Crossing Borders: Osnabrück - Hengelo

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by jolojonasgames, Mar 10, 2021.

?
  1. Yes

    43 vote(s)
    89.6%
  2. Maybe, if it's on sale

    3 vote(s)
    6.3%
  3. no

    2 vote(s)
    4.2%
  1. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    Hi all, for today I decided to make a suggestion for a route that crosses borders. that could provide a link between the Rollbahn coming from Hamburg and the Ruhr and the Netherlands. I came to this Idea after they mentioned that once they did one route for a country, they intend to do more for the same country, because otherwise research and developement of systems for these countries would be wasted. It's therefore intended to come after my other Dutch suggestion.

    IMPORTANT NOTE:
    This route is somewhat reliant on a different suggestion of mine, and should only come after that one and its NS Serie 1700 DLC is added to the game. They can then be joined up using my proposal for doing so. This makes this entire suggestion a bit 'far-in-the-future-material', but it still offers some nice perspectives on how cross border routes work, which Dutch routes can be added after the first one, and some interesting rolling stock, which could also come with different routes.


    [​IMG]
    Contents:
    • The Route
      • General description
      • Cab views
    • Services
    • Rolling Stock
      • What comes with the route?
        • Eurobahn FLIRT 3
        • DB BR 189
      • DLC
        • DB BR 193
        • Westfalenbahn KISS
        • Alpha Trains E186 (TRAXX F140 MS2e)
      • Layers
    • Conclusion
    • Pictures
    • Edits

    The route
    [​IMG]

    General description
    The route is a major artery for Dutch-German traffic. It crosses the border between the Netherlands and Germany. The stationary power and systems changeover at Bad Bentheim wouldn't be a first for TSW, as it is already implemented on SEH. The changeover would of course still offer some interesting gameplay to the route, as some trains switch locomotives. The route sees a lot of passenger and freight traffic, making it interesting to play. Just beyond Osnabrück Hbf there is a large freight yard, and Hengelo has some freight sidings where the services can end. (most freight services run on to Almelo or beyond in real life, this is on a different suggestion of mine and can be 'joined' like I suggested, allowing for a continuatrion of the service). At 95 km the route is a bit lengthy for TSW, but looking at LGV, I think it is within reason.

    As mentioned at the start of this suggestion, my Enschede - Amersfoort suggestion is quite important for this route. This is because of the loco change for the IC Amsterdam - Berlin at Bad Bentheim. The Enschede - Amersfoort suggestion contains the NS Serie 1600 and 1700, with the latter hauling the IC service, and the 1600 running freight to and from Bad Bentheim. I'll go a bit more into depth on this in the layers section of my suggestion. Because IC trains switch locos at the border, I chose to suggest two multisystem locos/units to come with the route, the BR 189 and Eurobahn FLIRT 3.

    Cab views
    A view from the rear of the train - WorldOfTransit
    Osnabrück-Bad Bentheim (including footage of the loco change at Bad Bentheim) - Dieseltriebzug (very low res)


    Services
    Below I've listed nearly all passenger services on this route. The stops that are on this route proposal are bold. In italic I've listed the last and first stops not on the route, so you know where the line diverges. Note that I've not yet added all possible services. Freight services are not listed, because they don't have a timetable.

    RB 61: Wiehengebirgsbahn
    (From Wissingen) - Osnabrück Hbf - Osnabrück-Altstadt - Ibbenbüren-Laggenbeck - Ibbenbüren - Ibbenbüren-Esch - Hörstel - Rheine - Salzbergen - Schüttorf - Bad Bentheim - Oldenzaal - Hengelo
    Every hour
    Rolling Stock: Eurobahn FLIRT 3

    IC 77
    (from Almelo) - Hengelo - Bad Bentheim - Rheine - Osnabrück - (onwards to Bünde/Bad Oeynhausen)
    Every 2 hours
    Rolling stock: BR 101 (Bad Bentheim-Osnabrück)/NS Serie 1700 (Bad Bentheim-Hengelo) + DB IC coaches

    RE 60: Ems-Leine-Express
    Rheine - Hörstel – Ibbenbüren-Esch – Ibbenbüren – Ibbenbüren-Laggenbeck – Osnabrück Altstadt – Osnabrück Hbf (onwards to Melle)
    Every 2 hours
    Rolling stock: Westfalenbahn Stadler KISS


    Rolling Stock
    What comes with the route?

