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Glasgow Cathcart Circle Preview Stream #2 - Your Questions And Suggestions!

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by DTG JD, May 28, 2021.

  1. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I do think that steam (which is noticeable when these re-used locos really got ramped up) may be affecting this, as I would imagine that would be depleting recourses, as they are probably (this is just a guess) that they are beginning to look at what trains & locos to add for steam.
     
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  2. jolojonasgames

    jolojonasgames Well-Known Member

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    In one of the articles I believe they mentioned that currently they were already using a modified Diesel loco as a kind of 'testbed' for steam's functionality in SimuGraph, so maybe developement work on steam engine models has already started so that testing can soon be done on an actual steam engine model.

    Steam engines have nany moving parts and controls in the cab and many places where steam or smoke comes out, which I imagine would result in quite high developement costs compared to other locos. Certainly if 'spirit of steam' is going to be a route bundle like Rush Hour is, with three routes (one for each 'major country') that all need one, two or maybe even three (I doubt the latter) newly developed steam locomotives made I can imagine the work for it needs to start months and months in advance.

    However, I believe I'm straying off topic a little :).
     
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  3. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    I think that a great way to showcase the Cathcart DLC would be for DTG Natster to go through the Introduction/Training modules (so we all get a walk-through), and then for someone in chat to suggest a Timetable Mode service, which can then be done at night, in the rain (so that we can see the lights, and hear whether the windscreen wiper has a sensible and non-destructive audio level (unlike the 72 Stock on BKL....).

    And for all of that to be demonstrated on Playstation, within normal game memory settings. On the shipping build. (Or you could postpone the release date, if such a demonstration isn't yet possible).
     
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  4. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    I doubt they would postpone a release over a stream. And if the things like lights at night etc. Aren't able to be demonstrated then it shouldn't be near released.
     
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  5. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, I agree with you on this. It shouldn't be near release - they should complete the DLC before they publish it.
     
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  6. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    No, it will be the ECW class 66 (same as it is used in SEHS freight services).
     
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  7. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    My question is regarding the tail lights on the class 314.
    Do we always have to go to the rear cab to turn on the tail lights or are they automatic like on some other units?
     
  8. lux#4689

    lux#4689 Member

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    I really liked the stream, and I just pre-ordered the DLC.
    But I have 2 questions:
    1) As Matt said, there were only 3-car services, what is the livery-option?
    2) Why did you not include the carmine and cream livery? Was it not possible for legal reasons or did you just not want to include it? I remember it being requested a lot here on the forums before. (This question also in mind for the fututre BR 313-DLC, where lots of people want the 313 201 in BR Blue-livery, to work similarly to the Trainbow 395 012). What I read from Wikipedia, only 5 BR 314 had the Saltire livery. The mix of Saltire-livery and carmine and cream-livery would have been a nice mix.
     
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  9. Scotrail156467

    Scotrail156467 Well-Known Member

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    Every half hour in each direction
     
  10. Scotrail156467

    Scotrail156467 Well-Known Member

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    Do you get a free can of Irn bru with this purchase
     
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  11. Yoinkermcskoinker

    Yoinkermcskoinker Well-Known Member

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    Do you work for DTG?
     
  12. Wolfovizer

    Wolfovizer Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: May 29, 2021
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  13. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    That isn't what I was saying. I'm saying they wouldn't be near release if it wasn't demonstrable. The DLC is complete minus "things that will be finalised prior to release" PIS, for example, so I was saying there was no need to postpone the release, as you suggested: just because they wouldn't demonstrate something.
     
