goblin with Chatham Main Line (no points for that one). Medway is apparently not included, but that only eliminates services south of Cuxton, so isn't missed anyway as it's a completely different service.

    Here's Danny's collections page in the Workshop, go check out some others including an electrified Goblin Lines.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2021
  6. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    WCML North is pretty old but good for it. It has some of the suburban lines around Glasgow as well as the main line to Carlisle for express trains to sport in. It suffers from an excess of faulty scenarios but there's plenty of stuff in the Workshop to make up for that and a nice Class 86- well worth the £4 sale price.

    Following on from Carlisle to Preston WCML Over Shap is newer, better detailed and more varied than I expected- perhaps my favourite main line route. If you want to try steam Western Lines of Scotland has a variety of traffic though all hauled by Stanier 5MTs- get it with Diesel Classes 20 and 27 and it won't matter if you don't catch the steam bug.
     
  7. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Can you list some scenarios and what is wrong with them? I have not checked this route yet, but do own it. I know someone who fixes old scenarios and posts them, so there is a chance it could get looked at (and if he doesn't do it, I might; I really should fix some L-B ones).
     
  8. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    Of the three Career scenarios in two the points available don't add up to the full 1,000 (I don't care about Career points, gold stars and achievements but plenty of people do) while in the third, a freight run called Scots Pine, you have to drive like a lunatic to keep to the schedule- if you just shrug and drive it at a sensible speed it screws up the timings and then breaks due to an AI collision. A Standard scenario called Polmadie Hop breaks (AI collision again) before you get half way done.
     
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  9. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    And all the Class 390 scenarios are apparently borked because it penalises you for comfort, I think it's due to the tilting.
     
  10. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I’m pretty sure I’ve done that one without incident.
     
  11. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    Really? I've tried it on at least two systems with the same failure.
     
  12. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I’ll have another go and check.
     
  13. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, tilting is uncomfortable, it gives you a sense of vertigo. :o
     
  14. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    Well I've just tried it again and Pffft! I did get further along than before though- actually got out of the depot but that may just be me pushing the speed limits a bit harder than before.
     
  15. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    I think I must have been mixing it up with another.

    I did all the shunting and was ready to leave the sidings, but was stuck at a red ground light forever.

    It appeared that I was waiting for a 37 top and tailed rake of coaches to come past (travelling at maybe 4mph), so I had an aerial tour round the yard.

    Back in the cab, I then noticed to my horror that the 37, instead of going through the clear siding beside me, was being down directly, and ended up shunting me back!

    I left it there: I don’t know if I was quicker in my shunting whether I might have avoided this: you’d think ‘AI’ would keep a train held back by a red signal if the track ahead was occupied though.
     
  16. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    No- there were a few reports of queasiness on the first public run of the APT much over-hyped since most of the "sufferers" were journalists who had indulged at the free bar laid on by BR the night before and who had been absolutely fine until the sun came up and they could see outside. The problem was that, if you were looking out of the window, you could see the train was tilting but not feel anything which was the idea of course but when the eye and the inner ear provide conflicting information it upsets some people's equilibrium- especially if they're hungover. It's something like one of those funfair rides where you stand on a platform in an ordinary looking room which then turns upside down around you to disorientating effect.

    The solution was actually to make the tilt system less effective so passengers are comfortable but can still feel a curve. All the senses can then agree that something is going on but nothing to worry about.
     
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  17. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    I must say a year and a bit ago I went to Crewe, going I was on a Super Voyager and I felt rather unwell from it, I think it's because it was busy - and a voyager. Came pack on a Pendolino and I was absolutely fine, indeed rather liked it.
     
  18. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I know that story, I did read about the Pendolino and read that the first journey...didn't get much approval.
     
  19. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    The data gathered by the APT project was widely disseminated would have been used by Alstom (indeed it has influenced every high speed rail project in the world since the '80s which people overlook in the rush to label it a failure) but, other than that, it and the Pendolino are unrelated.

    In a desperate attempt to drag this back to something resembling the topic...

    Having recommended WCML Over Shap above I'd add that I bought it and the APT at the same time and, if you want high speed you might consider it too. Unless there's an HS2 route I don't know about you won't go faster on a British route in TS without employing gimmicks like the super 47 and the jet train.
     
  20. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    There's this from Marleyman, an old item from a site that is temperamental. But it's free. Needs the 390, ICE 1, and ICE 3, for scenarios, also needs Glasgow Airport Rail Link (comes with the 380), WCML North, NEC, Guildford and District, plus some UKTS and other freeware. The links on the page don't work, so it might not be possible to run this without them. I have no idea.

    If the page refuses to load, keep trying. The site is VERY on and off. I got some things from there before and the downloading process was a nightmare.
     
  21. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    So, I've been having a look through some of the stuff available on steam.

