Upcoming Release Wcml : Preston - Carlisle, Coming November 21st!

Thats why my question came from to DTG to change the title

 

Thank you yeh thats why I was confused cause they put the 21st instead of the 26th

 

I’m not suggesting dumbing it down by not having the feature. I’m suggesting having the option to turn it off. Then You can play how you want and I can play how I want.

 

Let’s just say, my snacks are ready for this evening, I think this is going to be a preview I will enjoy, and I’m sure a lot of other people will too.

 

Yeah, get your 'Excitement' buzzword bingo card ready.

 

Don’t worry, already got some popcorn prepared

 

They still haven't altered the date... Hello DTG, knock knock, anybody there?

 

Now you're being even more unreasonable. Nobody suggested you were.

It's good to see that Just Trains, have not wasted any time or money, on a dumbed down, disable option for neutral sections.

 

Watched the stream tonight and feel that Just Trains have raised the bar again. The standard of this route is absolutely amazing. A huge thank you and congratulations to Tom Harrison and everyone at JTs for another masterpiece. I just hope that it works well on my Xbox one S, as there were comments that some services only work on gen 9 consoles.

 

That was a fantastic stream last night.

 

When London Commuter released, the version for Gen 9 had layers including the 166, the Southeastern 466 and 375, freight services etc etc, the version for Gen 8 didn't.

 

The scenery, the attention to detail, the sound of the 87 is just absolutely jaw dropping, JT have lifted up the bar again, best £32.99 Im going to spend this year, Looks and sounds stunning.

 

Haven't been this excited for a new release in many a year now. The preview was absolutely fantastic.

Need to get Flight Sim 2024 (out 19th November) played to bits quickly as don't think I'll be doing much else after the 26th when this comes out.

Great job Just Trains !

 

I’m really quite excited for this now. I had no intention of watching the full preview as normally they are quite bad to watch, but was so impressed right from the start that I was still there at the end.

That’s how a preview should be in my opinion. JT didn’t hide from any questions. I think nearly everything that was asked got answered.

The route and the 87 looks stunning, it’s my favourite era for UK trains and I already like the TSC version so pretty much certain I will get this day one. I’ll reserve full judgement until I have played it, but it looks extremely well done.

 

they have confirmed that Gen 8 consoles will be getting a reduced timetable

 

Unless they aren't able to edit the title once it's posted. Who knows

 

I thought the stream was excellent last night, they made it interesting and showed off the features etc.

 

Does anyone have an estimate for how many Gigs this'll be please ?

 

I’m guessing more than 10

 

It won't be as much as an Oasis gig!

Most disappointing part of stream was constant talking. I just wanted to hear the 87 start and pull away.

 

Just over 16 was posted by someone earlier
It's not an estimate..

 

Yeah finally watched it.
Bubbling with enthusiasm, like kids on Christmas morning.
Nice AP sounds that vary depending on which cab you're driving.A nice touch of realism.

 

I note the reduced timetable for Gen 8 and find it extremely disappointing personally. While I accept the memory problems, removing various services and from what I gather 3 of the 4 locomotives (08, 47, and 101) will not be present in the timetable. At the moment, Gen 8 users are paying the same price for a vastly reduced number of services. While still on Gen 8 myself, I would much rather Dovetail declare where they stand with Gen 8 and either drop support, or reduce the cost of add ons to reflect the reduced nature of these routes. This is especially pronounced in this route, and as I understand it the Morecambe branch, all freight and all shunting services are missing from timetable mode, which is a huge amount of variation lost. Is there any compensation to Gen 8 users for paying the same price for inferior content?

 

I would think that there’s a fair amount of extra work the devs don’t otherwise need to do, to get content running on gen8.

In any case I suspect the writing will be on the wall for gen8 soon, especially with Sony intending to start phasing out support for the PS4 from next year.

 

There will be no sort of compensation. Otherwise they would have to offer it to everyone so it's fair which they won't do.

 

Can people with good PCs and newer consoles get compensation off Gen 8 users for making the sim and routes suffer in order to run on your old, creaking hardware?

 

I watched some of the streams and it does look like a nice loco, (NOT a one-handled wonder), it does look interesting, but At this $44.99 price, This needs to have a "Manual" and not a three(3) page [ here are the keys, this how you start it and press this lever and go ] another $5 Duckets and you have {Train Sim World® 5: Standard Edition} And NO at this point it's not about who, what company or what people were involved in its creation. The MBTA was another $43 Duckets, Manual = 0, training center, and the most important one mainly for the new people ACSES is a complete Joke, not a single word as to how and why there is the ACSES system and how to handle it or what to expect. Yes, I understand Different animal altogether.

