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Tsw: Switching In The Subdivision!

Discussion in 'Dovetail Live Article Discussion' started by TrainSim-James, Feb 20, 2020.

  1. brandonmc205

    brandonmc205 Member

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    Thank !@$& for that.

    They should’ve stated that they were gathering data before making a decision.

    Clowns.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
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  2. deki32

    deki32 Active Member

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    [​IMG]
     
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  3. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    It's almost a literal example of "familiarity breeds contempt"..... Anyway - you have just reminded me of something....

    Q. Has anyone with the OSD DLC noticed whether or not the GP38-2 is recognised as a new locomotive, when you look at your list of locomotives? Because apparently this is a new and completely different locomotive, or at least heavily modified locomotive.......?
     
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  4. 4-COR

    4-COR Member

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    Someone did a list last week. It was very long!
     
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  5. 4-COR

    4-COR Member

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    Now I don't have the DLC (good for me!) but looking at videos, there are only minor differences in the cab of the GP38, plus the livery change
     
  6. bobsr

    bobsr Member

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    "Whatever happen to constructive criticism?" This entire thread has been just that, constructive. I think that some of us DTG fans, have to remove the DTG shades from our eyes, to see that. I am an fan of TSW, however, with this release, and, my displeasure with the shortness of some of the routes, the DTG shades, have been removed. This is coming from someone who has purchased every single route, and, loco for TSW. This route has been on my computer for three days. I havn't run it once. I was waiting for an response from DTG as to why they mis-represented what was supposed to be included with this route. I will wait for 2 days more for an official explanation from DTG. If no explanation, I will refund this route.
     
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  7. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Someone called them clowns. That doesn’t sound constructive to me.
     
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  8. Typhomat

    Typhomat Well-Known Member

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    A reminder, if you left a negative review on Steam, and they do resolve the issues with inaccessible parts of the yard and buildings blocking track, update your review. We are far from that point currently, but something to keep in mind if we ever get there.
     
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  9. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    I'm friendly already by not buying and refunding it just to write a negative review :D
     
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  10. brandonmc205

    brandonmc205 Member

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    They don’t respond to constructive criticism.
     
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  11. Random Railfan

    Random Railfan Well-Known Member

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    That definitely makes sense knowing the things DTG has been doing recently lol
     
  12. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes, when things are really really bad, it's better to give clownstructive criticism, because if you can't sit around and laugh about it just a little bit, then the only other options for comfort left are to cry, or to eat ten Big Macs and re-watch the first series (season) of Friends on DVD.

    And I am not going to be watching season one of Friends. And I am not going to cry over DTG.

    *still waiting for the burgers to arrive*
     
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  13. Mr T

    Mr T Well-Known Member

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    Although, Dimitri didn't specifically say there would be a response on Monday, he just said it will be after the weekend. I'm splitting hairs but that's what he said.
     
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  14. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    Yep, just like they're fixing Mastery after the Christmas break.
     
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  15. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    A fairly big change, with the locomotives on the OSD DLC is that they can all drive through buildings - nobody saw that coming - including the people in the buildings....:

    That picture again.jpg

    (NB: Image originally posted by Factor41 - it's such a good slide from the video....)
     
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  16. Manclion

    Manclion Well-Known Member

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    Well DTG say you can almost reach out and touch every milepost and every signal because of the realism.. Go one better and actually drive through buildings, go on.. Feel the detail. All yours for £25..

    Oh the humanity.. All those innocent man, women and kiddiewinks..
     
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  17. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Extremely poor communication on behalf of DTG. A whole day has passed and not a single word has been said on these forums.

    Even something such as “We are continuing our investigations and will update you in due course” is better than nothing.

    I made a thread about DTG’s communication on these forums, which can be found here. The results show that the majority of people voted bad.

    Guess what, despite the poll and results, not a single thing has changed.

    Now I oppose to any anger or hate against companies and individuals but DTG really do not help themselves...
     
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  18. Manclion

    Manclion Well-Known Member

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    And it's still for sale with the misleading description unchanged.
    It's beyond belief scandalous even it's as if they just don't care.
     
