Wcmls Major Update (december 2024)

Jonathan politely declined

 

I did 5Q54 on PS5 - actually a good run that I recommend. Haven't tried the others yet.

 

Not to take away from Liams & I’m sure others’ work, but all in all the handling of this route has been pretty poor.

The instability of it is right up there, low performance I can accept in small doses & is expected with routes of this scope, but not being able to guarantee a completed run is bad.

The licensing debacle, timetable, fictional track & signal laying, OLE spaghetti, state of the DC line, graphical issues, incorrect consists, performance & stability etc really make for a perfect storm - no less for TSW’s ‘most requested route’.

Some of the above has now been addressed (3 months after release), some of it hasn’t & some of it is worse than before. It seems that due to the way parts of this content were handled that some of the issues will never be resolved. Why on earth they’ve had to depend on the community to get a realistic DC line timetable is shocking.

Frankly DTG need to address whatever the core issue of this farce was, because developing & releasing their communities most requested route in this manner is just ridiculous & I sincerely hope it isn’t repeated.

The cherry on top is that despite it all, DTG has of course still managed to release 2 payware packs for the route.

I think this release alone warrants DTG addressing their yearly re-releases, they clearly cannot handle it. We’ve had problems with every single release of TSW as the time constraints being imposed are unworkable. It took 12 months for TSW4 to get suspension rolled out for a handful of trains. TSW5 launches & we still get new rolling stock without it.
The community is paying more than they should be to get this content & members of it are then having to do the work that DTG should have done. There’s obviously an R shaped elephant in the room too for this particular route, but frankly I believe the blame is still with DTG for that outsourcing blunder.

 

I’m not sure if this a bug I was driving the West Coast mainline south. I was driving the class 350 and I accidentally put it into neutral when the train was moving the train the brakes are supposed to release when the train stops but it doesn’t I tried pressing the AC button to get the power up and running again. The train still won’t move and also when the doors close the orange lights in the middle of the train are supposed to go out when the train doors are shut but the orange lights are still on

 

I have to say at this point I totally agree. The new release cycle does nothing apart from cause issues. I'd rather have DTG focus on 3 new routes than re-release the game for the 5th time. And as you say for some of those "Core features" we had to wait at least half a year for.

I know rush hour had it's mistakes but even with them that was so much smoother than all these different TSW releases that have caused so much trouble.

 

I can't recall but did frankfurt/fulda and LA/san bernardino route every have as many problems as wcmls cause been on frankfurt fulda all and runs like dream on xbox

 

The area between Hanau and Frankfurt could cause crashes but it's been better since they fixed too many trees causing memory links.

I find the regional services can be hit and miss especially in the dostos if the loco brakes aren't working properly.

But when it's working well Frankfurt-Fulda has lots of great runs with so much business.

I think WCMLS has similar potential if they can make the final steps they need to take in the new year especially if the railtours and sleeper services can be fitted in.

I think regardless of whether there is a TSW6, 7, 8, etc there just needs to be a review of which routes are going to take more time to be ready compared to others and look to adjust the resource and business strategy accordingly.

 

Rush Hour was an interesting point in TSW’s life. Overall I’d say the routes were a success, even if it did take some patching afterwards. As a project it did bring TSW forward quite abit as it was a real turning point for timetables in particular.

Unfortunately for all the things DTG should have learnt from that experience, they managed to conclude that despite having issues with developing 3 routes & staggering the release, they should shorten the dev time & push all three routes out together going forward.

Rush hour really marked a point where lessons could be truly learnt in striking a balance between bundle releases & appropriate development time to do so. It’s a shame it was squandered in that respect.

This is the point really, they got 2 out in largely the same state as a typical DLC, but failed to do 3. Considering it’s taking 3-6 months at least to get WCML into a good place, I’d say that’s the minimal amount of time that needs adding to the dev cycle. That said I don’t think Frankfurt was a massive success in all areas, whilst it’s in a much better state than WCML, there were release issues with it (particularly the rolling stock). Not sure what the state of it now is as I don’t play it due to it being plagued by texture degradation.

Now if they’d outsourced to a dev which has the tools & skills to produce a route to normal TSW standards, then the 12 month cycle might work, but Rivet was obviously not the correct choice for that in this case.

 

What speaks volumes is, Liam's work is fantastic from West Somerset Railway, to Cathcart Circle (which is now probably my favourite route because of how good it is), and the upcoming GWE remaster (which has been a discussion for years on how sophisticated any rework would be on it), and for him to put blood sweat and tears into this route and for WCMLS to still be problematic, really hammers home the failings in Rivets work...