    Eurobahn FLIRT 3
    [​IMG]
    On its cross-border services from Hengelo to Bielefeld, Eurobahn operates FLIRT 3 EMUs, numbered ET 4.01 to ET 4.08, capable of operating under Dutch 1.5 kV DC and German 15 kV AC overhead systems. The FLIRT 3 is part of the Stadler FLIRT family, it has a max speed of 160 km/h. Parts of this trains model can be used for different FLIRTs in the future. More info on Wikipedia

    DB BR 189
    [​IMG]

    The BR 189 is a German freight locomotive. On this route there is a lot of freight coming from Germany towards the port of Rotterdam in the west and other locations in the Netherlands. These trains are often pulled by the DB BR 189 because it can operate under multiple overhead systems. It was built by Siemens as a further developement of the EuroSprinter platform, with the first loco's being deliverd in 2003. When operating in the Netherlands they are usually painted white at the front. This is to increase visibility, and was done on suggestion of ProRail, the Dutch company that manages the rail infrastructure. The 189 often hauls container, tank wagon or car transports. In game it can also layer onto many other German routes, as it can be seen all throughout Germany. Alternatively, this loco can come in MRCE livery (which I think looks better), as shown below, for more variety. More info on wikipedia (German)
    [​IMG]
    Two MRCE BR 189s

    DLC
    DB BR 193
    [​IMG]

    The BR 193, like the BR 189, is a multisystem locomotive developed by Siemens. It can be seen increasingly often on cross-border freight services to the Netherlands. It's services are basically the same as the BR 189, and it can be seen throughout Germany, so could layer onto any other existing German route. The Vectron is also owned by many private operators, and could come in one of their liveries to add some variety. More info on wikipedia

    Westfalenbahn Stadler KISS
    [​IMG]
    Adding the Westfalenbahn's Stadler KISS sets would be an option, as they operate on this line from Rheine to Osnabrück. The KISS sets are double deck EMUs that are a further developement from the Stadler FLIRT sets. The advantage of adding this unit as a DLC is that the Westfalenbahn operates it on more potential future routes. More info on wikipedia

    Alpha Trains E186 (TRAXX F140 MS2e)
    [​IMG]

    Leasing company Alpha Trains owns some multisystem TRAXX locomotives operating in the Netherlands, Germany and more European countries. It shares many similarities to the TRAXX loco's already in game. It can haul cross-border trains, like the DB BR 189 and 193. It would add some variety in paint schemes to this route, and all other Dutch and German routes, as it can run on all of these. It might even be seen in other future countries, due to its multisystem nature. More info on wikipedia.

    Layers
    Normally, when talking about layers, I only talk about locos and units already in game or confirmed as coming to the game, this time I'll add a few from my Enschede - Amersfoort suggestion however, as they would add a lot to this route. These locos will be in Italic

    Passenger
    • DB BR 101: On IC77 until the border at Bad Bentheim. Here it decouples from the passenger coaches.
    • NS Serie 1700: On IC77 from the border at Bad Bentheim to Hengelo (and beyond). It couples to the passenger coaches at Bad Bentheim. Of course the loco changeover happens the other way around when the train is headed into Germany.
    Freight
    • BR 143/155/182 (DB and MRCE)/185 (DB and MRCE)/187/(maybe 232): all the German freight locomotives can run freight services along the route until Bad Bentheim, from where a Dutch loco would have to haul the freight (on this line until Hengelo). There is a freight yard just beyond Osnabrück Hbf for this.
    • NS Serie 1600: This loco (mostly under private operators) hauls the freight from Bad Bentheim into the Netherlands.
    • NS Serie 6400: This loco can also haul freight services across the border.
    • BR 363/(maybe 204)/(maybe Vossloh G6): These shunters could do some light shunting work at the freight yard near Osnabrück Hbf and at Bad Bentheim.

    Conclusion
    This route has a lot of interesting cross-border services to offer. It is reliant on Enschede - Amersfoort to unlock its full potential, so it might not make a lot of sense for now, but at the very least I had fun writing this suggestion. If you have any questions about Dutch signalling, I suggest you'd look at Enschede - Amersfoort first, as it contains this information.

    Pictures:
    [​IMG]
    Osnabrück Hbf, a truly magnificent building.
    [​IMG]
    another shot of Osnabrück Hbf, from the sky this time
    [​IMG]
    An NS 1700 hauling the Intercity from Amsterdam to Berlin through a cutting.

