Workshop Wednesday Suggestions

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by DTG Jamie, Oct 1, 2020.

  1. atomicdanny

    atomicdanny Member

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    There is a version somewhere but really really old - at the moment it's pretty much empty where I've extended it, rebuilt it, deleted it, rebuilt it etc (I only really use it now for screenshots unfortunately - and also couldn't even share it - it is it's own folder - and has DTG assets) (although I think we're taking the topic a bit off topic though :) )
     
  2. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    Well - nonetheless sounds very interesting
     
  3. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I'm with others. I personally consider anything you do on your own time to be content made as part of the community. That said, I am equally aware that some would say "Oh, they're showing their own employee, this is not legit." Would be a chat moderating nightmare. I don't mind if it's a payware route you are involved in making as it's still a DTG product and they have a right to show off stuff made on it, anyway. Even a freeware route with scenarios by others is fine, such as a scenario pack I found for the 2016 Faversham merge from ATS.. Where I can see issues is if they run your own scenario, regardless of the route it takes place on. It's too bad they would have to be excluded, but out of avoiding trouble, that is where the line would have to be, I think.
     
  4. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Jamie for updated the workshop Wednesday schedule, but it would be extremely useful if you could update it at least an hour before the start of the stream please and not a few day afterwards.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2021
  5. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Also was great to see the new Falmouth on there. If you want to redeem yourself, there are some WSR Class 35 scenarios up now, and the 07s. I plan to now do the 101s to soft launch my channel but will have to use Marleyman’s reskin.
     
  6. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    Am I the only one that finds it a tiny bit ironic that moments after we resolve all this discussion about whether or not it is ethical to show Danny's routes on the stream - Jamie and JD go and show one of Danny's scenarios!
    On the plus side though, good on DTG for putting the links in the description - it's definitely a step in the right direction for those of us who want to play along at home.
     
  7. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I completely missed that it was Danny's scenario. LOL But I agree, having the information updated quickly is important and a good step.
     
  8. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Where are you seeing the updated information as Jamie’s thread is so far only to June 19th stream?

    What does bug me is that Matt used to drive on routes other developers put on to Workshop, but since Jamie took over from Matt, he drives DTG routes and workshop scenarios and we no longer get to see the work of developers routes.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2021
  9. atomicdanny

    atomicdanny Member

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    He showed a workshop route on Wednesday :) (a reworking of a DTG route, but still a workshop route), - https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=2495889985
     
  10. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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  11. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I get why. Freeware routes are a way to extend the game using assets you already have. And if you are missing an asset, it sells that asset. Falmouth Branch facelift? It sells Riviera in the 50s as the secondary requirement.
     
  12. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    Well, personally, I think workshop routes show off the talent of the community much more. I could knock off a goodish scenario on a route with a fair amount of AI that lasts half an hour in about 30-45 minutes, whereas route building in itself can take months to make even a fairly detailed shortish route.
     
  13. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I've been finding great UKTS options. They are dated, but look for instance at Crouch Valley 3 with about a couple dozen scenarios on UKTS (and really should be on ATS or in the Workshop with a scenic update). The Central Route is also at UKTS and includes some 93 scenarios, with a scenario pack of a mere six more and a few others (possibly for v2, not v3) created by a user named Kenny; you may have heard of him, he's known as Marleyman. The route is old enough that it's among the 18 schematic maps on his site, in fact, along with the South Devon route. (He also has Port Road - WLoS is too new - and Newcastle to York Modern, the former JT route.) Want one more curious offering? I stumbled upon Leafy Suburbs today. Found a few scenarios for it. It's also a requirement for the Northern Heights route, also at UKTS. Then there's everything at BackdatedTrainSim, OnTrack Simulations, Vulcan Productions, and ATS with the exception of a couple of routes locked behind subscriptions that then also require one of the few rare items sold through their interface exclusively (which is kind of an irony; subscribe for a free route, but you must also buy this through us to use it, and by the way, no updates after the year ends).

    Other than the subscription bit at ATS, there's lots you can get for free even there. Quality can vary.
     
