I'm interested to hear everyone's opinions on what German routes they think are best in terms of driving freight trains. I will admit that I'm making this poll with an agenda. If time (and opportunity) allows it, I would like to apply some of the timetable changes (with regard to freight services) I have made for the Kassel-Würzburg Gameplay pack on other Expert timetables in the future. This is a long term thing, so don't expect any changes soon, and as you can see in the poll I have included routes that don't (yet) have an Expert timetable. With all that said, I'm also just curious to hear what other people think! I have excluded routes that are primarily branch lines (like Niddertalbahn or Maintalbahn), routes that are "vintage" (like Mittenwaldbahn or Linke Rheinstrecke) and routes that do not have TOD4 or the physics changes that were implemented since Nahverkehr Dresden-Riesa. This is no judgement on the quality of these routes or their timetables I would also be interested in hearing why you made your choices in the poll (I made it so that two options can be chosen). For example is it mostly the route that you like and freight driving is just a side benefit or does the timetable have interesting operations (like shunting etc) or is the interaction with other traffic interesting (like adverse signals due to congestion)? Let me know!
Hi William, My first choice is Nahverkehr Dresden-Riesa: I chose this because of several factors, namely because this route has a lot of variety, from different types of traffic, service patterns, branches and so on, but also because I like the route itself too. But, if I'm honest, while I like freight in general, when I play this route freight always tends to be my last option because they tend to be pretty linear A-B Dresden to Riesa or vice versa (with exception of the 363 services which are cool) which get very repetitive - thus I prefer passengers services from this route. So, if there were any timetable improvements, freight for this route would be a priority! But, in general, the whole timetable for Dresden-Riesa needs a major upgrade now anyway, from inclusion of FlixTrain services, CD services from Prague to Berlin and Hamburg (which in TSW could be represented by the Railpool 193 or MRCE 182 with the DB Bpmmz and Avmmz coaches), DMUs etc, plus more AI traffic at Dresden Hbf and Riesa Hbf etc. My second choice is Bahnstrecke Salzburg-Rosenheim: So, unlike Dresen, this route is one of my favourites for freight services. Firstly, I love this route in general because it's scenic, long, twisty, cross-border and finally because it always feels rather busy. I also love the variety and type of freight services too. Plus, again, this route also has a lot of variety overall, from S-Bahn to IC and EC services etc. Again, one of my suggestions for timetable improvement (well it doesn't relate to freight) but Salzburg Hbf needs to be more busy with AI traffic - it's emptiness is the only downside to an otherwise brilliant route. One final thought regarding the other routes mentioned but for those of us on console, there's no freight at all for Frankfurt S-Bahn.
For first one i chose Salzburg to Rosenheim. Thats because i do like the variety of freightwagons being used and i enjoy the shunting services taking short paths of the mainline. For second i chose Bremen to Oldenburg. A big change of pace compared to Rosenheim, as it doesnt have many changes in the gradient and is the better option for some chill driving. The amount of statick stock and shunters at Oldenburg makes the entire route feel a bit more alive. To navigate a cargo train out of/into Bremen Hbf is also quite fun. Im also a fan of Kinzigtalbahn, because the mainline running with rather long trains is quite challening. Most of them only run between Fulda and Flieden which is the reason its not in the first 2nd for me. Of course thats due to the route and not the timetable.
None of the above. That or Niddertalbahn (not on the list) or Linke Rheinstrecke(not on the list) It's like you picked all the routes that DON'T have good freight potential. It's weird because the headline says "TSW 3" but your choices aren't all TSW 3. If you said of all time (not just TSW 3, I'd say Ruhr Sieg Nord or Mittenwald.
I chose Nahverkehr Dresden and Bremen - Oldenburg. For DRA, it’s because it was the first route with the newer physics, so it’s just naturally become a mainstay for me. For BRO, it’s because of the busy timetable and interesting freight services that are not just green runs end-to-end.