    [​IMG]
    The platform roof at Hengelo
    [​IMG]
    Rheine Bahnhof
    [​IMG]
    A westbahn FLIRT 1 and NS 1700 with the IC to Berlin at Bad Bentheim. Note that neither of these loco's is part of this suggestion, the NS 1700 is part of my Dutch suggestion, which should come before this route. The Westfalenbahn FLIRT doesn't operate here at all anymore.


    Edits
    11-3-2021: Added the Alpha Trains E186 to the suggestions, and added the option of the BR 189 coming in MRCE livery. Also added a note at the beginning, detailing the the fact that this route is only feasible when another one is added first.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2021
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  2. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Excellent idea and for the DB BR189 you're going to need a tutorial on how to switch between ATB EG/NG to PZB LZB Sifa at Bad Bentheim. Regarding NS6400S there must be a scenario for them that requires three of them to pull heavy goods trains. One benefit of the BR 189 if you own this one then you can substitute them on Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden RSO RRN & HRR freight services. Furthermore they might appear in double formation when playing this route if there's a Timetable mode that has one of the services being a heavy goods train. The example of this is in MSB the 09:49 Aschaffenburg-Gemünden Freight train having two DB BR185s DB 86108.
     
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  3. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

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    Hmm... although I'd love a Dutch route, even cross border, having no Dutch train to go with it would be a huge letdown.
     
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  4. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, it would be better after a Dutch route is already in game :)
     
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  5. diamondderp

    diamondderp Guest

    I love to see this! I have also noted some other things that could also be in the suggestion.
    • The power changeover at Bad Bentheim is a bit different than what we have in the game. If you need to switch from voltage, you contact the "dispatcher" to change the voltage to the right one. So maybe they could use the "Contact signaller" button as to contact the "dispatcher" to change voltage. And maybe they could also make a scenario that you need to switch the DB BR 101 to a NS 1700, but the voltage don't switch from 15Kv to 1,5Kv and the NS 1700 has broken down. You still need to do the IC Berlin service but with two locos (the broken down one with a other NS 1700 in front of it).
    • At Bad Bentheim, the IC Berlin (IC 14X) switches from a NS 1700 loco to a DB BR 101 or the opposite (depends at which direction the IC 14X is going).
    • NS are lately experimenting with BR 193 leased from ELL to replace the NS 1700 due to how old they are being. There is even now a BR193 766 with the new NS livery :D
    • Keolis LINT41 between Zutphen <> Oldenzaal.
    • Bentheimer Eisenbahn (newer than the Keolis) LINT41 as RB56 Neuenhaus <> Bad Bentheim. Maybe this could be included as an extra branch line.
    • DBC 6400 does drive every Wednesday with a short boiler train from Delden (I think) to Bad Bentheim.
    • Every Tuesday, the DB BR 193 with a alumina train drives from Rotterdam to Bad Bentheim and further.
    • Most NS 1600 locos that are now from other private companies that are driving via Hengelo <> Bad Bentheim are from Rail Force One, but first they were from Locon. There are also some locos from Rotterdam Rail Feeding that also drive here as far as I ever as seen.
    • At Bad Bentheim, there is a 6400 loco from Bentheimer Eisenbahn shunting around the yard and shunting recently delivered wagons.
    • Every Tuesday, a DB BR 189 with mixed goods (called Nosta Shuttle) drives also via this route.
    • The BR186 from different companies drive also here frequently.
    I know this is a lot but I like to have everything on the route :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 10, 2021
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  6. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    All very good points. I think thqt atsome point we have to settle for having the 1600 and 6400 in NS livery only, due to licensing. I'd like to see as much variety as possible though. The power changeover is indeed somewhat different, but DTG doesn't have to start from scratch because they already have some experience with SEH and LGV.
     
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  7. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    This shows some of the shunting at Bad Bentheim, as you can see, there is a lot of activity on this route.

    I also added an Alpha Trains E186 (TRAXX F140 MS2e) to the DLC suggestions. It could add some new colours to German and Dutch routes.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2021
  8. diamondderp

    diamondderp Guest

    The Westfalenbahn trains doesn't drive here anymore, its now the Keolis/Eurobahn. Shunting has also been changed in this period, shunting is now mostly done by Betheimer Eisenbahn 6400 diesel loco. It also depends on day how many shunting is doing, last time I was at Wednesday at Bad Bentheim, it was pretty dead xD
     
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  9. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    You're absolutely right. There is a reason I didn't include the Westfalebahn FLIRTs in the suggestion. It's really hard to find recent images and videos of the area, probably due to Covid. I was there myself last summer (probably should have taken some videos, but I was just passing through), and it was pretty busy, but I think Covid did have an impact on the frequency of freight services. DTG would probably be best of adding as much as they can :)
     