West Coast Main Line: Preston - Carlisle
TRAINING MODULES
To help you master the included trains and locomotives, a set of training modules is available to take you through the basics Just how basic, <Here is the Key, turn it on, press this button, turn this lever & watch the needle does not go into the red and your good to Go, now turn this lever and go> This is DLC is introducing yet another route which has neutral zones, this is beyond basic I would think.

Yes, I looked at the nice long list of goodies, Like I said it looks good and very interesting, exciting, and fascinating, BUT, I stopped fawning over things a long time ago, I Question Everything... See my Sig... I have wasted enough time with plenty of broken content.
This includes the Raildriver that I rely on Heavily and it's just being looked into!?
Or is every scenario going to tell people to, walk to the train, put the key in to open the panel, then press the button to open the door then close the panel, close the door, sit in the seat, and so on? And this will serve as an extension of the tutorial and what to do.

And the loo is included


The bottom line this is a lot of money, I don't care if God made it, I will question it... So yes I will look deep and hard at whether this a "well it will go on sale one day" or ?

 

I think the problem lies in this not being what you actually pay for. We all pay for the same license (despite being on gen 9, I can also download the gen 8 version and vice versa, you will also be able to download the gen 9 version when/if you do upgrade). Playing devil’s advocate, we are both paying for the same license and just use different parts of it. Unless you start separating the licenses, there is no reason to change any prices.

Separating the licenses would have even more problems. Suddenly, all the people upgrading hardware would need to pay again to at least cover the difference if not outright buy it again full price, which would both cause an uproar and disincentivise upgrading, both of which are hardly in DTGs’ best interest. Given the havoc that DTGs’ yearly re-releases are causing at least on PlayStation, I also doubt Sony would welcome this idea with open arms.

Don’t get me wrong. I perfectly understand why you are upset and I feel for you. JT’s WCML(N) is probably the most frustrating case of timetable differences since HMA’s dead console timetable at the time. The timetable is the heart and soul of TSW and after reading and hearing about all the work JT put in it, it’s very unfortunate that gen 8 gets but one loco in the timetable as I understand. I absolutely see why one would want to pay less in accordance with that. Given the universal licenses DTG grants, I don’t see how that could work though.

 

Gen 8 and Gen 9 get the same amount of services, we pay for the same. What Gen 9 gets is different layers as part of the price because gen 9 can handle it.

It's what happened with Brighton Mainline and is what convinced me to upgrade to Gen 9.


So for example. A third party (let's call them Fastslowtrains) creates a route

Smithville to Henrytown, a 50 mile route with a branch line to Wallington city.

It comes with a loco, A DMU and carriages.

There are 250 playable services with 30 non driveable AI services coming and going on and off the map.

This costs £29.99 and is both Gen 8 and Gen 9 get this.

But because Gen 9 can handle larger DLCs it gets an additional 100 driveable services and 60 non driveable AI services with layers from other routes being added.

Gen 8 isn't being shafted, both are getting what they paid for, but Gen 9 gets additional layers as a bonus because it's Gen 9, eventually when Gen 10 comes onto the scene it'll be the same thing, Gen 10 will get the additional layers and services.

 

If Gen 8 owners want to pay less, then they will have to accept that they will have to pay again if and when they upgrade, otherwise everyone will buy the Gen 8 version and claim a free update (rather defeating the object or a two tier price system). As it is, when you upgrade, you will automatically get the extra layers for no extra cost.

 

Since I went from Gen8 to Gen9 the difference is staggering.

 

Oh my, nothing like a heartless lack of empathy to spice up the forums of a weekend.

Most, if not all Gen8 players are not able to afford to upgrade or else they surely would.

I think they have a valid argument for paying less for less content.

And there's that urban myth raising its head about Gen8 players holding everyone back, something repeatedly debunked by DTG but which persists in the minds of the mean- spirited among us.

 

I paid for my PS5 monthly over the course of a year, many websites and payment sites allow payments in installments. Gen 9 consoles are now readily available. Many game companies are now leaving Gen 8 behind.

 

As someone who was once a PS4 player, I empathise very much & I think the Value of Gen8 content has diminished significantly in the last couple of years, to the point where I myself wouldn’t buy it, it’s just a bad deal - pay the same to receive less.

The thing is though that DTG obviously have to spend time on getting it running on gen8 in the first place & someone needs to foot the bill for that.

Whilst DTG have repeatedly said Gen8 doesn’t hold back content, do you really believe they’re giving us the full story there? Sure, it’s believable that they have little to no bearing on route scope itself. But consider another big problem for TSW; QA, optimisation & fixes.

