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Stop Making New Dlc & Fix The Bugs

Discussion in 'Known Issues & Bug Reports' started by jENKS, Mar 21, 2018.

  1. jENKS

    jENKS New Member

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    I'm really getting frustrated by the LACK of initiative to fix the many bugs this sim still has, many of which are over a year old now. Yeah, yeah, I keep hearing from Jay @ DTG that the development and bug fix teams are separate, but my god.... is the "bug fix team" a part time 12 year old kid?

    It's past due that you either dramatically scale up your bug fix team OR pull your entire development team over to help fix the bugs. You cant keep doing this.

    There's an enormous list of blatant bugs that need to be squashed already, many of which dramatically impact the gameplay or cause the game to not function correctly. Here's a list of just the recent bugs posted here:

    NEC Issues: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/nec-new-york-issues.4017/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/gwe-sound-and-end-of-service-issues.3739/

    HST: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/hst-gets-back-some-graphics-glitches.2441/

    RT: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/rapid-transit-cross-town-unlock-doors-bug.2931/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/rapid-transit-buglist.2786/

    CSX HH: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/throttle-ammeter-incorrect-with-all-diesel-locos.3596/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/csx-buglist.2063/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/headlights-do-not-light-up-enough-ground.3098/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/wood-tie-plates-throughout-csx-hh-are-corrupt.3674/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/container-numbers-messed-up.3700/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/please-fix-the-brightness-issue-on-csx-soon.2508/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/csx-sd40-2-yn2-engine-bay-bug.3334/
    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/sd40-2-yn2-livery-engine-room-bug.3220/

    DTG, you have a MONUMENTAL task ahead of you, JUST to fix what you've already released. At the pace you've been holding on bugfixes, the new bugs are outpacing you by a factor of 3 to 1. You're losing ground big time.

    I'm never going to buy another DTG product. You've got a terrible business model and company culture to allow this kind of egregious behavior to continue. Shame on you. Maybe we should all get together to invoke one of the many of UK's customer protection laws. Because, afterall, we are not getting what is advertised. We're getting broken, crappy, half baked garbage. My friends and I have already contacted Steam to let them know about your behaviour. It's my understanding they've booted developers in the past for stuff like this.

    Jay - pass this on to the CEO please. He needs to know we're angry and serious. Stop releasing new DLC and fix the existing ones. If you cant afford to do that, then you have a failing business model. People are wising up to your deceptive game.
     
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  2. class350

    class350 Member

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    I too am about ready to give up on TSW
     
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  3. idiosis

    idiosis Member

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    Vote with your wallet it's the only language these people understand.
     
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  4. StratPlayer62

    StratPlayer62 Well-Known Member

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    Is it just me or are they having a lot of sales lately? I'm wondering if sales are down and they are scrambling to get some cash flow.

    I really want TSW to improve and continue, but I agree they need to fix it, most people don't want to keep buying DLC for a core product that doesn't work properly.
     
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  5. Juan Manuel Luengo

    Juan Manuel Luengo Member

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    It is obvious that how many of us participate in this forum is because we use TSW and we want it to work better and better, and to increase the DLC and that there is more and more content. We can not doubt the effort and intentions of the team of Dovetail developers to improve the base product and perform day to day better DLC. With their mistakes, the last two (WSR and RSN) have improved a lot compared to the first ones. We must hope that it continues to be so, and trust in the work and responsibility of the DTG team. The first interested in the sales increase is DTG. I want to keep buying better and better DLC. I think I can improve the ones that I have bought so far, but none have disappointed me.
    I, honestly, I have no rush for the much-demanded editor, but of course I am in favor of being available as soon as possible for those who want and know how to use it. As a player, I will not do anything with him: I will enjoy the good jobs that others want to do. It is not selfishness: it is sincerity and practicality. I hope to continue enjoying TSW for a long time, long time.
     
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  6. class350

    class350 Member

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    I wouldn't have a problem if they are learning from their mistakes, and constantly increasing the quality of the DLC's, and from what I can see, they are! My problem is the core bugs that "live inside" the game, as the bugs simply lying "on the surface" of individual dlc are easily fixable and often overlookable. These core bugs will be harder to fix obviously, and DTG don't like the sound of that it seems, so they appear to have given up on the basis of treating all customers, and are simply continuing foward giving those few that don't have issues what they want, and leaving everyone else behind in a cloud of dust. The more content that is produced, it will surely make it harder and harder to cure these internal bugs, as side effects are unknown. I fear we mean so little to them that they can happily live off their TS 20xx earnings and simply please the blind among us who don't seem to be affected like us true fans as a side note to the original TS. I have also noticed that while general quality of DLCs increase, there seems to be some aspect in each one that is simplified from the last. The interactiveness especially is plummeting towards lower than that of even a generic TS loco compared to where it was with CSX. To me, this seems like a bid to "X-Box-ify" the game, as there appears to be a large portion of the market there that probably cares a lot less about a 'simulation' and instead just want their shiny textures. Too much longer, and it will be Rest In Piece TSW for me, and I'm not going to further support a company who supports only those who blindy click "buy" on everything. I'll give them one final chance though, but I doubt they'll use it too wisely. Massively disappointed based upon my discovery of TSW 2 years ago.
     