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  10. Rail Runner

    Rail Runner Well-Known Member

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    Brilliant idea! I’ve always thought a Class 189 should be added, and what a brilliant idea to have both a Dutch and German route! A very pretty route aswell :)
     
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  11. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    Great to hear, It's of course only meant to come after other Dutch routes are already in game, I wouldn't like to see this as the first Dutch route to come to the game :)
     
  12. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree and for the DB BR101 it's going to be from HRR with the IC Coaches. Your suggestion will end up being the cross-border equivalent of HMA with layers from SKA RRO RSN HRR Rapid Transit & the king of layers Main Spessart Bahn Aschaffenburg-Gemünden. Reason for this is that Dovetail Games permits the use of dlc locomotives train wagons on another downloadable content route. Own HL then a BR 182 MRCE will appear at Bad Bentheim yard ready to take over the NS6400 & NS1600 freight from Bad Bentheim all the way to Lubeck provided once you reach Osnabrück Yard Edge at the direction of Hamburg. The game should load Hamburg-Lübeck for you then operate the Bad Bentheim Lübeck freight train
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2021
  13. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    If we can have a heritage pack for the 1980’s D trains, I’m in. Would love to relive sitting on those hard plastic seats in the DB UIC stock (BM232 etc) as used on the Holland - Scandinavia or Nord West Express services!
     
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  14. CowBoyWolf

    CowBoyWolf Well-Known Member

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    if the BR 189 comes to TSW i would like to have it in this livery [​IMG]
     
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  15. CowBoyWolf

    CowBoyWolf Well-Known Member

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    or this [​IMG]
     
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  16. Task

    Task Well-Known Member

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    I would really love a cross border route with a power changeover between Germany and the Netherlands. Although I'm not so sure a good variety of rolling stock could be provided, especially as this route requires a little more than usual because of the two systems.
     
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  17. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree and there's one that links the Netherlands with Haputstrecke Rhein-Ruhr Duisburg Bochum the Duisburg Oberhausen-Arnhem Railway. Check my signature for that route suggestion
     
  18. cyrill.kroonstuiver

    cyrill.kroonstuiver Well-Known Member

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    I must say, although I like this route, and I'd definitely go get it (especially with series 1700, my favorite locomotive), and I really like driverwoods#1787 's Oberhausen - Arnhem route as well if not more for the same reason, I can't help but feel like this should wait till there's actual dedicated Dutch routes first.
    Honestly, the idea that the first Dutch route in-game is only for about 1/5 part in the Netherlands and likely without any iconic NS rolling stock like ICM and VIRM would feel very wrong in my opinion.

    They're both great suggestions, and it would be super cool and unique to have the first cross-border train in-game which is definitely a great aspect, but as I said, I think it would be wrong to do this before dedicated Dutch content :)
    After that, 100% for this.
    If I could choose 3 Dutch route suggestions so far I'd wish they'd make most, at least one of them would be cross-border like this :)
     
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  19. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    I envisioned this route as a 'Well, what after the first 1/2 Dutch routes are in game?' from the start, so I completely agree with you.

    Cross border routes are an interesting thing for which I've been trying to come up with a good solution since LGV with it's voltage changeovers came into game, hence I made three different route suggestions for those kind of routes. The voltage and systems changeovers make for very dynamic gameplay that challenges the player somewhat on his knowledge of different systems and his ability to switch between them. And after all, what would be more Train Sim World than a route across two or more countries?

    Edit:
    I thought I'd add the order in which I'd like to see certain Dutch route suggestions:


    • My Enschede - Amersfoort suggestion,
      • with the ICMm and SGMm as standard
      • the NS 1700+1600 and 6400 being DLC
      • (VIRM and SNG substitution (and the DDZ, BR 189, E186 and BR 193 once those get added))

    • My Den Haag - Breda suggestion,
      • with the NS E186 (and maybe a privately owned one for freight) and SLT being standard
      • the NS FLIRT being DLC
      • (VIRM, ICMm, SGMm, 1600 and 6400 layers)

    • My Hengelo - Osnabrück suggestion,
      • with the Eurobahn FLIRT 3 and DB BR 189 being standard,
      • the BR 193 and AlphaTrains E 186 (if not included with Den Haag - Breda) being DLC
      • (1700/BR 101 + IC layers and 1600 + German freight loco layers for freight and IC exchanges at the border)

