Wcml South - Not Good Enough

Yep I've stood at Watford Jct. filming for many a happy hour and I honestly can't recall seeing many 4 cars in that time. Strange choice.

 

Wonder whether we're getting a Sunday timetable.

 

Bravo....Well said!

 

I think it does a great representation of the WCML during covid.
Otherwise as you say, it's mainly the usual suspects for me personally. It's sad that you probably know what those are without me having to list them..

 

Cancelled my pre-order. Spent the money on Black Myth Wukong, what a game! It's clear the DTG leadership are still happy to ship unfinished, potentially broken content for customers to spend their hard earned money on. When/if they suitably complete/fix it I will revisit.

 

Fair enough so you did. It wasn't a criticism, I assumed there was likely a failure. I said there were too many four car units on the stream.

 

I hate the way how lighting works on the trains yeah, same in tunnels. This couldve been sorted out a long time ago and it would be an huge improvement

 

For me having spent a lot of time on the route IRL the biggest failings are the London Overground services being relegated from 4 an hour to barely 1 an hour, making them less frequent than even longer distance services, also the 350's only appearing in the rare 4 car consists and the dreadful night lighting for what is mostly an urban route through London and the burbs. This should be an ultra busy route on a par with some of the German ones, more so.

 

All we are saying is DTG need to stop launching unfinished or rushed work and the only way the powers that be will under stand is money, DTG or Focus whoever is pulling the strings and you will give devs like Matt a chance to catch up. They rushed TSW out the door to get our money for a product they know isn't finished, but you do you.

 

That was also something I noticed. I remember thinking "I hope the German route looks busier"

 

If DTG can't seem to produce a Weekday timetable, a Sunday timetable is way off the charts.

 

I don't think the Sunday timetable is that sparse tbh.

 

I just wonder if we expect too much from the sim? I'm thinking in terms of modelling every single real life service, I believe even the real life systems struggle to cope with the complexity of running trains on WCML South? Are we expecting too much for the DTG dispatcher to bring us a complete working and reliable timetable for a route so complex?

Don't know really, I'd love it to have every service but I've a feeling even top end systems would struggle with so much AI, leading to crashes and/or unresolvable reds. Brighton was just about do-able with great 3rd party timetables, but some of that was only 2 track stuff.
DTG would hate us to have route lockups, constant red signals etc, it would lead to even more dissatisfied customers.

 

DTG should take a leaf out of Just Trains route Blackpool branches that is a stunning route the detail and scenery is amazing good timetable that's how a route should be shows they didn't rush it I'm so looking forward to what Preston to Carlisle will look like judging by the pics it looks brilliant

 

Watched about 20 minutes of the stream from the exercise bike and, pardon the pun, might back peddle a bit from my earlier stance. The route is not up to Goblin or BPO standards but it’s not barebones MSTS either.

I followed the run with Daisy driving from Euston to Harrow thus far, just a shame that there was virtually constant chat preventing the train audio coming through properly. That said it did seem very quiet in the cab, no real entertainment there. Daisy should have been encouraged to put the droplight down, see if the exterior sounds percolating in made a difference. And to be fair, the 350 in TSC isn’t all that loud either.

More concerning was the frequent stutters accompanied by sound dropouts. This brings me straight back to the core. By now the programmers should be bottoming this out and fixing it, rather than being directed to waste time on fluff. Also it might just have been me, but I didn’t notice much reverb passing under bridges or through the tunnels? Again that might be down to the cab window being shut.

So I am honestly a bit conflicted again about what’s best to do here. Well for starters I need to fast forward to the Pendie section and see how that comes across. There are still the other issues such as the scant DC Line timetable. But in terms of getting in the cab and driving it doesn’t seem any worse than the average TSW route. Also hinges on how the American and German routes come across, not sure when they are being streamed, need to check.

 

I'd expect the 350 sounds to be more or less identical to the 380.