I'm aware DTG are the publishers who allowed it to be released in this state so to some extent its just as much their responsibility. But if this isn't evidence enough about the questionable quality of Rivets work. I don't know what will be...

I believe it was JetWash who said back in September who said the original timetable wasn't the work of DTG from his experience. So I believe Rivet are solely responsible for the route building with the exception of the 390.

Lessons definitely need to be learnt going forward.

 

a hallmark of Rivet in my experience is the timetable. West Cornwall timetable was lacking, Edinburgh to Glasgow was around half of what was expected (although Skyhook have come in and vastly improved that one in fairness), while Fife Circle was possibly the biggest let-down from a timetable perspective in the entire history of TSW (and again i'm still holding out hope Skyhook can come in and save that with their class 158 timetable next year, as even with the 'improvements' of Cowdenbeath and Leven services it's still well below-par).. whilst the pros and cons of Rivet have been debated on here for so long, i think it's undeniable they have form when it comes to below-standard timetable offerings, it's there for all to see in their previous releases.

People can say it's unfair to call out Rivet on things like this, but DTG have been on form with timetables in recent times. And look at Just Trains for example, i don't think i would find one complaint regarding the timetable Just Trains provided in either of their routes.. JT have their reputation for a reason, they take great care and attention to detail on their timetables, you have to ask yourself can the same be said about Rivet?

that's not me trying to sound harsh, it's just simple facts of what Rivet have offered to us in the past.

 

I noticed the ‘72 tube stock still has an issue with carriage lighting. Also no passengers will board for the whole route - probably because of the nuclear lighting . Does anyone else notice this or is it just an Xbox issue?

 

I think that's actually a pretty fair critique. Rivet do great vehicle modeling, and truly do some interesting and new things (DTG, how's auto-announcements as a core feature coming along btw?), but their timetables have been bad across the board, and that's a HUGE problem because timetable mode is the heart and soul of TSW.

If the timetable is bad, the route gets a bad reputation from the very start.

I truly wonder if their team even play TSW timetables regularly- maybe coming from a TSC background, they are more into scenarios or maybe a quick free-roam session?

Whatever the reason, it's clearly hurt their TSW product imo.

 

DTG Liam DTG Matt Sorry for having to come back on this issue but: the 350 isn’t really working anymore for me on PC (no mods installed). When applying power (moving the handle to notches 1/2 etc), braking/driving barometer (next to the speedo) reacts very slowly and remains in the breaking area even though I’m giving (full) throttle. I’m assuming, that’s not how it’s meant to be, at least it wasn’t like this before the update.
But more importantly: the desk light dimmer isn’t working, so the speedo and the braking/driving barometer aren’t lit up, which makes driving at nighttime impossible.
Any feedback/help is much appreciated.
It would be such a shame because the update really made the route much better.

 

The 114 is pathetic and beside having a good model a total mess. On the other side the route itself is very well made and enjoyable, especially with the 101 expert.

Spent not even 10mins on a service run with the 114 because there is so much wrong with the loco. I would have preferedca 143 renumbered compared to now.

Whoever made the 114, had neither knowledge in trains nor interest to research and make things right.

 

Bit of advice: don't be tempted to spawn anything in Willesden/Wembley sidings, then fast travel somewhere else. No chance it'll cope with that!

 

Hmmm. My guesses as to what's going on here...
1. It's so cold outside the passengers are required to huddle to stay warm
2. It's some strange club initiation stunt
3. It's "pretend you're an emperor penguin" day
4. There's a local hospital that specializes only in the separation of conjoined siblings
5. It's a mime competition to see how many people fit into an invisible box

 

This has been happening at Stratford Intl on SEHS for a while now, its very annoying.

 

Oh yes on the 350 service I drove last night I had a similar issue where passengers got out and then formed a huddle like this outside the doors. Kind of looked like they were acting like doormen for anyone trying to get on my train

 

You're not getting on mate!

 

Good to know. I now wonder if the problem with the route not having working neutral sections is all down to the trains themselves. If not, and they've just decided to add them in the update it is a nice improvement.

 

I have to say, TSW offers now a lot of content and its growing a lot faster. But to be honest here, DTG should take a break from going to TSW6, 7, 8. Its really necessary to sort out the many core problems, passenger system is broken. And they keep releasing features which arent even getting delivered. Its really close to a point which can be called "beyond repair".