    • Cyrill.kroonstuiver's Utrecht - Gouda - Rotterdam/Den Haag suggestion, with
      • the DDZ and reused (different length perhaps) SLT being standard
      • a possible Class 66 DLC
      • (VIRM, ICMm, SGMm, 1600, 6400, E186, BR 189 and BR 193 layers)

    • driverwoods' Oberhausen - Arnhem suggestion,
      • with the Abellio FLIRT and BR 189 (and possibily 146.0) coming as standard.
      • (6400, ICE 3M and German freight layers)

    But of course, that's personal preference. Just look at how many interesting layers, and even mergers to create long and interesting networks are possible with these routes! 6 routes is of course way more than we'll see in the forseeable future, but there are so many fun possibilities :).
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2021
  20. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    What you're thinking of Domestic Dutch portion being Amserfoot CS Enschede and for Duisburg Oberhausen-Arnhem Railway it's Amsterdam-Arnhem Railway for these cross-border Netherlands to Germany routes.
     
  21. cyrill.kroonstuiver

    cyrill.kroonstuiver Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I agree, it is a good suggestion, and a line crossing borders is a really interesting concept that'd be hard to do right for DTG but super interesting nontheless.
    I guess it would feel slightly like switching modes in SEHS, but different of course.
    Also, they should indeed have a proper prior grasp of Dutch signaling in the first place before even attempting to make something like this feel authentic.

    That is a really nice list :)
    Glad to see my recent suggestion makes it into your top 5
    Let's see about my own.
    1. My own Utrecht - Gouda - Rotterdam/Den Haag.
      I mean, if I didn't want this one most, I wouldn't have suggested it first :)

    2. At the time of this post not yet suggested, Oude Lijn (Rotterdam - Den Haag - Leiden - Amsterdam)
      Funny how that'd make 3 relatively popular Dutch suggestions all containing the Rotterdam - Den Haag part, though I'd hope it's included in every route if they made them.
      This one hasn't been suggested yet, but it's definitely one I'm considering suggesting soon.
      Also, the route goes through Haarlem, but DTG could consider also adding the branch through Schiphol in a similar but longer way like they did in RRO.

    3. Shared 3rd place (if the above 2 have been done first) for your post in this thread, as well as Driverwood's Oberhausen - Arnhem.

    4. Purno's Amsterdam/Schiphol - Lelystad/Almere, because that one also includes Amsterdam station and has a minor networking aspect to it as well.

    5. Completely unrealistic, but basically a remake of TS20xx's fan-made 't Hart van Nederland route.
      This one is completely unrealistic though as it's just so incredibly long in total that DTG in their current capabilities would never touch such a project as a whole. But especially the Utrecht - Amersfoort - Zwolle part would be interesting, especially if they also included the Maliebaan.
      If this wasn't so unrealistic it'd definitely be my number 2 though :)
     
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  22. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    Also a good list! I do have to add that Enschede - Amersfoort is my favourite suggestion, although I placed purno's firts on my whishlist (mostly because it would create a few nice layers for Ensched - Amersfoort and attract more attention as it includes Amsterdam).
     
  23. cyrill.kroonstuiver

    cyrill.kroonstuiver Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, the first focus should be on routes with the most iconic Dutch rolling stock definitely.
    I mean, I'd love Zwolle - Emmen too, but that one only has Arriva Stadler GTW's (not a fan of Arriva), and before the route was taken over, NS only used Mat 64' on it.
    Same for Gouda - Alphen aan den Rijn which is operated by R-net.

    In the same way, going for any routes that operate too new or fast rolling stock would exclude any possibility of adding NS SGM, NS Mat 64 and NS DDAR + 1700 as DLC.
    I mean, I know Mat 64 has already retired, but as DLC some creative liberties could be overlooked :)
    Same as how NS ICM is going to retire pretty soon from what I've heard, but even if it is by the time DTG makes a Dutch route, I don't think DTG would be forgiven if they don't pay tribute to NS ICM either at launch or as a DLC almost immediately after :)
     
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  24. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you and for this route, the only DLC locomotive is the DB BR232 from Ruhr Sieg Nord can operate here if DTG retrofits the DB BR 232 with ATB which is needed for the Bad Benthem-Henglo segment. In my crossborder suggestion, the Duisburg-Oberhausen-Arnhem Railway special pre-2016 timetable is required to operate DB BR232 for Emmerich-Arnhem with ATB EG while the 1.5kv DC wires are usable by DB BR189 since it has ATB ETCS PZB Sifa installed.
     

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