    I've thought about these so far:
    ECML Newcastle - York (70s) with the Deltic, Class 47 and Class 43 HST.
    Suburban Glasgow North West Helensburgh - Springburn with the Class 320 EMU and the 158 DMU
    Liverpool - Manchester with the class 158
    Riviera Line Paignton - Exeter with the class 143 Pacer
    Great Western Mainline Paddington - Oxford with the Class 43 HST and Class 166
    WCML North with the class 86
    Cornish Main Line Plymouth - Penzance
    ECML North Newcastle - Edinburgh (Just trains version I think)
    ECML Modern York - Peterborough

    Class 91 add-on

    Having seen the comments about the class 86, I'm not sure I'd be able to understand the tap system for driving it.
     
  22. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    Looks almost crude by today's standards and the trains are all from Ye olde Euro/UK Loco's and Assets pack but still well worth having and what is it ATM- a couple of quid? (There's a North East England route from DP Simulations which you might like to check out if you get the dependencies- it's certainly on my RADAR.)

    You'll need to read the manual but you'll get it. Once you get the hang of it the 86 and 87 are really good to drive. You have to be on your toes but they give you a great sense of accomplishment. WCML North doesn't model neutral zones (dead spots in the OHLE where different parts of the power supply grid meet- the old leccys have to be prepared to negotiate them) which makes things a little easier.
     
  23. inversnecky

    inversnecky Well-Known Member

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    Sure you will. It’s actually quite a fun way to control a loco, and you’ll be set for the 87 and 73 too.

    Very simply, reverser to forward, brakes off, tap changer to hold, then quick presses on A or handle to the right, to build up some speed.
     
  24. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    A few notes on your selection

    ECML Newcastle - York (70s) - Note there are No overhead wires on this route
    Great Western Mainline

    Both these routes are very old and the quality is nothing like what you see today

    Suburban Glasgow North West Helensburgh - Springburn with the Class 320 EMU and the 158 DMU
    Riviera Line Paignton - Exeter with the class 143 Pacer - This line includes the preserved section to Kingswear
    ECML North Newcastle - Edinburgh
    These routes are quite good - I don't have the new Suburban Glasgow but I have the old version

    ECML Modern York - Peterborough
    Liverpool - Manchester with the class 158
    These two routes are ok but there is not much operationally to do

    WCML North with the class 86 -
    This is the older route
    WCML over Shap was built later and it comes with the Class 87

    Class 91 add-on
    Good choice and easy to drive

    Cornish Main Line Plymouth - Penzance
    If you intend not to drive beyond Plymouth then this is ok
    Just trains have made, in stages the entire route from London to Penzance via Reading, Bristol, Exeter, Plymouth.
    The first section is London to Bristol and Cardiff and it includes the Didcot - Oxford section

    Peter
     
  25. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Peter already gave his analysis, but I'll do another view.