This is a tough choice to make. I believe that every single one of the routes above have their own opportunities and would deserve its own game play pack with special emphasis on fright But as I had to make a choice I have opted for Dresden Riesa and Frankfurt Fulda. Dresden-Riesa I am not surprised this route has 70+% of the picks. After all, I think for most of us this route was the route that has put fright more in the focus for the first time. However, I feel the available TT still lacks in terms of variety. I think more of the available parts of the route could be used. Dresden Neustadt Gbf has not been used at all. Also Coswig could use some more action, for my liking. Maybe even with enough time to do a full "Bremsprobe" (one can still dream). When it comes to fright, I would really like to see more not just A to B services. Driving a light loco to Coswig, for example, to pick something up and drive it somewhere. There was a community project once, with some good ideas, some may be able to be taken oven for a new game play pack as well?! https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/new-timetable-for-dresden-riesa.74867/page-6#post-822439 I brought in the idea of a working site late at night, seeing the assembly of a working site train in a siding along the route throughout the day, which would then start working later at night, requiring track closure and wrong side ops. But also the diverging line (Berliner Bahn) has already brought variety to the route. An aspect that can surely be kept for a new TT as well. Frankfurt-Fulda Simply because it is a new route with unparalleled atmosphere when it comes to trackside and station modeling, which I would like to be put to more use. This route also has potential which is hardly used in the current TT, when it comes to fright. Frankfurt Ost is missing, unfortunately, however, Offenbach holds potential which is not used yet. Naturally, this route will see more A to B traffic but there can be action in between, like in Neuhof or Hanau. Maybe it could also be used to actually put the two idling 218s in Frankfurt Hbf to some use. Also a broken down IC, which could be placed at a siding could be brought into a new TT All in all, lots of potential. And no matter what route will be chosen in the end, I am sure it will be great
Well, if you would have bothered to actually read the original post you would have understood his reasoning And another hint, you have ignored the “+” behind the “TSW3”. Otherwise you would have understood that he was talking about routes from TSW3 onwards…
Not sure if i'm voting correctly lol. I picked Frankfurt-Fulda because it's already so busy, but i think the freight operations are kinda boring on it. I echo some of the sentiments above about making freight-runs operationally interesting. A-B gets old fast, even if they're prototypical. Whatever route is chosen, I suggest: Use any and all accessible industry/sidings. So many cool little areas that are never touched in timetable mode. Relatedly, even if they're fictional, some local freights add so much life to a route. Ballast/MOW trains can serve this role if it truly has no local industries to serve. Shunting within industries. Again it might be a bit fictional but give us chances to run the little guys out there. Anyway, OP, i appreciate all the work you've done on the freight side of the game- it's made it much better! Any chance you could clone yourself to revamp US freight gameplay? Lol
I stand with the Man, the Myth, the class 20 with bugs bunny teeth..... Holiday express for life, the most immersive Freight experience you can get....... For a Borrower......... If you know, and get it (and you Fred, you know all) you are proper legends.......
Rambling incoherently isn't really a substitute for clear communication. Neither is arbitrarily throwing out the best freight routes for no apparent reason. Which is why I clearly said his list was incomplete and the opposite of good freight routes. Now I won't accuse you of not reading my response in bad faith like you seem to have done. We'll just leave it at that.
My choices - 1. Nahverkehr Dresden-Riesa - No brainer. It's my go-to German route ( as a non-German ). Gives you something of almost everything. Run an ICE, a regional express, heavy / light freight, shunt around Nunchritz, multiple mainline/branchline action, a handful of yards and sidings that give you some opportunities for free roam gameplay, a wide variety of rolling stock and so on. So I'm all in if there's room to make this perfect route even better ! 2. Schnellfahrstrecke Kassel-Würzburg - This route has a special place in my heart for multiple reasons. Firstly, it's a very unique route in the TSW universe. The scenery with tunnels and bridges and the elevated view of the valleys below makes it really memorable. The gameplay is very unique as well. You take a train to speed and hold it there for a while. You can meditate at 300 km/h; works better than any therapy ( atleast for me ). It's a mostly a straight track with occasional speed changes; that motivated me to learn it properly to drive HUDless. Thanks to that now I've mostly ditched the HUD everywhere across TSW. Later I learnt somewhere that it was Germany's 1st purpose built high speed line. I personally support the routes with historical importance to the railway industry be made in TSW. The ICE 1 that came with this route was iconic so it left me with a great first impression. The service pattern with ICEs in the daylight and heavy freight during the nighttime is an interesting dynamic. Also, the preview stream for this was on a night when I really needed something to keep my mind elsewhere. So thank you SKW for being there. So I'll be advocating for this if some potential improvements can take place here. Thank you !