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  14. isaac47593

    isaac47593 Well-Known Member

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    There is no freight on this route. The 1 service with the 66 is an engineering/maintenance train
     
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  15. isaac47593

    isaac47593 Well-Known Member

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    1. Can we see the depot
    2. Can we see Neilston turnback siding being used
    3. Can you make it so all the platforms in Glasgow Central can be used in scenario designer
     
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  16. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Oh, okay. Then I disagree with you, and I find it astonishing that you actually say what you have just said, because I believe that DTG have a very long track record taking TSW DLCs to actual release (not just "near release", but actually releasing), without key expected features in place that should have been demonstrable in a preview, including:

    HLL - PZB was not demonstrable
    RT update - S6 services were not demonstrable
    OSD - half of the DLC was missing, and a year later the other half is still broken and poorly featured
    LIRR - scenarios were not demonstrable
    .
    .
    NTP - no working lights (light sources) on the front of any locos (to be specific about lights - this is the thing that I would like to see demonstrated in GCC, because I suspect the build is a bit shaky on performance, and might not be set up with light sources as a result - I hope that I am wrong)
    .
    .
    NEC - vast numbers of timetable services that broke within 5 seconds of starting the modules
    .
    etc.
     
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  17. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Yes well you were suggesting they "Postpone the release date, if such a demonstration isn't possible". Even though there is no way on earth they would postpone a DLC over a Stream Demonstration
     
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  18. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Well I have faith in them.
    Everything I have seen so far is positive.
    The feedback I have seen on things like the YouTube replies to the trailers, Talking to people I know, these very forums, has all been positive.
    As a Scot, the route looks fantastic and they have nailed it, minus a couple of small things. (To name: The SPT Livery missing, Cab Weathering & Catenary Weathering) So I have faith in them.
    Yeah they've screwed up in the past however that's the past and I have undoubted confidence they will have looked at these things and look for ways to make things better.
     
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  19. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    That's because the trains in reality had no headlights, just little marker lights. Indeed, headlights on UK trains are absolutely rubbish - they're designed for you to be seen, not for you to see out - and is the reason until very recently, UK trains have had yellow fronts. It's only recently (last 5 years or so) headlights have become powerful enough to not require the yellow front.


    My questions for the stream:

    - Are Inverclyde and Paisley Canal services included as AI only in Glasgow central? Even if they're still only 314s, it would help make Glasgow feel more alive and really sell you're in a real place.
    - Is the wet platform system from LGV in use on this route, is it a new system, or are the platforms completely wet allover no matter if there's a shelter?
     
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  20. elarthur

    elarthur Well-Known Member

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  21. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    Why we don’t get the Class 380 and 385 when this Route is Set in 2017?
     
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  22. Yoinkermcskoinker

    Yoinkermcskoinker Well-Known Member

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    It’s set in 2011-2014, actually.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2021
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  23. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Yes, this is the standard line. But it doesn't cut any ice for me because:

    - an exceptionally weak 1.5v pen torch casts enough light to enable you to see reflections quite some distance ahead, especially from highly reflective surfaces like speed limit signs, when it is dark outside;
    - I can guarantee you that a 1970s 12v P-Way torch can be used to safely navigate track at night (on foot), and these can cast quite a strong beam, and the marker lights on British diesel locos have always been at least as powerful;
    - in TS2012, all of the same locos in TSW NTP have strangely been programmed with powerful light sources on the front - because multiple light sources can be more easily handled in TS2012 (because a lot of the other lighting effects are baked in);
    - I am fully aware that removing light sources happens to be a quick last minute way to recover FPS/performance if a build has not been properly built or optimised (like NTP) - and I hope that they have not had to do this to Cathcart or to the Class 314 (because the same would probably be implemented on the Class 313);
    - on German routes in TSW, where the routes have been optimised, old locos like the DB BR 155 have perfectly decent light sources on the front, and actually modelled to look really weak, with a very low colour temperature, which for me is quite beautiful...... especially when that colour temp is reflected off the signs, which you need to see if you are trying to make the most out of the simulator by going HUDless.

    I don't expect to see a powerful AAA searchlight on the front of rolling stock, lighting up several miles ahead - just a few metres, so that I can get an impression of movement in the dark, from some light reflecting off trackside furniture and catenary gantries, and the fronts of passing trains. If properly implemented, this would be a particularly immersive and atmospheric feature on a route like Cathcart - it is essential, in fact.
     