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  7. raildan

    raildan Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately, I'm afraid the more profitable solution to this has always been to just improve new releases. Supposedly, as the product improves, complaints die off and people buy more, but this way they need to spend more money on new DLC and they need to spend less time fixing bugs. DTG- or, rather, its predecessors- have shown this in TSxx- Donner Pass was one of the first routes released for it, back when it was still called Railworks, I think, and the scenarios are still completely broken and unplayable. They have learned from this mistake and newer DLC is much better, but they're never going to fix the older ones.

    As time passes and new DLC arrives, stuff before WSR at least will be seen more as antiquated, ancient, and obsolete than broken and needing a fix.
     
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  8. Budge4

    Budge4 New Member

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    Id already more or less given up with this game (bought GWE and not bought anything since), gets reinstalled just when I hear there is a new update and that's all, usually give GWE a few runs, see if anything has improved (or got worse) then I uninstall it again.

    Had installed it again a day or so ago and had a couple of updates including a 75mb one this morning, ran a service on GWE as usual and hadn't got far from Reading in HST and it crashed to desktop, had that UE4 window open where I clicked on send. All previous time ive re- installed it to give GWE a run it has not crashed once. So even less impressed now its crashed on me.

    Still find the world lighting a bit strange, still looks a very dead world, and the track in front of a loco looks awful, also not particularly good sounds. It used to look a lot better than it does now. I used to get around 30-50 fps quite a while back, now im getting upwards of 100fps, sometimes as much as 130-140fps (all at Ultra Settings), same comp system, just wasted fps. Shows how much the graphics have been watered down. It just doesn't push the latest hardware as it did at release on Ultra settings. Anyway TSW uninstalled until next update, back to Railworks for my train sim fix..
     
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  9. Darthtool

    Darthtool Member

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    Fix the bugs and you'll increase you player review positivity, more people will then buy the game after seeing it better represented on youtube etc etc,.

    come on DTG.. you have a good thing here, get it sorted.
     
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  10. LastTrainToClarksville

    LastTrainToClarksville Well-Known Member

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    Just to inject a bit of economic reality: if DTG quit producing add-ons for TS and TSW, where do you imagine that they would obtain the money to pay the folks that fix problems and put up with all of this yammering? Feel free to downvote this post -- you won't change this reality one iota.
     
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  11. class350

    class350 Member

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    That's exactly the problem! They have enough supporters that we don't matter! And so I fear the game is lost for us.
     
  12. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    I am missing your logic, if the company has enough supporters that are willing to support the company as they are learning an entirely new engine, tweaking what can be done with the said engine and are showing constant improvement with each release, how is the game lost for them?

    The income from the release of DLC allows them to continue to develop and refine the product. And they have been slowly fixes some of the past released bugs, never as fast as we want them to and never in the priority that will statisfy everyone.

    In general, I am pleased with the progress TSW is making. And the cost of the DLC where I can get multiple hours of entertainment costs me less than a dinner out with the wife... not that big of an expense.
     
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  13. hightower

    hightower Well-Known Member

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    Whilst I agree with your post, I have to take issue with this particular statement. LIRR & NTP, whilst not terrible, are both somewhat of a step backward from RSN. Fact.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
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  14. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    The problem with opinions is, not everyone agrees with them. I do not think NTP is a step backwards from RSN. But you are fully entitled to your opinion that it is. Hope you had a great holidays... and I am looking forward to continued improvements in TSW for the upcoming year.
     
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  15. hightower

    hightower Well-Known Member

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    You’re right, and that’s where the debate lies I guess. I do feel that they’re both demonstrably a step backwards (hence the use of the word ‘fact’) particularly when it comes to the lower quality scenery and the bugs in both releases - sadly basic, really obvious stuff again .

    They’re not bad, they’re just not as good as RSN which I think is a shame. For example, NTP is almost undriveable at night, unless you’re willing to completely suspend reality...no lights on any buildings, trees & signal gantries lit up like it’s daytime when everything else around is pitch black, stations with no night lighting & so on.

    Hope you had a great Christmas also, and here’s to another year of TSW. Hopefully less frustration & more enjoyment!
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2019
  16. davejc64

    davejc64 Active Member

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    Are DTG really in such a hand to mouth existence that the only way they can survive as a company is to keep releasing DLC that gets them money to pay the staff, doesn't bode well if they are.
     
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  17. class350

    class350 Member

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    Seems to be the case. To be honest, if I was in there position, it would be really hard to persusde myself to fix a bug that would bring back maybe 200 users, prohibiting further dlc temporarily and maybe giving staff an extra $50 a year. For them it's not financially worth it. That's the problem with today. 50 years ago, if you got someone to paint your house, they would personally see that it was done right and to the best quality, even if it meant an extra couple hours labour. Today? Uneven paint that peels in a year.

    On the other hand however, dtg do a great job at fixing the small bugs (eventually. Some seem way too obvious to have not been noticed before release though...) but it's the specific harware related bugs, such as sound and rendering issues that they seem to accidently brush into the waste basket that accidently gets set on fire.
     
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