That’s the inherent problem with freight in TSW, 99% of it is just a variation on an A to B passenger run from one end to the other. The potential is pretty much untapped and while TSW probably can’t be adapted to the Run 8 style of industry sideplay something like that is really what’s needed. Also modern routes are pretty much about block trains and bulk movement, very little in the way of local or pick up freight. So my answer is a bit cryptic I’m afraid - basically pick the route which has the most freight movements IRL factoring in any potential for side traffic and that’s the one to go for.
I'm scratching my head at your reaction to this poll. The poll is about Expert timetables, which so far means timetables that are duplicated (or made from scratch) to utilize the BR 101 Expert over the original BR 101 DLC. How many BR 101's do you see running on Niddertalbahn or on Mittenwaldbahn in 1989? If we make a vintage locomotive in the future that necessitates an Expert timetable for some reason, then I would take into consideration back dated routes. But for now they obviously make no sense, thus the poll options. I agree with you that RSN is a really good freight route, but the same logic applies here: there is no need to make an Expert timetable for that route since the BR 101 doesn't run on it (at least not as a playable locomotive). I didn't choose the options willy-nilly.
I think the question is bit misleading. Where I go to play freights and where I think is the biggest opportunity for a new good freight timetable are directly contradicting questions. Alas, my two choices: Dresden - Riesa as obvious choice, everybody has this route, and it has massive sidings and industries that are more or less completely unused. It is a no-brainer that there is so much to improve in terms of variety here. In fact, enough that I started collecting some freeroaming ideas into a random generator that people could use to insert ad-hoc trains into the otherwise pretty good through trains timetable. (If you have ideas for such freeroam services, I will welcome them on discord and add them to the generator.) Second choice is perhaps unexpectedly Mannheim - Kaiserslautern, again for its unused sidings and original timetable being more straightforward than it could be. There is a one of biggest industries in Germany located here, this should be a freight paradise, but it isn't. Make it a busy day when all the factories run at full speed, add a pack of tanker wagons and reskins and you'll make this route a pleasure. As always, obligatory request for RSN remaster. Scenery-wise the route is on-par or even better than many current routes, only needs the TOD remake. A mod can do that simply so it's not a difficult job, just needs altering light sources on stations and there is just a handful of them. Then it becomes one of ultimate freight routes again with many and many industries along the route which can be given an amazing timetable with all the stock we have nowadays.
I don't want to speak for anyone else but i didn't realize "expert timetable" in your question specifically related to the expert BR101. I thought you meant more like "advanced freight gameplay" in general. I don't believe you mention the BR101 in the original post at all, so that could be the cause of some confusion.
Fair enough! I could have been more clear. Sometimes I feel like I would need to clone myself to be able to realize all my plans Maybe some day I'll make an Expert US locomotive (like an SD40-2 Expert or something like a GP40 that would have realistic gameplay in the shorter routes of TSW) but currently my "backlog" of Expert locomotives I want to do is quite long.
Haha i won't hold you to any promises but i would be seriously interested in an expert-level EMD loco, understanding the premium pricetag it would command. It would instantly add life back into all the old US routes. In some ways it would be even better than the expert BR101 (which is amazing btw) because US freight is more conducive to Free Roam, which would give a hypothetical SD40-2/GP40 life right out of the box even before any expert timetables are developed. I know PTC is never happening but maybe some form of fictionalized cab signalling would at least make it driveable on NEC, etc? Really though my suggestion for an expert version would be a major emphasis on maintaining the air line throughout the train. It's so simplified in the current implementation that it might as well not even be there, and it's a huge part of determining if your train makes it safely down the inevitable mountain that every US route must feature lol. If i'm getting fanciful i'd love to see some sort of axle defect simulation take place. The BR101 has shown random failures can be workable, but not sure how feasible it is to implement on a per-wagon basis. Anyway looking forward to whatever projects you end up working on.
As Dresden-Riesa is the most picked route in the poll, I would give a little suggestion for an possible timetable. The S1 services to Meißen have regularly 4 wagons (also in TSW). For a few days, those trains drive with 5 wagons instead, which is too long for the most platforms (the train is 154 meters long while the stations have often only 140 m). In this case, you have to stop with the loco behind the platform so all doors fit in. If you create a new DRA timetable, could you implement those 5 wagon formations? It would be very fun imo (and there are for example in Mecklenburg-Vorpommern and Brandenburg a lot stations with the same situation).
Mine were Dresden and Frankfurt S Bahn. Dresden was an obvious pick. Timeless TSW. I picked Frankfurt S Bahn because it has shorter freight runs. I think expert level movements and gameplay would do a lot for the freight operations on this route.