  14. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Jamie, what are you planning for tonight’s programme? Some good ideas provided by Cyclone. Also it’s the anniversary so Brighton line on a 73 next week please.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
  15. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I presume you mean my earlier post. The most recent post details some non-Workshop items. Some of those use things like the UKTS freeware packs or other assets from UKTS and can't be on the Workshop for that reason. As a result, they definitely would not fit the Workshop theme unless Jamie just decided screw it, I'm doing something different. In that case, Crouch Valley and the Ay Valley Line would be great options to consider. For the former, I even have a couple of scenarios on the Gainesborough Line near the Braintree extension.
     
  16. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    Great birthday stream last night, it was nice to see the return of the Onehouse Model Railway, although I was a little disappointed we didn't see Knebworth. Honestly, it's like Laurel and Hardy with Matt and Jamie - Stan Laurel gives it a try and Knebworths, and then Oliver Hardy says "let me show you how it's done" and SPADs within the first few minutes! Perhaps Jamie might retry the scenario later on like he did in the March Madness stream. Anyway, I thought I’d re-suggest one of my ideas for the birthday stream here, since it didn’t get shown and is really fun.
    Name: Forest Rush Rollercoaster by Ditjo
    Link: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=571127863
    Length: it’s a short loop line, but lots of run potential.
    The route is a literal rollercoaster, if you use the saddletank from IOW with 5 plank wagons, it will go around the track entirely propelled by gravity. Of course, it’s nice to try some other small rollercoaster type locos to see how they fare (milk float anyone?). It would be fun to see it, because as well as working practically as a rollercoaster the rollercoaster area is fully populated with scenery. There’s even a few helix loops to get back up to the top.
     
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  17. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Who's on first, What's on second, and I Don't Know is on third...
     
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  18. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Shame Jamie or DTG cannot be bothered to give us prior warning if only ten minutes before the stream. Their programme must be planned in advance and it is disappointing that those streaming at DTG cannot inform us before going on air. Stops those wanting to play alongside the stream.
     
  19. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I can understand them wanting to keep it a little bit of a surprise before they start. But at the same time, I kind of want to know what's being played before the stream too, yes.
     
  20. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Hoping there will be an announcement Jamie, when you can, before tonight’s stream please.

    Incidentally, Workshop Wednesday Routes and Scenarios thread has not been updated since June 2nd. I hate to say it, but I would have thought DTG would have been more professional. I would happily keep the tread up to date especially as people will be looking in hoping to see the update.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
  21. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    It is a real shame, since this is the only regular TS stream we get now (edit: apart from the asset creation streams but these are irregular and don't feature any actual TS gameplay - I'll let people have their own opinions on that one), considering DTG have dropped release streams for most TS products, or merged them into the workshop Wednesday stream which really defeats the point of workshop Wednesday. I think your best shot would be to ask in chat while the first scenario/route is being showcased what the second will be, and load that up before it starts, I have seen this work before.

    Edit: also, I remember a couple of weeks ago DTG put the links in the description of the stream (on YT, at least, I don't watch the streams on twitch), but then never did so again. If they could at least do that, it would give us the minutes to download them and load the first one up.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2021
  22. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    I take back what I said, good work DTG, links in the description is definitely an improvement. Thank you for listening to our feedback in this regard :)
     
  23. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Jamie for updating thread
    Workshop Wednesday Routes And Scenarios
     
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  24. terrybartlett1992

    terrybartlett1992 New Member

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    This is a scenario I made for the workshop Its called Modified Hall Rescue feel free to check it out Jamie its under TTbartlett
     

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  25. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    DTG Jamie, can I ask - are you planning on showcasing any routes in this week's upcoming stream, or any time in the near future? Personally, and I'm sure people might agree with me on this, I would love to see some more routes on the stream, since in my opinion they really display the talent of the community more than scenarios. It's really nice to see them showcased, considering a lot of routes require many dependencies and people might not be able to see them for this reason. In terms of which routes, I've suggested quite a few in the past few weeks (really quite a lot actually, sorry, but I love me a good workshop route!) or you could even show one that has been shown before, perhaps a long time ago, or show an area of a route that hasn't been shown before (such as the Lenton-On-Sea branchline shown a few weeks ago - it's an absolutely huge route, with the showcase a few weeks ago you barely scratched the surface!)
     