I don’t believe at all that there aren’t resources being poured into forcing gen8 to run things, optimise for them & take up more QA. I wouldn’t think it would be a stretch of an opinion to say those resources would be better used for the benefit of the future (if not current) bulk of users.

Gen9 is already seeing problems with running the game; texture loss, sound issues, crashing, performance etc. it seems like a rapidly losing battle to keep gen8 in the mix, when their releases are at the point of included DLC trains not being able to run on the timetable.

Unfortunately we live in a reality where hardware becomes obsolete faster. Look at games these days releasing even on PC, unable to break triple digit FPS without DLSS & FG. Have you seen the Stalker 2 benchmarks Nvidia released recently? Not even 60fps without DLSS on a 4090. Optimisation is a war in the gaming space and it’s one that developers & consumers are losing. So ultimately no, I don’t believe at all that gen8 support isn’t costing everyone else a better experience.

 

They also said BR era content does not sell well.
I bet this DLC is one of the biggest in terms of day one downloads in recent history.

I understand that it's money and not all can afford it, but there is plentiful supply of decent secondhand machines available that won't cost £450, whilst still allowing you to keep your DLC. You can also trade in the old against it to lower the differential.

I'd bet most people have well over their machine cost in DLC. At some point you have to accept limited support and gameplay or pay the cost to upgrade.

I'm an XBox S user, so gen 8.5 really. These machines are just as much an issue as Gen 8 I believe. I will stick it out until Gen 10 is available, as I see no point in changing if they upgrade in 2 years (not gonna pay twice).
If that means limited layers next year, then that's what I will need to accept.

I want the routes to get bigger, better, more layers, more details, more realism as that's progress. That's evolution and it's always gonna happen.

 

At some point before long the tenth-gen consoles (PS6, XBox Nonsensical Designator) will be rolled out, and DTG will be forced to drop the 8th gen because they can't support three generations at once.

But pity the owners of six year old PCs, like moi. That upgrade costs way, way more than 400 bucks.

 

A question to regarding services on Gen 8. Are you able to spawn in the missing stock using the sandbox and drive services like this, (with one of the Class 47/08/101) or can the consoles just handle the 87 in the route at 1 time?

 

I wouldn't know, my PC is more than ten years old (the GPUs exactly ten) and while I was thinking of upgrading to an RTX at the very least, most of my "issues" are low framerates, I have yet to ever see crashes or blurry textures...this to say yes, the upgrade is going to be hella costly but I don't feel as forced to do it (I could just be less stubborn and lower settings or not play at 1440x3440) and be fine nor do I ever get castrated timetables....

 

In preparation, I've loaded up Blackpool Branches this week and redone the Preston shunting with the 08. Haven't driven a shunter in ages.

I forgot just how much fun those services are. Looking forward to more shunting on the new route.

 

I recon in the future, perhaps in tsw6 if their is one. Most consoles will have a restricted timetable due to the current performance of the consoles. I recon the ps5 pro in the future will be the only console with most layers. I think we are closer to Gen10 than a new Gen9

 

The problem is then if you upgrade to a gen9 console then you get the route at the same price making it cheaper than it should be and dovetail probably not allow that,

 

Just Trains preview stream on Tuesday at 19:30 GMT

 

If Tom Harrison is presenting it. It will be really worth watching. This is going to be another Just Trains masterpiece!

 

I've been fortunate to have purchased both my Xbox One and Series S at significant discount. But there is an avenue for people to purchase a Series S/X on an installment plan - https://www.xbox.com/en-gb/Xbox-All-Access

 

Just watched the stream.

I think it is safe to say that JT has raised the bar once again and is really showing DTG how things should be done. Most likely a day one purchase for me. This sort of quality definitely needs to be rewarded.

 

Do you mean, for instance, spending the best part of a year on developing a route?
Because that apparently is a big factor in how JT was able to raise the bar on quality. ( I would reference SPG in this context ).

Or is there something else involved that DTG cannot do realistically?

 

JT may have taken a year to build this, but that's because AFAIK their team are all people in other full time employment doing this in their spare time. Surely it follows if DTG have teams working full time 8 hours a day on a project they should be able to output a similar length route to the same level of quality in a shorter time.

 

Don't DTG allocate something like 3 months per route? That would explain why, they need to get it finished so they can work on their next project.

 

Maybe so But I referenced SPG because DTG apparently spent considerable time building that route ( including the TSW core ) and it bears the mark of care and time spent.

In my opinion there is a very real connection there.

 

Time is definitely a factor. The more time/resources spent on a project, the better it is. JT has proven this twice so far.

When you have a 3rd party developer getting things this good, you have to really question why DTG can’t consistently do the same when it is arguably more experienced and a much bigger team of people.