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  19. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    And just like we'd hear more about the Editor Open Beta 'in the New Year' back in 2018...
     
  20. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that's just an insult....to clowns. ;)

    Jokes and banter aside, the overwhelming majority of posts are constructive in nature, so if you're going to generalise, I'd say it's generally constructive.
     
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  21. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    I don’t see it that way.
     
  22. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough.
     
  23. nne4229

    nne4229 Well-Known Member

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    Anthony, what’s your honest thoughts about times when they promised us this or that and years have gone by and they haven’t said anything since like the examples above, also what about the studio articles I mean seriously how long has it been and Why did they stop? Being excited about this game is difficult when it shouldn’t be.
     
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  24. Digital Draftsman

    Digital Draftsman Well-Known Member

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    AlexNL made a post regarding this, but it's disappeared. Anyway, in the live stream Matt says at 1:05:52 'so in this area you can basically drive where ever you want.' The screenshot below is what was on screen at the time and is what was being refered to. We now know a lot of this trackage shown on the screen is not available to the player.

    upload_2020-2-25_0-39-6.png
     
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  25. nne4229

    nne4229 Well-Known Member

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    We’ve gotten responses from some at dtg, oh I’m working on this article right now *one year passes* ... that’s sad and unacceptable I don’t get it
     
  26. Mr T

    Mr T Well-Known Member

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    You know, you have to wonder what the route builders were thinking when they plonked the buildings over the tracks like this. ie. "No one is going to be able to access this area so we'll just put these giant sheds over the tracks". I don't think they were thinking it would get opened up or used at any point.
     
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  27. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    I think I've found a workaround for the situation: When you drive your highly flammable and explosive tankers into those sheds on the track... Just imagine they were the DTG offices. Maybe the route is fun this way! It's not about the length, it's how you use it... right?
     
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  28. AlexNL

    AlexNL Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I decided to remove my post when I saw that someone else had already posted the stream in this topic. Don't want you guys and gals wasting time on stuff you've already read and seen :)
     
  29. Typhomat

    Typhomat Well-Known Member

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    I am not against the jabs and such that myself and others have made towards DTG, but this to me is too far. As frustrating as this has been, and I believe I speak for most of us here that we wish this was better handled, this comment to me is inappropriate.

    At the end of the day, the employees of DTG, many who do not deserve to be in the cross-hairs regarding this situation and put a lot of effort into delivering us the best product they can, are human beings.

    The issues we complain about here seem to reside in upper level management too, not the entire company body.
     
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  30. MillerPC

    MillerPC Active Member

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    That is too far, regardless of how much they messed up, no one deserves such threats as those. Even if you didn't mean it that way, It still shouldn't have been said. The point of us being heated about this isn't to throw threats and pointless anger in one direction. It's for the sake that we want this game to go somewhere and as of right now it isn't. But when you escalate it to as such, it's no longer criticism or feedback, its just being childish.

    This goes to anyone and everyone: No threats, whether if its a joke or not. No one needs the added fear of thinking if something goes wrong, someone will do bodily harm to them. (because I'm certainly sure on this planet, it has happened before) Let's be civil and just.
     
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  31. Yerolo

    Yerolo Well-Known Member

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    I reported that post...Im certain DTG will deal with it now

    I expected better from him tbh. You cannot dismiss a post like that as a joke
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  32. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    Yes - precisely. It's not just the map in the manual, and the Sirius Cybernetics Marketing blurb - this DevStream was a key part of the advertising, and part of the marketing scheme. It's quite incriminating, overall, and bizarrely, self-incriminating and self-published..... ;-O

    When I saw the full extent of those yards, as highlighted on the in-game map in the DevStream, and considered the likely dense build-out of industrial buildings around it, and the possibility that it might be properly lit, I literally saw thousands of opportunities to take really cool screenshots, and do some arty stuff... Blade Runner style rainy street pictures... snow covered high contrast scenes... sunrise and sunset between buildings... etc. I said as much, in the middle of the "Oh Canada" thread. I actually considered the Hamilton layout to be a "network". (Even if it wasn't quite a "route unto itself....")