If they continue like TSW 4 & 5, DTG might possible botch the entire franchais

 

That's a system error. I haven't seen anyone else mention the issue so I think it may be on your end. One question I should ask is how much of your system storage is free? The Xbox operating system is a heavily modified version of Windows, and Windows does have some issues when the storage gets really full.

The BR204 had a hilariously bad timetable. Almost every 204 service used a separate locomotive, and no thought was spent on the start and end points for these locomotives. Therefore the locos ended the day at a different place to where they started, meaning that if you left the timetable on overnight it would break itself.

 

The second run through of the route (and I was streaming at the time) there seemed to be very little stuttering, not as bad as the first run I did after the update.

Hentis

 

Hi I have 760gb free tws is the only game on my Xbox people have had that message before on other routes

 

In the interests of constructive feedback, started the 350 run again I aborted the other evening.

This time no one under at Harrow so this has got to be an intermittent problem, possibly related to passenger movement on the adjacent DC Line platform. However massive stuttering and FPS drop going through Harrow, so same as pre update.

The odd instance of track texture phasing blurry and back around Watford.

Basically this route needs a bit of bug hunting and a lick of paint in the right places to turn it round. Despite not being a fan of modern trains I find the 350 not unpleasant to drive (better than the Electrostars) and the Pendolino is a nice train too. It's basically Watford to Euston that drags the route down and why, with hindsight maybe it should have gone from Watford to Rugby via Weedon and Northampton instead.

 

After being initially impressed with the timetable doing some rush-hour runs, I booted up in Euston at a slightly quieter time of day — 15:50.

I set the date to today, RTT says there’s ~21 trains leaving the station in the next 59 minutes.

I could find ~75% of the trains.

Of the missing ones, there was no:
15:53 AWC to Manchester
15:56 LNWR to Birmingham
16:10 AWC to Birmingham
16:13 AWC to Manchester
16:39 AWC to Edinburgh

It feels like there’s a good step forward with this timetable, but it’s not quite the gold standard. If those services exist then I’ll happily be corrected.

 

I'm a bit disappointed that the stations such as Manchester haven't got their proper names on the passenger information screen

 

Just did an early morning Pendolino run. I've probably played 250-300 hours of TSW between PS4 and PS5 and never had a 'one under' on any route but just had two passengers do it at once around Harrow. Based on other comments in the thread I think this has become a problem area for the route in terms of NPC behaviour that needs looking into urgently. It really takes the relaxation out of the game.

 

I agree, I think they need to review future DLC work and releases and solve the core issues first. With more and more coming out, it's only going to get harder to sort.
With today's news on 2 out of the 3 packs 'suddenly needing' the core routes, it's almost like a runaway train that needs bringing back under control.
If DTG came out and said they were suspending development to solve the game breaking and immersion killing issues for a month or two, I think most would accept it.

Feels very much like fire fighting at the moment with constant Issues at every turn.

 

I said I was going to leave it but the issues with trains blocking one another at Harrow & Wealdstone prompted me to do some very basic investigations:

I spawned on foot at Harrow & Wealdstone both at 10:55 & 11:00 and the Overground train (service 2C21) that was blocking me when I attempted service 2C22 wasn't there and had gone on further ahead as it should do. There was also not two 1972 stock trying to hog the siding either and service 2D69 was not blocked by the 1972 stock that half in the siding and half on the main Watford DC track. I then spawned on foot at Headstone Lane at 10:55, waited for 2C22 to arrive and then traveled to Harrow & Wealdstone as a passenger and same results - nothing blocking each other.

I then decided to see if I could actually complete 2C22 given the game crashed as I pulled into South Kenton. Everything ran the same including the trains blocking each other at Harrow & Wealdstone so as before, I deleted the offending trains and then carried on. This time, there was no crash at South Kenton and I was able to make it all the way to Euston almost without any issues (more on that later).

I then not long ago decided to run 2D69 out of curiosity - outside of a couple of rogue AWS ramps, tunnel texture issues and noticeable frame rate issues at Euston, I made it to Harrow & Wealdstone to find everything was normal - 2C22 passed through heading south as it should and only one 1972 stock in the siding as it should be. I then continued onto Watford Junction

So, I can only guess that when you specifically select service 2C22 to run, 2C21 decides to throw a hissy fit when it reaches Harrow & Wealdstone. A 1972 stock arrives at some point after this and once it's finished alighting at the station, it's then routed towards the siding with the game forgetting there is already a 1972 stock in the siding. This then blocks both 2C22 which is forced to sit at never ending red signal just before Harrow & Wealdstone and 2D69 which is forced to sit at Harrow & Wealdstone, never making it to Watford Junction. To top it off, even if 2C21 could move under it's own accord, the 1972 stock can never get out of the siding because the one closest to the station is not in a position to switch to the southbound DC line to reach the platforms so both are trapped as a result