  24. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    The Timetable said 2017 because some people said so after the Preview stream
     
  25. sophieclarke1983

    sophieclarke1983 Well-Known Member

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    I have a question in the preview stream Matt P stated due to current PIS implementation it isn’t possible to manually set on train destination boards how and why is the case given that in as little times ago in southeastern high speed we can set the destination blind of the 375 electrostar also will this be resolved by the time Brighton mainline/Gatwick express comes out ?
     
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  26. Cameron's Gaming

    Cameron's Gaming Well-Known Member

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    A torch being used by a human, on foot, pointed at the ground, is going to light up a lot more things than if that torch is pointed where you're heading and is about 10 feet off the ground.

    Do you seriously expect this to cast lots of light (or even enough light to see from the cab) onto the track? I don't. Indeed, it seems Armstrong Powerhouse don't either - I've just tested it with their 37.
    [​IMG]
     
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  27. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Rather than a thousand words, I thought that this might help you:



    Note how the pair of marker lights on this Deltic are seen clearly reflected in the yellow wall in the background. This is clearly visible, from quite a distance, despite the station being incredibly well lit, and despite the marker lights being situated next to a much more powerful light (obviously also reflected), and despite the incident light being reflected to the observer at quite a large angle.

    Lineside signs and nearby trackside equipment are easily illuminated by marker lights in real life, and light is clearly reflected from them, and gantry supports, lineside cabinets, etc., when you are travelling through open countryside at night, or in a tunnel, for example, on NTP. So - marker lights should be regarded as light sources in TSW - it adds to the immersion. They would not light up distant objects through fog though.

    And DTG know this - and this is why they usually make marker lights functional as light sources, but they have a CPU performance hit - so routes like NTP didn't get the feature (and I suspect that it was actually originally there, but removed to get better FPS).
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2021
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  28. jackiedore

    jackiedore New Member

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    Will the ai trains be able to drive the livery that you created like SEHS
     
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  29. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Question for the guys in the stream...

    Are there any plans for a loco DLC for this route? A lot of people seem to be disappointed with just the one train. Not me but it would be interesting to know about future plans if there are any. Is there scope to add services into the timetable for a future DLC even if there isn’t one planned?
     
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  30. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    I think they loosely implied that they want to make a loco DLC for this route sometime in the future.

    I’ve no doubt that this will happen, and I bet their first loco DLC for this route will be the Class 320.
     
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  31. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    It’s probably the 380 or 385 also.
     
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  32. dasmith1

    dasmith1 Active Member

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    The 385s were not in the Scotrail fleet as the trains entered service in 2019. The 380s i dont believe were used on the Line as they trains were only used on the Inverclyde and Aryshire Coast Lines
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2021
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  33. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Wrong era and line for that.
     
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  34. Tonto62

    Tonto62 Well-Known Member

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    What a shame the time frame they've picked means we can't have the original Glasgow Blue train, the class 303 emu. Not having a corridor connection on the end we'd have a much better view.
     
  35. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    Wrong era but right line.
    For the 380 anyway, the 385 didn't exist yet.
     
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  36. DB628

    DB628 Well-Known Member

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    We need this Route also for the 380 and 385
    Glasgow–Edinburgh via Falkirk line
     
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  37. sophieclarke1983

    sophieclarke1983 Well-Known Member

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    I have a question for the stream Does the Cathcart circle dlc feature any approach controlled signalling like southeastern high speed does ?
     
  38. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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  39. dasmith1

    dasmith1 Active Member

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    If E+G line was added to TSW2 it would be set before Queen Street was Electrified with the Class 170
     
  40. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    No, I don't but seeing as though the class 66 in GWE is in DBS livery and only available on GWE and the 66 shown in the preview stream was EWS which is available as part of ECW and SEHS, then logic dictates that it will be the ECW version that is used as it is newer.
     
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  41. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Specific questions for the guys in the next stream for CCL...... (also, see discussion above, but I wanted to put specific questions down, so here they are...............)