 

Damned right they should! You can guarantee there will be no shoddy workmanship and nothing left untouched in their version of WCML, I bet we'll have proper working Neutral sections too and some if not all named 87's and probably one or two nice surprises too, it will blow Rivet's/DTG's WCML out of the water.

Really really looking forward to it, hopefully have it in time for Xmas but not really expecting it until early in the new year

 

Having seen all the comments in here and given that I was only interested in WCML, I'm cancelling my order too now given the free upgrade to TSW5 will be available.

I've been travelling to London once or twice a week on that line and have only seen 4 cars trains on 1 or 2 occasions. So much doesn't look right it would annoy me to much. That and the quiet timetable. I hate the quiet routes with no traffic at all.

Not had value from the new versions for a while and feels like a tax on top of buying expensive DLC. I will just sit back and buy things when they hit big sales in a few months.

 

The 380 sounds in the game were actually sourced from a 350, as stated by Matt himself. They had the house alarm-like Desiro sounds, they had a good relationship with Scotrail, it just made sense to put the two together. So yeah asides from perhaps ambient sounds in the internals, in terms of the traction motors and running noise I suspect the 350 and 380 will actually sound identical.

 

Yes it is like a tax and like tax you are expected to pay it. No hang on to your money, every year it is the same DTG whip us into a frenzy, get us all hyped for the content and then dash our hopes, year in year out.

 

I think it's unacceptable to relegate the super busy London Overground to become the equal of a long distance service in timings. Breaks immersion.

 

I never got around to ordering, but what I will do is await improvements to the route and then if this happens buy in the future. Thank goodness for the free upgrade otherwise I would have felt blackmailed to buy it to get the future stuff.

 

Is TSW5 using Unreal 5? I thought it was still 4.xx?

 

Managed to get a few minutes to watch the Pendolino. Now that actually didn’t sound too bad and helped by Daisy opening the cab windows. Still far too much stuttering and sound dropout though. But I would regard the 390 sounds themselves as acceptable. Just a shame it’s such a short section to stretch the Pendie’s legs, similar to when we got the original DB 101 on HRR.

As regards reverb, seems to have been implemented for tunnels, but not for bridges? Something whoever is building the route needs to address before declaring it Gold.

And yes, what the hell is going on with lighting in tunnels. Sudden flashes of bright light at intervals passing through. If this is meant to emulate the effect of air vents in the roof, it doesn’t look like that. Maybe if that was the intention getting distorted by adaptive eye which needs to be suppressed within the tunnel.

So, sigh, yet more confliction. I can see my finger hovering on the rebuy button later and wearing sackcloth and ashes (or being tarred and feathered) on the forum for it.

 

Simply not enough at the end of the day. This is their UK flagship route days away from release and they show this?!
My £54 for the Deluxe edition is safe until I’ve seen what the actual ‘release candidate’ looks like.
DTG have a habit for shooting themselves in the foot. Are they in competition with Rivet for worst showcase haha

 

Why is everyone always comparing with Blackpool? I don't see how you can compare these two routes? They should take a leaf out of Suffragette line. That route looked very well and resembles more with what I would expect of a modern era route.

 

We won't tar and feather you, we will just tar you. Yes, I know the conflict, we all have it, nothing would please me more than DTG to fix everything by the 17th, but it is not gping to happen, it probably won't even be fixed this year. Does that help?

 

I need therapy, or beer…

 

Having read through the entirety of this thread and twice watched the stream I have cancelled my pre-order on Steam. I hope that DTG Alex & DTG Matt take notice of the negativity and produce something that is value for money and that does justice to this wonderful route. No doubt some of the talented mod community will do DTG’s job and produce something that will do this route justice. Until then my cash is firmly staying put in my wallet!
Edit; money saved in not buying this tosh just used for Star Wars Outlaws…and I saved £14!

 

Train sim world is a complete accident in its current state. Some things work well on a certain route, while the same things don't work on another route. Why do I have a good light at night in Dresden Riesa, while on a new route there is only a black screen at night? I mean even Rapid Transit looks better at night with headlights on than the latest track accident in North West London.