    Obviously, I was wrong - I was stupid enough to place trust in what was said on the DevStream, even if the written blurb was ridiculously and unbelievably hyperbolic. It was all just a bunch of "porkies". (rhyming slang.....>> Pork Pie = Lie)

    Total madness. I mean - surely they knew that people would find out.....? And pretty quickly...?

    And then all of that is made much much worse by the sheer extent of the bugs, sim kick-outs, boundary issues, splodge and bodge scenery placement*, etc., etc., etc.

    *which I might mention in a later post...
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  33. synthetic.angel

    synthetic.angel Well-Known Member

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    I have quite a bit of experience building out sim geography and kitting it out with assets, and I can give you a short answer to your question. It was rushed. Not just done quickly - but slap-dash extreme rushed.

    The buildings were placed across the tracks, at the very last minute, because you were not (in the end) expected to see the tracks at all, after they had decided to not include them in the route.

    The nature of the extreme rush to publish is made even clearer in that they didn't even have enough time to pull up the redundant tracks, or disable them as assets linked to locos and the map..... and then clean up the physical boundaries (because the places where you get kicked-out were probably not initially meant to be boundaries).

    Even if they intended, very very late on, to re-build at a later date, they could easily have saved a version with the track layout, and then publish a version without the redundant trackage. But that would have taken time - like, a couple of hours extra to do and validate, even at a very late stage.... I am not kidding.

    I have no idea why they rushed it in such an extreme way. I really would not want to speculate on that.

    The only other alternative explanation, which even I find too difficult and implausible to contemplate is that this is the standard at which they now build out their route DLC, and they consider it to be completely acceptable.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  34. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    I don't think driving pixels on a screen into other pixels on a screen is going to put anyone in real harm. If it does in some allegorical way I hadn't thought of, then maybe better don't, that's right.

    Sorry, maybe dark humour had run away with me on that one. George Carlin would probably have done a better job making it sound funny.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  35. Factor41

    Factor41 Well-Known Member

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    I think you'd have to be really pushing the boundaries of overreaction to actually consider driving a virtual train into a virtual shed as an actual real world threat. They can't even get PSN trophies to work, I imagine building voodoo properties into the route buildings would be a little out of scope.
     
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  36. thearkerportian

    thearkerportian Well-Known Member

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    It's OK. I've made a joke that didn't work well with the audience. If the vast majority complains, chances are, it really was a bad joke. Or, in other contexts, a bad.. let's say, trainsim DLC.
     
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  37. TinTin_57

    TinTin_57 Well-Known Member

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    No, for me I have already done 700+ miles in it. So it is adding to the previous one(s)in the list
     
  38. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Now that’s just bad...
     
  39. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    You really can’t make jokes.
     
  40. Manclion

    Manclion Well-Known Member

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    DTG don't seem to be able to make bug free, value for money dlc either, swings and roundabouts..
     
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  41. Manclion

    Manclion Well-Known Member

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    I fail to see what you bring to the discussion, short one liners often with Matt said this Matt told me that with no point to them at all.

    Everything in DTG land is full of gold, honey and unicorns, despite a massive c Ock up and a kick in the teeth by DTG you don't pass any kind of constructive criticism or any criticism at all despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.
    Maybe you think Matt is your best friend and you don't want to upset him in anyway?
    Seems strange to me.
     
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  42. deki32

    deki32 Active Member

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    *Shots fired*
    [​IMG]
     
  43. BigMountain555

    BigMountain555 Well-Known Member

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    So they released an unfinished product that we all know they will never finish? They have never added anything of this nature to previous TSW releases, so I don't expect this to be fixed. I tried to be positive but this one was too much for me. They provided a map in which half the displayed trackage is unusable? Just wow.
     
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  44. Typhomat

    Typhomat Well-Known Member

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    Let's get this thread back on track, any update from DTG yet?
     