Whilst doing this testing, I didn't encounter anymore passengers crossing the tracks at Harrow & Wealdstone so it does seem to very random judging by everyone's reports (mine happened in the Class 390 refurb scenario). I did have a near miss with a passenger at Kensal Green when heading towards Euston - they had just crossed the track as I pulled into the station but were trapped in the middle between the two lines as a 1972 stock was at the opposite platform

 

I read this whole post in Max Payne's voice, if you see what I mean

 

On the same wavelength my dude, I totally get what you mean.....

 

I have to say I’ve been enjoying the route much more since the update . The busier timetable makes the immersion much better . Not really having any significant performance issues , but am on PC with 32gb ram and 11gb video ram maybe helps ( this is with all layers enabled 710 etc and new gameplay pack ) . 350 I found is also quite nice to drive . One thing I did notice when stopped in the 350 it’s completely silent. However sometimes when you first get on the train ( starting on foot ), there is an electrical humming sound which sounds more realistic , but this soon disappears and doesn’t come back when you stop again . Also the yellow PCB / pantograph up light in the cab seems to be illuminated almost all the time which I’m not sure is correct .

 

Seen a few people mentioning potential issues with the class 350.

Just run 2T24 Tring - London Euston 10:13AM departure
PC Player - Steam

1: The unit certainly does make sounds whilst stationary. Getting out at Berkhamsted the same sounds exist.
2: The Panto/VCB light should NOT be illuminated
3: The DSD should illuminate when on, it does NOT

 

So DTG when is the update coming out to fix all the problems caused by the last update especially for xbox x/s user please cause I just played a 350 and crashed when I got to harrow and Wealdstone and the 390 crashed when I got 1 mile away from Euston I'm on xbox x witn 760gb free memory tsw is the only game I have on it xbox is update.

 

It weird I've got a Xbox series X with 347 games on it with 7.2TB free storage and have been in and out of Euston and done full length runs and not had a single crash since the update, don't even think I had a crash before the update either.....

 

Thanks for that .


So do you always hear some sort of running sound while stationary? When I drive it , and come to a stop the cab is completely silent . Not even any air con sound unless I turn it on , on the panel behind the drivers seat .

 

Yeah you 7.2tb I got 760gb that's why it might be ok for you or you just lucky and encountered any problems

 

1 genuine question, how old is your TV or monitor, I've got a 65inch modern high quality 4k ultra hd TV that can handle loads of graphics being generated for the game, I'm wondering if it's not your Xbox but your TV or monitor that can't handle what's being asked of it.....

 

I doubt the amount of free storage space has anything to do with the crashes. DTG has said it’s system memory that’s causing the issue.

 

60 inch LG 4k a year old tv and it handles every other route perfectly

 

Yes. After starting the train up at Tring and when stopped collecting passengers at Berkhamsted the same train sounds existed ( I got out and walked down the train ). I play exclusively on PC.

 

Fair enough, though I do think it's more of something at your end than the update on the Xbox, you just seem to have every issue that you could imagine that not many others do, and I'm only talking about the Xbox side of this issue, playstation peeps are sharpening their sticks and pitchforks I believe......

 

Thanks, for some reason I only occasionally hear some sound from the 350 cab when stopped , normally when I first get in .

 

The thing is before the update it worked just fine none of theses issues and all the other routes are just fine frankfurt/fulda and LA/sanbardino and the older routes even the new WCML over shap works brilliantly then play WCML london/Milton Keynes and just goes horrible wrong.

 

At Bushey station, platform 5, in two places there are textures with the name of the station floating slightly in front of the fence:

 

I also play on PC and have noticed that the class 465 is very quiet in the cab when standing still as well. There seem to be some sound when putting the reverser into forward, but it quickly cuts out. It might be a similar issue, although I have not heard the sound continue in a while compared to the 350.

Anyway, I just tested a couple of services and it seems to be random which cabs have sound in the 350. I am running with a few mods though, and I will try again later at some point without any mods. I also noticed that the desk/instrument light dimmer didn't dim. Instead it just switched between 0% and 100%.

 

Never seen an NPC hitch a ride on a moving freight train...



She stepped on board at Apsley and was last seen heading in the direction of Euston.

 

Before fast travel implementation to the game this was my method of getting about, surfing freight trains on various routes lol.......