You can't use half the timetable because you only see a black screen at night. Nobody of the developers and testers seen this????

Why does the suspension work on some trains and not on others. Train Sim World is a huge puzzle where you have to work out for yourself where things have been programmed and implemented correctly. Some routes look good and some look like they were started 10 minutes ago.

And the whole thing has to stop as soon as possible. There needs to be a standard for new content.

 

It seems to me that every year they need to placate the shareholders by releasing a rushed product which the casuals will lap up.
I strongly believe that Matt + co have a genuine love of trains and train sims and, once profit is achieved, will work to improve matters.
For us on here, I think we're a minority. I realize many are, unlike me, big train fans, but patience is key.
I've recently bought TSW4 deluxe for 8 quid, and I'm very happy with it.

 

iirc the guy that started DTG came from EA which explains a lot!

 

Oh Jesus...were are doomed!!!

 

DTG arent gonna listen to yous unless you STOP BUYING CONTENT

 

This tread need to be lock before it get out of control

 

Why? There's nothing being said in here that goes against their code of conduct.

 

Whereas this tread needs replacing....

 

It's got tread on it. Good to go another 10k

 

Unless DTG have a problem with us expressing our thoughts on a highly anticipated route, which has unfortunately not been done with the love and passion we were hoping to see, then this thread should stay open. There are no fights going on, and nothing getting ‘out of control’.

 

TSW5 is running on Unreal Engine 4.26

 

Judging by the level of the account, and the number of achievments unlocked during the stream, it would appear to have been a fresh install / build swap for the stream.
As regards the timetable, could it be that some layers were not picking up correctly, as Matt said that ECML should have around 100 layers if you select/deselect them in the layer option, but this appeared to have 3.
Maybe the 8 car 350 services are on a different layer and weren’t being picked up.

 

Are you from North Korea?

 

I'm guessing unlike TSW, you avoided reading any criticism of Star Wars Outlaws, this is Eurogamer's review:

"It lacks the branching, open stealth of an Arkham game, the systemic options of a Dishonored or the incisive, relentlessly satisfying speed of picking enemies off in Assassin's Creed. It lacks the linear polish and charisma of Uncharted. Lacks the animation flow to its yellow-ledge platforming next to a Horizon, or the sheer joy of taking platforming and making it into an actual game in itself, as in Star Wars Jedi."

 

DTG are listening, they are reading the forums and they have genuinely thanked us for our feedback because our feedback is invaluable to them as a company to get customer feedback as to where they are going wrong. What would kill TSW would be to say nothing and NOT buy the game, DTG would much prefer you discuse your problems with the game. This will help with TSW5 and going forward it will help with TSW6 because when the Devs tell upper management the game isnt ready, they will listen and not do a forced launch, sure we might get the game late, but it will be finished.

 

My theory is that since DTG are only modeling the 350/1 that there are not enough class numbers to cover all services as 8 cars without featuring the other sub classes?

 

Better than there efforts last year when TWS4 Launched with ECML
Further to that the TSW version of WCML-South is looking a hell of lot than the TS version

 

DTG locking this thread would not look good at all. We are entitled to vent our frustrations providing we are not rude or abusive.

 

They haven’t listened so far. There has been strong feedback for years and here we are on TSW 5 with a lot of the same problems, just under a different coat of paint.

 

Problems with TSW5? How about TSW4?

 

No, I have watched some streams of Outlaws and decided that my hard-earned would be better spent on that than TSW5. I understand & appreciate that no game will be 100% perfect but after watching the TSW5 livestream on Thursday that I will wait and see how it evolves.
Looking at Steam just now I can see that I have spent almost £2k on TSW content. Until DTG seriously take notice of players concerns and issues I wont be spending any more money on them.
Btw, Eurogamer reviews arent worth the digital paper they are written imo.