    ECML Newcastle - York (70s) - This is one of the original ECML Routes, so can often be found used in scenarios and such. However, you yourself bring up ECML Modern,. It's bundled with the Class 91 (Intercity and East Coast packages), EWS Class 66 v2.0, and the Class 158. If you are looking for Armstrong Powerhouse products in the future, note that both 158 packs utilize the Network SouthEast Class 159 and not this Class 158, but you will find a good amount of older Workshop content utilizing the EWS 66 and this Class 158. The 91 isn't seen as often from my observations to date.
    Suburban Glasgow North West - I've played this. Some in the Discord server have referred to this as a "scam", but this is because of two reasons. One is that the route used to be a freeware route; Iain is currently rebuilding his old freeware route in the Workshop (currently called West Highland Line and posted in January) around the Suburban Glasgow route we can now purchase as a base. So there are merges with West Highland Line South and adding the Oban Line, maybe even merging all the way to Mallaig on West Highland Line itself. If you want to drive the full line from Glasgow to the north, this is the southern terminus. The scenarios in here, meanwhile, are fairly well done and I have had really no major problems with them, so in terms of scenario play, this is one of the better options out there. The other reason it's been called a "scam" is because of the Class 320, which seems to some like a clone of another train. They may be right, but there is also an older and more feature-rich Class 320 in the 321 pack from Armstrong Powerhouse. PTGRail drove it on one of his route learning videos.
    Liverpool - Manchester - Classic route. There is currently a Missing Link project at AlanThompsonSim if you can stomach up the $30-40 or so to subscribe to his site. Though I've heard people say other benefits of subscribing are not that good. I have suggested that DTG visit the Crewe to Stafford segment of the Missing Link on North Wales Coastal while refurbishing it; we'll see if this actually happens and if NWC ever does return in some form (they could even extend it to Birmingham to connect directly to the WCML South that just released, and then Cross City can be merged in to connect more of Birmingham to Holyhead). That leaves Crewe to Liverpool, and Crewe to Preston, and if that gap ever comes in somewhere else, Liverpool-Manchester is likely to be part of any route merge.
    Riviera Line Paignton - Exeter - Actually the next route I think I'm going to play. I'm debating getting the Major.Wales Class 143 Revamp Pack. Sadly, it also requires the Armstrong Powerhouse Class 142, which has mediocre reviews. However, it has the sounds needed by the 143 Revamp Pack and it is a new model with its own liveries, not an enhancement pack. (The 142 also has a free Revamp Pack from M.W if that interests you; the 153 from Just Trains even has one.)
    Great Western Mainline - This is an original Train Simulator route. If you don't need the newest and best-looking stuff, this is a nice retro route and can serve as an introduction to the game with trains that are not as difficult to use as newer models.
    WCML North - Another somewhat retro route. I think it's dated to something like the 80s or 90s. I may be mistaken.
    Cornish Main Line - No. Not from Steam. Don't do that at all. Just Trains products tend to have additional content on their own site that Steam doesn't. As such, buying on Steam will not get you that content. The Kyle Line is a good example of this, as well. Also, as Peter noted, the main route is Western Mainlines from Exeter to London Paddington with stubs to Oxford and Cardiff; the South Devon Main Line gets you to Plymouth from Exeter, and then the Cornish can be attached. Even better, get The Complete Collection, which was on sale for $60 USD over the holidays. Just do not get the partial line on Steam.
    ECML North Newcastle - Edinburgh - Definitely get it from JT. Once again, I believe there is unique content. Sometimes it involves stuff found only at JT, but having the option later on is not a bad thing. Note it's about 7-8 years old from JT, and DTG only got it on Steam in 2020. Not yet on Steam is Mully's Scottish ECML from Edinburgh to Perth, which I think goes through Dundee. Just Trains is now exploring Inverness to Perth to connect to the Kyle Line. Imagine if this all ever gets merged into one route. That is a massive drive.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2021
  26. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like this could get very expensive with extra add-ons required.
    I don't understand all the extras needed such as loco packs, sound packs etc from third parties and what is required to make them function. This would be due to mind issues and not being able to process complex information.
     
  27. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I want to be clear; you don't HAVE to get stuff from AP (BTW, Major.Wales is free). You also don't HAVE to get much of the stuff I mention, as they are extra add-ons and the routes WILL run without them. They are just things to improve your play with the routes.
     
  28. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    I'm all for improving game play. TSW gets bland sometimes seeing the same units over and over again.

    Personally I'd love to drive routes local to me (Yorkshire) as TSW has Northern Transpennine (kind of my local route along with ECML between Doncaster and Leeds and the Calder Valley line).
    I like a variety of stock to drive but I'm into mostly modern units (class 166 is my most driven unit on TSW).
    I'd also like to travel on routes I've been on and drive trains I've actually travelled on which include sprinters, super sprinters, turbostars, class 43 HSTs, class 91s, voyagers, pacers etc).

    Idk if this would help but I could provide a list of routes I've been on and types of unit I'm interested in to see if any of the packs from eother steam or 3rd parties has what I'm after.
     
  29. JJTimothy

    JJTimothy Well-Known Member

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    Third party routes often use scenery assets from other routes and won't work, or at least won't look right, if you don't have these "dependencies". Workshop routes invariably do this. Routes sold on Steam are self contained- there are other DLC you can buy to use with them of course but as they come they'll have everything they need in terms of scenery models and textures as well as trains and some scenarios to run with those trains so there is some hours of entertainement to be had in those routes before you even look in the Workshop never mind buying any extras.

    I mentioned the European and UK Loco's and Assets pack in my comment about ECML North but that pack is included with the route. Both it and the equivalent US pack are included with WCML North and, again, provide all the rolling stock for that route except the Class 86 loco'. (Both packs may be long in the tooth but are worth having being much used by Workshop scenario creators- they can be bought separately but getting them with a route can save a lot of money.)
     
  30. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Any route that is sold generally has all of its dependencies included. The Just Trains versions of the routes discussed are self-contained packages as well, without the need for third-party assets. The benefit is that, if there is an update, you're more likely to get the update quickly from the developer than from Steam. There are things on Steam that have been awaiting patches for years. What Just Trains CANNOT sell in the package is the contents of the European Loco and Asset Packs, and as such notes you must have them to use the scenarios. But it's only for the scenarios. JT is the Steam seller most guilty of having otherwise unplayable scenarios, I'll grant you that. But there are so many routes that include it now that it's a minor concern. Even their Bristol-Exeter includes it and the US pack on the Steam side, and is a rare case of an identical offering at Steam. Note however that Western Mainlines covers the path of that route as well as Southwestern Expressways, and maybe others. It does unlock a bunch of scenario packs and other scenarios included with JT products, however!
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2021

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