  26. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    It can also make people in the community very sad. Such as, driving the Raquette requires Stevens Pass, so do you really want to advertise a route to people when they can't even obtain the requirements for it? Things like this have to be considered. When a route has all parts obtainable, that is one I would show off to encourage people to get those requirements to drive the route.
     
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  27. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    Well, most routes don't require routes not universally available. I don't have Stevens Pass, Marias Pass or Phorum Peninsula, which seem to be the main routes that cause this problem, and yet I have built up a quite handsome collection of workshop routes. I agree though, I would advise against showing routes that require these, but nonetheless there are a good many that don't.

    Edit: like back in the days of train sim live, if a route required the Phorum Peninsula, Matt wouldn't show it unless the chat really wanted to see it, if it was a really nice route for example. If there was a nice route that required any of the unobtainable routes, personally I would prefer to at least see it, if I can't play it. But maybe that's just me.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2021
  28. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    The irony is routes requiring Phorum can be reposted using LTHC instead. Just delete the existing one, repost, and get your 30 likes again. Too bad there is no way to expedite this process for correcting such changes.
     
  29. terrybartlett1992

    terrybartlett1992 New Member

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    Last edited: Jun 23, 2021
  30. davidjamesgoodfellow

    davidjamesgoodfellow Member

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    Hi please Can you do the brighton mainline in the 387 or the 377 from London Victoria to brighton
     
  31. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    It usually helps to have a scenario in mind rather than just asking for a random drive on the route. If you have any in mind, please post them. Otherwise, I've randomly pulled out the second most popular scenario in the last week, one called Brighton Connect. I was tempted to grab a Thameslink service through London Bridge but decided that might be too long and requires a route merge be installed first anyway.
     
  32. atomicdanny

    atomicdanny Member

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    They won't show the 387 because it's a reskin :), although equally - there are scenarios like this one -
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfi...9452308&searchtext="South+London+to+Brighton"
    or this one -
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfi...2573214&searchtext="South+London+to+Brighton"

    (a complete list - although for that "merged" route )
    https://steamcommunity.com/workshop...[]=electric&browsesort=totaluniquesubscribers
     
  33. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    It's finally happened - the mammoth of a project of the New York Division Bergen Line has been completed and finalised. I know this route has been shown once before, but that was only in the original Workshop Wednesday stream. Anyway, if there's a route worthy of being shown twice it's this one. The project first started 7 years ago, I think, by Minerman and his son. It has progressed considerably since then, totalling 99.4 miles of mainline on the NJT Main Line and Bergen Line, with multiple various spurs branches, bringing the route total to well over 100 miles. The route has featured many times on Matt’s twitch streams throughout its development, and Matt does seem to be a big fan, so I think he’ll be glad to know it’s finally finished. The route runs from Hoboken Terminal through Secaucus Junction Low Level through the Hackensack Meadowlands and across the Delaware River finishing in Port Jervis. It is a non-electrified route operated by NJT and NS.

    The route has the detail of a very high-end payware route, and yet has a huge length. There is a list of recommended stock on the workshop page, including any diesel NJT loco for passenger services and locos like the NS GP38 or any Dash 7 for freight. If you want to show this, you could either wait until any scenarios are uploaded, or if you want to make a quick one for the stream, if you’re going for passenger, the GP40 was used last time so I think it would be good to try something different, like the F40 or the new U34. Personally, I would love to see the route from the new comet I cabcar that comes with the U34 (which, by the way, won’t actually work with anything other than the U34). Edit: meant to say, if it was my choice, for a freight scenario, I would quite like to see a NS B36-7. But that’s just me, there is a lot of other good NS stock out there. Also, was just looking at one of Matt’s videos on the line, another good train that isn’t actually on the list is the Metro-North P32, especially on the newer section north of Suffern.

    So, I think it would be great to do the route justice by showing it off again, especially including the new section of the route. I doubt the entire route would be able to be covered, considering its incredible length and the fact that it is rather slow in places. I don’t know, if it’s viable it might be an idea to dedicate an entire stream to it, maybe with more than one scenario to show off the whole route. It’s really amazing that such an amazing project is finally done, congratulations to all involved.