    Q1 -
    Has the Class 314 been equipped with a light source that beams out from the front, for the white headlight / marker-light clusters?
    Q2 - Has the Class 314 been equipped with a light source for the red marker lights in the cluster....?
    Q3 - If you have chosen to not make a forward facing light source (destroying the immersion it would provide), why have you done this...?

    I looked at Fridays' preview stream again, and I noticed that:

    - absolutely no light reflected off speed restriction signs or tunnel walls, or gantry supports, or rain particles, on the second demonstrated run, even when all of the bright white lights on the front were on, and the ambient lighting conditions were very dim;
    - Matt indicated that although they could show the Class 314 at night next time, they could only do this within Glasgow Central station.....

    Q4 - Why can't you show the Class 314 running at night, outside of Glasgow Central station, in the next stream....?
    Q5 - Does the Class 314 work at night (or when it is dark) at all.... when it is outside of Glasgow Central station?
    Q6 - If they were not ready in the dev build on Friday, do you intend to implement light sources on the front of the Class 314..., and if so, when do you intend to do this.....?

    It looks to me like the lights have been given simple glow textures, like the Class 47 in NTP. And if this is true, then this is extremely disappointing. To put this into context, the DB BR 182 that originally ran with the Rapid Transit DLC in TSW 2020 has got lights that are light sources, where the light reflects off speed signs, gantry posts, and trackside furniture. So why not the Class 314.....?

    Question to Forum Members: And as a general question to other people in this thread... is it just me that thinks having a light source on the front is important? Does this actually matter to anyone else....? Are other players okay for the Class 314 to be treated like the Class 47 in NTP... (lights to be seen, but not to see with....)..........?
     
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  42. Oo7 BELL 7oO

    Oo7 BELL 7oO Active Member

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    Can you demonstrate the route in heavy snow conditions so that we can see the WSP intervention from the train and the physics.
     
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  43. isaac47593

    isaac47593 Well-Known Member

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    Set too early for 320s, they only became regulars on the line in more recent years. The 318 or the 380 would be the best options for DLC as they were often used during peak times and to cover for 314s during the time period the route is set
     
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  44. dcnine#5410

    dcnine#5410 Well-Known Member

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    What? Matt didn’t say that they could only do Glasgow, he said they’d do a few stations, but not a whole run. That’s a decision that makes sense, because you don’t want to spend half of the stream showing off a route shrouded in darkness. People were already complaining in the last stream that they were doing a rainy run, I can only imagine that more would be annoyed if they did a full nighttime run.
     
  45. Train Sim 9723

    Train Sim 9723 Active Member

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    Is their any cab and or passenger heating controls?, I’ve noticed these have been inaccessible in recent releases

    The feature really helps with immersion
     
  46. pjwilson15

    pjwilson15 Member

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    I have a simple and basic request. Can you please give us a look at the braking and power controls and how they operate.
    Thank you.
    Great looking route by the way.
     
  47. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Yeah - that's what I am worried about..... "a route shrouded in darkness".

    I really want CCL to be as good as South London Network in TS2012 (albeit a fraction of the size) - so that you can drive HUDless, following the speed warning signs and speed limit signs. To do that, you need a light on the front to see the signs (and to help you learn the route). But if the route is "shrouded in darkness", then I will not be buying CCL until we can see the light (or not at all, if the lighting is poor).

    I very much hope to be proved wrong and that there is a simple answer, which is that the lights on the front of the Class 314 are actually meant to be light sources, but they just weren't enabled in the dev build shown last Friday (or weremaybe not visible in the ambient light o the raining run).
     
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  48. neilwatson2007

    neilwatson2007 New Member

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    I'd like to see Locos and Carriages in the platforms used by London bound services, not driveable ones unless they can and disappear into the portal but just to add realism to a mainline station like Glasgow
     
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  49. isaac47593

    isaac47593 Well-Known Member

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    There is no stock in the game that would fit for that. The route is set around 2014
     
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  50. Gswales

    Gswales Member

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    A run with the Class 66 I think I remember hearing it was an engineering train be nice to see. But I am already sold can't wait to be able to drive it myself in game
     
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