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  45. londonmidland

    londonmidland Well-Known Member

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    Still no update from DTG as of 14:00 Tuesday, today. Really don’t know what or why is taking them so long to update us on what is happening/happened?
     
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  46. BigMountain555

    BigMountain555 Well-Known Member

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    It's disrespectful how much time has passed and not a word has been said by DTG. As if they just don't care and will ride out this storm. At the very least they could have said something like they are aware of our concerns and are looking into it. Instead, all we get is silence.
     
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  47. zane88

    zane88 Active Member

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    NO, what's BAD is this dlc and the "whatever" attitude that Dovetail seems to have about the situation.

    AT LEAST "THEARKERPORTIAN" DIDN'T RIP ANYONE OFF!!



     
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  48. JonnE

    JonnE Member

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    In my opinion, after following the discussion and trying to evaluate the economic reasons behind this whole situation, I think there's still no update because it wouldn't make things much better.

    The way I see it this DLC was originally planned with all sidings and industries which are shown in the map. But it couldn't be finished in time because...
    ... maybe it turned out to be more work than originally planned
    ... some of the route builders got sick
    ... the attention to detail was too high to stick to the release plan
    ... something else.

    But the reason doesn't really matter. The result is here. As we can spot from the pics or even noticed ourselves it seems to be quite a massive amount of work left on that route for including all of the areas correctly.
    Yet I don't think this massive amount of additional work is part of their working schedules for this year. They will have some resources planned for bug fixes and maybe even development of new features but this? This wasn't expected.

    And this hurts a bit to write because I fear there are very good reasons NOT to alter the current working schedule.

    There was written DTG would be quite short of money. The necessity of public money is definitely a sign for that, even not so uncommon in gaming industry.
    If you rule a company that is in such a state your short and middle-term goals are gaining more money for a more stable economical situation. Cost whatever needs.

    And sticking to the plan with personal resources, a clear vision of what is to come during the next month for the employees and the continous release of new DLCs will most likely generate more income for DTG than stopping this and working on bugfixes.

    I'll try and give an example: 6 DLC a year with an average selling of 10,000 each still generate more income than 3 DLC with an average selling of 15,000 each due to higher quality.

    I fear there have been calculations of what the best development plan of DLC for TSW could be like and the current one looked most promising.

    With a higher amount of DLC releasing over the year you keep yourself in the media, people will notice, some people will give them a try, and so on.

    With a lesser amount of DLC you can reach a higher quality and maybe higher sales for the single products but the risk of a generally decreased income is higher. And DTG doesn't seem to cope with that.

    So I don't think there a resources for a huge update for OSD left. The usual bug fixes, yes. But not as much as should be done.

    This is definitely not what a significant part of the community wants to hear right now. But it might be in some cases quite close to the actual situation.

    I hope I could make myself a bit clear. I in person am very unpleased with this form of communication and would manage it differentely. What I experience in my daily work (where I'm not speaking English, but I think you noticed that already) it is extremely helpful to speak about problems, no matter what origin they are.
    Creating transparency can be a vital part of creating progress.

    But as there's a lack of communication even to really constructive feedback where users try to help as much as they can I doubt that this will be the primary strategy for now.

    These are my thoughts...

    Edit: So as a summary - I wouldn't expect an official statement during the next days. There will be an update, as it's always be, and maybe a bit earlier than usual or a bit more extensive. And maybe some sort of statement will be released before the patch notes. But I wouldn't expect more. In fact, more wasn't promised anyway...
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2020
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  49. zane88

    zane88 Active Member

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    You speak better English than some of my neighbors and your point is well taken.
     
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  50. KiwiLE

    KiwiLE Active Member

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    Do any of you people actually think this game is like driving a real train? And by denying you the access to some pixellated yard, that DTG is denying you the experience you may have had if you had chosen a different career path?

    I'd say "get a life" if I wasn't here so invested in one stupid, meaningless simulation game.

    Get something else to do, and stop sniping at Anthony Pecoraro too, that isn't on.
     

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