    Edit: completely forgot the standard format for one of these posts :D:
    Name
    : New York Division Bergen County Line by Minerman146
    Link: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=265923409
    Approx length: 100+ miles!
    Why it should be shown: illustrated in my above post
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2021
  34. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    I knew it wouldn't be long - I just was looking on the workshop and noticed a scenario had been uploaded for the newly finalised Bergen Line - https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2534736975. It's a full run of the line and takes 140 minutes, so would be a good one of you are prepared to devote an entire stream to it. If not though, I'm sure it won't be long before there are more.
     
  35. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    If any route deserves a longer segment, this is it. Put the train on notch 1 and just look around the route as you go. I've seen other streamers do this, such as schnauzahpowahz who has produced MULTIPLE videos on the line. I'd say make a special episode just running the entire line with such a scenario.
     
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  36. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Quick observation (and now a double post due to time between): on Youtube, the live chat replay is disabled. It might be handy on the permanent video to include links to the scenarios and routes in question there. This would take a lot more work than updating the thread, but it would be extremely useful to have them in the video description where they are played in addition to having the compiled collection of items in the thread here. This may be, as noted, more work than it's worth, but adds to the value of the video itself in each case.
     
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  37. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    On Wednesday's stream, it was mentioned that a new challenge was needed to test DTG Jamie's ability further. A few things came to mind, and eventually I decided on this: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2480385998. The idea came about after I posted a thread about DTG doing their next challenge livestream on TS rather than TSW (https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/dtg-challenge-stream-for-ts.39656/ if anyone’s interested) which inspired the author to create this challenge scenario, which I think could be put to good use here. It’s a tight-timetabled steam hauled service in a massive rainstorm, with accuracy points as well.

    On another note, I recently posted a thread where people can leave any really nice, high quality workshop routes they had found, to which Jamie replied saying he had wanted to show some more workshop routes on the stream, which I am very happy about, I do like a good workshop route. So, I thought I’d make those routes into an official suggestion here. Rather than having to paste over all the links, here is a link to the earlier thread: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/best-highest-quality-workshop-routes.42175/.

    Finally, yesterday, I happened to come across some really good scenarios for the DPS ECML Northeast, which is one of the routes I earlier suggested, if you want to show it. Both https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=762374816 and https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=433069269 are both really enjoyable. I would say, although I really enjoyed both, I would prefer the first one, but the latter probably fits better into the stream timing-wise.
     
  38. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    If the route is on DPSimulation but not on the Workshop, they won't show it on Workshop Wednesday, which is about the Workshop. Frankly, I wish a weekend stream showing off random things in the TS world outside of Workshop would happen.
     
  39. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    No, the route is on the workshop, but it is by DPSimulations. There is an updated version on their website though.
     
  40. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I misread that as the new North East England release. Yeah, they'd use whatever version is in the Workshop.
     
  41. 749006

    749006 Well-Known Member

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    Does seem a bit pointless having Workshop Scenarios that you cannot drive from the menu because it shows the Metropolitan Route as a requirement even though the scenario uses NON of those assets.

    From this there are 758 Scenarios on the Workshop that require the Metropolitan Route - most of which don't
    Screenshot (27).png
    DTG needs to fix this rubbish
     
  42. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    At least one of those 758 scenarios will be mine. I've no idea the criteria it decides a scenario uses Met Line, especially given I don't own it. Is it perhaps the author's ownership of the Just Trains Common Library?
     
  43. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    When I did my remakes of two TobBirk scenarios (with his permission, and he's listed as a contributor, putting them on his scenario list too), I actually found that both the originals and mine were also tagged with Metropolitan Line. I do not have even the JT version of Metropolitan Line. This started, BTW, when the route was first coming to Steam.

    As another note, Edinburgh-Newcastle has been a rogue tagging requirement that seems to now be fixed. The York-Peterborough Scenario Pack is still sometimes tagging as needed, however, despite not using the stock included with that (one is some kind of 158).
     
  44. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    I think it is largely a situation with JT routes, I’ve seen the children mainline and London - Aylesbury pop up once or twice. I wouldn’t be surprised if all of these JT routes DTG are rereleasing now start to come up in the workshop. The Met Line is definitely one that needs to be fixed, when I uploaded my first scenario to workshop it came up straight away.
     
  45. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    Interestingly, the Newcastle to Edinburgh one dates back to 2014. I actually researched this and contacted Support about it (or someone, anyway) and was basically told the problem is on Steam's end. Which is complete and total rubbish, I will say immediately. The route wasn't on Steam back then, why would there even be a tag created for it and why was it being flagged for people who didn't even own it?
     
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  46. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    It seems this thread, in its role as a suggestions thread, has died a little. I thought I would keep it going with a few suggestions, having looked to see what’s new in the workshop this morning.
    Firstly, the “East Kent Coalfields and it’s railways reimagined” route has been finalised, with a few scenarios coming out, of varying lengths. It’s a very high quality route, including a section of the Faversham - Dover mainline and multiple colliery branches. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2243416265

    N
    ext, a new route, Western Branch Lines. This was originally released a few years ago with a four mile mainline and 3 mile branch line, and has now been updated in scenery and the mainline extended to nineteen miles. The mainline takes about a half an hour to do a fast nonstop run, plus about ten minutes for the branch line. The scenery looks very nice, it only requires one DLC for those who want to download it.
    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2555064100
     
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  47. trainbraint

    trainbraint Active Member

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    It seems that recently, when new TS content comes out, the Workshop Wednesday stream is just used to showcase it, with workshop routes and scenarios as an afterthought, and that full-fledged release streams are being reserved for DTG content, and special things like Smokebox’s Big Boy, instead of for most new content like it used to be. As much as I have been enjoying the streams, it sort of defeats the purpose showing official content rather than workshop content. In an ideal world, we’d have separate release streams and leave the workshop streams for workshop content only, but what with TSW and everything I doubt DTG would return to this.

    So, and I would say this counts as a suggestion, I would suggest that if DTG wait until workshop scenarios are released for any new products, and then use those to showcase the new products. In a lot of cases, good workshop scenarios can be more interesting and varied by utilising pre-existing stock that can run on the route. If DTG are unwilling to do this, I would suggest they at least do something to the default scenarios to shake things up a bit. For example, DTG have been rereleasing a lot of JT content on steam recently, and all of the scenarios use stock from the original European Loco and Asset Pack, so it might be a good idea to swap it out for something more suitable. To take the example of this week’s stream, the 165 on southwestern expressways could have been swapped out for an FGW 150/1 or 158, both of which have worked on that route at some point or other. If DTG were to release the rest of the JT MML, such as the Derwent Valley Line or Nottingham - Sheffield, the default stock could be swapped out for a Central Trains 156, 158, or 170, or a Northern 156 or 158.
     
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  48. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    I do agree with this aspect: if the title is “Workshop Wednesday”, keep it about the Workshop and schedule a separate stream to show off new content. Do not try to merge them. This will merely cause people to see TS as an afterthought to TSW.

    Personally I am always poking around the Workshop looking around. There is no shortage of stuff to play. Pick a different route every week and find two scenarios, or follow longtime and busy creators (hundreds of scenarios) and feature some of their content. Railfan, Not.Silent, RBJets (popular too!), and greendragon32 for instance are all people with hundreds of scenarios posted and I feel it appropriate to pay back such creators by showing people some of the stuff they produce as well. I mean, I could sit here and tout two entries for the Class 101 on TobBirk’s route on my own channel, and if you want to choose one, feel free (I list him as a contributor because his original scenarios used the old BR Green version, while I used Weardale’s, so this puts the scenarios on his channel as well), but those who have done a lot deserve attention.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2021
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  49. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    I agree the title is now unfortunately wrong, but it was refreshing to get back to seeing a workshop route last Wednesday.

    Just wish Jamie would update his past programme content thread which he hasn’t updated since June 17th.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2021
  50. Cyclone

    Cyclone Well-Known Member

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    It is habitually updated late, which I dislike.

    I have not yet looked into this week's, but it sounds like a Workshop scenario was featured alongside something else in TS. Again, if you want to feature specific TS content not in the Workshop, don't call it Workshop Wednesday. Run another stream for promotional stuff. It just makes TS appear to be more and more of an afterthought by this point, as there is way more focus on TSW2, but there is way more interest I feel in TS.
     

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